Plumbing Question…Toilet Flush Pressure
user-5449330
| Posted in General Discussion on
I’m in the process of buying a 1995 house in Charlotte. Overall, the house appears to be in excellent condition.
One of my few concerns is the flush pressure for all the Kohler toilets in the house. Everything seems to work okay and they drain fine, however the flush pressure seems low (all the toilets (4) flush with same pressure, it’s not unique to one toilet). The toilets don’t look old.
My impression is that it would take multiple flushes to evacuate the bowl.
Any ideas what’s causing this and what the fix might be?
Bob
Charlotte, NC
Replies
For a standard tank-type toilet, "flush pressure" is essentially fixed by the design. Sometimes pressure (and water volume) can be lowered by making internal adjustments or by, eg, placing half-gallon jugs of water in the tank, but there's no practical way to raise the "pressure" significantly.
However, be aware that if you compare a toilet of today to one from 30-40 years ago, the "modern" toilet will appear to have lower "pressure". This does not mean it flushes less effectively -- most toilets of today are at least as effective as the 40-year-old monstrosities -- but simply that the design has been changed to perform more effectively with less water.
The one minor exception to the above is toilets (such as Toto models) which employ a pressure tank. These flush with a very pronounced "whoosh" (and are often quite noisy).
And be aware that some toilets have two modes of flush. If you press halfway down you get a "#1 flush", using only a small volume of water, but if you press all the way down (or, on some models press twice or pull up or some such) you get a "#2 flush", with the full-force flush.
Bob
Old toilets relied on a lot of water swirling around and down that held pretty much power.
About 1994 the law was changed eliminating residential use of 3.5 gal/flush and the dawning of the more economical water use toilet....1.6 gal.
Early models of the 1.6 gal. rcvd complaints they didn't clear the bowl.
some Kohler models were reported but my experience with Kohler did not see that.
so, a little later power flush became the hot shit, blasting (sort of) it down.
others just reconfigured the drain shape solving the problem.
Now, there's the single/dbl flush models to cloud the waste line.
so. No answer for you from me.
Check for a model number, perhaps a made on code. Call Kohler, see what happens. I don't think I'd be using the toilets to get the asking price down.
Exploding Toilet
On a recent road trip in Carpenteria Calif. at Motel 6 we were awakened at 4:45 am by 2" of water on the floor. We checked the bathroom for a clogged toilet but everyting was intact. Went out the front and from under the door of the next room there was a veriatable river. It seems that the pressure toilet had exploded.
That brings back memories....
Seem to remember back in the 60's, Columbus, Ohio......
HS state wrestling championships.
Toilets being ripped and flung out the hotel window.
then there's of course, "loose shoes".............( demented old adage)
I want details about bathroom contractors.
potential realized
Sloan Flushmate pressure assist vessels manufactered / assembled between 1997 and 2009 have been recalled due to a defect that can cause a severe and violent tank rupture........
" hard '' water
Try flushing each of the toilets by pouring 2 - 3 gallons of water directly into the bowl; I suspect there is a build up of mineral deposits in the bowls rim and syphon jets which would slow the flow from the tank to the bowl.............
Blame The Feds!
There seems to have been a period in the 90's when toilets simply didn't work. This was because of the government decreeing toilets use less water - as a result, for a few years there was quite a problem of folks smuggling Canadian toilets into the US. (What have we come to?)
In my own home, I simply could not find anything wrong with either the toilet or the plumbing. Yet, getting a clean flush was nearly impossible. So, about a year ago I replaced it with the fanciest toilet at the home center - I think it cost me about $200.
Guess what? The new toilet flushes without hesitation.
It's amazing the change this has brought to my household. I actually almost look forward to entering the bathroom; before, I often wondered if I'd need a whip & chair to keep evil spirits away as I answered nature's call.
Now, if only we could 'flush' this silly idea of mandating 'progress' with the regulatory pen!
When we replaced our 1976-vintage 4-gallon Eljers with 1.6-gallon American Standard Cadet units the improvement was enormous. It wasn't until California mandated low-flush toilets that the manufacturers actually became interested in the dynamics of flushing and made an effort to improve things.
" hard '' water
Try flushing each of the toilets by pouring 2 - 3 gallons of water directly into the bowl; I suspect there is a build up of mineral deposits in the bowls rim and syphon jets which would slow the flow from the tank to the bowl.............
2" vs 3"
Back in 1994 I bought a 'high end' Kohler one-piece toilet for a bathroom remodel in the house I was living in. Probably one of the first of the 1.6 liter designs it worked great. As years passed and lime built up around bowl rim (water was HARD!!) I had to break deposits off flush valve seat to cure slow leakage but it still flushed just fine.
Flush pressure's a function of water level in tank (unless there's a pressure-assist device) above level in bowl as well as the size of the flush valve in between. Newer high efficiency models have a 3" valve which greatly improves flushing efficiency over similar models having a typical 2" valve.
These toilets should have printing visible if they're 1.6 liter designs. Checking flush efficiency with a couple gallons of water dump is a good idea.
user-1 does have a point of sorts in that it's possible for the jets around the margin of the bowl to lime up and restrict flow. This takes fairly severe liming conditions, though, and it's fairly easy to clear up with a little brushing and/or some vinegar or dilute muratic acid trickled through the flush valve.
The fix is to install new toilets. Like othesr have indicated, toillets of this vintage (I had them in my house) suck. Get rid of them. Luckily a decent 2 pc toilet isn't very expensive. If you have to have a plumber install them, then they might give you a better labor price to do all four at the same time. Getting on the schedule and site set up is half the battle. TIP: My advice is to ask for the price to do one. Settle on it. Then ask for the price to do all four. My guess is that it won't be 4x's the initial amount if you approach it this way.
Mineral build up?
Ive seen where mineral deposits from the water build up in the interior water channels of the toilet and reduce the water flow and performance of the toilet. I suppose I could've tried some CLR in the tank but that seemed like a lot of time I didn't have so I replaced the toilets.
Is your water hard there?