Started my garage yesterday, got the roof rafters and everything peeled off. Left the old ceiling joists to hold the tarp on until I got the new floor joists up.
Figured I put up a few pictures of the progress. Tommorrow the whole tribe will be onsite to bend nails.
Got to play with my new Makita 16″ beam saw. Very awesome saw.
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This is me crosscutting a 6×6 in one pass.
Then I used it to make the 1-1/2″ relief notchs for the 2×12 beams to rest on. THe 2x’s will get through bolted to the tops of the posts.
You can see the 2×12 floating in space that gets supported by the post and beam detail I am working on in the pictures. Frozen 24′ 2×12’s were all I could handle solo today.
Woods favorite carpenter
Replies
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what chu lookin at , sucka ?
and who's takin the pics ?
My wife is taking the pictures, she snuck up on me in that one.
I caught a glimpse of her foot as she was snapping that one. Woods favorite carpenter
seems like it will be fun, keep us posted.
Ductape can fix EVERYTHING!!!
you're one tuff hombre Matt,
since they're calling for snow all week from here to you
and you're really scary looking in that second shot
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It's been a long winter, been fighting snow for the last few months.
Theres a time table I have to have the garage done by or I would have waited until spring.
Today was around 0 degrees, tommorrow even worse. i hope to have all the floor joists and subfloor down by sun down. We'll see.
Woods favorite carpenter
I think I have seen the ground for about three days this year too.....it's snowing right now. YAY!.
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<< and you're really scary looking in that second shot >>
you can say that again...that look is creeping me out!Justin Fink - FHB Editorial
I think he should be in Pete Ds next movie as a serial wacko ! just kidding StilletoJeezus...... " The Stilleto Framer".
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Just keep the hood drawstrings either cut or tucked inside the hoodie.
I have a big Ryobi beam saw.
Don't ask.
Sorry bud, didn't know you were working over here. Guess you decided to build it the way you wanted to--bank/ins. co. be dammed. Good for you.
Where's some photos of that gang-cutting?
The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
I did decide to go with the room in the attic, after this is done the wife might actually be able to park her car in the garage.
No gang cutting pictures, sorry. I was home alone doing that last night. If the wife would have been here I would've had her snap a few.
I went to bed with a big smile on my face, and woke up with it too. The head cutter is a great tool. The chainsaw makes very smooth accurate cuts. And very fast.
Woods favorite carpenter
Today the whole army showed up and an entire garage roof fell onto the walls.
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I gang cut all the rafters last night, here they are waiting to be unstrapped and nailed in.
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Heres a Tim Uhler picture, dead on 45 degree cut with a chainsaw, got to love that. Woods favorite carpenter
Nice picture :-) of the rafters and square.
I have seen your pictures showing how accurate the chainsaw was, so I decided to take one too.
Thanks for sharing your framing knowledge here and JLC, I've told you that before and I hope you know that I really mean it. Gang cutting roofs on the ground and having them fit perfect is an amazing feeling. Woods favorite carpenter
Heres some progress pictures, this is at 7:30 am
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This is about 10 am and a different camera operator, I rented a Vermetti to raise the 32' LVL ridge, $40 well spent.
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Woods favorite carpenter
This is the view from my back door, I like the covered overhang for the grill idea so I kept it. View Image
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This is around noon, rafters all nailed in and sheathing going on. Diesel pigs Hitachi makes an appearance hanging on the sheathing. Woods favorite carpenter
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One side almost sheathed.
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While I was sheathing, I had a couple guys build the rake walls. Each gable end gets a 3x5 slider window.
Woods favorite carpenter
nice work Matt...
I like yur methods too...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
very nice Matt, I'm glad you didn't have to deal with that snow we got down here last week...
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We've had our fair share of snow, but this week has been excellent. 30 degrees and sun feels like a heat wave. Woods favorite carpenter
yep I was in a t-shirt todayI hope you felted the roof or whatever you call it ......... sounds like we're gonna get some more Monday night.
