Got an opportunity to get a free tree, already down, cut in roughly 12 foot chunks. Big. Major part is on top of everything else. 3 to 4 foot diameter. Sawmill won’t take it because it may have spikes or fence embedded. Bad location and can’t get it whole without a big crane, which would not be worth it for me. “Coffee bean tree”. Looks like english oak. Nice wood and rare in these parts.
Never tried to split anything that big. Could take it if it were quartered. Any chance I can split it with a sledge and wedges? It’s green. Only down for a month. Any clever tricks?
Replies
Dyn-o-miiiiite !!!
Can't we all just get a log ? - Paul Bunyon
Quittin' Time
5 feet from one house and 15 from another. 2 doors down from a police officer. While probably entertaining, dynomite is not a viable option. I was hoping for possibilities that would result in lumber rather than mulch.
The easist way (not REAL easy) is to rip it with a chainsaw. I had a Woodmizer for a lot of years and ripped stuff up to over 6" diameter (not to mention a 14' diameter Redwood log). The trick is to get a chainsaw with a long bar (a 5 footer is an easy-to-get item for a good saw shop).
Snap a chalk line on the log and make a few starting cuts with the saw with the bar nose...don't try to plunge the cut with the bar perpendicular to the log....kind of drag the bar at a slight angle, making several passes, deeper and deeper. You'll get a much straighter cut and recover more lumber.
Give the saw an occasional rest to cool off....chainsaws are not built for long, sustained hard work. And the shavings will be long and stringy....keep the sprocket guard cleaned out.
You don't really need a ripping chain to do this for only a log or two. If your bar is too short make some wedges out of some hard wood....limbs work great...and drive them into the saw kerf. Just a few raps on each wedge, back and forth, keeping the splitting action even along the length of the log.
Caution: the log may come apart in a hurry...block the two potential halves up before you start so you don't end up doing the splits and getting creamed!
If you have to quarter the log, follow the same proceedure as above.
Thanks. I might try that. I would need to do some careful rigging now that you mention it. I would probably cut halfway through then wrap some chains around it so the two halves don't roll apart (and on me). Then try to split with wedges and a sledge. This thing is real heavy. The tree guys could not remove it with a 10 ton crane. Boom was all the way out, but still it must weigh a couple tons.
I have done it the Notchman way for a super sized pine and it wsa still heavy. I can imagine that oak will definitely be more likely to snap apart in a big hurry once it decides to let go, but heavy rope might be safer than chain. It will absorb some shock and if you still need to go back into the split with the chainsaw to finish the separation, you don't want to hit a chain with it.
Here are acouple of other forums that might have some suggestions from experienced woods guys.
Is there any way to get a dolly cart under it? The wheel is one of man's finest inventions.
http://www.woodworking.org/cgi-bin/ubboard/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro&BypassCookie=true
http://www.forestryforum.com/cgi-bin/board/YaBB.pl
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Excellence is its own reward!
bob I do a lot of cutting and splitting of larger trees (3-5' across the butt end) and I use the Alaskan saw mill attached to my 3' chain saw . Works fine for slabbing the trees into manageable sizes. Not good for making lumber tho, takes too much kerf (about 3/8") If the tree is in the 5' or better I use black powder to crack it in halves or quarters. And yes I always let the local police know when and where sometimes they like to come and watch. Makes about the same noise as one of those lil' cannons they use to start the sail boat races here in S. MD. The saw mill jig only costs about $160 or so, the chain saw runs around $800. Mine has paid for itself many times over the years. If you want to crack it with the black powder let me know and I'll explain the process step by step. It's very simple. safe and works every time. Good Luck Bill D. QWC
Interesting options. I have powder, but I'm not sure this would be a good candidate for a first-time attempt. This is really residential. They would like me to take it with a crane, but that's not an option for me. Lumber is worth only maybe $2K in the rough. $200 as firewood. Crane and flatbed and all that would be too much. I have a decent Stihl saw but don't think it could handle a big bar. Only a model 250. I can look into renting one. The idea of having a chainsaw mill is interesting. Would be really nice to get a couple wide quartered slabs down the middle. I have a friend with a big "portable" bandsaw mill, but not enough room to set up for that. The powder idea is also interesting because I'm not thrilled with the possibility of running into a fence post with the saw. Always a possibility. Checked it with a detector and doesn't seem to be any real big bits, but you never know.
If you split it with powder, does it split in a predictable way? I have another friend with a 30 acre woodlot and I'm sure he would enjoy seeing that process. I could try it out there safely. This something where you use a half ounce or something like that? Don't really want 3 tons airborne.
