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Is my house sold?

upnorthframer | Posted in General Discussion on April 20, 2008 04:35am

Well, after a short stint on the market with a realtor, I recieved a full offer on my house.  Only contingent on an appraisal at or above sale cost and a water test showing no bacteria in water (well).  People who made the offer put down 5k and want to close in 4 weeks. 

Started thinking as I spent the day cleaning out the attic.  How secure/forsure is the sale?  

I’m leary of signing a lease for rental property even though I have to so I have a roof over my head in 4 weeks. 

This is my first time selling a house.  How secure is the sale?  Can they still back out if they were to get cold feet or find a different “dream” home?  Is there anyway I can make the sale more concrete/final before I move out? HELP!!!

upnorthframer

“If you think education is expensive, try ignorance!!!”

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  1. MSA1 | Apr 20, 2008 04:40am | #1

    Hate to break this to ya but they can back out right up till you give them the keys. Of course once you have a signed agreement you can keep the deposit and possibly sue if they back out for no reason.

    I'd at least wait for the appraisal and water test before I started packing.

  2. Marson | Apr 20, 2008 04:48am | #2

    I've sold four houses now. Once had a guy make an offer who turned out to have a judgement against him so he couldn't get a mortgage. Have had offers that were contingent on the buyer selling a house that never did sell. Have had guys make offers only to change their minds and forfeit their earnest money. But usually it is a pretty smooth process.

    About all you can do is ask the buyers for a letter from their bank or whatever showing they have or will get the money. Won't make it any more or less likely to happen, but it might make you feel better. The fact that they want to close in only 4 weeks is a good sign.

  3. DonK | Apr 20, 2008 05:11am | #3

    I hope for your sake this is real. But I've seen some deals that were too good to be true and they weren't. I would be cautious.

    Normal procedure when I've bought/sold is that they make an offer then it's reduced to writing in the form of a contract, usually drafted by a lawyer. Makes it harder to back out, not impossible. Like someone else said, it usually allows you to keep the deposit.  a contract is good too because it spells out lots of details, like are you allowed to stay there after the closing, how long, etc.

    Your state may have different procedures. But, if you are dealing with a real estate broker, they should have at least qualified this buyer - i.e. run a credit check.

    I would check with a local lawyer and get a real contract if possible. i've seen people give binder checks that get stuck in somebody's folder until the closing and then you have zip.

    Don K.

    EJG Homes    Renovations - New Construction - Rentals

  4. mrfixitusa | Apr 20, 2008 05:39am | #4

    Your contract probably addresses these:

    (1) appraisal

    (2) loan approval

    (3) inspections

    If there are issues with any of the above that cannot be resolved, the contract is declared null and void and Buyer gets full refund of earnest money.

    Is the Buyer selling his house in order to buy yours?

    Good luck !

  5. Jim_Allen | Apr 20, 2008 07:04am | #5

    I'd be most concerned about the appraisal process.

    Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac have instituted new rules regarding the appraisal process. Lenders can no longer be in contact with the appraisers. That means that they can't cherry pick the appraisers and use appraisers that are known to "deliver the goods".

    A lot of the mortgage industry troubles were caused by the appraisal process. Lenders would post an appraisal contract, with the mortgage amount needed, and appraisers would bid on the job. Needless to say, if the appraisers didn't deliver an appraisal that would result in numbers high enough for the loan to go through, they would be blacklisted.

    I've been on both sides of the issue and never felt sure that the loan would close. On the last one I bought, I was driving to the closing and still betting that they wouldn't give me the loan. When they closed the loan, I was still betting that they wouldn't honor the check and something would kill the deal. I didn't believe that it was done till I knew the checks had cleared.

    Bob's next test date: 12/10/07

  6. robert | Apr 20, 2008 10:10am | #6

    My Townhouse?

    After appraisal and approval, Check in hand, Ready to sing papers.............

    I sat in the Realtors office for four hours while the buyer debated if he was actually going to close.

    Turns out that the payment was going to be $77 a month more than what the mortgage company told him. That was a whole weeks spending money to him (Single guy, new school teacher).

    Finally, he weighed the pros and cons of walking away from his $5K or figuring how to come up with $77 extra a month and signed.

    Nothing is "Sure" till you sign on the line and hand over the keys.