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Edited 2/24/2008 5:42 pm by maddog3
Glad you're finally getting around to this project.
Did you consider a shed-dormer on one side? $$$ prohibitive?
BTW, no engineer here, but those headers should be perfectly fine. Think about it, are the gable pair (rafters) carrying any more load than any other pair throughou the structure?The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
or dogouse dormer, all depends on what he has on his house and/or the neighboring houses
Ductape can fix EVERYTHING!!!
I'm glad I got to it as well.
I finally finished the kitchen with a cathedral project and my garage couldn't wait any longer, I honestly think the layers of shingles were holding the roof together and I was on thin ice with it collapsing.
I had to draw the line somewhere with this garage, I'm already going way over the top with it, so I'm fine with all the extra storage I gained already. Woods favorite carpenter
Matt, what is the access to the second floor? It really shows that you've been busy, but did you build a staircase yet? I can't wait to see the shop set up.
Dustin
I am going to get to the stairs in the next few days, I gang cut those as well.
I'll get some pictures of that. I have to move a mountain of tools out of the way before i can install them.
The wife can't wait either she wants to actually use our garage for a car, crazy idea I know but what she says goes. Woods favorite carpenter
Roger that, if the chief ain't happy, ain't nobody happy
wait, you said you listen to your wife?
is she about 5' tall? I'm 6'7" and my wife is5.2(irish) what a temper
My wife is 5' tall and irish, I'm 6'7" as well.
I listen to her, if shes not happy then no one is happy. Woods favorite carpenter
oh boy! been there done that.
Shes a good woman but stubborn doesn't even begin to describe her. Woods favorite carpenter
it's that irish in her. I had always thought of myself as stubborn until......
very loyal, don't mess with her kids....
Got your check yesterday too, thanks. Hope the guns work out for you. Woods favorite carpenter
Some more progress pictures
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This is the back wall, papered in, window wrapped in ice and water shield.
View ImageWoods favorite carpenter
THis is the front wall, you can see the ice and water wrap is left long so it can be lapped onto the siding when I install it
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Woods favorite carpenter
This is the roofer, he shingles from the top down. Never seen it sone that way before.
He is a recent transplant from Tennessee.
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Kenny is a good man, glad to see we got a good one from down south. I can see how he can do the roof so cheap from the top down. No jacks or planks. He nailed down 6 sq in about two and a half hours. Woods favorite carpenter
Excellent work. Great photo thread Matt! Everyone likes framing threads! Your gable window headers are more than adequate. You really don't need any header in there at all. Remember, your ridge really isn't structural. Each opposing rafter is holding itself up and it has no chance at pushing out the bottoms of the rafter. The tops of the rafter aren't going anywhere, neither are the bottoms. The middles could sag, but I wouldn't worry about that because of your steep pitch.I notice you mentioned collar ties. You said something about 9'. Don't do it if that is a shopspace. Put them all the way up tight to the ridge at 12'. You can never have too much height in a shop. I didn't notice a firebucket out there. You are da man! Very brave...in 0 degree weather! All those rafter cutoffs would have been warming my soul! Around here, I wouldn't need them. It broke a record here yesterday when it hit 90 degrees! I'm smiling big time!Oh yeah...those crazy guys from Tennessee....I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it. Crazy! I once had a framer tell me he'd found the secret to sheathing 12/12 roofs...."FROM THE TOP DOWN"...he said....he was out of business within a year. I'm not a roofer, so I won't try to tell Mr Top Down how to do his business... Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
I didn't have a fire bucket, I just stayed moving. And lots of layers helps.
Last few days have been a heat wave 30 degrees and sunshine.
The roofer is only charging me $300 for 13 sq on a 12/12 pitch. I was going to do it until he offered to do it for that. I'll go make money elsewhere, I hate roofing.
Woods favorite carpenter
"I didn't have a fire bucket"Ask Frank....I started searching for my fire bucket before the summer was over. I learned long ago not to push it. Once the snow starts flying, buckets seem to dis-sappear. For me: no bucket...no getting out of the truck! I'd hire Mr Top Down roofer too for $23 a square rather than laying them! Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
His price made it a no brainer desicion for me, I can make money elsewhere while he makes his.
