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Long Landscape Stairs

randomr | Posted in Construction Techniques on December 18, 2007 05:21am

I have a cottage with a steep slope to the water. The existing stairs (6 of different lengths) follow the slope (supported on deck blocks), but are too narrow and need to be replaced.

Instead of so many sets I would like to make at least two with 32 foot long stringers (PT 2x10s doubled up on each side). Each tread would be two 2×6’s 48 inches long dadoed into the stringers. Because of the width, and instead of a middle stringer, I would like to use a threaded rod through the stringers under each tread (nuts and washers on the outside of the stringers), with a block of wood wedged under middle  to provide the added support.

Other ideas?

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Replies

  1. User avater
    boiler7904 | Dec 18, 2007 05:33am | #1

    If it's as steep as your saying, I'd opt for more shorter runs with landings in between than two really long tuns without landings. Your idea will get tiring after a couple of times up them.

     
    1. randomr | Dec 19, 2007 05:27am | #3

      I haven't had a chance to do any measurements (just bought the cottage and existing steps are under alot of snow), but the length of the stringers may not have to be a full 32 feet and I do plan to have a couple of landings.Right now the longest stringer is about 14 feet and if I can eliminate a run of 14 feet then a landing and another set of say 10 feet by combining them I think that would be an improvement. But I know that if I making them too long it will be too tiring.Thanks for the comment.

  2. Kivi | Dec 18, 2007 06:05am | #2

    Why wouldnt you use 2x6 risers to support the span of a single wider tread, rather than the threaded rod scenario supporting 2 2x6's ( which I do not think will give adequate stiffness).

    1. randomr | Dec 19, 2007 05:51am | #4

      I thought I would leave the riser open and I was thinking I might go for a rise of 8 inches, but it may be easier just to use a riser.Thanks for the input.

      1. Snort | Dec 20, 2007 02:11am | #11

        An 8" rise over your long run will keep you in shape... but unless you're looking to waive gym fees, you might want to keep them around 7", makes a big difference in the comfort level. Winterlude, Winterlude, my little daisy,

        Winterlude by the telephone wire,

        Winterlude, it's makin' me lazy,

        Come on, sit by the logs in the fire.

        The moonlight reflects from the window

        Where the snowflakes, they cover the sand.

        Come out tonight, ev'rything will be tight,

        Winterlude, this dude thinks you're grand.

        1. peteshlagor | Dec 20, 2007 02:39am | #12

          Anyone have experience with some form of gondola or car suspended from a track allowing electric mechanical lift for such beach access?

           

          1. User avater
            BillHartmann | Dec 20, 2007 03:58am | #14

            I live on a small residential lake, but it is really limited as to any places that a tram would be usefull.But there is a only lake nearby that is much steeper lots. I have seen them at that lake. But most of them appeared to be very old.But about 15 years ago when I was looking for a boat lift so of the same people made tramways..
            .
            A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.

          2. randomr | Dec 20, 2007 05:40am | #15

            Thanks for the idea - I have looked at a few web sites.This may come after the stairs, but I am keeping the option open by considering where I place the stairs so I don't block a logical path for what ever we should call it - a tram? inclined lift? inclined elevator?

          3. Faulted1 | Dec 20, 2007 07:23am | #16

            Wasn't there an ad in one the last few FHB for such a "tram" device???

          4. Faulted1 | Dec 20, 2007 05:18pm | #19

            Here is the company which advertised in FHB

            http://www.marineinnovations.com/

          5. User avater
            BillHartmann | Dec 20, 2007 07:50am | #17

            I think that all of those terms have been used..
            .
            A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.

          6. peteshlagor | Dec 20, 2007 07:55am | #18

            My lake lot has a stairway of 142 steps.  It serves 6 lots on the east shore of L Mich.  We're up about 110' and the 6 of us would like to go that route.

