*
J.,
Your major problem working for this guy seems to be no coordinating authority ,which generally is a experienced Construction Supt, who shedules subs and material deliveries and stands inspections with the building dept.
Without one of these guys ( I was for many years) havoc and chaos is the order of the day and the subcontractors will run the job,meaning they show up when its convenient for them.
You have my sympathy, get a job with more control over your aspect or continue to be frustrated in your work.
FredD
Replies
*
J.,
Your major problem working for this guy seems to be no coordinating authority ,which generally is a experienced Construction Supt, who shedules subs and material deliveries and stands inspections with the building dept.
Without one of these guys ( I was for many years) havoc and chaos is the order of the day and the subcontractors will run the job,meaning they show up when its convenient for them.
You have my sympathy, get a job with more control over your aspect or continue to be frustrated in your work.
FredD
*
To price it, determine what you want to make per week, month, year, and charge accordingly. If you know the framing sucks and the rock only compounds the suckiness, you're going to have to bid or price accordingly.
If you know you're going to have down time, due to other subs not performing - or the contractor/architect not performing - find other little jobs to fill in those gaps. You can always find an exterior door that needs replacing, or someone who needs crown molding stuck up somewhere.
If you love what you're doing, and the work is fun to do, and you're determined to stick it out with this guy, then you'll just have to live with the disorganization. I would start shopping for a new builder. If you can deal with your present situation, use it as a selling point to another builder.
*Tell em' "Time and materials or I'm outa here!"
*I think Dann is headed down the right road here.It does seem to me though that you enjoy the work. In situations like this, try to do your pricing by the week instead of narrowing it down by the day or hour. This gives you leeway on a hard to schedule job and covers your rear when things get difficult.On a normal house you might say "I've seen this before. Doors and trim, 4 1/2 days, 2 days for the cabinets, setup and cleanup a coupla' hours. 7 days easy, maybe 8.That leaves me 2 days next week to start the guys on that siding job."On this job I would not even say the word "DAY". Everything would run into the next week and I would charge for it before hand. I'm not a big fan of time-and material, so I spell out in the contract precisely what we will do, and write change orders at my stated rate for additional work that crops up.Also, Bill's point about needing a super is true. A job will tend to run smoother if there is someone on-site to coordinate the effort and make trade-overlapping decisions. Unfortunately, you will rarely, if ever, find hired supervision on custom residential construction, and it is unlikely that any pleading you do will convince someone to shell out the $$$$ to hire it out. If this contractor balks at at C-Y-A pricing, you might point out your concerns and tell him you would be able to bid more closely given better quality and supervision to work with. Otherwise, don't bring it up. This stuff your doing does not really come under the heading "VALUE-ENGINEERING" anyway, and you should be well paid to do it.Have fun, Brent.
*
Thanks for the thoughts. I have a great superintendent, I just have to think about materials and they are there, if they are available. I've been trimming for a long time. Everything from tract housing to large colonial customs. I can price these, but they aren't very challenging or even interesting. The problem is: these new houses are very custom,schedualing is a tricky balancing act, and, as I said, not much is normal. I'm looking for more accurate method of pricing and thought, perhaps, there might someone else in the same boat with a better rudder. So, I'd appreciate any more ideas, and I'll let you know how it turns out.
*I have often-times done jobs like this. I never did make much money.If money is what you are after, then you have to go back to tract-type work that has pricing to the penny.Some say ..."experience is what you get when you dont get what you wanted"...I have found that if I pushed too hard regarding money , from someone who just couldnt pay, the job would not get done.So what do you want to do?I was able to build a lot of one-of-a-kind things because I didnt charge much money.And I have experience.Now with that experience, all that is left is to wait for the bucks to just roll right in.Or, do another job, cheap.Hope this helps.
*Wow...All I can say is that I agree with everybody. Its always good to see so much help out there, that comes from true hands on experience. I am currently in the process of finishing a built in cabinet job that has been a challenge. Being a rookie out here on the market I like to tell people I learn a new thing every day. When I first started my new business I started without giving written estimates, and worked by the hour/day/week plan. Now its three years later, and to get good size(one man)jobs written estimates and contracts are the way to go. When it comes to actually coming close to the estimate you gave, good luck I'm still working on that one myself. Contractors,...the hour,day,week plan works best. there will always be bad supers, learn to avoid them, or like others have said, plan for the occasion There is something to be said about one of kind jobs. I am a sucker for them. Being one man its easier to find neat jobs, but plan on some odd jobs to fill in the time. good luck out there.
*Crawford, Please be careful telling people that you learn a new thing every day. Think about that.Why only one?Which one do you commit to memory? And on what basis do you decide that is the one?And so on...I worked for a guy that used to say, about the two of us, that two half-wits make a wit. And the customers would direct their inquiries and comments to me. Like I knew what he was saying!Hope this helps.
*
UNFORTUNATE AS IT MAY BE, MOST BIULERS IN CUSTOM HOMES ARE LIKE THAT. YOU HAVE TO ASK YOUSELF IF IT IS PAYING THE BILLS OR ARE YOU JUST SPINNING YOUR WHEELS? THEN POSSIBLY LOOK FOR A PRODUCTION BUILDER, AND DO BOTH OR WHICH EVER ONE YOU LIKE THE MOST. MAYBE ONE DAY CUSTOM HOME BUILDERS WILL GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER AND EVERYBODY WILL MAKE MONEY!!!!!!!
*Alan,I would much rather consistantly learn one thing every day than to spend every day never learning one thing.
*
J.....I have just read all the posts on this thread, good advice but I have a little more. If I was in the position you find youself in I would..................arrange a meeting with the architect/builder prior to starting the project. Determine exactly what is PLANNED TO DO, then sit down and write a proposal stating exactly what you will do on the project. Arrive at a price including draws if necessary and write all this down in the proposal. Include the time for the meeting and proposal writing in your price. Explain (in writing) that this is what you will do and any/all changes will required a change order and you will charge for the change order. At all times make it clear that you are intitiled to fair and reasonable profit. You are ! The key here is the change order...You know they are coming so make 'em work for you. Even if the change is a deletion, you will need to charge for the change order. It takes time for you to write it out and time is money. I'm not advising you to do financial damage to the builder here, just get that fair and reasonable profit that you are intitled to. Otherwise.....you may as well go fishing or whatever flips your minnow. Nobody needs to make a killing in this business. but we all need to make a decent living. "The life so short, the craft so long to learn"
*Crawford,Good for you!I am proud of you.Dont let anyone tell you different.Hope this helps.
*
Mr J. Holland Eshelman, thank you very much for your response, as for your article, there's a saying in Honolulu, "when in doubt; piece it out".Wishing you and yours a very healthy, happy and prosperous new year. Haoli Makahiki Hou !!!!
*
I've recently gotten into a position where I work for only one contractor. Problem is, he's an architect too, and not a normal one. Pre-hung hollow core birch doors with painted base and shoe give the pretense of normalcy and ease, but it ends right there. Sheetrock returned alumininum sliding windows with fitted clear oak or maple sills, vaulted hipped ceilings with dropped ridges covered with more clear finished oak or maple, whacked out fireplace details all clear finished, more ceilings coming into ceilings with more clear finished beams doing the same, and trees, right now I'm trying to work oak to maple columns, only the maple columns still have the bark on them... I love this stuff, but how do I price it? The framing is way beyond stinking and the sheetrock on top of it never had a chance. Every tradesperson working on these houses has the same problems: start, stop to wait for someone else who had to wait for them to start to wait for someone else...and on and on. The houses are 1/2 mill and up. Anybody out there have any helpful suggestions,even understand my quandry, or want to come help?