I have to supply him everything, nails, staples, hose, compressor and nail gun.
His stuff just got stolen and he is trying to get back on his feet, so on a refferral from a life long friend I hired him and plan on giving him some more money that what he asked for. THats not enough in my book. Woods favorite carpenter
Matt,
Great work. I'm sure you can't wait to get in there.
I've been dreaming of my shop/garage I plan to build off the alley on the back of my lot. Working out of a 10x16 shed right now! (see cc counter thread)
I'll likely build something with 'attic' trusses to get that second story and go for dormers like this building in the photo. These trusses have a 4' heel.
This is the garage/guest cottage on one of three houses in a little subdivision here that went up almost a year ago now. They can't sell em!
Til then... it's dreamin' and savin.' Wish I had your expertise and that small army in the photos too! Although I dunno about that top-down roofing thing....
Thanks for posting.
Pat"Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
The small army came out of the wood work so to speak. I planned on a few extra guys but 7 including myself was more than I could have ever asked for.
My phone was rining off the hook, my friends who I had built structures for them, or bailed them out one way or another wanted to pay me back. So karma worked in my favor.
The one thing that made the difference more than the amount of guys was the tools, the beam lift was priceless. Gang cutting with my big foot saws saved me a ton of time, taking something that would take a day and do it in 30 minutes. Woods favorite carpenter
Waters
I thought about your post a little more, I went with rafters instead of trusses based on cost.
THe difference was at least $1,500 rafters VS. Attic trusses. I'd look into knee walls and rafters first before I pulled the trigger on trusses. If moneys tight rafters would be much cheaper.
Just a few thoughts for you. If you'd like to talk some finances I'll let you know what I spent on what items to get where I am.
Woods favorite carpenter
Edited 3/1/2008 5:01 am ET by MattSwanger
Matt,Nice thread. Your gang cutting speed has paid for the big saws already...not to mention the gains from not having to fight with stuff that does not fit...and nice, accurate framing sure makes the finish work hum.Kudos,Basswood
THe saws pay for themselves very quick, after a few guys seen this in action I have gotten alot of calls to cut their roofs.
I hope it works out, one guy I told him to call me when he was ready and he said he wopuldn't dream of calling anyone else, nice to hear that at times. Woods favorite carpenter
Thanks for reply,
Yeah, an attic truss is expensive. I'm waiting to hear back from job--rebuilding a small shop in the backyard. He's now choosing between a std 4/12 truss or an attic truss with 4' heels 10/12 for that room up. The attic trusses are about 150$ each vs. 35$ for the std.
Small building, we'll see what he wants to do. Good practice for me tho as my younger business grows. Right now I do lots of smaller projects--fences/decks/patio covers/front porches and whatnot and I've got feelers out for some larger remodel projects. I have 2 other sets of plans for 2nd story addts now on smaller buildings--backyard accessory dwellings and a coastal cottage.
As I look at it, a truss will probably be a better bet for me either way with my limited framing experience. I have a good mind for it, and all the methods make sense but limited experience.
Thanks again.
Pat
"Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
Don't let rafters intimidate you, all they are is trusses with a ridge.
Keep the basics in mind use a pattern and keep your heel heights the same like trusses and you can save yourself alot of money.
I am still a truss guy, but when I can put $1500 in my pocket for 1 hour of work I'm all over it like a hobo on a ham sandwich. Woods favorite carpenter
"Don't let rafters intimidate you, all they are is trusses with a ridge. "
Hey now - Them's fightin' words.
(-:
(And not at all true)
I try to avoid looking forward or backward, and try to keep looking upward. [Charlotte Bronte]
Fly me and my saws out there and I'll cut them for you. I always wanted to go to the west coast. Woods favorite carpenter
View ImageThis is us getting setup for cutting stringers.
