I was told this weekend that some new England states have a “view” tax which is added onto your property tax (if you have a scenic view, I guess). Sound wacky to m if true, how do you judge the views?
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You missed the point. The view is all over. The taxes are so high, it must be because of the views!>G<
Do you still have to pay of you legaly blind?
what if its your own property?
I wouldn't be surprised if, in areas where the assessed value is limited by some formula (vs using true market value), there would be a push to impose such a tax in order to realistically tax higher-valued properties.
Down here in Florida, just like in Charleston we don't have any mountain views. People who live on the water get taxed more than those who don't because waterfront is considered more desirable. In states like Colorado where there are no waterfront lots to tax at a higher rate they've started taxed more for elevation because elevation generally brings better views and higher lot prices. Just consider it another tax on success.
We have that here on the Chesapeake Bay in the Peoples Republic of Maryland. If you have a water view, your assessed value is higher.
Exactly. I live in Maryland too (Annapolis) and waterfront and waterview naturally get taxed higher because those are property assets. Really no different then having a property with a 6000SF house being taxed higher then the same propery with a 2000SF house.
Runnerguy
Exactly. I live in Maryland too (Annapolis) and waterfront and waterview naturally get taxed higher because those are property assets. Really no different then having a property with a 6000SF house being taxed higher then the same propery with a 2000SF house.
But to me it seems simple; a 6,000 sq. ft. house can be objectively measured against a 2000 sq. ft. house, and water frontage can be measured. But how do you measure "water view" or "mountain View' objectively? I mean, if i have trees in my front yard and only have a water view in the winter when leaves are gone, and you are my neighbor with an identical home with no tress so you see the water more of the year then I do, are your taxes higher? That is the trouble with "view" taxes. Note, I am not argueing "waterfront" but "water view" taxes.
Using an example involving hard numbers probably was a poor choice on my part since we're talking about an intangible
There are many intangible factors that are present in determining the value of a property. View is only one. Is it close to public transportation? How good are the schools? Does the back yard nestle up against a sound barrier with an interstate highway on the other side? Is it in a "good" neighborhood? Is there a park nearby?
My point being, assesments are usually determined by the price a willing seller and a willing buyer arrive at in an arms length transaction. And in that price is reflected all the intangibles. If there's a water view that price will be higher then the same property without a water view. Hence higher taxes.
Seems to me to have a special tax on an intangible is to tax the same thing twice.
> assesments are usually determined by the price a willing seller and a willing buyer arrive at in an arms length transactionNot true everywhere. In some areas assessments are based on a formula -- so much for each square foot, so much for each bath, etc. And even when this isn't explicit, it's often how the assessor in fact does the job. So having an explicit line in then assessment for "view" may make sense.I believe the courts have universally decided that you can't be assessed for more than the true (appraised) value of the property, so there's protection on that end. But on the other end there are a lot of places in the country where assessments are well below appraised value, for one reason or another.
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
Sure. Having a line item in the assessment formula for "view" to arrive at an accurate assessment is one thing but then having a tax on the view on top of the normal property tax is another.
Like you said, the formula also typically includes "number of baths" among other things. It'd be like having that figure contributing to the assessment and then adding on a special tax of X dollars per bathroom.
Doug
Which is perfectly reasonable, if a formula is being used. If the intent is for the tax to be on the "what it would sell for" value of the house, then "view" should be factored in. A house that would be worth $X in an average setting is worth $X+Y if it has a "view".
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
like you said...it is simple... in most coastal towns there is no such thing as a view tax
it is all done by state law "assesed at market value"..
so go to any real estate magazine and look at the ads..
IF ..... there is a view , it wll be mentioned....if it is abutting a water feature , it will be mentioned....idoes the view enhance the value ?... you know it does...so why the outrage ?
"a tax on success" ? is there any other ?
when i was a kid in the '50's..... our ten square mile island had 900 winter residents... and ballooned to 1600 in the summer... but it was all working stiffs and old money.. their demand on services was much lower then the current resident
eg...... we had one full time cop and two summer cops... now we have 26... my point is this... the higher income ( Success if you will ) requires a higher per capita expenditure... property tax is a very progressive tax if you exclude minimum housing and retired on fixed low income
so market value is a legitimate assessment.... would you value based on land area and house/building area .. with no other criteria ?
or would you prefer to abandon the roperty tax in favor of an income tax or a flat tax ?Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
IF ..... there is a view , it wll be mentioned....if it is abutting a water feature , it will be mentioned....idoes the view enhance the value ?... you know it does...so why the outrage ?