Bob, It will split with the grain, so if the tree is badly twisted the split will follow the twist. Also, if the tree has many large knots it will split in and around them. It's a simple process by boring or plunge cutting with a chain saw about halfway down the length of the log making sure the cut reaches the heart of the log or a bit beyond. Then, fold a length of cannon fuse which is twice the depth of the hole plus 12 inches in half. Stuff the fold down into the hole leaving two 6 inch fuse ends sticking out. Dump black powder (or I use Pirodex) in the hole, tamp with a wooden stick or ramrod. Then stuff in a scrap of paper towel or other wadding. Fill the the rest of the hole with dirt, or sand or lime (anything that will pack well, even sugar!) Light both ends of the fuse for a positive ignition. (I used just one fuse one time and it fizzled out. I left the log sitting out in the field for a week in the rain before I approached it.) Then walk away (briskly, don't run. Too much risk of falling down!) about 75 feet away. BOOOOOM! Log jumps about 2 feet then lands in two halves. If you can't get the log to your friends lot to BOOM in then consider using the Alaskan chain saw mill to slab it up. I used an empty field next to a grave yard. No complaints, no one woke up!
Any questions? Just email me.
Billy D QWC
thanks, Billy - - this forum never ceases to amaze me...
Thanks. I'll try that some time. I have access to a much bigger tree that came down in the hurricane. More like 5-6 feet at the butt and deep in a thick stand. Can only pull it with a winch to the nearest access. Going to try something weird with the other tree. Make a pocket at one end, put a 10 ton hydraulic jack in the pocket and pump until it splits. Maybe.
40 ton porta power.
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
Also a good idea. Don't know whether to get one of those or an adapter to make a chainsaw mill. If I got the portapower, could maybe squash some of the dents in my truck.
There's 60 ton hi-lift ram that works in all posistions. Not much resists for long....
Look into the Enterpac system. That will get you drooling. Their air over hydraulic set up is the cat's meow. They also hace electric drive / hydraulic systems. Last I knew IIRC they go up to 500 ton. A 100 tonner is a no sweat for them.
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
I've seen those. Nice. Don't know exactly why I need one, but I'd probably figure that out if I got one. Now that I think about it, there's a volunteer fire company down the road that has a whole setup. Maybe they'd like to come over and practice with my tree. I could maybe convince them with a case of beer. Nothing quite goes together like chainsaws and beer. That's why they sell those hard hats with beer can holders on the sides.
You could lift that log - put rollers under it and tow / roll it to where ever like.
How about a breaker hammer and a few over sized steel wedges in case the spade gets stuck...
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
The log is landlocked. Houses and fences close by. Septic on one side, so no trucks there. Wellhead and stone walls and other stuff in the way. Also, 10KV power main is too close to bring in a crane. The main trunk is laying on the offcuts from higher up the tree. Not real stable. The fact that they didn't smash anything important is a tribute to the skill of the tree guys who took down what remains of the tree. But, even they couldn't figure out how to get the lumber out. It will take some creative thinking.
I will wager that that method will only suceed in spliting off a two or three foot piece before the crack runs to the out side of the log. Just my guess. Let us all know hoiw it works out.
If you must saw to the middle or beyond as you say, what is the point of the black powder? The job is already half to half plus done and clearly wedges at that point would make short work of the final split.
Is it just more fun your way?
I got a hold of a half case of basting stuff (not sure if it was dynamite or not) and blasting caps and had a ball driving four or six sticks at a time under stumps years ago. So if your method is simply fun I understand.
JR
I think you might have misunderstood. You make one plunge cut right in the middle of the log to the heart of the log, not the entire length of the log. Yes, my way is a lot of fun, and since they don't alow fireworks here in So. MD this is the only alternative (fun) I have. 'Cept my wife, of course! Of course I would also recommend to Bob the chain saw mill and a gin pole to lift the slabs on to a truck.
Billy D QWC
Ok, got it. One plunge? And it splits relatively straight the entire length? What is the longest length you have tried this approach with? Not a standard 16' I trust (my timber background is showing, hardwoods are probably 8 foot lengths, ya?)
