So….I get this email out of the blue. I’ve x’d out the personal info. If you got it, what would you do?
Dear Mr. xxxx:
The reason for this email is to advise you that someone has taken images
from your site/artwork collection, and posted it on their site, without
credit or citation to you. In your case, this individual has
misappropriated conceptual drawings and illustrations and photos of several
of your projects in progress.
On one page of his web site alone, this person has ‘hijacked’ the
artwork,conceptual drawings and photographs of at least five others. This
person has a demonstrable history of willfully engaging in such intellectual
property theft. I have first hand knowledge of this pattern of
misappropriation.
I am providing you this notice strictly as a professional courtesy, and not
in any way to solicit business.
Please let me know when would be a good time to talk with you. I am in
Washington State, Pacific Time Zone.
Regards,
xxxx xxxxxx
xxxxxx Corp.
999 xxxxxx Avenue
xxxxxxx, WA 9xxxx
Voice: 360.555.xxxx
Facsimile: 360.555.xxxx
Email: [email protected]
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message is intended only for the use of the
individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential
and/or legally privileged information which may be exempt from disclosure
under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee
or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient,
you are hereby notified that any copying, dissemination, or distribution of
the e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in
error, please call the sender immediately at (360) 555-xxxx.
Edited 8/11/2004 8:55 pm ET by Cloud Hidden
Replies
Ask him for the URL of the offending web page. Tell him you appreciate his vigilance and might be willing to retain his services in case of a fight, but you're going to try a polite letter first.
Punch him in the nose.
In all seriousness, that kinda blows. I do think that LEUCAS (did I spell that right?) gave you the best advice there is. Try the diplomatic route. The writer of that email oughta give you the URL if they truly aren't trying to sell you something. Don't you just hate it when you're cruising through life, minding your own business, and some Ahole without a life of his own has to go and pee in your cornflakes?
Bummer. Let us know how this things plays out would you?
By the way.....I'm a big fan of your designs too. Although I haven't stolen any. Would love to live in a dome someday. I'm settling for a Cape for now though.
Wow Cloud !!!!!!!!!
Im gonna have a Rez moment here if you dont mind [ sorry Rez],
Thats a hell of a compliment Cloud !!!!!!!
Tim Mooney
Well now...
It does give you pause, doesn't it?
I got a chuckle out of the irony of the latter paragraph warring against spreading the contents and here I am reading it when it wasn't adressed to me.
But at the same time, there is a small scent of con game attached to this letter. I can't help but think that if this scene were real, that he would have provided a link to the offensive site right off. if there is something to it all tho, I would be full frontal press to slap down the slime bag stealing my work and taking credit for it as his own.
I guess I would have to follow it up, but fully expecting that some money would need to leave my pocket before I had more than the slightest hint of who it was stealing from me, and by then, the real thief might be the sender of the notice. on the other hand....it's hard to know
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Even if they did what the letter said, there's very little recourse unless your material was copyrighted (and copyrightable). Ask for the URL. I bet you never hear from them again (or you get some sort of run-around).
Yes, but virtually everything in the category of "conceptual drawings and illustrations and photos" is both copyrightable, and copyrighted.
Under current U.S. law, which is consistant with international treaty (the Berne Convention), works acquire copyright as soon as they are created, or "afixed in a tangible medium". In other words, when you take a picture, the picture acquires copyright protection the instant the light hits the film. There is no longer need any longer to afix the (c) symbol to a copyrighted work, although it does serve to give notice that you intend to excercise your rights and makes proving willful infringment easier.
If this guy won't tell him the URL without getting paid, it smells fishy.
Two issues: One, I agree with the other guys that Mr. Professional Courtesy sounds like a scamster. I wouldn't have anything to do with him.
Two, what is it exactly that you sell? If someone came to you and said he really liked your work but couldn't afford to hire you to design a house for him, and wanted to buy copies of the drawings for one of your houses, would you sell him the drawings? Or would you tell him you sell design (and engineering?) services and you couldn't just sell him drawings for a house that might be unsuitable for his site, budget, lifestyle, etc.?
The point of the question being, if you're not selling drawings, then you're not losing any business by having your work allegedly posted on this web site. As Piffin implied, this might be closer to free advertising than anything else.
Intellectual property rights are a huge legal issue right about now, and one I deal with daily. I like the first advice - ask for the URL for the offending photos, then consider the actual infringement (if any). If you suspect that there is a serious infringement, talk to a lawyer of your own choosing. most large (and even mid-sized) law firms will have at least one attorney who specializes in IP. You may be able to buy a brief consultation for as little as $100. If so, it's money well-spent, if not in pursuing damages, then in your own education.
I hadn't the heart to touch my breakfast. I told Jeeves to drink it himself.
P.G. Wodehouse
If it's a simple courtesy, then the URL dhould have been given in the email.
I'd simply email the person back and ask for the URL of the offending site. If the sender pushes for a phone call, then it could be a scam of sorts.
A while ago there were cases of people actually building websites and "stealing" graphics from other sites. They'd then get in touch with the owner of the "stolen" graphics and offer to provide legal services to get the offending site shut down. You pay, then they switch their site to contain someone else's content and the game goes on.