View ImageI stack all three stringers on top of each other, only have to lay them out once and cut all of them at the same time with the beam saw. Woods favorite carpenter
View ImageMaking the cuts, no pattern, no moving of stock thats unnecessary. View Image
This is Ronnie, he made good on his promise to me to improve and become a carpenter. I am so glad he did, he's a good man and I didn't want to let him go.
View ImageAnd thats his soon to be brother in law Ethan. Young but wants to become and apprentice, I may put him on this summer after hr graduates High School. Woods favorite carpenter
hey , ronnie's got my nail bag on .... obviously a talented guy !Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I bought the Oxy Lights a few months back, and couldn't believe the difference.
He tried them on and loved them as well, so he bought a set. Woods favorite carpenter
Anybody who'd drop 2 beans for a set of bags is probably serious Matt. Good luck with him.The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
He's come al lomg ways since this summer.
I put him back on fulltime now, he has to earn his keep there. Woods favorite carpenter
Matt,
Nice thread. One question, When you cut those stringers stacked three high like that, how much of an overcut do ya have to give up on the top one to complete the cut on the bottom. thanks
dug
oooh, oooh ... i was hoping someone would ask thatMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Yep.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Maybe 1-1/2" overcut, on the top stringer but less overcut as you go to the bottom,
I laminated the two side side stringers with another 2x12 making a housed stair. THe bottom stringer with almost no overcut becomes the middle stiringer. Woods favorite carpenter
no criticism... just wondering
with the diameter of that blade i imagine you could do one with zero over/under
but with 3 stringers , the choice is under or over
we usually choose under and finish with a sawzall....
back in '73 my boss patiently showed me how to finish with a 1 1/2" chisel
then i tried a handsaw, and jig saws... and sawzalls.... whatever works
with three stringers , in a housed stairwell, two get nailed to the framing, and the perfect one could be the center one
anyways..... i was just wondering if you had really reinvented the wheel
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I overcut the top ttwo stringers and the third just slightly.
THe top two get sistered to full 2x12, glued and screwed.
THe bottom slighlty overcut one is the middle stringer.
I'll get some pictures of it when I can, Woods favorite carpenter
Mike,
When I cut stair stringers, I use either LSL or LVL and overcutting is just not an issue.
Otherwise I cut to the lines, flip the top off, do the same for the next two at the same time, and then finish with a jig saw.
It is heavy using the big saw, but the advantage to me is that you have 3 identical stringers.
Matt,
Speaking of cost. The house we frame next we got a truss bid of 13,500. This did not include sheathing, fascia, flyrafter or any overframing (which there was a fair amount).
What I figured to frame the roof, including fascia, flyrafters and all overframe was 10,079. I don't think labor will be much more either.
Of course we had to have it engineered, but we needed the whole house engineered anyway, so for the roof it was about $500 additional.
I easily saved 2k raftering as opposed to using attic trusses. No brainer there.
Woods favorite carpenter
can't wait any longer... You have to give some follow ups.
I have to get some pictures still, I still haven't done that yet.
Give me a few more days and I'll try to get them posted. Woods favorite carpenter
patience man, he just had a serious fall
There's enough youth in this world, how 'bout a fountain of SMART??!!
Yeah, but it's spring now.
Forrest
would late fall be better????
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Humpty Dumpty had a great fall"
To make up for a lousy summer, one hopes.
Forrest - had a spring break once
yes he did...
and his summer just might be curbed a bit....
BTW... Ace hardware has a great selection of replacement springs....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
sorry, didn't hear about it, are you OK?
I'm fine ;) It was a pretty serious fall 102087.199
There's enough youth in this world, how 'bout a fountain of SMART??!!
Edited 4/10/2008 8:46 pm ET by andyfew322
Edited 4/10/2008 8:47 pm ET by andyfew322
I thought most had read about my accident, so I didn't say anymore about it.
I was putting the siding on the back of the garage and fell off a lower roof, the fall resulted in a shattered hip and pelvis.
