So yesterday my wife points out the mold growing on our vinyl clad doublehung windows and wonders what I know about it. “That’s mold” doesn’t get the awe inspired look I was hoping for, so I decided to come here and poke around a little. I see there’s another post about mold growing where the two windows meet and realized our problem’s got to be moisture related… duh. We live in basement remodel less than a year old, with radiant floor heat, 750 sq ft of living space, a shower that I don’t use the exhaust fan on near enough, my wife who is happiest cooking, and a 4 gallon humidifier to keep my newborn from stuffing up (and it helps me out as well.) I realize now with that much humidity in this small space… mold is bound to sprout somewhere. SO, do I crack a window? (Iowa winter’s an unwelcome indoor guest), run the exhaust fan constantly (seems funny to burn electricity to make the humidity and then burn more to eject it), or just tell my Mrs. to keep the spot clean with some diluted bleach?
Any ideas?
Replies
run the exhaust fan constantly (seems funny to burn electricity to make the humidity and then burn more to eject it)
That's your answer. If you're getting so much humidity to form enough condensation long enough for mold to form on your windows, you have way too much humidity in the air.
Most health professionals recommend 40%.
BTW, don't even think about the mold that could be growing inside those basement walls!
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"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
We have three boys - 2, 5, and 7.
Shortly after moving into our current house (1996) with baseboard hotwater convectors, we stopped using humidifiers.
We've had them all - heated steam type, cool mist atomizer and also the wet belt/fan types.
Anyhoo...the first two definitely can dampen up a house in a hurry.
If you need to increase humidity, I recommend the belt/fan type that has a humidistat, although it does require the belt to be cleaned or replaced periodically. Don't get the soaked paper filter humidifiers.
In the winter, household activity can be enough to generate enough humidity but I guess it depends on the family and the type of house.
One constant in most family households is the wife's tendency to run the shower scalding hot....
We have several humidity gauges in the house and we take advantage of the shower steam, which dissipates fairly quickly.
Thanks for the input, I think we'll shut the humidifier off for a week or two and see if we actually notice a difference in the air and our noses.
It's not just the humidity. That's only part of it. Human comfort calls for about 40% humidity or so and houses live better with 16-18%. Your range should be controlled within that.
But mold doesn't grow on water alone, it needs food and it darn sure won't eat glass. If you have mold growing on windows, wash them. If they're that dirty - enough to grow mold - I'm betting there's other things in the house that could stand some cleanup too.
And don't just tell her to do it. Jump right in there and show her how - oops - I mean help her out.
;-).
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit.
The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are."
--Marcus Aurelius
Good mold info:
http://www.fsec.ucf.edu/bldg/mold/index.htm
Couple days ago was a news item on sudden increase in mold insurance claims and litigations and how some insurance companies are refusing coverage against it.
One thing mentioned was it's not that there is a sudden increase in mold but more folks all of a sudden becoming more aware of it.
There may be other factors, such as modern building techniques and some lifestyles that contribute to the problem.
As the public becomes aware of it, there are more falsified claims designed to line lawyers pockets too..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit.
The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are."
--Marcus Aurelius
I'm sure it's a lucrative gig for many folks.
As the public becomes aware of it, there are more falsified claims designed to line lawyers pockets too. [Emphasis added]
Designed? So someone fakes a claim to make lawyers rich? That's their intention and goal?
Some lawyers do some cruddy things (remember, it's only 90% of the lawyers who ruin it for the rest of them {G}) but I think you're getting a bit carried away in that characterization.________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
The poster is not really concerned with the mold as effecting life style . So to a point its intentional that he continues to have mold. If his child got sick and the docs said it was the mold some one would want some insurance coverage and they might blame a lanlord in court. I can think of several ways for people to make mold lucrative and the insurace company cease to pay.
I know I would not want to pay a claim to him when he is more concerned over losing one of his options . His options should pay the bill . Yup, right out of the back of his pocket. Its fruadulent to collect on a policy that you intentionally caused the claim.
From our cabin to yours ,
Happy holidays .
Tim Mooney
can of worms
Tim Mooney
Tim, it was the bit about who was intended to get money that got my attention: designed to line lawyers pockets
No biggie, just a nit pick________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
You might think that I'm getting carried away but go to JLConline and seaarch the threads for mold. There's some serious documentation and articles along that line..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit.
The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are."
--Marcus Aurelius
Piffin,
I've just read all of the JLC threads for the past 2 years which had the words "mold" and "lawyer" and didn't find anything to that effect.
Yes, there was bitching about lawyers making some money, and I'm sure that happens.
But look at the typoical statement, this one regarding a law suit where no money was actually paid: "yes if a lawyer was involved, he/she got paid, as they do in any kind of case they handle."
That's just dead wrong; most consumer cases are handled on a contingency basis - no pay out, no fee.
Or look at this message:
"One of our few good builders here sold a new spec house and quickly got a law suit filed against him.
