A comment in another thread about working alone got me wondering about scaffolding when working alone. I use standard 5X5 metal scaffold. Which is a pain to set up and move over and over again.
What do others use when working alone?
Under 6′ i use ladders and a plank.
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Anything I can.
I have pump jacks, ladder jacks, and two A frame wooden plank holders.
For scaffold I can set two high from the ground, then hook the 3rd on the pins and set that. After that its a haul rope and a helper.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
The problem I have is with the metal frames I have to take it all apart and move it. Before with a helper we could carry it.Just did some reading and it said that with A frame wood scaffold you can go 10'. That might be good as then i could get 16' high. High enough for most single story gable ends.May also have to look at Ladder jacks. Have used them before and found them bouncy.
I made my wood A frames like Smitty has with 10' 2x4s and 1x6's about 2' wide, all PT. Too top heavy and too heavy to tote much. So I cut them down to about 9' when folded, and working about 7-8' tall.I also like my extendable alum pic, goes 8' to 11' no problem setting it about by myself, and I have a bad back.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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"Extendable Alum pic" ???What do you mean? I Have not heard that term before.
I got it at HD or Lowes. Ever see the old wooden ones? Two halves that slide into each other? Like that, but Alum.Sorry I can't give ya a picture on this computer. I'm sure some kind soul would dig one up.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
I have site build using cleats on window openings and between studs. With a 2X10 fir for a plank. With fir 2X10 I find 10' to be the comfortable span as a scaffold plank. I have gone further but it deflects too much for me. I have also put a 2X6 on edge under the center and screwed them together. A T shape to stiffen longer spans.I also have a bakers scaffold with wheels for inside work. Good for about a 12' ceiling. You can get/rent taller ones and so far I have not needed to.
I was never too fond of hem fir planks. Doug fir is good but watch for knots. Yellow pine is great but when it decides to break, it just explodes. Also watch for knots. I was always very comfortable on 10' spans too with a single. If the doug fir was good, I'd go 12 without fear. At 14', I always doubled them. I'd walk a double 18' but I'd be careful about knots again. 20' and I'd be looking for microlams or glue lams or some form of a truss or something. I also was big on adding intermediate support too but be careful....they cause teeter/totter situations. In 90% of my work, I'd lean all the material up and cut and fit everything up there. I never used a cut man and for me, it was the same as working alone on the deck. I got very creative at building workstations up in the air. Airguns are great for that.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
I made these planks. Scored some mobile home roof 'trusses' for a couple of bucks apiece and then screwed/glued 1/2" plywood both sides for a 12 ft plank that served me well inside and out in my house. Worked well, They are relatively lightweight and strong.
Is this a saw horse type thing?
No it's a walkboard type thing.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
They work pretty good. I never had one but I've worked on them on some interior work. If I was a remodeler, I'd own one or two..http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
I work alone most of the time but I still prefer using pipe scaffolding, the same 5'x5' frames you're talking about. I agree, they're heavy and a pain to set up and move, but there are some things you can do to make it easier.
First off, get some 30-inch-high frames to supplement your 60-inchers. They are half the weight of the full-height frames and easier to carry in a pickup truck. They can also be combined with your standard 5x5 frames to create steps when setting up on hillsides too steep to handle with adjustable screw feet.
Second, get some 7' cross braces in addition to the standard 10' ones. I like using work platforms with hooks because they're twice as wide and much more solid than 2x12 planks. They also sit flush on the frames so you don't have that trip hazard where two planks overlap each other. But 10-foot-long platforms are heavy and to shift one alone is dangerous and one of the worst PITAs I can think of. 7' platforms, OTOH, are 30% lighter and easy to shift alone.
Finally, carry a 50' length of 13mm braided rope with you so you can haul up and send down frames.
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How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
I have three little giant type ladders and 2 adjustable alum. walkboards.These are easy to set up very stable and give me 26' walkboard run.with the little giants it is fairly easy to accommodate sloping ground or shrubbery.
You can walkup the ladder and step on to the w.board with ease.Most hooks slide into the gap on the walkboard so are less likely to be a trip issue.