  7. mrfixitusa | Apr 20, 2008 02:50pm | #7

    I don't want to sound negative, but it's possible you will go to closing and find out at the last minute there "is a small glitch" and closing is being postponed.

    If it's a matter of a small detail closing gets rescheduled for the next day or two.

    In general, you would assume that the Buyer is NOT going to back out on the day of closing.

    By then he has incurred out of pocket expenses:

    (1) earnest money

    (2) appraisal

    (3) inspections

    So. just assume the home will sell and closing will occur as planned.

    BUT have a plan B in the back of your mind (what you will do and how you will handle things if the deal is off at the last minute)

    Good Luck!

  8. User avater
    Matt | Apr 20, 2008 03:56pm | #8

    These things are never for-sure but that one sounds like there is a pretty good chance it will go through.  Minimal contingencies, and $5k is pretty good earnest money these days. 

    One thought - you might want to chlorinate your well.  Do a search - it has been covered here.

  9. sledgehammer | Apr 20, 2008 05:13pm | #9

    $5000 ain't much of a deposit unless the price was under 100k. 10% deposit means they are really serious. In the begining of the market downturn builders were cleaning up keeping deposits of 20 grand and up on walk aways. Ask to rent back for 2 weeks after closing.

    1. DougU | Apr 20, 2008 06:34pm | #10

      10% earnest money! That doesn't happen, or if it does its as rare as someone paying cash for the house.

      $5000 earnest money isn't all that bad, couple that with the fast close and I'd say you have someone pretty serious. Of course all this depends on the actual selling price of the house, I'm thinking in terms of what's average where I'm at,  that may have some bering on my thinking.

      But if the OP'er already signed a offer sheet then going to a lawyer and drawing up another contract is nothing more then an exercise in how to throw money away.

      Doug

    2. User avater
      Matt | Apr 21, 2008 12:10am | #13

      I've never heard of a deposit of 10% for an existing house.  Two or three percent would be more typical.  For a new house, it's more paying for extras up front than an actual deposit, so the actual deposit might be 2% but the builder might require extra stuff be prepaid, just in case the buyer walks away because the buyer can't get financing or whatever.   That way the builder doesn't end up eating the cost of extras that another buyer may not want.

      If someone was buying a million dollar house do you think they are gonna say: "Here is $100k, just so you will know how badly we want it."   The interest alone on that 100k would be several hundred dollars if the closing was a month or 2 out.  People don't get that kind of money by wasting it... 

      A new house deposit might be more if it is a total custom or if the buyer owns the land, in ether case progress payments might be more typical.

      I'd be curious to know what kind of area you live in...  How about filling in a little of your profile... click on your screen-name where it shows up in underlined blue on this screen.

      Edited 4/20/2008 5:20 pm ET by Matt

      1. sledgehammer | Apr 21, 2008 03:21am | #14

        I have bought many houses. I never have paid full price and I demand a quick close.

        If I want it, 10% gets peoples attention. If I want a million dollar house I'm not likely to walk away from 100K now am I?

         

        I'm in the Baltimore/Washington area... why would that make any difference?

        1. User avater
          Matt | Apr 21, 2008 03:38am | #15

          >> I'm in the Baltimore/Washington area... why would that make any difference? <<

          only because I was wondering what the market and average home value might be where you live...  BTW - I grew up in that area (no va and southern md) and lived there for nearly 40 years...  Bought or sold 1/2 dozen there.... Still never experienced 10% down...  I'm sure things have changed since I left there though - glad to be outa-there....

          Maybe you are a real estate tycoon...  I hear the market is really down there - or at least in No VA.... hope you are weathering it well.  I hear it's a buyer's market.  Please refresh me, in a down market why would a buyer put up 10%?  In a down market any valid market gets notice... I guess if your closing date was in 10 days on cash terms it might make sense... maybe....

      2. jayzog | Apr 21, 2008 03:40am | #16

        It may be regonal , but 10% is the norm here.

        The last house I sold went for 4 mil, the buyer offered 5% deposit, I declined and said if you can't come up with 400 now why would I believe you will have the 3.8 in 6 weeks.

         My lawyer had the 400 the next day. 

        1. User avater
          Matt | Apr 21, 2008 04:04am | #17

          Sounds like maybe it's more market dependant, than regional.  How long was the property on the market? 