"The owner claimed that the yard didn't drain well which caused his kids to get sick. He contacted one of the local lawyers who had just made a killing on EIFS settlements. She called an environmental consultant who had apparently left her a business card after attending some school on identifying the troblesome mold spores. This consultant, who ofcourse is trying to develop a new market in troubled times, finds the bad type mold spores. (Probably could have found them in every house here.)
"Today in mediation, the owner said he would walk away for $20,000. (The lawyer gets $6666 of this for having a paralegal compose a complaint wrapped around the consultants report and spends a couple hours in a mandated mediation)
...
"The bottom line is that the lawyer and the consultant make money and the rest of us lose. The price of houseing goes up. The price of insurance goes up.
Wait a minute: the bottom line is that the homeowner walked away with a bundle of cash - a lot more than the lawyer.
Did that homeowner have the intent or desire to make the lawyer rich? Nope, the homeowner wanted to get rich himself.
Does it make sense for the lawyer to make that much money for that little work?
I don't know; but here's the underlying rationale:
Our legal system wants all people to be able to get access to the legal system to get justice for wrongs done to them.
Litigation is very expensive, few peple can afford to pay an hourly rate to a lawyer to pursue a claim.
So, lawyers are allowed in those cases to charge a copntingency fee: X% of any judgement obtained and paid out. Not every suit is going to be a winner; the "excess" made on one suit helps cover other suits where the plaintiff doesn't win.
Are there abuses? Of course there are. Is it as bad as some people paint it? I don't think so.
BTW, I have some strong disagreements on a private home inspection forum with the one JLC forum moderator there, Mike O'Handley, but (i) he is a very knowledgable guy when it comes to buiding practices, materials and problems, and (ii) I agree with his well articulated and knowledgable views about mold.
________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
Edited 12/1/2002 9:39:05 PM ET by Bob Walker
Here is an article in today's web edition of the NYT.
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/02/national/02TEXA.html?todaysheadlines
Mold is mentioned half way down.
What is your point?
My point is the fairly simple point that all this brohaha is not "intended to benefit lawyers."
Yeah, there are some slimeball lawyers who are milking this. There are a number of "mold testing" buisnesses who are milking this as well. And some home inspectors.
There are also consumers who are faking illnesses to line up at the trough.
A local elementary school in the Toledo area was closed down and huge amounts of money spent cleaning it up because kids were "developing rashes."
What the kids were doing was getting out of class and out of school by scratching their arms hard and showing the "rash" to the teacher.
I know a senior guy at the company that oversaw the cleanup. An Industrial Hygenist. He knows his stuff.
He tried to argue against the cleanup (even with his company making big bucks) and he was the most knowledgable person involved.
There was no way the school was not going to clean up, however, because of the rampant misinfomation out there and the risk of getting sued (not by a lawyer - they don't start 'em, their cleints' start 'em.)
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"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
Bob -
Not trying to make a point.
Since "mold" is part of the discussion I thought the article might be of interest, which I started reading mainly for the cost of homeowner insurance topic.
Perhaps I shouldn't have sent the note as a reply to your post.
Alan
Ahh, Ok. There's been a lot of information and misinformation about mold the last couple of years.________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
The newscast does mention an expert who says not all signs of mold require drastic and expensive measures.
My dad's an insurance claims adjuster in MO and says there's no such thing as a "mold induced illness". I send him every article in the paper about Penicillium etc. making peoples eyes bleed and other nasty things.
The first day we walked into this house was in May after some heavy rains. The real estate agent, home inspector, and my husband and I were sneezing like crazy. Thought it was the Mulberry tree blooming in the back. (I have no allergies) After moving in and coming down with allergies that nothing helped, we noticed some plaster falling off in a corner of the room addition that had been "Micky Moused" to fit around a window.
The plaster contained 2% of the A word so we had it abated. I reframed the corner so it's leak proof...no more allergies. We didn't speak a word to our insurance co.; out here they're cancelling policies left and right if you say the word "MOLD"
Wood is Good, may Wood be with you ;):
Everything I've read about mold is that we really don't know a whole lot about it; some people are affected by it, most aren't at levels typically found in houses.
I had one client who had been in a house about 2 1/2 hours and was doing fine until I mentioned there was some mold in the crawl space at which point she started gasping for air!
Control moisture and clean up what's there.________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
all these other folks trying to make a big killing off of mold and not a single lawyer anywhere pushing cases into court?
tell me another funny one..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit.
The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are."
--Marcus Aurelius
all these other folks trying to make a big killing off of mold and not a single lawyer anywhere pushing cases into court?
tell me another funny one.
Of course there are. Please reread my posts.________________________________________________
"I may have said the same thing before... But my explanation, I am sure, will always be different." Oscar Wilde
Likewise a few years ago there was no sudden increase in road rage. There was a study last year that the number of incidents of road rage have remainded about a the same, rare.
But a few years ago there was a big story about it in one paper or magazine. Then all of these incidents that never had new coverage was now being shown on the news and thus a big "increase".