My son worked for me until I closed my company in January. Since then he has continued to work for me liquidating the business and working some on a flip house I have. He has continued to apply for jobs but of course they are scarce even with his degree and experience.
So he found a job. A large local landscaping company has been bought out by a national landscaping company. The local company has a strong prescence in snow removal throughout the state. The national company felt that is a market they should do more in so that is the reason for the buyout.
My son has been hired to be a 3 state co-ordinator. Someone else sells the snow removal to large commercial accounts, like Wall Mart, Lowes etc. Then my son gets on the phone and drums up local people who will do the work at a corporate predetermined price. If there are any issues he may have to travel to the site and work them out but basicly this is all handled using phone, internet, email, and fax.
Anyone else see something wrong with this movie?! Maybe it is my age or I am too small minded but I can’t for the life of me see how this will work successfully long term. I (trying not to offend him of course although in my direct manner that sometimes is difficult) asked him “son, how do you know what you are getting? Do you check references on these guys or anything?”
His response was that the company said they need to move quickly so there is not time for that sort of thing at the moment. If there are issues they will deal with them as they go but for the moment getting enough contractors to fill the contracts is the only worry!!WTF?! Sure will be interesting. Hope they get a few winters under their belt so my kid can have a shot at another job if this tanks.
I guess as a dad something else I find interesting is my son seems to think this is a great way to handle it all. So I am trying to decide if he is blinded by the light and the new job, or if I am getting older and more cautious and the business world is passing me by, or if I just didn’t teach him anything about customer care and loyalty at all. What do you think? DanT
Replies
I'd be worried too. Sounds like a Walmart mentality is trying to get in the snow removal business.
What does walmnart do? Cut out the middle man. I.E., your son, eventually.
I wish him the best.
Question. Why can't he do this on his own, with a little parental backing??
"Why can't he do this on his own, with a little parental backing??"
While I was able to close the business, pay my bills, sell my equipment and buildings I was not able to do so without some personal cost. Further I helped support my son and his wife for the last 8 months and my brother and his family for 4 so I don't have the resources to be of much assistance at this point. Now that they are both employed I can work at getting my financial picture back in order. DanT
I don't think so. I did shopping center maintenance for 15 years, Walmart never bothered us about outside maintenance. As a matter of fact they complained if we did something during the day that might inconvenience the customers.
Sounds like he'll need to bring a lot of savvy, a lot of people skills, and a lot of problem-solving to bear. That's the kind of job for a person with patience and persistence, and an even keel. Does he have those things? If so, he's got as good a shot as there is. If it were me, I'd be on the phone right now trying to ferret out the good operators in the towns he's going to service. Get their insurance certs, worker's comp info, etc., see who's real and who's not.
"If it were me, I'd be on the phone right now trying to ferret out the good operators in the towns he's going to service. Get their insurance certs, worker's comp info, etc., see who's real and who's not."
That is exactly what his job is. But my point is you can only know so much by seeing their certificates, comp info etc. And since they have decided to forego references I think it is a #### shoot as far as what they are getting. And they tell them not to waste time with the reference thing as they have over sold to the point they are thinking of hiring more co-ordinators. DanT
I haven't done snow removal but I have lots of experience hiring people to mow grass and sweep parking lots in shopping centers. Parking lot sweeping always gave me the most problems. They were almost always be small businesses' and they'd underbid the work. I'd tell them their price was too low but they'd insist. A month in they'd skip nights, not empty cans, etc. I fired 15 companies in 10 years, some of them twice.
It may not be your son's problem if they don't preform but I can't see how they'll keep the business without feet on the ground at the properties.
What's your son doing to do the other 6 months out of the year when it's not snowing?
"What's your son doing to do the other 6 months out of the year when it's not snowing?"
Well, since it is not snowing now I assume he will be doing something of the same. But I didn't ask. DanT
"The local company has a strong prescence in snow removal throughout the state"
That should count for something. There's already a network in place. He's not starting from scratch.
I wouldn't worry about him. I'm sure you raised him well and he'll do his best. If he gets the job done, he'll have a job. If he doesn't get the job done, he'll gain some valuable experience...and be looking for a job....just like he was when he applied with this new company.
I don't see anything wrong with this program other than they don't have enough time to check references right now. If he can quickly get his vendors lined up, he might be able to start checking references instead of finding out who won't get the job done after the first snow.
Thanks for the encouragement. He is the best producer of the 3 they currently have. I know he is a smart and a hard worker. As with youth though he is sometimes idealistic in what will work or happen. Good thing I guess. We get old and cynical after being run over by the train we thought was a light at the end of the tunnel a few times lol. DanT
Hard to say. Not much different from what Sears has been doing for decades.
"Hard to say. Not much different from what Sears has been doing for decades."
A good point. I hadn't considered the similarities but you're right. DanT
I'd also note that around here the big construction companies do most of the heavy snow removal. They have skip loaders and dump trucks that are idled in the winter anyway, so it makes sense.
Smaller lots are generally handled by guys with 4WD pickups and a blade on the front.
I read all of the replies before posting, and before I even got there I was thinking of aka blue's why I love roofing business thread, and the rat roofing company I described in that thread.
Number one, first thing that jumps to my mind is "Who did the snow removal for all these places last year?"
Sounds like your son will be contacting some of the same small local people who did the work last year but this year they will be asked to do it for the new corporate predetermined rate.
Now I have no problem with this in concept as long as it is all fair and above board, there is nothing wrong with hanging up your shingle and asking for work, what bothers me about it is that it seems the way to be successful with this business model is the pattern that walmart has used. Walmart controls the price vendors charge and the wages walmart pays to its "associates".
What I would be worried about is the large corporation offering contracts in the beginning for less than what the locals were charging, then after taking corporate profits offering the locals less to do the work than they got last year.
With the economy the way it is, if you are a guy who makes his living with a pickup and a blade attached to it during the winter, and you find out a new company has all of the work sewn up in your area, and they are offering to let you do it for $10 per hr when last year you got $20 per hr... what do you do?
As you said in your post, "for the moment they are only worried about getting enough contractors to fill the contracts". It should be no problem to get the same guys they got last year unless a huge amount of snow removal guys retired or got other jobs all of a sudden, unless they don't want to do it because of the rate.
If your sons new job is with the company that wants to be the walmart of snow removal, and his position in that company means he is on one of the upper rungs of the ladder it sounds like he may be in a good position. I know I feel sorry for a lot of the "associates" at walmart. I wish they got better pay and benefits, I would gladly pay 20% more on everything at walmart as long as it all goes to my neighbors that work there and not the corporate big wigs.
Worst case your son gets an education about differentiating between a train and a light at the end of the tunnel.
The hands off corporate approach.
We see a little of it around here. Bigger landscape companies (philly area guys) get the contract but they send their own hand crews out, they just sub the equipment work.
If they get lucky and hire the right sub, they are good, if not a nightmare.
Big companies get bigger and bigger till they collapse. I am all for growth, but controlled responsible growth. Much of the corporate world seems to have gotten away from the idea smart growth.
I think youre bein a gripe .
He didnt have a job when he found that one . He couldnt find one in his feild . He was working for you trying to get by after you shut down. Whats he supposed to do?
My wife did about the same thing . [yes a little different] She was running a wealthy plant and lost her job. She took a job with a start up plant thats borrowing money to get started. She said she was afraid of it . Afraid of what ? She hasnt worked in two years and shes worried about losing two weeks pay ?
Im proud of your kid for gettin out there and makin it happen. Atta boy.
Tim
I am with you on this one!!!
Must have come across wrong. I am grateful that he found a job.............any job.
As I said in a further post I am also glad to end the "dad help" portion of his income so I can iron out some of my own wrinkles.
I just found it an alarming way in my mind to do business. And was looking to see what others thought. I see your thought is that I should shut up and let him work. Glad he didn't go to work as a male prostitute. Concerned parents. What a pain. DanT
I didn't take your coming across as wrong at all, I think you are correct to worry that he is not getting involved with a shady company, or even a non shady company that will have a short future.
Although as other posters have pointed out at least he is working, and I am sure it will be a good learning experience no matter how it turns out.
So long as the kid doesn't have any of his money in it (or yours), and so long as he has no legal exposure, it's a safe learning experience, if nothing else.When we get old and cranky(ier) we tend to forget that a young person with few obligations can afford to take a risk, and may actually enjoy the risk.
As I stood before the gates I realized that I never want to be as certain about anything as were the people who built this place. --Rabbi Sheila Peltz, on her visit to Auschwitz
And if he didnt take this job what would he do? So he has to work hard and you think he may get screwed, at least hes out there doing it, not sitting around unemployed like a lot of other because they " cant find a job in their field".
You probably taught him more that you realize and hes finding his own solutions to his problems, you should be proud hes not looking to you or the government for a handout.
Dan,
Brickman took over some if not all of the Honda accounts last year. I think they mostly did it to get the mowing. They approached the independent guy that coordinated the plowing for the previous contractor. They asked him to come up with a price that was agreeable. This was only for a group of parking lots at one facility. The only change for the guys doing the plowing was the insurance requirements were higher therefore more expensive. So they raised their rates to cover this. I believe somewhat at the Honda plant gave the Brickman personnel the contact information.
Around my way,
Places like the old LUcent building are always soliciting for a snow removal contract.
Seem like it's a new guy every other year.
Reason being? In a good year the contract may be enough to carry a small landscaper thru an entire year, leaving the mowing, planting and leaf picking up as gravy.
BUT
The management company usually has the contractor strung out until June or July for payment for snow removed in January or February.
I'm betting that more than 50% of the contractors involved in some of these contracts will galdly work for the new company as subcontractors in exchange for getting paid when work is complete.
A crappy way for the business to go?
Yup, sure is.
But it is a reallity of the business environment that tradesmen on all levels have allowed develop.
If nothing else, he gets a years work experience out of it...........and I'm betting many, many life lessons that will help him in the future.