I don't have "outrage" per se. Let me make my view a little clearer if I can. You are correct. The value of a home is based on what it sells for. You may wish to make a higher offer based on things that are important to you like location to public trans, schools, etc. which I totally agree with. The problem we (or I) have here is that real property is reassessed every three years. Even that is OK because you can adjust based on what comps are selling for. The problem is when an assessor sujectively adds a "view" value on a property that hasn't sold in years. Now, once again, I am not arguing "waterfront" which can be measured, but "view".
"...... property tax is a very progressive tax if you exclude minimum housing and retired on fixed low incomeso market value is a legitimate assessment.... would you value based on land area and house/building area .. with no other criteria ?or would you prefer to abandon the property tax in favor of an income tax or a flat tax ?"If we had to start from scratch on taxation at the local level, how far would anyone get with a proposal to base a man's share of the town's cost of operation on the buying power of some other guy? At the state (except in NH and maybe one or two other states) and federal levels, tax burdens are generally based on the principal that those with more means to pay ought to pay more. The sales tax is only a crude way of doing that, if you figure the high-income guy buys more stuff.If one follows the philosophy that the impact of a tax burden, in terms of financial hardship, should be distributed fairly, then the income tax is hard to argue against, unless you vote straight Republican ticket on the NH ballot. Then dogma rules.Has anything new on this subject been said in this thread? Not by me, and I doubt any substantial change will occur soon.
> Has anything new on this subject been said in this thread? Nah, it's the same old rants -- the only good tax is a dead tax.
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
we get an up graded tax based on number of feet of water frontage.Seems I have heard of a view tax before too. I have to contact my assessor this week about something else, so I'll try to remember to ask.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Also one county (Harford) in the Peoples Republic of Maryland will give you a ticket for parking on your own driveway if it is not paved!
"If all else fails, read the directions"
Unless people live in this Peoples Republic they can't believe what gets taxed and how. I won't work in your county for love or money. Everytime I pulled a permit it was such a hassle. I feel your pain.
I don't live in Harford county, I live in Baltimore county. I was just bringing it up to illustrate what the whole state will go to to suck your money out of your pocket.
If you own a house with the value going down-down-down try to get you tax assessment lowered, you have a better chance of winning the lotto, "MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU'.
"If all else fails, read the directions"
They tried to impose this in a neighboring town in Vermont. Lots of heated response at town meetings. Best was when a farmer stood and said that he had asked each of his hundred or so cows and not one of them gave a S*** about the views.
It's funny isn't it? Here on Vancouver Island very few people used to live on the waterfront because it is too cold. Now it is taxed through the roof.
I used to spend summers in PEI. None of the locals spent time at the shore. It was mainly for visitors. They all lived with breathtaking views, but just accepted them as being part of life, not something to gape at or be taxed for.
Maybe your taxes should be adjusted seasonally depending on how nice the leaves are when they turn.
This explains it better than I can...
http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geu.cezAlLTfEAT2xXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTE2bGtubTdzBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2FjMgR2dGlkA1NBTUEwMDNfMTAy/SIG=11pgccdmk/EXP=1259019678/**http%3a//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/View_tax
Connecticut's been tinkering with the idea for quite a while. It's not on my
assessement, but I've heard of it from others.
Here's a NY times article from 20 years ago.
http://www.nytimes.com/1987/08/09/realestate/view-tax-outrages-a-connecticut-town.html?pagewanted=2
Recessions always seem to bring out creative politicians.
-d
Don't go giving our Governor any ideas! He has been grasping for any tax to impose, as if we don't have enough already. In addition to sales tax, income tax, property tax and excise taxes on anything that moves, Maine folks are required to pay a sales tax based on your income, just in case you bought something out of state and didn't pay Maine sales tax. Our state's health care initiative is bankrupting us. They just tried to impose an added tax on soft drinks. Fixed income folks are leaving Maine in droves. It's getting like the Beatles song, "if you take a walk they tax your feet".
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
"Maine folks are required to pay a sales tax based on your income, just in case you bought something out of state and didn't pay Maine sales tax."That is actually not a requirement - more of a not so subtle extortion.
And is called a use tax I think.You can check of box or make statement "I did NOT buy anything from out of state that is subject to Maine Sales Tax" and pay nothing on that line.
But if you get audited and they find that you did buy a dollars worth of junk out of state, you are guilty of fraud so be sure the statement is true.I prefer to pay the asumed amt because I do generally buy way more than .
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
"Subtle extortion" is an apt description if you leave off the subtle part!Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
You would be wise to delete your post. Tax collectors are gleaming social sites and using posts such as yours to trigger audits.
They can audit all they want. I am legal
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I went back and reread. I missed that you are paying what they assume.
""if you take a walk they tax your feet".
I talk to my brother (midcoast Maine) about once a month and usually get an earful about the gov't, regulation and taxes. He had a visitor from the state awhile back- now he is required to register his air compressor with the state and have an "annual certicate inspection". Just one of many hits by the state ........ no wonder it's the largest employer. And they wonder why young folks leave and industry won't come.
"There can be no doubt that Socialism is inseparably interwoven with totalitarianism and the abject worship of the state…Socialism is in its essence an attack not only on British enterprise, but upon the right of ordinary men and women to breathe freely without having a harsh, clammy, clumsy tyrannical hand clasped across their mouth and nostrils" -Winston Churchill
There are a lot of them heading here ( Texas) because of less governmental intrusion. There is pressure on the State Legislature coming from all angles to intrude more into the private lives of citizens but thankfully, their is equal resistance pushing back. For instance, the state just sunsetted their "builders license" laws.
The use of annual inspections, accompanied by fees, is nothing more than another way of stealing our liberty.
"he is required to register his air compressor" WTF.
Seems rediculous , do they have to use blunt nails?I thought the Great USA was proud of it's lack of Government interferance. I thought California's labeling laws were stupid.I live on lakefront property and get taxed accordingly. The tax man came out and remeasured my boat house 3 times to find the missing 8 sq feet. I asked about the 10 feet of beach I have lost, he did not care about that.
The last time they sent a women assesor out, she tried pushing her way in the door and my wife stopped her and said "do you see and **** baseboards". She insisted she had the right to nose around the house, DW called the RCMP they advised her to leave the house, and she did. Last spring she was out on her rein of terror, 3 people boxed her car in with 3 big trucks and trailers and went for a long lunch. The tow truck driver refused to touch any truck and left her standing. Oh well she gets paid by the hour.
Those air compressors need to be licensed , and also kept in a fenced back yard. They can be dangerous.
There is no such thing as a view tax, just a subjective determination of "value", considering comps of course.
There were two identical properties in the same town. One is located on Swampy Rd. across the street from the entrance to the local transfer station. The other property sits on a grassy knoll and has a great view of Lake Blowhard and the mountain peaks in three states.
Which house do you think would command a higher price, and hence have a higher valuation?
Waterfront is one thing, that can be measured. The challenge is putting a value on this desirable feature without actually calling it a view tax.
Along the shoreline here in Conn, a 'view' will elevate your taxes. If you live directly on the shore, the 'view' becomes 'waterfront' which elevates it even more. There is no table of percentages of increase; they are arbitrarily established by the assessor or agency doing the assessing.
I would imagine a similar setup in any town or county with any desireable feature.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
My new next door neighbor (from hell) just erected a six foot solid white shiny vinyl fence along her property line, essentially destroying any of what I might have called a view. Does this mean that I should point this out to my property assessor and get my taxes reduced?
Most likely it means that you get to call the town hall and complain about a fence in violation of ordinance (if indeed it is). Beyond that, you can "suggest" to the assessor that your property value has decreased due to the fence. If he doesn't take your suggestion then usually there's a standard schedule for challenging assessments, sometime in the first quarter of the year, and you go before the assessment board and make your case.
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
Barmil
Around here there is the old story;
If you install a fence the asseccor stops by and says ' that's a nice fence it really improves the valve of your property, i will make a note of that'.
Then 10 years later when you take down that fence the asseccor stops by and says, 'removing that old shabby run down fence really improves your property value, I will make a note that'.
Regards Rich