ANDYSZ2WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
How high up can you achieve that 26' walk plank? That sounds like a great setup for remods.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
My ladders are 7' tall as step ladders and are fairly stable but I will tie off if I feel uncomfortable.
You can get little giants up to ten ft I believe but they would be really heavy.
ANDYSZ2WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
Here is an example of and extendable aluminum pic http://www.americanladders.com/ladder/product.php?productid=16338&cat=300&page=1It's great for working off of while doing crown moulding. It's adjustable so it usually fits for any standard room. I also use mine to put the miter saw on and many other uses. Very versatile for me. Well worth it.
I use fiberglass ladders, werner ladder jacks and werner pics a lot. i own a 24' ,2man pic and two 16 ft. pics the 24ft. ,2 man pic hasn't been out of the shop in a couple years- the 16 ft. pic travel a lot. i have a wooden version of a stretch plank-similar to the aluminum one sphere mentions and kltzycarpenter showed. frankly-at this point I might be willing to trade the 24' 2man pic for one of those adjustable planks-cause I don't think the 24 fter is ever gonna leave the shop again. I don't leave equipment on the customers property overnight-so you get good at set up take down- I can get 4 ladders and 2,16 ft. pics up and operational in just a few minutes.stephen
Why do you not use the 24' pic?I tend to leave my scaffolding as I work rural mostly.the extra 8' means less supports.most of my work is under 48' so only need 3 supports.
Good topic cjeffrey.
Hopefully, others will weigh in with the "proper" setups....my experience has been with site built stuff. I have set more than my share of standard metal stuff though too. Sometimes, it makes the most sense.
It really will depend upon what tasks you are doing. Each task has their own needs and desires.
In my framing history, I worked alone on my own setups 99% of the time. I rarely set a scaffold with the idea that more than one would be working on it. The tasks that I were doing were varied. I rarely had to set up scaffold to put siding on a wall because we did all that before we set them.
With all that said, I liked good old doug fir 2x10's best because they were the right weight for me and we always had an abundance of them. The support structure was: anything and everything i.e. ladders, sawhorses, carpenters benches etc.
Another thing I did a lot of was to simply lean several straight ladders against a wall and then walk from ladder to ladder. It would not be uncommon to see me hoarding both 20' wood extension ladders. I'd split them up and have 4 leaning on a wall. I can cover about 4' per ladder without going up or down...so I could effectively work 20' of wall without a plank.
What kind of work are you normally scaffolding for?
For low stuff ladders or sawhorses and planks work good.I wonder about higher stuff.Had to sheet a high wall the other day, or something like vinyl siding and soffit and fascia.
I always treated the high work the same as my low work....same principles, different height. I've done the ladder jack thing...the ladders can get bouncy and sheet stock can blow in the wind. How good are your tite-rope walking skills? http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
I like ladder jacks and stinson planks. 3 ladders, 3 jacks and (2) 24' planks work well. With the above, you can stage one side of most ranches/capes/colonials by yourself in under 20 minutes. The 12" X 24' stinson is only 69lbs and rated for 500lbs...
That sounds light. I'm not familiar with Stinson. The pics I had were so heavy I finally left them lay around on a job so long someone took them. I didn't care LOL.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
I work alone a lot . Most times I use either wooden A frames with an aluminum 12"x16ft plank (much easier to carry than a wooden plank and it doesn't rot)
If it is higher and more involved such as siding.
Then I get help to set up the pump jacks and the 24ft pic and up I go.
I never set this stuff up without help. I'm just not that strong or stupid.
Most of the time on low to medium stuff i'll bring a couple of ladders some ladder jacks and the 16ft Pic.
the trick is to plan your work accordingly so as not move this stuff too often.
I guess it all comes down to the situation your are faced with as to how you are going to stage it.
I have ladder jacks which I use when the grade around the house is uneven or obstructed. When I can use something else I sure do.
I have a couple of little giant knockoffs that go from 5' to 9' and then put a plank between up to 14', but i'm a little guy.
I also have a bunch of 5x5 frames with 7' braces that get a lot of use. I work alone up to 2 racks high but higher than that I get a helper, not for setting up and taking down scaffold, but just because it takes up too much time and effort moving up and down with materials and the rest of whatever's being installed.
j
So one of my jobs coming up is to put on vinyl siding. Usually one cuts and the other is on the scaffolding which we run the entire length of the house and installs.Obviously I need to change my method as I do not want to climb up and down that much.I had thought about using an angle grinder and cutting the siding on the scaffold. Take up a box and leave it on the scaffold.Any other thoughts or help appreciated.
Angle grinder for Vinyl?Big snips is all ya need.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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used to use snips, now I use a SCMS with backwards blade and a grinder for long cuts. Maybe I should go back to snips.
I've done more V and Al. than I'd like to admit. I made a cut table from 2 2x10s ( wide) and 1x2's as a spacer full length front and back. They are a "fence" and can be marked for repeat cuts. on TOP of them I use 2 1x3's with a rabbet edge that captures my circsaw base , like rails to ride in/on.One set of rails for crosscut and one set longer for the rake angle.Carbide blade backwards or a fine tooth plywood blade.Slide the siding under the guide rails and make the cuts.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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Used to use a homemade jig/fence for the circular saw then switched to the SCMS way faster and easier.I would not take the jig up on scaffold.
Snips or the angle grinder I could.Will try both and see what I think.
Edited 11/29/2009 7:43 pm ET by cjeffrey
Snips will set you free..http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!Edited 11/29/2009 6:37 pm by jimAKAblue <!-- JIMAKABLUE -->
Edited 11/29/2009 6:38 pm by jimAKAblue
a frames, pump jacks, ladder jacks, pipe staging, wall brackets.
It all depends on the job and the site.
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Wasn't thinking it is to cold for snips, pieces tend to crack. So angle grinder with diamond blade works better in the cold.
Absolutely angle grinder for vinyl, especially in the cold. Put a thin cutoff wheel in it and it's fast and easy and accurate. Get a Makita cordless 18v grinder and you're really set to go on scaffolding. It works great. On vinyl my snips come out for mitering corners in J channel but most everything else is with the grinder on a scrap of OSB.
About the only time my circular saw or scms comes out is for cutting soffit to length in the box.
mmmmm ... vinyl siding ;)
j
Try a diamond blade. Doesn't leave the grinder dust on it.
cjeffrey,
my 24 ft. pick is heavy and awkward to set up single handed- frankly it ain't fun with TWO people to set up It's also awkward to transport and inconvienient to leave on my truck for extended periods- basically-it's a pain. but 2, 16 ft. picks- go up quickly and easily---solo.
stephen
Grant has a sub , a thin guy like me, maybe even thinner. Not as tall either.One job Dale and I were up roof and saw Max walking by with a 24" x24' pic on his shoulder like a 10' 2x4. Just sauntering to the trailer to load it up.MAn, it made me feel REAL old, real fast. Those things KILL me.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
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PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
I was doing some vinyl today and tried your diamond blade suggestion. Worked fine but very slow compared to a thin cutoff wheel. Maybe my diamond wheel wasn't brand new either. j
I find my diamond wheel about the same speed. Around here it is mostly vinyl. Maybe a little brick or stone on the front then the rest of the house is vinyl. Stucco also happens some but it is 4 or 5 times the price and takes up to a couple of years before it seems like the guys doing it get around to finish it.Very little FC or the like. To many bad jobs, probably guys not knowing what they are doing with a new product. And more costly for the product and the installation.
Where are you? Interesting that you're in a pocket where the fiber cement gospel hasn't reached (yet). I find it like vinyl in that it's easy to put it on but not so easy to put it on well. I have an exterior reno coming up in the spring that will involve a combination of vinyl and an existing limestone facade. It's like having a starbucks coffee and a mcmuffin for breakfast. j
I am in Saskatchewan.
