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Discussion Forum

Kitchen cabinet box thickness

cdpierc | Posted in General Discussion on November 15, 2005 10:02am

I’m planning on building on building about 10′ feet of kitchen cabinets (wall and base)and was wondering if using 1/2″ birch ply with dadoes is just as good as 3/4″ birch ply. All the cabinets will be face framed with cherry and cherry doors. Any input would be helpful. Thanks

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  1. stinger | Nov 15, 2005 10:18pm | #1

    Half-inch ply carcase sides is what I see when I look in the showrooms that sell most of the name brands:  Kraft Maid, etc.

    Unless you are going the inset door route, I prefer frameless cabs.  No faceframes to build at all.  Make all the carcase sides, floors, dividers, tops, etc., out of 3/4" melamine-faced particleboard.  Easily obtained, the melamine comes finished white or woodgrained maple.

  2. User avater
    Sphere | Nov 15, 2005 10:19pm | #2

    Depends..ya planning on Granite tops or HPL?

    I like 3/4 for all I can..more weight=more solid against racking and better availabilty of decent stock to work with, less inventory on hand, scraps are useable in differing locations ( I.E. a hidden Blind corner side can use the same material that is not showey enough for a finished side)..etc. or the ocaisional "whoops"..can be recycled in the same scope.

      Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

    HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp

    1. stinger | Nov 15, 2005 11:14pm | #3

      But wait!  Kraft Maid has 1/2-inch ply carcase sides, and the brand is used a lot here where I am, and under a whole lotta granite tops, without any additional top reinforcing.

      Are you aware of cabinet failures when 1/2-inch ply carcases are used under stone countertops?  I'm not.

      We did a kitchen two winters ago using Conestoga RTA cabs, faceframed and with 1/2" plywood sides, then made and placed 2-inch concrete countertops on them.  Most all the granite tops here are 1-1/4" thickness, so this set of 'crete tops was 60 precent more thickness and weight, as compared to stone tops. 

      Never saw a wobble, nothing crashed through the floor and all the way to the basement, everything is still standing, doors and drawers all work.

      1. User avater
        Sphere | Nov 15, 2005 11:46pm | #4

        I can also stand a pitcher of beer on a dollar bill with enough folds or rolls...don't make it right.  Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

        HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp

        1. stinger | Nov 16, 2005 12:02am | #5

          So what is right?  Should houses be framed with 2x8 studwalls?

          Should the door panels and other bodywork of your truck still be made of 20 gage sheet steel like back in the 50s?

          Those foamfilled steel entry doors everybody uses.  Should they be .024 steel like when they first came out in the 60s, or the .0179 that is common to 75 percent of them shipped today?

          We weren't sheathing houses in 7/16 OSB 20 years ago, but it sure predominates today.

          I'll bet that Conestoga kitchen we did with the 'crete tops would have taken tops at 3 inches thickness.

          Have you checked out carcase construction done by the higher end names in factory-built cabs.  Wood-Mode, Crystal, PlainNFancy, and a lot more, are all using 1/2" plywood for their sides.

          The thread starter asked if 1/2" ply was OK for his cab carcases, and I was trying to provide some facts.  Fact is, 1/2" ply sides will work, it's real common, and costs less than 3/4" ply.

           

          1. User avater
            Sphere | Nov 16, 2005 12:24am | #6

            You ever MAKE cabs? with say, MDF or MCP at 1/2 inch? Ever drill line holes on a mutiple spindle line borer? At 8mm? or 5mm? Eversee the blow out whena  shelf pin gets over loaded?

            Sure ya can do anything, and rightfully it'll hold the design value. I won't , I like my stuff to feel handmade, and exhibit it in the long run.

            You conviently missed my other points as far as inventory and common sizes in the shop atmosphere..in lieu of pounding the benefits of factory made cabs.

            After 2 yrs of hanging 2 kitchens and 4 baths a day, and templating tops..all paid by the box...I seen almost every manufactures "best" and worst..I stand by my beliefs, and you can feel free to disagree.

            If you'd sleep well at night witha $$$$ soapstone sink in a 1/2" ply sided  sinkbase with no back  and freestanding.....BTDT, then OK, I am anal and you are not a hack.

             

             

            edit: I was a distributer for wood mode during 1990-1993, and installer, why do you think offered the "upgrade" to the carcasses for "high end"?

              Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

            HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp

            Edited 11/15/2005 4:30 pm ET by Sphere

          2. stinger | Nov 16, 2005 01:16am | #7

            Now that you ask, Sphere, I actually have built cabinets!

            The first set of which, built in '76, had faceframes, and sides of (gasp!) 1/2" plywood.  And, they've not fallen apart, or racked, or slumped, or anything else I can tell, yet.

            Hey, look, I think most everything today has been "value engineered" down to its minimum standard for survival and acceptability, but the fact is, most all of it works.

            Sure, I wish we could all live in houses like they still build today in northern Europe, with heavy masonry walls, timbered roofs, doorframes made from 4x4s, exterior and interior doors at 60mm and 45mm thickness, respectively, plastered walls, tiled roofs, 1.5 inch stucco finish over the masonry on the outside, etc., etc.

            But we're running out of trees, and some of us are on a budget.

          3. User avater
            Sphere | Nov 16, 2005 01:33am | #8

            Ok..call me old school. What I create is not affecting the world timber market one iota..they still do it, wether I buy it or not.

            As far as your reference to foriegn lands, I was taught by a Chezch(?) that you build with dovetails..cuz yer taking the cabs with ya when ya go..they need to travel well.

            No pissing contest, just my method.  Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

            HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp

          4. FastEddie | Nov 16, 2005 04:34pm | #12

            You're not going to win the argument.   So be quiet and go back to doing quality work.

              

            "When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

          5. cdpierc | Nov 16, 2005 09:11pm | #13

            The reason I asked was because the house is just a small ranch and we probably won't be staying here more than a few years.

          6. VaTom | Nov 16, 2005 09:27pm | #14

            The primary problem I see with 1/2" stock is that I normally use 5/8" long screws to attach everything inside.  You're not gonna have a lot of purchase without them coming out the other side. PAHS Designer/Builder- Bury it!

  3. Bruce | Nov 16, 2005 08:29am | #9

    You could park your truck on a run of cabinets made of 1/2" ply and then fastened together.  The plywood will take a tremendous load in compression.  Be sure that the bases are all shimmed properly so loading from a slab will not cause them to deform.

    Bruce

    Between the mountains and the desert ...

    1. cdpierc | Nov 16, 2005 03:20pm | #11

      sorry didn't mean to start such a heated debate

  4. TomT226 | Nov 16, 2005 03:20pm | #10

    Don't know how experienced you are, so I'll say you can build'em outta 1/2", but 3/4" is easier for joinery.  I build all my carcases out of 3/4" paint grade Maple (if painted), with 1/2" ply backs, either BB or Ash, depending on what kind of finish is going on.  The 3/4" sides give more support for the adjustable shelf pins, and the 1/2" back replaces the back rail for mounting.  Cleaner look.  I also don't put any bottom rails on the base cabs, just make the base wider, and band the front.  Gives you 2" more room on the bottom.  Rabbet, glue, and brad the concealed sides. 

     

  5. User avater
    Mongo | Nov 16, 2005 09:38pm | #15

    You can get away with 1/2" but 3/4" would be much better.

    More plies, fasteners will hold better, more surface for glue, less chance of 3/4" splitting vs 1/2" splitting when screwing into the edge.

    More thickness means more purchase for screws used to attach drawer slides and other hardware.

    Make a cut list.

    Figure the sheet count.

    See if the extra $10 per sheet wil break the bank.

    Probably not.

    1. User avater
      Sphere | Nov 17, 2005 01:15am | #16

      Are you still my paid thug?

      Just wondering..gotta dog in the hood, pesterin us..this ain't gonna be a wet job, we be covert...

      LOL

      Thanks fer settin the dude striaght ..  Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks

      HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp

      " Nie dajê siê olœniæ statkami parowymi i kolej¹ ¿elazn¹. Wszystko to nie jest cywilizacj¹. - Francois Chateaubriand (1768 - 1848) "

      1. User avater
        Mongo | Nov 17, 2005 06:14am | #17

        'Course I'm yer man.But watch out. My sister lives down in Frankfort, she moved there when I used to live there many moons ago.She works in Lexington, I told her if she ever sees a couple of good old boys dangling a hundred feet up in the air off the courthouse steeple to let out a holler that "Mongo says Hi".Don't pizz her off.She could beat me up!<g>

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