JR..... splitting straight? That depends on how straight the log is. The logs that I use are almost veneer quality, no knots, no twists (fresh cut if possible cells in the tree are still full of fluid which will not compact upon explosion, like dry cells will) . $$ but, No matter what the quality of the log twisted or not, 1/2 a small campbell's( tomatoe )soup can of Pirodex will split the log clean in half. And as for the lengths, I have split logs that were 14 -16 feet long and 4-5 feet in diameter. No problem! When in doubt I use 1/2 (plus a pinch)of a soup can of Pirodex "FFG Small Grain" pack well ..like loading a black powder rifle. Log jumps up in the air (maybe 2' high as you stand about 60' 70' away), lands in two halves. If it splits well enough I can split the halves again into quarters with a 1/4 can. I have a video of the Amishman (no face shots) who taught me how to do it. What used to take me 1/2 a day with sledge and wedges now takes about 10 minutes. most logs are white oak. Have fun but be careful.
Billy D QWC
Edited 10/28/2003 10:38:53 PM ET by 20657
That's about 2 ounces of powder or so. Be careful, that's quite substantial. There are probably a lot of forum readers who are familiar, but probably many who are not. Good that you use Pyrodex. It is much safer than actual black powder. Black powder can ignite much easier and requires special storage and handling. Pyrodex doesn't require special facilities and permits for storage. Pyrodex burns. Black powder detonates. A subtle but important difference. Don't try log splitting with that much black powder without experience. Don't store it in or near a dwelling. It gets less stable with age, so don't keep it around for a decade. Past a couple years, pour water in the can and distribute it in the garden. Decent fertilizer and high in nitrates. Do not get it on your hands. Not healthy. Don't light the fuse and watch if you value your eyesight. There can be a lot of splinters moving at Mach 1. Let's stress that if you don't have experience handling this stuff, get help. This seems to be a technique I may have occasion to use, but it's very much a "safety first" thing. Don't want to hear about it on the 6 O'clock news.
What did you say you used for a fuse?
You buy red or green waterproof canon fuse. Available from many fine firearms purveyors or sometimes from hobby shops that sell those little toy rockets. Sometimes they only have it in real short pieces. 6 inches is not enough. You need a couple feet. Burns at a couple seconds per inch. Also available, of course, on the internet.
JR,... I use the green cannon fuse. And I buy in the 25'-50' rolls , like I said I do a bit of splitting. Also as Bob posted before this is not a FIRECRACKER !!!!. You'll have 1-2 tons of log jumping 1-2' in the air ( not many splinters .but do stand back 60-70') . And I do let the local police know , I live in a farm area,but still you got to let folks know what's gonna go on. You don't want someone grandma having a heart attack because when the log went BOOM!!!... she choked on a chicken bone and had the Big one. But seriously this does work ...but do be careful!!!. I'm kinda sorry I responded so lightly on the subject.. I was responding to an alternative to inaccessibility with bob's situation. And it works best on straight grain. Good luck Billy D. QWC I just noticed I responded to the right post wrong person. I'try to get it right
Edited 10/29/2003 9:25:23 PM ET by 20657
Bob,
I split quite a few 12' locust and black walnut logs for fencing. Your log will split much easier after it has dried out a bit. Take the bark off of your logs, they will dry quicker. If you can find one, get a bark spud to do this and do it soon, the bark comes off much easier when the log is green. Set them up off the ground on some of the other logs.
As it dries it will build up internal stresses as the wood shrinks and splitting the log will be much easier. Look for checks at the end and follow them down the trunk. Hopefully the grain won't twist in a spiral down the trunk, but you will be able to see this as it dries out. I've got a collection of about 8 iron wedges for doing this sort of splitting, but seldom use more than 4 at a time. Always meant to make a few big hardwood wedges to encourage the split to run and free the iron ones when they get stuck, but never have.
Good luck with it whatever method you choose.
slab it on site. here are 2 methods:
http://www.procutportablesawmills.com/index.html
http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles/tre139.html
Those links didn't work for me.
The first had nothing about sabbing on site.
The second one returned a 404 error.Bumpersticker: Practice safe sex. Go screw yourself.
I run a portable 8" X 26' Lucas mill big enuf for your log on site. A VW mill (Mobile Dimension) would do it, too. No big deal, we do big'uns every day out here now that most of the big mills won't accept anything bigger than 25" DBH.
I'd come mill it for you, but it's too long a hike.
http://www.sawmill-exchange.com/index.htm
http://www.mobilemfg.com/
http://www.baileys-online.com/
http://www.woodmizer.com/welcome.html
Check the phonebook and the mill manufacturers/sellers for portable sawmillers locally. Local tree service guys will know of them, too. Few advertise.
You need a big Lucas or Mobile Dimension....the sawyer will do it on shares or for a fixed fee.....around $400/1000BF here, depending on what you want....4/4 stock takes a lot longer to mill than 4X4 stock.
Good luck.