The thread Andy posted a link to has all the details, I'll be out of action for another 2 months at a minimum.
Woods favorite carpenter
Glad to hear you're relatively OK. I'm guessing the thread is in the Tavern since I can't see it. Figured some kind of fall from the comments.
I just read about the billionaire founder of ABC Roofing Supply, who fell off his garage roof this Jan. while supervising some work - he didn't make it. Sucks you are so busted up, but really glad you're still with us!
Matt:
Care to share the story again where we can see it? From what I can gather about your accident I did the same thing last July 21. I was very fortunate. Heard of a friend of a friend that just fell a few days ago and he's messed up pretty bad.
Glad you are okay. I'd like to compare notes. I can post my story of what an idiot I am sometime if it would help others to not be idiots like me but I have to pack it in for the night now.
GregT
Just request "Tavern Access"
To REZ I think."Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
rez, or me
or most efficiently RDA
There's enough youth in this world, how 'bout a fountain of SMART??!!
I was putting the siding on the back gable of the garage, rushing like an idiot and walked off the lower lean to roof I was standing on. I landed directly on my knee and that caused the damage that the doctor compared to a high speed car crash. I drove the ball through the socket by about three inches.
I spent a week in the hospital, I went in on friday afternoon, they didn't do surgery until Monday afternoon. I was doped up for those three days, I would wake up and see my knee pointing to the left and my toes pointing at the ceiling and would pass back out. Partially from the pain and partially at the sight of it.
They released me with 33 staples in my skin, a 16" incision where they accessed the hip, 4 pins, two screws and a plate that looks like a bike chain.
I am pretty much couch/bed ridden. I can get up to pee and thats about it. Its driving me insane, I am one month into it and have two more to go. It's gonna be tough, but I have only one shot to get this right, physically and financially and that has been a good motivator for me to stay somewhat still.
It could have been much worse, I am lucky, I was just in a hurry and a little tired. THe typical recipe for a job site accident, I should know better by now, I usually see things like this coming and pack it in for the day but I got blinded by finishing the siding by the time a snow storm blew in.
Thats most of the story. Sorry for blathering on. Woods favorite carpenter
Matt so your accident was what david hawks was talking about! Man I was down there in statesville a few weeks ago helping him out a bit and he was talking about Matt falling off a roof and messing himself up.........I didn,t catch when you got hurt either ---shoot man get well soon.
I ain't the sharpest tool in the shed anyway. D.W.
David called me when I was in the hospital, he was just going to tell me that a check was on its way for some framing guns I had sent him.
Woods favorite carpenter
Hope you heal up quick. Don't rush it. Better to spend a little extra time getting healthy than re-injuring something.jt8
So what was that like?It was like coming THIS close to your dreams. And then watch them brush past you like a stranger in a crowd. At the time you don’t think much of it. You know we just don’t recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they’re happening. Back then I thought, “well, there’ll be other days.†I didn’t realize that that was the only day. --FoD
Geez, that sounds bad. Glad to hear you are recovering and hope that you can get back to normal sooner than expected. I'm only 1/2 hour away so if there is anything I can do. If you were siding, I'm guessing your project was weathered in pretty well before your accident. Just email me if I can help.
Last summer I was working on my house and in a hurry of course and went to nail off an end rafter for a shed roof addition. I was about half way up on a 6 ft step ladder and therefore above the 4 ft tall guardrail where the adjacent side wall would be. I didn't frame that end wall because I wanted to build it in place below the rafter. For some reason I put my weight on the rafter and it only had to slide 1 1/2" to fall off the end of the wall. Since my center of gravity was above and over my guardrail I was pretty much committed to going over. First I grabbed for anything I could to save myself and when everything slipped out of my grasp I decided to switch strategy and twist around to put my arms out and hopefully break my fall. I twisted too far and landed on the side of my hip. I fell 14 ft and it is amazing how much time I had to think it through. Fractured my pelvis in four spots but none were displaced so I just had to heal for about six weeks. I refused to let my wife call 911 since the local volunteer fire department would have responded with 18 people and two or three fire trucks. I couldn't stand so I crab walked over to our minivan and got inside (dumb move #2). I was supposed to take it easy and be on crutches. One week after my accident I was so stir crazy I had one of the guys pick me up so I could visit a jobsite with him to go over some things (It was the Eric Henkel dealership on Dickman road that they remodeled last year). Just getting around that site put me back in bed for two days as I really overdid it.
