Do any of you use lockout/tagout? Still working with an HVAC buddy, now we’re at a local college in New Rochelle installing a new A/C unit on a rooftop, and splitting the work with the college maintenance staff. They’re doing electrical, we’re doing the A/C installation/piping/etc. They disconnected the old unit, and the wires are laying (out in the rain) on the roof, but the breaker is not locked out. I’ve asked repeatedly for them to lock it out, they say yes, but never actually do it. I’m not sure which breaker it is, I think it’s this one.
of course, my guys are no better.
“Where’s the striker? NO! You absolutely will not light that torch with a lighter. Do you know what’s in a lighter??? Butane. Do you want to die? I don’t care if you’ve done it like this before. I will not allow it.”
I often b!itch about my shipping company, but this sort of bullsh!t is not tolerated.
Jonathan
Replies
I'm a big fan of living so yes I lock out, tag out. I wouldn't say for sure if that's the right breaker or not. You could ask them then lock it and tag it yourself I would imagine.
Gangstas don't dance. We boogie.
I've asked multiple times. They're of the opinion that, "no one's gonna turn it on" but no one ever thinks they're gonna die from a non locked out breaker. The scenario I can imagine is another unit trips, and the guy goes to the attic to reset, and turns on my breaker and I die. Pushing and pushing with no results ... always political repercussions to deal with, 'cause the likelihood is nothing is going to happen ... this time. But eventually it will happen, and I want to cultivate a culture of safety ... and that's not happening. It takes time, money and resources. It's one of those elusive gains. You never see the benefit, because it prevents an accident that didn't happen. And you don't see the cost of that, only the cost of implementing safety.Jonathanfair winds and following seas
Four words: They are total idiots.
Do what I do when guys have that attitude with me. Have them rehearse the apology they are going to make to my wife at my funeral. I did this a couple if weeks ago with a guy that insisted in using my insulated screw drivers instead of getting a regular one. I said. "Justin let me hear what your gonna say to my wife when you see her at the reception line at my visitation." He looked dumb founded. I said. "Is it going to sound like this?" Then I mocked crying. "If only I had reached around to the other side if his bag and got the right tool instead of his insulated ones. It wouldn't have taken any longer and he'd he alive.". Maybe it gave him something to think about. I also told hinm not to look at me like I was an ####. He's the one trying to kill me.
Gangstas don't dance. We boogie.
OSHA has two divisions, the enforcement group, and the education group. The education group will do free site inspections. I would call and ask for a courtesy inspection from the education/training side of the house. They will give the college an advisory note. A few weeks later the guys with the ticket books will show up. If the advice hasn't been followed, it is really hard to talk them out of the ticket or get the fines reduced.
Sounds like they've got some kind of Darwin experiment going on.
jt8
Time is the coin of your life. It is the only coin you have, and only you can determine how it will be spent. Be careful lest you let other people spend it for you.
-- Carl Sandburg
I'm guessing that part of the problem is that they can't lock out the breaker without a special adapter, and they don't have one. Not a reason, but probably excuse enough for them.
Even at that at least a piece of tape and sign would be a GREAT IMPROVEMENT.Now, to be honest I don't bother because I am the only one working on it or even around.But where you have two different companies working on it and multiple people in each one. And then you might have some other maintance people come along that don't know a thing about it. Recipe for disaster..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Very true.Another option is one could put a split bolt on the wires, though it would be no help while actually rewiring the unit.
As I stood before the gates I realized that I never want to be as certain about anything as were the people who built this place. --Rabbi Sheila Peltz, on her visit to Auschwitz
I wouldn't work on it unless it was locked out.
You don't have to wait for another unit to trip- just someone wandering by that notices one breaker "off" and then that person turns it "on".
I notice that breaker is 175 amps. That'll do some damage.
No thanks.
Watch this.. scroll down to the 480v 3 phase arc flash demo.
http://205.243.100.155/frames/longarc.htm#500_kV_Switch
That could be you.
I just spent way too long going through that link and watching those videos....that is some amazing stuff!
Aside from the whole fact that it can kill you, electricity is a pretty incredible thing to try to understand.
The one time I was shocked by 120v was enough for me though. It's not like it hurt so much as just didn't feel like something your body should feel. Multiply that by any number and it seems like a whole heap of trouble!
You will spend even more time if you explore some of the other links on that one page....
There is one on You Tube about a guy that inspects high voltage lines... high voltage like 500kV (could be more, I don't remember if they say exactly)... he gets on the line from a helicopter...
I don't think that one is linked, but it is worth the look.
Whoever said that time travel doesn't exist hasn't been on the internet :)
Glad to be of help :)
"There is one on You Tube about a guy that inspects high voltage lines... high voltage like 500kV (could be more, I don't remember if they say exactly)... he gets on the line from a helicopter..."
High Power Job
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I am pretty sure you should hand there supervisor a copy of this http://www.osha.gov/SLTC/controlhazardousenergy/standards.html
If that doesnt work hand whoever is over them a copy and on up the chain until someone with common sense takes action.
If that doesnt work call osha, whatever you do dont work on or near that area, theres no job worth your life.
Obviously, your warning has not been heeded. First things first. Get your own lock and attach it. They are inexpensive and you are entirely within your rights to put one on. At least you and your workers will be safe. If you are aware that a danger exists but continue to work under those conditions, you could be liable. Of course, it ain't that bright either. You will carry a heavy burden if someone gets killed. If you want to take on the education of these other workers, that's up to you. It's probably a waste of time. CYA
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
>>"Where's the striker? NO! You absolutely will not light that torch with a lighter. Do you know what's in a lighter??? Butane.
Opps. I been dumb. (although I keep my striker in my torch bucket, there've ben times....)
What is the issue/problem?
"Ask not what the world needs. Ask what makes you come alive... then go do it. Because what the world needs is people who have come alive."
Howard Thurman
http://rjw-progressive.blogspot.com/
the torch might start a bit more aggressively than you anticipate, and ignite the entire lighter which is full of butane, and you will lose your hand, drop the flaming lighter and maybe burn the house down.fair winds and following seas