        2. User avater
          Matt | Apr 21, 2008 02:31pm | #22

          I've been thinking about that $4 mil house and all I can say is WOW!  So, what are you doing hanging around here?  Shouldn't you be out managing the stable hands who groom your polo ponies or something?  Seriously though, I know money is much different in NYC but still $4 mil!!!! 

          I live in a 400 or 500k slum...

           

          1. robert | Apr 21, 2008 09:48pm | #24

            I've been thinking about that $4 mil house and all I can say is WOW!  So, what are you doing hanging around here?  Shouldn't you be out managing the stable hands who groom your polo ponies or something?  Seriously though, I know money is much different in NYC but still $4 mil!!!! 

            Different animal. I have a relative who lives in the sam general area as J does.

            Apartment in the city?   $600K with 20% down and 20% in escrow for expenses and repair.

             

            House by a train station?   1800sqft, 1 1/2 baths and needing $50K worth of upgrades/repairs?    $1.1 Mil

            Hard to imagine her and my redneck a$$ are from the same gene pool

             

             

             

            ?

          2. upnorthframer | Apr 21, 2008 10:53pm | #25

            House sold for 190,00.  Buyer is pre-approved for a loan and is putting half the sale price down plus the 5k earnest.  It seems like I should just keep packing, sign a lease for an apartment, and if they back out take the 5k and be happy????  Not sure what else to do.  

            What have you guys done when you sold.  I'm not going to buy a house but plan on building in a few months so renting is the only option.

            upnorthframer

            "If you think education is expensive, try ignorance!!!"

          3. rnsykes | Apr 21, 2008 10:55pm | #26

            I don't know if anyone else on here is a "Realtor" or not, but I can give yo uadvise on this matter becasue I've been a full time RE/MAX agent for the past 6 years.  I was in before the market was super hot, and I'm not flaking out now that houses are hard to move.  I'm not the greates agent in the world, but I'm honest about my business and I do thing by the book.  I know the business and it's interesting to hear others give advise based on their own experiences.  First of all the deposit is "decent."  It's enough money to make someone think twice about before walking away.  I always try to get the largest possible deposit out of a buyer though.  If my buyers mortgage broker tells me that they will be putting 20% down on the mortgage, then their is no reason they cna't put 10% down on the contract.  If they are a first time buyer with a 95% loan, then 2-5 thousand is fine.  It all depends on the buyer.  Second, the appraiser is most definately contacted and scheduled by the mortgage company.  The agent nor the buyer have the obligation to hire the appraiser since the appraisal is required by the morgage company and no body else.  If the buyers is paying cash, they dont usually get an apraisal.  Lastly, the contract is not final until you get your check.  However, once they sign the agreement, and the attorney review period is concluded (assuming the broker prepared the contract and not an attorney), the contract is binding.  They are obligated to purchase the house according to the terms of the contract or you can sue them to perform (and the agents can sue them for commision).  The only way the buyer can walk away with their deposit is if the contract states that the it can be cancelled for a specific reason.  these reasons might include;

            well test, termite inspection, inspection by lender or surveyor, CO inspection, appraial, home inspection etc....

            The contract will state what these guidelies are, and every contract is different.  Usually, there are $$$ caps on what the seller is responsible to take care of in the even the home needs repairs.  For example, a common cap for termite repairs is $1500.  That means that if the buyer has a termite inspection done, and damage is found, the seller is responsible to pay up to $1500 to have the damage repaired.  If it's more than $1500, than the seller can say no, or they can negotiate the amount over the $1500.  This usually applies to the CO inspection as well(which by the way, the seller is usually responsible for providing assuming their municipality requires them).

            Their is uaually no type of cap for damage found by a home inspector.  The buyer hires the inspector and asks the seller to make any repaires based on his or her findings.  The seller can say no, or they can negotiate an amount that the seller will pay to have the repairs made.  However, the buyer can only ask for repairs that the home inspector recommends on certain things.  Things like, Roof and flashings, Mechanical systems, Environmental conditions like radon or mold, and structural defects.  They can't ask the seller to fix a broken tile or re-pave the drive way.  Any of the repais that need to be made for any of the inspections can usually either be made by the seller or the seller can offer money as a credit at settlement which is usually the case when trying to settle quickly.  The other thing to remember is that if anything is found like bad water in the well, mold in the basement, a crack in the foundation etc... and you don't want to fix it, you and your realtor have an obligation to disclose it to any future buyers that are interested in the house.