Ask them for the URL.
If they flinch...
I agree there is something very fishy about all this.
And I think Mongo is probably right -- how could this person possibly know your particular work had been picked up, unless he or she was the culprit.
I assume he already has your real name, address, phone # etc. from the Web site. But if not, I would keep all that info under wraps. I would do what everyone else suggests and ask for the URL.
But I would also be inclined to give him a call (assuming he did provide a phone #), just to see what he has to say, as well as to extract as much info about his operation as I could. It may be illegal, but I would also tape the call. Radio Shack probably sells a cheap little suction cup device that can be stuck on a phone handset to ask as a mic.
In the meantime, I would contact your internet provider, web host, and anybody else you can think of that might be interested in tracking down scam artists that are working the web. Doesn't the FBI have an office set up for this sort of thing?
I thought as most of y'all did...it's a scam to get me to hire them for legal fees to discover who knows what. Left it alone, and then got this one two days ago...
Mr. xxx
The attached email communication was sent to your offices this past week
inadvertently omitting the web address (URL) of the offending site. I
apologize for the oversight and any resulting confusion. The URL is:
http://xxxxx/xxx.php Should you decide to challenge the
infringers' misappropriation of your conceptual drawings and illustrations
and photos, you or your attorneys need only notify the web host for
"xxxxxxx.com" web site, "Godaddy.com". The URL for an overview of
Godaddy's process to report and stop intellectual property infringement is:
http://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/legal_agreements/show_doc.asp?isc=&se=%2B&from
%5Fapp=&prog%5Fid=GoDaddy&pageid=TRADMARK%5FCOPY
While I am an intellectual property attorney, to reiterate, this is not an
attempt to generate business for my law practice; it is merely ####professional courtesy. I and others in Washington State have suffered
losses as a result of the malfeasance of the principals behind XXXXXXX Corporation and "xxxxxx.com". I am working with and through
local law enforcement to ensure that the fraud perpetrated by Messrs. xxxx
and xxxxxx in Washington State is not repeated in Arizona.
###
The web site (I just really looked in detail for the first time) is about a freaky-deeky desert B&B that is selling "Key Club Memberships" that suggest you'll be buying 5 acres with your own permanent "desert dome". As "evidence" of their project, they include renderings of a bunch of 'em--my renderings plus a few others--plus a few construction photos from some of my clients' projects. None of the photos are attributed or linked. The impression is left that their "outlaw architect" did the work and that this desert community is actually being constructed.
Their mission: "The avid pursuit of quality in nurturing the physical, emotional and spiritual well-being of our families, key club members, customers, strategic partners, clients and their families, while being responsible stewards of our human and financial resources." Bleeech.
Haven't decided yet if I'll mention the site here or not. Tried the keywords above in google, and the site didn't show up. It has a real low hit count, too. They're either really developing a community while ripping off the designs of me and others, or running a scam on gullible people using the renderings as bait, or--the devious one you mentioned, Mongo, that I hadn't considered--that it's all a fake site that's part of a plan to get some $$$ from some designers. I might try the godaddy reporting route, be/c it doesn't cost anything but time.
Cloud,
Google "whois xxxxx.com". The whois service will give you all kinds of information about the owners of xxxxx.com.
Write a nice note explaining that they are using your property, apparently in an internet scam, and forward all info you have to:
A] The FBI .B] Your State Atty.C] xxxx.com owners State Atty .D] xxxx.com's internet Host State Atty.E] and "I am an intellectual property attorney"s State Atty.
If you have a business Atty that you use, send his secretary a copy to place, date stamped, in his files on you, no action required.
Then forget all about it.
SamT
While many of the buzz words are common it looks like they riped off a health care organization for their mission statement.
"The passionate pursuit of excellence in nurturing the physical, emotional and spiritual well-being of our patients and families while being responsible stewards of our human and financial resources."
http://www.vistacare.com/difference/company_information.php
http://www.volunteersolutions.org/boston/org/509670.html
Once you get over the moral qualms of taking one person's work, the next is likely easier! Heard that about murder, too. :)
Check and see if they copied the actual picture or if they where lazy and just linked to a picture on your site? I am wonder how else the attorney knew that it was yours (unless he happened to have a interest in domes and knew of your work).
If this just link to your site then you can have some fun.
Change the picture to say "stolen from clouldhidden.com" or "Vist cloudhdidden.com to view the real source of these designs".
They took the images...no links. Took those of some acquaintances of mine, too.
The lawyer could have been following these guys, like he mentioned, and then with a fairly direct path along with good googling, come upon my original work. Or he could be running a scam. Hard to tell today. I searched around on some of the names mentioned, including his, but came up dry.
I followed up on GoDaddy's procedure for reporting copyright violations...we'll see what happens. No big deal...fun little diversion.
Maybe he is a good guy extending you a "professional courtesy."
Or maybe he reads BT and realized the error of his ways.<g>
Either way, I hope this gets resolved to your satisfaction and you get the parasite (whomever that may be) off your website and out of your life.
It could be a con or just a sleazy lawyer.
