Our house has 4-year old QS red oak floors that were finished initially with Pacific Strong satin (or semigloss – hard to tell now…) I paid extra for the Pacific Strong and was told it would be more durable than the oil based finishes.
So much for that claim – I am extremely dissapointed with the results – there is not one square inch of floor that does not look like crap – even areas which get little traffic look heavily scratched up. It’s so bad that I am considering what to do next. I would like to go back with a high gloss finish but am not sure if that would be worse or better in terms of durability.
I have this floor in the entire house and hiring a professional to come in and do the whole thing would be cost prohibitive. I’d like to take a room at a time and refinish it myself – ideally, I’d like to minimize the sanding, since the wood is in pretty good shape.
What are your suggestions?
- should I go back with water-based or oil based? (I know that’s the kind of question that can start a good fight 😉
- should I sand off the old finish (down to the wood) or leave it in place and just scuff-sand it?
- would high-gloss be more durable than satin/semi-gloss?
Thanks a ton for your suggestions,
Rob
Replies
There are catalyzed water-based finishes that are very good. I think these are not a do-it-yourself option. Very toxic stuff until cured and not always easy to apply. Oil-based has a long track record. You'll get a lot of different opinions, but I'd sand back to bare wood. I think there may be adhesion problems otherwise. I don't think there's much durability difference between gloss and semi or flat, but there is a tendency for the dull finishes to eventually get more glossy with use and for the gloss to get a bit more dull. My preference is a gloss oil-based finish on bare wood.
Do you have dogs or kids?
It's hard to understand how even untrafficed areas look scratched unless there was something scratching them.
3. High gloss has a higher percentage of solids but it showsa every little mark, ding, or scratch. Most of my customers who choose high gloss don't allow anyone to walk on the floor in shoes, not even the King of the Pacific. satin is the better choice for anyone who wants to actually live there
2. Hard to say without seeing it.
1. I prefer oil finishes for their beauty but the water based are supposed to be harder finishes, and for a DIY, easier.
Finally, unless you are really sure you know what you are doing, it could look worse when you aree done than it does now. It can be a painfull learning process.
Excellence is its own reward!
"1. I prefer oil finishes for their beauty but the water based are supposed to be harder finishes, and for a DIY, easier."
Piffin,
This is the opposite of my feeble understanding. Your saying that the water based is easier for a DIY??
I've used oil and it was pretty easy. I've read Breaktime comments on the water based and it sounds kind of tricky.
Rich Beckman
Another day, another tool.
i do installs of hardwood floors, but sub out the finishing to a friend who does nothing but hardwood installation and finish (second generation). as a favor to me/side jobs for him i get a good rate for the finishing of floors, $2.50 per sq ft for brand new floors, new construction, nothing in his way or to protect. for a refinishing it is $.50 a sq ft if i get everything out of the way, and he can get in and blow it out. refinishing includes screening, vaccuming, and recoating with oil base finish. he does not sand to bare wood to recoat oil base finishes.
he does reccomend screening and recoating every 3-5 yrs to maintain a typical hardwood floor. if you do not do this and it needs a total refinish w/ beltsander price goes up to new construction rate. this is the maintenance that hardwood requires if you want it to stay looking good, and you have dogs, kids, parties, etc. and you actually let people walk on floor with shoes on. you can usually go longer if you are carefull, but i let my kids rollerblade in the house, (i told my wife we should just put sport-court for floors but she wouldn't listen) so we refinish. $500 every 5 years for 1000 sq ft wood (great room, halls and office) is only $100 a year to keep it new.
he wears a respirator with hepa filters (the purple ones) when he does this work, and you do not want to occupy the house for at least a few days after he is done. longer if you have kids and pets that you are concerned about. plan for refinishing at vacation time and get a neighbor or relative to let workers in, and air the house out.
Maybe I spoke out of turn here. I only used water based on one floor, and found it terribly easy for me. cleanup of brushes is definitely eaasy too.
But I do work fast and my hand knows what to do. The fast drying of the water based could make for problems with a DIY, I suppose - with dry lapps.
BTW,
Since your advice on Freecell, to do no move without knowing why I am doing it, I have already improved my percentage a whole point which takes some doing with about 6000 games on record..
Excellence is its own reward!
"...I have already improved my percentage a whole point which takes some doing with about 6000 games on record."
Yeah! I hear that! By the way, I have a text file for you. Send me your e-mail please.
[email protected]
Rich Beckman
Another day, another tool.
I agree with Piffin. regardless of oil or water, high gloss will show EVERY scratch if you have any real kind of lifestyle.
The water bourne polys are great in terms of their ease of recoating. All you need to do is wash the floor and after it dries, screen with a 150 grit screen. The poly will powder off nicely. Go in by hand to get to any divits or dings and in the corners.
Then apply another or two coats of the SATIN finish. Wait 2-3 hrs between coats. Screen between coats. Bona Kemi/ Pacific Strrong is one of the best out there. Maybe you should concider going up a notch in Bona Kemi's line and use Traffic.
A room should not take any longer than an easy day. Wait 3-7 days before laying any carpets or heavy furniture.
If you have pets or kids floors take a lot of abuse. With the water bourne polys you won't ever have to sand down to the bare wood again, as long as you don't let the finish wear off. Simply wash, screen and recoat.
F.
A couple of points to remember:
The glossier the finish,the harder the finish.But as Piffin said,hi-gloss finishes can show every scratch. A good compromise is semi-gloss.Water-based finishes have improved greatly the last few years,but I prefer a traditional varnish or polyurethane.
Recoat with Bona Traffic. It is one generation ahead of the Pacific Strong. About 70 dollars a gallon. I always use oil. Non voc compliant. But I have a job coming up and the client does not want it to get amber. I'm using Traffic and charging for the addition cost of the third coat and the added material costs. I'll do anything "they" want for a buck. GW