            Appraisals are different.  they can break a deal and the seller can have little to no re-course.  If a home is priced fairly, and the seller is not too greedy, then the appraisal is usually no problem.  Also, if the buyer is putting down a decent amount of money, than that helps as well.  For example, if a house is selling for $100,000 and the buyer is putting down 20%, than the house would ouly need to apprais for $80,000 (it's not that easy, but you get the idea).  The most important thing to remember is don't over price your house.  I have a feeling that since you got an offer so quickly, it's priced right.  The other part to this is if the buyer turns out to be under qualified, the mortgage company can cancel the contract and you have no rights to their deposit.  However, there should be something in your contract called a "mortgage commitment date."  It's usually about 20 days prior to settlemet.  On or before this date, the morgage company has to provide you with a letter of commitment.  It states that the buyer has taken all necessary steps to obtain the mortgage, and that they are well qualified for the amount they are asking to borrow.  Look for that as it's really another checkpoint on the way to settlement. 

            Hopefully I haven't confused you, and if oyu have any questions, let me know.

             

          4. jayzog | Apr 22, 2008 01:50am | #27

            The house was a burn out that I bought in mid 05, rebuilt it and listed it in 1/07.

            From listing to contract was about 8 weeks- then another 6 to close.

            I got lucky and got rid of it while making a couple of bucks- no home run- maybe a ground rule double.

            If I hung onto it for another 3- 4 months , the bank would have been the only one to make any money.

            What am I doing here? Same shid as you. And for stable hands, well my wife does have a horse, so I guess I will go out and muck the stalls now.

             

          5. User avater
            Matt | Apr 22, 2008 04:03am | #28

            OK - maybe I got it wrong... Sorry.  Still hard to imagine anyone I know owning a $4mil property...

    3. seb | Apr 21, 2008 04:38am | #19

      <<<$5000 ain't much of a deposit unless the price was under 100k. 10% <<<deposit means they are really serious.

      Few years ago had a real estate lady bring me an offer on a house I was living in, not listed, and didn't really want to sell. The Deposit/earnest money was $500... in the form of a promisary(sp) note...I laughed...She was serious...And outta there....
      Bud

      1. Jim_Allen | Apr 21, 2008 04:45am | #20

        She was a novice real estate investor trying a technique she learned about from a book, seminar or tape. It's a valid technique but not likely to work on a non-motivated seller.

        The grasshoppers forget that most important detail: find a motivated seller.

        I have some lake property in MI that I would sell on a promissory earnest deposit. I wouldn't bat an eye accepting that offer. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07

  10. runnerguy | Apr 20, 2008 10:57pm | #11

    You mention closing is in 4 weeks. In all the houses I've bought and sold over the last 30 years (and there have been several), there's a specified time to clear up all contingiences and a specified time for closing, set for a little later. I've never heard of a contingiency deadline and the closing set for the same day.

    Runnerguy

     

  11. alrightythen | Apr 20, 2008 11:11pm | #12

    when are the subject removal dates? Closing dates are no big deal, you could close in 6 months, but have subects removed in 1 week. Once they are removed, they are bound.

    Talk to a real estate lawyer is you are really concerned.

       View Image                                          View Image    
  12. User avater
    Matt | Apr 21, 2008 04:09am | #18

    BTW - just so we can put a little more perspective on this thing.... What is the approximate value of the home and how would you characterize the RE market where you live?  Ie - what might be a typical time on market for your type of house... or more specifically, how long was your home on the market before you received this particular offer?  Further, was it a full price offer, or what was the offer percentage off of full price?

  13. Pelipeth | Apr 21, 2008 01:17pm | #21

    Get your ducks in a row, I would also (if u have it) get my septic tank pumped and take a picture of the interior. Got a buried oil tank? Have that tested also. These things can hang up the closing, got a lawyer?

  14. mrfixitusa | Apr 21, 2008 02:54pm | #23

    Here are some things which can cause "glitches" in today's world.

    Your Buyer has the well tested and there is some kind of problem.

    So he asks you to fix it and this matter is addressed in the real estate contract.

    The contract is submitted to lender, and for whatever reason, the lender sees this as a "RED FLAG" and they don't want to loan money on a house with this kind of issue.

    Hey, it happens.

  15. mrfixitusa | Apr 25, 2008 04:43am | #29

    I was just wondering if the buyer has done any inspections

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