The dumbest thing was that my harness was 30 feet away in my truck and I had plenty of places to tie a lifeline to. I also had scaffold on site that I could have set up beforehand and accessed it safer. Fortunately I landed on dirt and gravel next to the footing below. The hard concrete may have made it worse.
Best wishes for a speedy recovery!
GregT
Thanks for the good wishes Greg, everything is in good order here. My crew finished the siding on the garage without me knowing while I was in the hospital. It was a good thing they finished it, I only had 90 days to finish from the bank and that would have easily expired and I would have lost the last draw on the building.
Proabably a good thing they finished it, unfinished it would be driving me nuts looking out the window at it, bored out of my mind.
I learned that the human body had a hip and a pelvis, I thought they were the same just different names. I haven't smoked since I fell, 14 years of smoking I can hopefully put behind me. So a few good things have come out of this, at least its not all bad.
Woods favorite carpenter
Glad they got it all buttoned up for you. Sounds like you are in good spirits.
Not to be a downer but the friend of a friend that just fell passed away this morning from his injuries. Unfortunately he fell on his head from 10 ft up on a ladder. Hearing it serves to remind me to count my blessings and to not complain about how bad I have it when others are so much worse.
It could have been much, much worse. I can say that knowing I am right. I will be able to get back to life as usual after a small speed bump, the same can't be said for your friends friend and countless others that are in the same field of work.
Woods favorite carpenter
greg.... we asked that it not go in the tavern so all could see it.. but anyways
here's a post that might interest you ...
102087.53 in reply to 102087.52
listen... we really need a 4th for golf... so any of you that would like to help Matt over the hump can send donations care of Quittin Time
Cal will be our banker...
QuittinTime is organized to receive funds... check , cash ( not recommended ) , money orders and Paypal
just mark it payable to Quittin Time with a notation " for Matt"
here are some links to Quittin Time
http://www.quittintime.com/
http://www.quittintime.com/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=0&Number=10175&an=0&page=0#Post10175
the thread is in the "Back Porch"
called ## Help a Brother ##
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / RestoreMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
BigPete suggested we get this back over to the undarkside (non tavern) so here's another bump.
I've been trying to encourage folks that it isn't the amount of the donation, but rather the volume this community represents. Cripe-a hundred ten dollars-zess is a thousand.
Matt's been an knowlegable participant here-helped out quite a few posters. You'd think if some of 'em saw this thread they'd jump at the chance to help. Look at that tool trade he started. Shoot-there's several folks there that he helped by his generosity.
Now, if it's because they know nothing about me and my history of honorable collection here and at QT-then I'm sorry. I certainly don't try to appear the faceless honorable Nigerian former oil minister.
So here's the challenge folks.............dollars, fives, tens? You bet that's fine! Add em up and they make a good deed.
Make a check out and send to :
Quittintime
p.o.box 351
Maumee, Ohio 43547-0351
Include reference for matt.
or check this out:
## Help a Brother ##
thanks!A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
Hi Matt
I didn't read about your accident, I'll hope you will be as good as new when everything is healed. I know how hard it is when you are not able to do what you like. It doesn't matter if it's your work, family or life in general that has been put on old, it just plain sucks when your injured. I had a work accident last July and I'm off work now for over 8 1/2 month, life is passing by and I am missing out on it.
Take care, get well.
I looked at Andy's link but nothing shows up.MartinOne cripple to another LOL
not for nothing, how did he do that and use proper nailing pattern? Must be because I'm a dumb yankee, I can't figure.