If I ever do some more vinyl, and if I ever buy a grinder, I'll try your method. I'm curious.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
<If I ever do some more vinyl, and if I ever buy a grinder,>Why does that make me wonder if either of those things are ever likely to happen?I was putting vinyl on today and thinking about it a bit up on my big scaffolds with my grinder. I don't really like vinyl siding but it's been several years since I sided a renovation with anything else, I'm embarrassed to say. I use hardieplank on my new construction but on renos the customers are asking for vinyl from the get-go. Part of it is that a lot of exterior renos here involve wrapping the house in rigid foam insulation. Wrapping the house in plastic foam and then trying to convince the customer that wrapping it in plastic siding is a bad idea for environmental reasons doesn't make sense to people. They feel like I'm just trying to up-sell them on a pricier siding. Maybe I need a new pitch. I guess this thread is actually about scaffolds. oops. jAlso, to be honest, I can install vinyl effeciently by myself but wood and FC I can't.
I actually didn't mind installing vinyl siding. I was never a snob though and simply did my best with it...just like I do with any project.I don't doubt that a cutoff wheel would work..I just like the idea of being able to cut everything with a very light too hanging in my pouch. I've never owned a cutoff tool though and I doubt that I'll be buying one soon. My son in law might own one though. Like I said...I'm curious. As far as your attempt to upsell....That's a topic for the business thread but I'll take a stab at it. I wouldn't attempt to upsell from vinyl by talking about the negatives. That's a lose/lose proposition. Instead, sell the upperscale products by talking about their benefits: longevity, beauty, fire and insect resistance, resale value, etc. If you try to diss the vinyly and they end up choosing it because of budget, you are basically telling them that their new remodel is substandard junk. I had several vinyl houses. I don't mind the stuff at all.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
One more kick at the cat for solo installing on scaffolds with vinyl. The thing that makes a big difference for me with the grinder is those Big Lug tool hooks or similar (like Gunook or something - i've tried 'em all) I wear a shoulder harness with my tool belt and there's one hook always attached to the back of the belt and if i'm by myself above the ground there's two more in front on the suspenders. Grinder, impact driver, stapler, all that stuff that otherwise has to be set down somewhere now has a place to ride along. Way safer and quite a bit faster too. Looks a bit funny but it works great. j
I second the big Lugg and suspenders.Do you put planks on the scaffold for a work bench?
how does OHSA view home made scaffolding board. around here you get fine just thinking about it.
My work is usually rural. And I am in Canada.
<Do you put planks on the scaffold for a work bench?>Yes I do. and a scrap of osb on the planks to cut on. The only height that is really a pain is when i can reach everything i need to from the top level of scaffolding but don't need another layer. Then the cutting surface is at the level of my feet and it's not so convenient. j
Jeff couldn't help but chime in on the grinder use with the vinyl siding. Never tried it but I'll give it a try next time I'm doing some vinyl. I think I might be doing my neighbor's house in the spring.If I read this correctly, you are using a diamond blade like the one for tile or masonry work right?Just like JimAKA blue I'm curious;)Cool tip can't wait to try it.
I use a 4.5" grinder with either a very fine cutting disc or a diamond blade. I find the diamond blade doesn't leave as much grinder dust. Either one leaves dust from the siding.I find a 4.5 inch grinder small enough to handle with one hand.
Cool, Thanks for the tip.
A whole ago i bought a twin pack of Ryobi 4.5" grinders I have one in the truck with a sanding disc on it for coping molding and other quick uses. But i have the other one sitting in the garage in the box.
I might just have to hook it up with a diamond wheel and give this a try.I reach for the grinder often for all kinds of weird things, now it's always in the truck,
To get back to the original post of scaffolding and working solo.I just repaired a roof on a bay window above the garage doors at a customers house yesterday.
I set up 2 ladders and ladder jacks.
I needed to get my aluminum pic up on the jacks which were now about 12ft in the air.