            Guess what Googling does?

            http://www.lakeshoretram.com/index.htm

             

            Edited 12/19/2007 11:58 pm ET by peteshlagor

  3. Jim_Allen | Dec 19, 2007 06:23am | #5

    Do not make runs longer than 15 or 16 risers. Folks need a resting place.

    48" wide on a 2x6 is certainly aggressive. You might be able to obtain satisfactory results if you install a solid 2x6 riser. This vertical member will add significant stiffness to the front tread and can also help carry the back tread.

    Are you just being cheap or is there a reason you don't want to add another stringer in the middle?

    Bob's next test date: 12/10/07

    1. Piffin | Dec 19, 2007 07:54am | #7

      I don't think that dadoing and using the wedge and all thread is cheap by any stretch. It is really complicated compared to just cutting a stair stringer or four. I get the impression he is trying to re-invent the wheel and that is why he is here - to avoid making all the same mistakes we learned on...For instance - that landing thing really sticks in my mind. I had to replace a long set of steps from a porch towards the dock for somebody here 'cause it was rotting. There were probably 22-23 risers in that run and the woman of the house asked if I could make it less steep because her husband was getting older and having a hard time with it.I designed the new with a landing 2/3 of the way up in addition to lengthening the run a little bit.At first, the old man was like, "What's this?!" Until he walked them a couple times and it really made a diff for him to be able to pause on that landing. family still raves about it, though he is laid to rest now.Anyways, I knew nothing about codes and requirements back then. Just did what I thought right, and it was only a month or so later that I read that it was code to have no more than about 15 risers without the landing.So there i was re-inventing the wheel myself! 

       

      Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

      1. smslaw | Dec 19, 2007 07:52pm | #9

        If there is room, another nice feature is to put a little bench on each landing for anyone who needs to rest on the way.

        1. Piffin | Dec 20, 2007 12:36am | #10

          Especially when there is a view 

           

          Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

  4. Piffin | Dec 19, 2007 07:43am | #6

    There is a limit to how many risers/treads you can have before interrupting with a landing, for safety abd comfort. I believe it is fifteen.

    A 32' stringer sounds like something that would challenge the codes and common sense on this point alone.

     

     

    Welcome to the
    Taunton University of
    Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
     where ...
    Excellence is its own reward!

  5. User avater
    BillHartmann | Dec 19, 2007 06:58pm | #8

    Don't forget that this is exposed to the weather.

    Dado'd slots for the treads are just a place to collect water. Even with PT lumber it will rot there and/or freezing will bust up the connections.

    I think that it would be much easier to cut 3 idential stringers notched stringers.

    Then install foootings and post at the top and bottom and in the middel if needed.

    Install one outside stringer. Then the other outside stringer using a lvel to match it up with the first.

    Then do the center.

    then it is very quick to drop the treads in place and screw them down.

    For that long of run you might want handrails. Just extend the outside posts about 3 ft above the treads.

    .
    .
    A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
    1. randomr | Dec 20, 2007 03:22am | #13

      Thanks for all the input.Some things I plan to do.- Railing at least on one side is a definite.- if dados for the treads is rot looking for a place to happen then I will consider metal brackets.- I have counted approx. 100 steps so at a limit of 15 risers I am back to 6 or 7 staircases - alot to build and alot to climb. I can see limiting the number of risers per set - 30 could be a stretch, but 20 doesn't sound crazy.- There is already benches on the old ones so a good idea.Right now the big issue is that the stairs are broken up into some long, some short, a straight landing to the next stairs, a right angle landing to the next set, a stretch of sloped grass to another set. Any sense of flow is non existent.And yes I have thought about building a tram.This is my cottage and what ever I end up building I would like to have a little fun out of it ...

  6. User avater
    jonblakemore | Dec 20, 2007 08:01pm | #20

    Others have mentioned comfort on long stairs with no landing but there is a code issue as well. The IRC states "A flight of stairs shall not have a vertical rise greater than 12 feet between floor levels or landings."

    You may not have to follow the code for this job but it's worth keeping in mind.

     

    Jon Blakemore

    RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA

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