If it's supposedly coming from a law firm, you can check in Martindale Hubble, although that doesn't prove much one way or the other.
I imagine there are spiders for searching out images and the URLs and the file names - in fact, I'm pretty sure you can use google to search for file names of images on the net.
Perhaps a google (et al) search for some of the file names of your posted images.
"It is as hard for the good to suspect evil, as it is for the bad to suspect good."
-- Marcus Tullius Cicero, statesman, orator, writer (106-43 BCE)
real simple...Ive had it done to me recently
Ignore it big time.
Dont let him drag you in.
Be well
andy
The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
100% scam.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
My sniff test says that is completely a scam. Did they take the images from your site or your artwork collection, why isn't the message specific? Why wasn't the URL of YOUR site provided in the letter as a way of personalizing it? Why wasn't the URL of the offending site provided? If they are working with local law enforcement, what are the case numbers? If this is a legal office, contact the bar association of Washington state and find out whether it really exists. If it is a corporation then the Better Business Bureau should have a listing for them. But they won't because it is a scam. I'd say you either need to ignore this or report it. But I would NOT do the godaddy.com route because that's what they said to do. At the very least your computer could catch a nasty virus (even though it's a Mac, it ain't invulnerable).
>>But I would NOT do the godaddy.com route because that's what they said to do.
GoDaddy is a legit site registration company. It's where I registered my websites.
I don't host them with godaddy, however... so I am not intimately familiar with how they handle copyright infringement notices. However, their policy is not that hard to follow... so I certainly would do it.
CH:
What I would do depends on how I feel about the work, what it is being used for, and what it is worth to me to put an end to the misuse. While the person responsible for notifying you of the potential infringement claims to have done so as a "courtesy," it seems suspicious that they would then request a convenient time to speak about the issue in the future. Let’s face it, if the sender's only intent was to notify you, then there would be no reason for future contact. You have been notified- enough said. But because someone who appears to be an attorney has indicated a desire to communicate further, I would anticipate a less-than-altruistic motive. This is not to condemn the sender- they may well have done you a favor- Just do not be afraid to ask "Are you going to charge me for this consultation?"
But this does not change the analysis of what to do. If the work is of a neighbor's doghouse I painted with jar of food coloring and a garden hose, I'd forget about incurring the expense of seeking an injunction. But if the misuse involved the type of work for which I have built a reputation AND if the user was either profiting from my work, damaging my reputation or both, I would pursue legal action.
In that case, a polite letter from an attorney may be just the trick. Shop around because just like contractors, there are good ones at fair prices, and there are bad ones at every price. Make sure you talk to at least one other attorney before moving forward. It would be inefficient to invest a lot of money in letters and legal research only to have a judge deny your request for an injunction. Treat hiring an attorney the way you wish people would treat hiring a contractor. Spend a little extra time and money to ensure you make the right decision.
Start now by documenting everything you can: date(s) you created the drawings or other work, date(s) you became aware of potential misuse, and all communication regarding the issue. It may sound silly or arcane, but by simply writing down now important things like dates, clients, distribution and correspondence you will save legal fees and improve your chances should you seek an injunction from a judge prohibiting use or your work by others.
Think of it this way- You know how much easier it is for you when you have a client who is organized, knows what they want and asks questions that help you advise them? It is the same way for attorneys. So I would first decide how much it is worth to put a stop to the infringement. Then, I would seek legal advice to see IF the copied work is protected work. Then I would do a cost/benefit evaluation in order to make the determination of whether or not to go forward.
Best of luck-
Mike
P.S.
If you reply to the sender, and if he is an attorney, I would anticipate an offer to share the legal fees with others who have had their work misappropriated. This may or may not be a good deal for you.
There are a lot of resources available to check the background of any attorney you may be considering. I'd recommend starting with the Washington State Bar Association. http://www.wsba.org/info/contact.htm They should be able to tell you of any enforcement issues or complains regarding every member of the Washington State bar.
-ms
Jim,
That first letter was so general as to be an oft repeated scam with a few fill-in-the-blanks for your particulars. But nothing is mentioned about domes, etc. There could be a ton of such phoney sites set up to "prove" to you (and many others) that someone is stealing your work.
It is scam to get a retainer out of you. Then they disappear.
But it is an interesting scam in that it is so much more focused than most fishing scams. And required a bit of work to set up the bogus site. But setting up the bogus site is could be mostly automated and/or done off-shore where the web-gurus are cheap. I suspect we'll see more of this sort of thing and that it will become increasingly polished.
Seems to me it would be pretty easy for the scam guy to create the web page with your pictures and drawings on it. Then he gets you to pay him to take it off the internet. Technically all he told you is that someone is taking credit for your work; he just doesn't bother to tell you that it's himself. Probably the reason he didn't include the url in the first email was because he didn't want to waste his own time creating the fake site until he got you to nibble on the bait and show some interest. He's pretty safe because you don't know who he is and would have to go thru too much time and expense to go after him for intellectual property infringement. So you either fall for it and pay him or you walk away and he moves on to the next mark...
Scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam, scam..."When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading." ~ Henny Youngman