Now on lower stuff i can just lift one one end of the pic and place it on a ladder jack ad grab the other end and walk up the ladder with it.that was not going to work this time.So i used one of my cargo straps and hooked it on the ladder jack so it would hold one end about half way up. then i lifted the other end and climbed the ladder with it placed it on the ladder jack and then took care of the other end. Worked great. same thing to get it down afterward.
just thought I would share that;)
Hey CJeffrey
Just got back from Loweslooked at the diamond wheels for the grinder.
there where 2 different types of diamond wheels
1: had small teeth on the side of the wheel.
2: had no side teeth but had some grooves taken out of the outer edge of it.
Which one are you using?Never used a diamond wheel before so I have no idea which one.
I use one without teeth.
Hey thanks for the info,
Just checked back in this morning and OMG!!!!
The whole breaktime site was different and i could not log in.
Ginder works great. I just finished a job on my house where I was bringing a roof line into the second story of my house. I just snapped a line where the roof would meet the side and ran the grinder over it. I could build and sheath the roof and then just before shingles, I took enough siding off to do the job. It works slick.You get out of life what you put into it......minus taxes.
Marv
Grinder is good for cutting siding in place in renovation work. Doing a porch addition on a 2 story house and had to cut the corner post off for the new roof line. Grinder did it excellent.
I don't use the diamond wheel. That was the other guy in this thread. I tried his suggestion the other day and didn't like it - went back to my thin cutoff wheel today. The best thin wheels to use are the really cheap ones. They have a coarse and uneven grit in them that is terrible for metal but sails through vinyl really well. If the wheel's not too worn down you can easily do three layers at a time. Don't go so slow or press so hard that the wheel burns out in the work surface below. Start near yourself and let the wheel pull its way through the cut. Simple crosscuts and notches for windows and doors work fine, but where the grinder really shines is those long angled cuts as you work up the gables on a 4-12 roof. Cutting those with snips is nothing but a request for carpal tunnel syndrome. j
I'll give that a try first considering that the diamond wheel was $12-$25 dollars and the cut off wheels are just a few bucks.I have some scrap vinyl some where, can't wait to try it;)
Heres a set up I just put up today . A tower of pipe staging consisting of 3 lifts of 5' tall and 1 3' lift on top .
Extension ladder and aluminum jack on the right supporting a 16' staging deck .
Notice the ladder is tied to the wall and the deck tied to the ladder .
Access ladder onto the tower . This job is to remove the old gutter liners and replace and relay the lowest 3' of slate just above the metal .
7' snap on decks are on the lifts .
View Image
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Why the ladder to get on to the scaffold? I usually just climb the scaffold.Easier to carry stuff up?
Wait'll you get to be our age...LOLFunny tho' when I first started working with SeeYou ( a poster here) I showed up a job before the other guy ( with the ladder) and I was supposed to shingle a cone shaped roof, the scaffold was up.By gawd, I got the shingles up, almost killed me, and when Dale came up, he looked at me, and said "How did you get the shingles up?" I said, I climbed em up...
He said, "You can't climb scaffold with shingles"I just said "Thanks for telling me that NOW"
LOLSpheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
You'll learn that that is a receipe for fatigue and frustration .
Why work twice as hard to get up where you're working .
I suppose if you are going up a lot then it sure would be easier.
For me -- it's going up at all. I find trying to get down is worse , climbing over the side .
Oh yeah.
I feel it some days too.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
PROUD MEMBER OF THE " I ROCKED WITH REZ" CLUB
I think The Slatesman's right about a ladder to get up even for a young guy. Climbing the scaffolds takes effort that I want to be spending on job progress not climbing, 'specially carrying materials or tools up there. My setup's very much like his except that I have wooden planks so not such a long span to the ladder jack. I also rarely rarely get as level and clear a place to set up as he has there. If that were my jobs there would be a couple of pyramidal cedars and some rosebushes and a decorative garden gnome or boulder to work around. Plus a grade sloping away from the house so you have to bury the legs near the house and block up the far ones. I'd give a discount for a nice flat setup spot like he's got in that picture. Wow. No jealousy here, not me. j
What did it take you to set that up? 30 mins maybe?copper p0rn
I'm 59 with bursitis in a hip <G>
How 'bout a couple hours ! 30 years ago when movement was fluid it would have been 30 minutes .