Replies

1. 
   sapwood | Jan 18, 2011 09:49pm | #1

   Ask a librarian... they know it all

   I suggest you start at your local library. Check out a few books on home wiring. Each one (if they're any good at all) will have a section on the service entrance and panel. You need to read up, then you'll know what questions to ask.

2. 
   glacierfergus | Jan 18, 2011 11:50pm | #2

   They are pretty standard....

   I am not an electrician, but I just did my own house and went through a similar research process. Take my advise for what is worth ( a well informed DIYer, not a professional). For the most part, a 200 amp 40 slot panel is a 200 amp 40 slot panel. THey all have to meet requirements to be UL listed and they will all do the job. Pick a major brand that has been around for a long time, and pick the brands that your local suppliers carry so that you will be able to get a replacement or additional breaker 10 years from now.  Around here, most panels are either GE or Square D. And check the prices of AFCI and GFCI breakers as well as the price of regular breakers for the different brands.  When I started, one brand wanted a fortune for AFCI breakers, so I chose not to use that brand of box.  I am sure that prices have changed as AFCI breakers are much more mainstream now.

   When you bring up adding all the other stuff ( photo elecrics, automation, etc.) you would probably want to talk to someone who installs that stuff and ask them what to get or avoid in your service panel.  My very limited experience with such things has all involved either something that fits into your existing bow or resides in a secondary box, so the service panel is not much of an issue. Others may have a more informed opinion than I do.  I would call the local electrical inspector as well. I have been blessed by a very knowledgeable and helpful inspector and he has been very willing to help me avoid a few pitfalls. Ask questions early so that it is done correctly and to code the first time.

   Be sure to get a big enough box to add circuits. The difference in price betwee a 32 slot and a 40 slot box (both 200 amp) wouldn't buy a decent meal at a restaurant, so if space permits I always go for the bigger box. I also got an extra grounding bar for mine (inspectors suggestion), so it was easier to fit all the grounding and neutral wires with a minimum of sweat on my part. My electrical inspector recommended that any extra parts or things that had to be removed from the panel (extra screws, the bonding bar on subpanels) should be laid in the bottom of the box so that it was there if I needed to reconfigure later). I also found that keeping the grounds all on one side and the neutral on the other may save some frustration later. My project was an addition on the house, and I brought new service into a new 200 amp box.  I then subfed to the old 125 amp box (only 15 years old). That meant that I could not bond the neutral and ground in the old box, so I had to re-do all the neutrals and grounds in the old box to get them separated.

3. 
   Scott | Jan 18, 2011 11:51pm | #3

   >>>Are service panels even

   >>>Are service panels even subject to innovation and new features?

   Yes. But in terms of what the end user experiences, No, since the switch from fuses to breakers.

   IMO there are subtle differences between commercial and residential panels, but because of obvious public safety issues they are all governed by strict performance standards.

   I've always used the basic panels sold in big box stores. Yes, you put up with some workmanship issues with fit and finish because these panels are made as cheaply as possible (while conforming minimally to the standards). But my budget constraints have always steered me to the basic ones. So far, no complaints.

   I try to make up for this "cheapness" with fastidious workmanship. I'm very careful with splices, labelling, thermal issues, and protection from mechanical damage.

   You didn't indicate whether you are going to do the work or if you'll hire a pro. That's probably a factor in your decision.

    

1. 
   Scott | Jan 18, 2011 11:57pm | #4

   Oh... and one other thing.

   If you plan to do the work yourself, ALWAYS get it inspected.

   Most inspectors are quite accomodating, and great sources of advice. But even the mean-spirited ones can save your life.

   Know what you are doing.

4. 
   junkhound | Jan 19, 2011 08:38am | #5

   FWIW, get Square D QO type breakers/panel,  NOT 'homeline'.

   50 year track record of reliability and quality.   (so much for 'what's new')

5. 
   Clewless1 | Jan 20, 2011 09:07am | #6

   If you are doing PV down the road, install a piece of conduit to accomodate wire you will need later. The PV system will have its own 'controller' and then that will plug into your panel. Having the conduit in place would be nice. Run it to the likely location of your PV system electronics (e.g. inverter, etc.).

   Home automation and monitoring. Monitoring, cable, phone, internet, and controls) is low voltage and would be in a different panel. Home automation ... hmm more difficult, but I ain't no expert electrician, either. Home automation, I think would integrate low voltage controls w/ e.g. line voltage via ... I forget what they are called ... solenoid switches (but that's not the term I'm looking for) to operate e.g. your furnace, lights, whatever. May want another piece of conduit for this, but no idea how large (i.e. will there be lots of wires or little).

   Continue research like the other guy said.

6. 
   Amish Electrician | Jan 20, 2011 03:47pm | #7

   As a general practice, I advise the DIY crowd to leave service upgrades to the professionals. Here are my reasons:

   First, you'll have to work with both the utility and the city. There's more to it than swapping out hardware; the power company wants to know your needs, so they can be sure to provide you with enough power.

   Next, there are a LOT of details that will be addressed, apart from just the size of the panel. The service mast will be changed, and it may be necessary to add a ground rod.

   You will NOT want to make the service connections -or break the meter seals- yourself. Let the pros work with the live stuff. If you have an older house, a larger service will also require a new meter base and disconnect.

   An electricain can make allowances that will ease the later addition of a generator or other energy source to the system.

1. 
   junkhound | Jan 22, 2011 10:20am | #8

   You will NOT want to make the service connections -or break the meter seals- yourself

   Y   not??

   ....just pulling your chain <G>    would advise not to swap services in the rain on an aluminum ladder - dont ask how I know that.......

1. 
   Scott | Jan 22, 2011 11:40am | #9

   >>>would advise not to swap

   >>>would advise not to swap services in the rain on an aluminum ladder - dont ask how I know that.......

   Now THAT sounds like a story I'd like to hear. Esp. considering you're still around to type it in......

1. 
   junkhound | Jan 23, 2011 08:23am | #10

   One of these days when I have a lot of time......

   this will make amish cringe --  when I cut 3 feet of rigid 2" conduit lengthwise from a 200 A service so I would not have to call the poco so as to  save $230.   e.g. pull weatherhead, slide in a 1/8 thick piece of polycarb inside 2 sides where ya cut, run your saw along the conduit with abrasive cutoff blade open the clamshell and remove....... wait for a dry day for that ..

1. 
   Scott | Jan 23, 2011 09:11pm | #11

   >>>this will make amish

   >>>this will make amish cringe

   Hahaha....yup. Me too, like only you can do.....     ;-)

2. 
   bd | Jan 26, 2011 05:59pm | #12

   I'm beginning to think there maybe a good reason why Junkhound has as many scars as he does.