We live in an Oregon suburban neighborhood with homes built around 1988. Yesterday, we found a pool of water in our crawl space right where the main water pipe runs in at the south side of the house (there is also a turn-off valve directly outside the house from this spot). The meter box out at the street is also pooled with water (our neighbor’s meter box which is 4 inches away has no water in it).
A check was done to see if the meter moved after 7 hours of no water usage and it stayed the same. We dug around the turn off value next to the house to confirm there wasn’t any leaking but the soil was very very soppy here. We cleared out all the water from the meter box and from the pipe area in the crawl space. Both filled up again within a few hours. After looking through the whole crawl space, a few more spots were found with small pools of water (one right where the sewer pipe runs out on the west side of the house).
We thought maybe we were having some odd ground water issue so we dug a 3 foot hole nearby and it was completely dry. We had the city water and plumber come out and no one knows what to make of it. Where is this water coming from? Can it follow pipes into the house? We are not sure what to do next. Any thoughts?
Greta Girl
Replies
Yes water can follow pipes..or rather the disturbed trench/soil that the pipe was laid in. But since the house is approaching 20 years old it isn't likely! and your meter indicates that there is not a leak on the house side of the meter.
The water at the meter box maybe from the main side of the meter and would not show on your meter since it did not pass through the meter to the house service side. The water at the meter may be an issue to itself and may not relate to the crawlspace water you see.
Do you have an air conditioner running? If yes, then check out where the condensate drains.
Check out your gutter downs and runoff. How much rainfall have you had?
Does the lay of the land or the geology of the site indicate the possibility of a ground seep/spring? Is an uphill neigbors house seeping water from its service or a swimming pool , or condensate drain?
What is the condition of the floor joist and decking as viewed from the crawlspace? Any evidence of rot, mold, mildew etc?
Check out all areas of the crawlspace to determine if the water is saturating the whole area or is limited to only the spot you describe.
Investigate further, please.
........Iron Helix
Do you have an air conditioner running?
- Not recently and only when it's really hot. It drains on the east side of the houseCheck out your gutter downs and runoff.
- I checked these last fall and all was well. They drain to the north curb.How much rainfall have you had?
- Just had some rain last week but nothing significant.Does the lay of the land or the geology of the site indicate the possibility of a ground seep/spring?
- Yes, there is a seasonal pond in the woods across the street but it is nearly dry right now. The grade of the land north and south slopes toward us and then the east side slopes away from the house.Is an uphill neighbors house seeping water from its service or a swimming pool , or condensate drain?
- There is no evidence of this but I did go around checking our neighbors water meter boxes for water and only the people behind us (down slope) had water in their boxes. We are a corner lot and at the street corner there is a gutter. You can always hear water running there even when we have had months of no rain. Sometimes it sounds like a waterfall it rushes so hard, even in the middle of summer. But it is just a slow run right now.Also, last fall, the city opened a pump house at the top of our hill (2 blocks up from us). Here is an article describing it (see What is Aquifer Storage and Recovery (ASR)? on page 5):
http://www.beavertonoregon.gov/departments/publicworks/Utilities/docs/BeavertonCCR2006.pdfWhat is the condition of the floor joist and decking as viewed from the crawl-space? Any evidence of rot, mold, mildew etc?
- All wood is fine. Not rot, mold, etc -- yet!!!We have the pipes directly outside the foundation exposed and will replace these pipes and shut off value with a new one -- since it is all dug out right now and could probably use it soon. Both the plumber and city water guy said there wasn't a leak in the box but we are thinking of having it replaced too just in case -- even though the meter is showing no leak.
Well, found a leak tonight. It was dark out and I was using a flash light so I will need to investigate more in the morning. It looks like it is right outside the meter box (on our side) where the pvc pipe starts going down into the ground. I do not know why it didn't show on the meter in the test (or why the city water guy and the plumber didn't find it) because you could see the clean water flowing into the muddy water tonight after I drained the box. It makes me worry about the rest of the pipe going to my house. I am assuming the water was just following the pipe down into the house? Maybe we should we get the whole pipe replaced just to be safe? I do not want to go through this again...
Great sleuthing!
Sure makes you wonder about the competency of the people that sometimes serve the public.
As far as the meter...it could be defective/intermittent.
The leak also might be intermittent...as the usage of water decreases after folks go to bed and the water towers are refilling the main pressures increase as head pressure at the towers builds. The small crack in the line then leaks under the increased pressure.
The pipe failure could be due to expansion and contraction movement of the meter fittings in the box after twenty years of pressure and temp cycles. The PVC fatigues and become brittle as well as the solvent joints failing.
I would excavate and repair at the meter box only, then wait and see if the leak persists before ripping out the whole service.
..............Iron Helix
Here's my leak...
Nothing a little duct tape won't fix.
So convenient a thing it is to be a reasonable Creature, since it enables one to find or make a Reason for everything one has a mind to do. --Benjamin Franklin
Yes, it can follow the pipes. We had a case with a Habitat house here where the water line was cracked right at the main and the water was following the line in and flooding the basement -- sump running continuously. Initially didn't suspect anything since it was wet season and low ground, but when it kept going the same in dry weather they went looking for the cause.
Bail out the puddle then when it refills take a sample and see if you can smell chlorine, or have it tested .. if it's the city's problem and you can prove it, they might be more interested in stopping any potential damage to your property ..
That's a great idea about having the water tested. That way we can tell if its ground water or city water. Thank you!
Unfortunately, the water testing idea is not foolproof. We had a water issue that the county swore was not their water because it did not test for chlorine. Only after we dug up the line between the basement and the shutoff at the street and showed them the crack in the line were they convinced.
There was a post on here a few weeks ago about someone who started digging at the valve where water was showing -- no leak. Had to follow the pipe hundreds of feet (including under the street) and past several tees to find the leak. (I'm amazed that water companies don't have some hi-tech device that'll pinpoint leaks. Or maybe some do??) Anyway, digging is a pain, but you may have to do some. Dig down to below the pipe near the house. You'll probably be able to tell which direction the water is coming from. Dig again at whatever valve, tee, etc. is next in line in that direction. Repeat. If it's on your side of the tap-in to the main, it's your problem. If it's on the other side, it's theirs.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA