One day drywall patch; anyone use this method?
dpbellus
| Posted in General Discussion on
I recently came across this video clip on youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/user/drywallgall#p/u/21/8t6q1UEB4v0
In the clip, the guy uses regular joint compound and mixes in plaster of paris in stages. It appears that the plaster hardens faster when it’s mixed as opposed to just soaking up water. By doing this he gets three coats from one batch, and each coat dries pretty quickly. It looks like this would be a great way to patch holes in one trip, instead of doing one coat each day.
Does anyone here use a method like this? I usually take several days to make a patch, but I’d like to learn a faster method.
Replies
Have you tried a 5 minute compound? They even sell it in small boxes perfect for small patch jobs. HD has it.
Haven't tried the 5 minute compound, that may be even easier. This method caught my eye, and I wanted to see what the pros here prefer.
I usually just use 20 minute compound, and mix in hot water to make it set-up faster. Conversly I will use cold water to extend the set-up time of the mix. I can do several coats on a patch and texture from a can, all in one day.
I don't sand the first two coats, you can't anway because it is still wet after it cures. I slice off all the high points with a 6-8" knife and try to get it pretty flat for the last coat. I make the final coat extra wet, and mix it up real nice. This coat should be pretty thin. I let it set-up and then feather all the edges with a wet sponge. Then I texture the patch, and let it dry overnight before priming.
there's alaways the famous D mix
Ha! Caught you!
EZSand setting compound comes in several versions with different setting times. I use the 45 minute the most, but its also available in 20 minute and 5 minute. The 5 minute is harder to find, and of course the most difficult to work with. You gotta be quick.
A good paint store is the place to look for the 5 minute EZSand.
Hey DP,
Here is what I do.
I use 20 minute "hot mud" to start. (I guess I could use 5 minute but I'd end up chiselin my mud knife outta the pan) Like was posted before, I use hot water when I want it faster and cold when I want it slower. (I mostly want it faster. I can get most everything done I need in less than 20. But not always!)
I do that first. Hot mud is real hard. Then I use green top, or, heck blue top and black top mud for the following coats and use a heat gun. If it is a big job then the heat gun is not time/cost effective but for a small patch you can get the whole thing done quite quickly. Sand in between coats and you're good. But! Sanding hot mud is a learning event. Sometimes when it looks dry it is not. You'll just have do learn that. It has a different color to it too.
KD06
BTW- Hot mud works better in deeper patches. The colored top muds tend to crack and sink in as they dry. Hot mud pretty much fills and dries.
KD06 BTW- Hot mud
I'm not familar with that .
Have a brand name?
Sounds like you are using Durabond products. IIRC the bags are color coated. Sanding any of them is a PITA.
Try Durabond on you intial coat(s) and then switch to EasySand. It will do just what the name implies.
I've got job coming up this afternoon that will be Easy Sand all the way. A 4x8' (approx) patch on a plumbing wall. It needs to be finished, primed and painted by Monday afternoon and we won't work on it durring the week end.
Hi Dave,
Yea, it is durarock. I just picked up the term from the guys I work with. I mean it doesn't even really get hot! But I use the term. I actually like using it. Took awhile to figure out the water to powder ratio but I am comfortable now. (Took about a year... Guess I am a slow learner...)
Good luck on your patch.!
KD06
We call it hot mud too.
Mix the 5 to 20 minute stuff to stiff and it will indeed get hot in the pan. I can't tell you how of the fast setting stuff I've tossed out because I got behind the setting curve.
A year isn't bad for learning to use it, if you don't do it every day. It is like everything else. Repetion and practice hone your skills in any trade.
Heck, I just found out what a "level 5" finish is, yesterday. A painter told me I didn't have to take a patch job to a level 5 because the paint (metallic) that he was using had a texture that would hide flaws to a level 4.
I guess he thought I was pretty dumb when I told him i didn't know anything about levels. I've been finishing everything I do like this for darn near 40 years. I don't know anyother way, and I am to old to change now.
5 minute mud is great for patches....with hot water it kicks over quick for the inital taping, with cold water it takes 10 minutes-ish to firm up.
The biggest danger with quick patches is paint bubling when there is too much moisture in the drying mud, so one way around this is to seal the patch with an oil based primer or shelac--I keep a spray can of Kilz just for this. Another way around it is to skim the patch with one of the spackles that is pink when wet and dries white when suitable to paint--I think in addition to simply changing color it has a property somewhat like caulking that kicks over at relatively high moisture levels that blocks moisture migration to the paint layer. Often the color is white but it's soft to the touch, but still holds paint well.
Anyone remember the green board mud that seems to be essentially like caulk in a tub? I needed a quick tape job and didn't have quick set and the temperature was relatively cold so I looked around to see what else I could embed the tape with so I used some caulking and it worked great. When taping a simple crack in an existing wall where the thinnest taping makes covering the tape much easier I've switched to using painters caulk--at least for small areas. Unlike typical caulking uses, a thin layer under paper tape dries up really hard so I don't think long term movement and cracking is going to be a problem over a more rigid material like drywall mud. It's nice to be able to squeegie out all extra material under the tape so it lays super flat.
Anyone use painter's caulk to enbed paper tape with bad results over the long term?
The biggest danger with quick patches is paint bubbling when there is too much moisture in the drying mud, so one way around this is to seal the patch with an oil based primer or shelac--I keep a spray can of Kilz just for this.
There is another product that works really well for sealing paper tears, preventing textural problems (with patches) and preventing bubbling and that is Zinnser Gardz. It's a very watery product but levels out ok with a brush (difficult to roll but you can roll/brush out if you're careful). It really takes care of texture differences that you would see due to differences in suction between paper, drywall, compound etc.
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Jeff
With 5 minute mud mix with hot water if it's a small area. As soon as you're taped, scrape out extra mud and mix another batch--by the time it's mixed you're ready to go over the tape--repeat and you're almost done. Next I normally skim over with the pink spakle....as it starts to dry it can be tooled a bit for a smoother finish. When it's all white I'll damp spunge it if I'm in a hurry or let it dry a bit to lightly sand, then spray with kilz and roll on the paint or add texture. By using the pink stuff for texture I think it's ready to paint quicker than with mud, but of course the oil based stuff in a can dries the fastest.
As stated above the 20 minute mud from sheetrock is a very convenient way to go... Im gonna have to find the 5 minute and give it a try but if it aint broke..... I've used the 20 minute for a while and love it. Clean your bucket and tools as soon as you're done with each coat and scrape the first few coats and sand the last.
The only thing I would be concerned about is adding plaster of paris or any other powder mix to any 'ready to use' pre-mixed mud as the dry times are much different. The powders usually dry a little harder as well.
Good luck all.
plaster patch
I tried it long time ago, but I found that compound+plaster may feel dry on the surface but have not dried throughout. Because of its fast set time, I also may have tried to patch the hole too fast and sometimes the plug just got pushed in, that is, the patch-plug did not bond well to the area around the hole. For small holes I just use sheetrock with some of the paper left on. Setting compound is more predictable. This may not be true, but I seem to remember that if you mix the plaster with water/vinegar mixture, it sets slower. Hope it helps.