Replies

1. 
   Danial_T | Jan 22, 2002 01:21am | #1

   *
   Jim,
   Haven't installed that particular model. I do recomend Moen often as I think it is value priced and have had no call backs to date. As far as the support department is concerned I have had nothing but success. I lost a ring once and they replaced it free. I bought a bunch of plumbing parts and one Moen faucet had no handle, the charged me for it but sent it and I had it in 3 days. DanT

1. 
   Jim_Darr | Jan 22, 2002 04:11am | #2

   *Since I posted the initial discussion, I was able to speak with a MOEN rep. They were professional and helpful .... my experience with their support was on the top peg!! While I'm not sure my experience would give me the warm and fuzzy feeling I need to install the model with which I had difficulty, one has to consider other products they market and support. Thanks!!

1. 
   xJohn_Sprung | Jan 23, 2002 10:58pm | #3

   *We've had Moen faucets in the San Pedro house for 30 years. Once every 20 - 25 years, you have to pull the innards out and push in a new set. The local hardware store carries them.-- J.S.

1. 
   Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 23, 2002 11:46pm | #4

   *Some people love them. I have seen too much junk from them to be pleased. Their faucets seem trouble prone to me. Expensive and often difficult to repair. A number of companies even make special tools to repair them. Is that a hint?Just my opinion.

1. 
   Mr._Pita | Jan 24, 2002 12:18am | #5

   *So, if I have a wrench that is specially made for a Chevy or Ford, does that mean all they make is junk? Or is it a wear part that is designed to be replaced every so often, but maybe wasn't designed with common hand tools in mind, or the custom designed tool works better than the common tools?I think like Chevy or Ford, they make crap, but they make good stuff too. Like Chevy - they make the Tracker, which I consider crap, and the Tahoe, which I wouldn't mind owning. Maybe the junk you've seen is from the lower product lines?I don't mean to pick on you , I just don't understand your logic. I would not be surprised by trouble from the $40 faucet, but I would not expect it from the $140 faucet.

2. 
   Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 24, 2002 12:40am | #6

   *Good response...First of all... The fact they make very cheap plastic garbage does not mean their better stuff is bad.BUT, I have seen lots of trouble with their better faucets. Their Moentrol T&S faucets usually get hard to operate after a couple years. Hardly acceptable in my opinion. I have replaced countless diverter buttons that started sticking after a couple of years.Many peopla I talk to are kinda down on pull out spouts. Ask a few questions and it comes out they had experience with a Moen. Talk to service plumbers. I have found the majority do not have a high opinion of Moen.The special tool was mentioned from this aspect...I believe a faucet should be simple and easy to repair. If it takes special tools it is neither. And hey, a truck has hundreds of parts. Not a fair comparison there.I try to ask every plumber I meet what faucet they use. if they use Moen i ask why. Never have I got the answer that high quality is a factor. I used to wonder... is there something I am missing by not being a Moen fan. I mean if everyone else thinks they are so great maybe I am just not seeing something. That is why I ask the questions.i have now come to the conclusion it is because of inertia that as many plumbers use Moen on thier new installs. I even asked a Moen rep why I should use Moen. He never mentioned quality as an issue. Instead he kept saying they are "about as good as Delta" I had been very careful to not portray my opinion when I asked. Interesting.I am not saying they are junk. If there is a reason anyone can give me as to the superiority of Moen please let me know. At this point I have heard the wide selection of styles as the best reason. I know there are all these people who tell you about their wonderful Moen that Great-great grandpa put in and it still works fine. I can find you the same story about any other brand. I can also find horror storys about most brands. Neither prove anything except that that person was happy or unhappy.I am going more on a general overview of my experience, feedback from customers, and asking other service plumbers. (Service is the key word)Note: I am not upholding Delta as the superior alternative in this post. So don't try to refute my post by knocking Delta! LOL I like them but have had problems with certain models. Wolverine Brass makes some of the best mid range faucets out there. Moen and Delta cannot compare when it comes to quality.

3. 
   Danial_T | Jan 24, 2002 04:57am | #7

   *Wet Head, Just goes to show it can happen to any brand. The last 2 Deltas I installed leaked the moment the supply valve was turned on. Had to return one and the other I had to disassemble in order to get the o-rings reseated properly. The last Delta I rebuilt still leaked and had to be replaced. None of these issues have occured for me with Moen. And the Moen is a simple cartridge replacement instead of a series of o-rings and springs. As far as simplicity Central Brass always was a favorite of mine. To each his own, but I still install Delta if a customer asks. If you really want quality and price isn't the object then these two brands aren't what you are looking for anyway. DanT

4. 
   Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 24, 2002 05:22am | #8

   *You are right about the quality and these 2 brands.Delta faucets leaked around the spout I just bet. Tell me if I'm right.

5. 
   Steve_Weeks | Jan 24, 2002 06:00am | #9

   *The main points were raised. Though they're quicksilver when new (like when you're testing them at the kitchen and bath boutique), Moen cartridges clog up quickly, making them hard to regulate --Oomph On, Oomph Off, forget in between. Deltas leak everywhere. Every kitchen Delta I've seen in others' homes has a mineral ring at the faucet base. Ceramic cartridges are the answer. When my ceramic cartridge shows signs of getting stiff, I shut off the stop and rotate the faucet control fully from on to off a few times. Cleans out the minerals. Open the stop again, and it's like new. Will never go back to rubber.Speaking of special tools and Chevys, anyone remember the tool needed to loosen the distributor nut on 70's GM cars, the ones with the distributor behind the engine? It must have bent six ways and had to be threaded under the wires, past the manifold, aside the vacuum tubes, etc. before engaging the nut you couldn't see unless you took the hood off and laid on the car's roof. Doesn't speak well for the Moen cartridge extractor tool.

6. 
   Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 24, 2002 06:08am | #10

   *still waiting for someone to ask about the olverine Brass faucets... LOL

7. 
   Rob_Rehm | Jan 25, 2002 12:48am | #11

   *Ok I'll bite what about Wolverine? I like moen because I can easily get them, My plumber likes themm & I don't have to listen to him bitch about a different type & I feel they offer a good value & style selection for the money. I put them in my house & like them. If money is no object ( not my house) We use Grohe.

8. 
   G.LaLonde | Jan 25, 2002 01:15am | #12

   *I agree with a lot of Wetheads comments. If you buy a top line Moen they will send you free replacement parts forever. Their cartridges are not the best, so you must replace often. They either work too easily and the handles on the kitchen faucets fall down or in a short time, they start sticking and you can hardly move them. On the other hand, I don't know of a similarly priced faucet that is any better and you sure don't get the free replacement like you do with Moen. Their cartridge replacement tool should be kept right in the sink cabinet for future use! I can change a Moen cartridge in less than 5 minutes, so it is not a big deal. The cheap plastic tops on the $175 dollar faucets last about a year and then they will send you a bag of them rather than make a good one in the first place. You can also renew a sticking cartridge to like new condition by relubricating it with silicone grease.

9. 
   Danial_T | Jan 25, 2002 04:32am | #13

   *Wet Head, You are correct. That is exactly where they leaked. Most of my customers want stuff they see at Lowes. When you mention a better model or brand the response is "but I really like this model and it looks real good". So I put it in and explain some of the issues, to no avail. (sigh) The special tool I remember is the socket for small block chevy oil sending units. $17, only available from Snap On or Mack. That was in '75! DanT

10. 
    jim_"crazy_legs"_blodg | Jan 25, 2002 05:13am | #14

    *We put Moen single lever faucet and shower valves in our house 15, or 16 years ago and I'm not impressed. I have replaced several of the cartridges several times. I'm going back to the old style with seperate handles for hot and cold. Those single levers seemed sweet at first and my brother in law (a plumber) had nothing but praise for them. What's this about a ceramic cartridge?

11. 
    Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 25, 2002 08:03am | #15

    *Wolverine faucets are priced slightly higher than Delta or Moen. The quality if much better. They have a 100 year warranty. Don't know if the warranty is much good. Never get to try it out. Ceramic disk cartridges too. The ONLY drawbacks are smaller selection of styles (what they do have are very good looking.) and only available through plumbers. I can help with more details if anyone e-mails me. They blow away Delta and Moen when it comes to quality.

12. 
    Mr._Pita | Jan 25, 2002 02:43pm | #16

    *Thanks for the reply. Now I understand your logic a lot more, by knowing that at least some of the crap you saw was the higher end stuff. As for me, I don't really have any faucet preferences either way, just find it interesting how some people will alienate an entire brand based on a limited exposure - obviously not the case in your experience.

13. 
    G.LaLonde | Jan 25, 2002 04:00pm | #17

    *Steve, I still have that tool in the lower drawer on my toolbox. This obviously dates me as a mechanic. With slight modification, this tool can be converted to a Moen cartridge extraction tool!

14. 
    jim_"crazy_legs"_blodg | Jan 26, 2002 06:37pm | #18

    *I'd like to know more about these Wolverine faucets, Wet Head. Never heard of them. Can you post some info here?

15. 
    Wet_Head_Warrior | Jan 26, 2002 07:14pm | #19

    *http://www.wolverinebrass.com105 year old company.Site doesn't really do them justice. Like I said the selection is limited. But the quality is second to none. Anyone interested in pricing contact your plumber or e-mail me.

2. 
   Jim_Darr | Jan 26, 2002 07:14pm | #20

   *
   I would appreciate hearing the experiences that others may have had regarding the Moen Pure Touch Kitchen Faucets ...... installed one 2 years ago ...... nothing but problems. Moen support is hard to contact ..... we'll see. Appreciate the comments.