You aren't the only dumb yankee. Seems that method would produce high nailing , I always end up with two layers to nail though when I start from the bottom.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
frammer... it's not really from the top down
it's really from 5' below the ridge to the ridge
then you move down another 5' adn shingle up to where you first started, you tuck the top course
then you move down another 5' and start up again
Hazlet showed how to do this about 5 years ago
we use it in teh summer to keep from damaging our shingles
we also use a layout tape made from drywall tape so the courses come out right when you get to the bottom
they even sell a special lay-out tape for this method nowMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Thanks for posting that info. I have never seen it done by groups of 5 courses, just one row at a time and I didn't like the method. What you post makes it work.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Not necessarily 5 courses DT. More like, however far up your tallest guy can reach.
If you've got a 7 footer on your crew, you could put your first row of planks about 9 feet below the ridge.
Clear as mud?The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
Yep, I am used to seeing and reading though mud. Just another winter day here in Ore. ;-)
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
I,ve only tried the top down method a couple times, but it does have certain advantages, like not having to walk on new shingles in hot weather
The nailing pattern is not difficult. The nails in the first shingle of each "section "are held high ( right at the very top of the shingle ) Once the top shingle in the next lower section is installed, you can go back and renail that first shingle properly
I guess this dumb yankee understands. I would think that it would be a lot slower.
That's how I do my shingling on a non-walk slope. Just nail the bottom row with two at the top. On the next run, lift and click. It REALLY makes the job easier and less damaging to the shingles... especially if you're going solo.Liberty = Freedom from unjust or undue governmental control.
American Heritage Dictionary
I still don't get it.
Th eway I understand it is you would start at say the 5th course below the ridge. Nail it high, and then keep going up to the ridge.
When you have filled that whole tier, drop down to 5 courses below the First couse ( you nailed high, so you get under it and nail off that finisher) and repeat.
Frog your way down X amt of courses, and you are still nailing as per the norm except for every X course.
Itss good cuz no jacks to pull out of finished work, and less scuffing the finished shingles, traispeing up and down.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Success is not spontaneous combustion, you have to set yourself on Fire"
Edited 2/26/2008 12:27 pm ET by Sphere
What Sphere wrote. I still use jacks/planks 'cause the shingles need somewhere to lay and my toes don't hold toe boards well. Just pull 'em as you work down the roof.
I also use drywall tape as a layout/storyboard to maintain the reveals. You can simply adjust the last 5 course's reveals to give the appearance of equal steps.
I don't think this is a Hazlett approved technique, but I'm so slow anyway that a small speed penalty is miniscule in the total picture.Liberty = Freedom from unjust or undue governmental control.
American Heritage Dictionary
This is the back wall of the garage
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This is the new workshop space, without the knee walls, I'll get to those soon.
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Great feeling to know the math behind rafters, I can't thank the regular framers enough for sharing their knowledge. I have a hard time sleeping the night before the rafters get nailed in, but when they fit perfectly theres no better feeling.
Woods favorite carpenter
VERY nice Matt.
Do you NEED the kneewalls?
I'd be inclined to leave them out and gain the floor space if even for storage.[email protected]
I sheathed the whole floor so I could build storage into the knee walls in certain areas.
I may leave some of the knee walls out but in certain areas I will be making base cabinets for storage as well. Woods favorite carpenter
Nice Matt!
Good days work in the cold. Couple of questions. you had mentioned adding tails on , did you drop that idea? And what did you to for rafter out thrust when you have no joists or collar ties tying the rafters together? Simpson hardware?
Edited 2/23/2008 7:28 pm by dovetail97128
This is about 10 am and a different camera operator, I rented a Vermetti to raise the 32' LVL ridge, $40 well spent.[email protected]
Eric if you are saying that the ridge is a ridge beam then I would be telling Matt to change out the headers over the gable end windows.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Yeah, I saw that..........wasn't sure. Just posted it.[email protected]
I added tails, I thought I could get enough rafter with 18', but I was wrong. So I had to add 4' tails to each rafter.
I nailed a 2x6 plate down directly to the floor and rim joists then sheathed to them, then I am going to add some simpson ties, I have a mountain of H1's laying around that I'll probably use.
I'll be adding collar ties in the upper third of the rafters in the next few days. The beam is about 12' off the floor so I can easily add ties and not lose too much ceiling height. Woods favorite carpenter
I went back and looked at the pics, I can see where you added tails from the finished product , just didn't study the pic well enough and expected to see them in a pic of the frame only . I have done roofs the same way , using Simpson hardware and collar ties, I was just curious is all. Can't remember what hardware we used, engineers choice.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
The ridge isn't structural, at least not fully. I'm sure it helps.
I just wanted to have one single board for the ridge, not a spliced one.
THe 32' LVL cost me around $100, a 24' 2x12 was $35 so for an extra $60 it made life a little easier.
I will be switching out the window headers, I didn't notice they had installed them until after I was done sheathing. I'm going to install a a pair of 2x12's for them. I have some extra to get rid of and that would be a great place for them.
Woods favorite carpenter
Buying the ridge makes sense, splicing ridges is a pain. Those header do look a mite on the small side.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
The one guy that was graming the gable ends recently moved here from Tennessee and I can see that working there. He's not used to our snow yet and framing for it. Woods favorite carpenter
Matt, The headers may well be fine as has been suggested. I am no engineer and just do some stuff by "eye" so don't sweat it because I said anything. The place looks great , I ma glad you got the insurance issues dealt with and are underway . It should make a great space for working in.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Your replys are fine, don't sweat it.
I thought they were small too, but it was too late by the time I seen them. I am going to switch out the inside ply for peace of mind.
Woods favorite carpenter
Would using a sheet of plywood on the interior wall be enough to correct for the small header.As the ridge was not load carrying and you are going to have ceiling joists.
I would also make the ceiling 9 ft tall so sheet goods are easier to manuever.
ANDYSZ2
WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
I am going to have at least 9' ceilings in it, I haven't got to installing the collar ties yet but I want at least 9'.
Considering the ridge is almost 12' off the finished floor I don't see any issues with that. Woods favorite carpenter
nice work matt....
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it's not a structural ridge... so your gable ends are not carrying anything
if your headers give you the wood you need for trim... i'd leave the headers you have
more room for insulationMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Thanks for the kind words Mike, I'm not sure about the headers yet, I may switch out the inside ply at least. Woods favorite carpenter
Thank you Mike!
Those gable headers are no more structural than the walls themselves.The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
hey, good work, thanks for keeping us posted. it's fun to see the whole prosses. There's a house going down the street of me, and I love going by there each day seeing the progress.
Ductape can fix EVERYTHING!!!
Thanks for posting the photos and descriptions. Does my old heart good to see men working on such a fine looking roof in cold weather. Always have loved to see rafters against a clear blue winter sky.
Wise move, renting that lift for the ridge beam. I can think of a few old jobs when one of those would have been a real blessing.
I've never used one of those monster saws. I wonder what happens if it kicks. Dislocated shoulder? I guess I wouldn't want to find out, huh?
Edited 2/23/2008 9:00 pm by Hudson Valley Carpenter
It's been a really fun project so far, I'm looking forward to moving the shop equipment upstairs.
Without that lift I could hardly imagine trying to get that monster ridge up there.
I'm not sure what happens when that saw kicks, I go easy with it, let it do the work and not force it through the stock. Woods favorite carpenter
I go easy with it, let it do the work and not force it through the stock.
That and making sure that you support both ends of anything you're cutting, so it can't bind.
If that's obvious to you, forgive me for bringing it up but it seems to bear repeating with so much torque in hand.
I've spent more hours than I care to think about behind a Makita beam saw, even using sideways to cut tenons, etc. I've never had it kick back at all...it will bind first. In fact, it's amazing how easy they are to bind if you don't cut perfectly straight.
Nice work, nice tools. Where the heck are your safety glasses?
Have a good day
Cliffy