Replies

1. 
   Piffin | Sep 11, 2003 10:48pm | #1

   Last year not so good because of focus on wifes cancer but this year going gangbusters and looking better ahead.

   I'm a remo too. The remodeling industry has done exceptionally well, given the state of the national economy. The combination of bad stock market and low interest has helped all construction and conspired to make real estate a better investment. Add to that the fact that the demographics of the baby boom generation briong a heap oif folks to the market looking for second homes and vacation homes that they can afford now that they have juniors college paid for. The supply and demand formula says that the market will continue to improve. The vast majorityu of himeimprovement and remo work happens within three years of buytin a home or six months before selling one.

   Another thing to keep in mind is the psytchology of homes. In uncertain times, the nesting instinct is stronger and people like to have their money in something they can see, touch and feel. like gold, land and house..

   Excellence is its own reward!

   
   

   ---

   Edited 9/11/2003 3:51:00 PM ET by piffin

2. 
   pio | Sep 11, 2003 11:05pm | #2

   I would like to expand on Charles' question.  Yesterday, the company I work for announced a voluntary separation incentive plan.  It was followed by the statement that if there are not enough volunteers, then the plan will become "involuntary".  This does not surprise me, it has been going on for awhile.  So I'm hatching my exit strategy.
      I am a white-collar software weenie by day, but a serious remodeler and rental property owner otherwise.  During the last 8 years I've been reading FHB, the scales have been tipping steadily towards the possibility of me making my exit from this company, and into the wild world of Remod/handyman/contract business.
      My extra question to append on to Charles' is:  What is a realistic figure that a two-person handyman business, doing small 2-3 day jobs, could bring in per year in the current economy?  Let me set some assumptions such as:  Our reputation is already good and the project pipeline is filled 2 months out, and there are no capital equipment loans to pay off.  So, Just looking for a ballpark number, if that is enough data to go on?

1. 
   ccal | Sep 11, 2003 11:42pm | #3

   I can honestly say that I believe I could make close to six figures in a business similar to the one you describe in the city I live in. Population about 200,000. There are some upper end vacation spots near here with yearly damage from storms and such that bring in a lot of work for me. Some one without a lot of contacts and experience would not do near as well. Realistically I believe you should expect about 30 to 40k in a good start up year, possibly much less. Many variables involved, and I have found that it is a very hard thing to adjust to for a person going from the white collar payday every friday world to the self employed const. business. Try to come up with a minimum of 50k either in a line of credit or something similar to be able to keep things moving when times are tight.

1. 
   Piffin | Sep 12, 2003 02:33am | #5

   whoa! Let's stop and think about what you just said.

   Did you mean 30-40K in profit or in gross? He is talking two people there, you know.

   Then you said a LOC of up to 50K. A banker would be crazy to extend that much to someone with an expectation of only 40K/year.

   I started this one with intentions of being a small one man outfit in '91. My smallest year since then was about 76K gross. My biggest job was about $380K done in five or six months. It has been hard keeping small..

   Excellence is its own reward!

1. 
   ccal | Sep 12, 2003 05:19am | #11

   30 to 40k salary is what I meant, and no, a bank probably wont give you a line of credit with those figures. That is what I would recommmend having access to for startup in a business like he mentioned. It could be savings, home equity, credit cards, a rich uncle, any number of things. I started with a lot less and am sure most of you did too, but it would not have taken me 10 years to start making real money if I had some capital to run with in the beginning. It was fun starting with nothing when I was single and in my early 20s but from a purely business stand point I would have been here a lot sooner with some working capital. I did miss the part in the post where he said a two man outfit. It is much more difficult with employees. I would start with temp help.

1. 
   Piffin | Sep 12, 2003 06:16am | #12

   Capital startup costs/investment.

   That would be another topic. A good one, don't you think?.

   Excellence is its own reward!

2. 
   ccal | Sep 12, 2003 07:17pm | #13

   Yes, lack of operating capital almost did me in several times.

3. 
   jc21 | Sep 12, 2003 07:24pm | #14

   Any advice on capital (or lack of)/ startup costs?

4. 
   Piffin | Sep 12, 2003 08:59pm | #15

   look for another thread, "Startup/capital costs".

   Excellence is its own reward!

3. 
   seeyou | Sep 12, 2003 12:51am | #4

   I'm having a much better year, but I only worked 9 months last year. I also instituted some major changes in the way I do business. I reserve the right to bash Bush.

4. 
   SonnyLykos | Sep 12, 2003 02:57am | #6

   I'm doing better than last year. Business is about the same as far as incoming calls, but I'm doing better by tweaking my business, increasing my labor rate and improving how I serve my customers. All and all, I'm thrilled. I work by myself with occasional help when needed.

5. 
   JeffBuck | Sep 12, 2003 03:06am | #7

   I'm a sole prop remodeling contractor that subs finish carp/tile/cab's to a coupla design/build firms.

   I've been just about the same....if not slightly busier than last year.

   Dad told me many years ago ...remodeling is a recession proof biz. In times of good people fix up their places or buy new and add on. In times of bad....people fix up their places because they ain't moving any time soon!

   I've positioned myself where I do mostly high end finish work. I've discovered something over this last "recession"......rich people ALWAYS have money! And they'll spend it recession or not!

   So I'm hoping I'm in a pretty good situation here.....remodeling..for rich people!

   I live in the city and drive "way out there" ...about 45 min both ways...sometimes an hour to get home.....I talk with guys that work around here ...same guys that say I'm nuts for makiing that drive....and lotsa them have seen downturns....

   That's why I don't work "here"  ...I live here and couldn't afford me!

   Jeff

   Buck Construction   Pittsburgh,PA

    Fine Carpentery.....While U Waite                  

6. 
   andybuildz | Sep 12, 2003 03:09am | #8

   Pretty much the same as always.

   When the economy was bad and people were forclosing left and right cause they were A-holes and spent more on their egos than what they should have spent on their realistic family budget....I cashed in on working gigs for real estate companies redoing houses that went into forclosure and the people trashed over a few months....

    One thing good about reno work......they will always need us especially when youre an educated conscious builder with a smile!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

   Be a conscious builder that sees it from your house!(vs a-holes that say,"can't see it from my house")

                andy

    The way we regard death is critical to the way we experiance life.

   When your fear of death changes, the way you live your life changes.

   http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM

7. 
   FrankB89 | Sep 12, 2003 03:11am | #9

   The building market has been very strong in my area for quite awhile...may soften some as interest rates climb a bit, but they're still relatively low.

   I'm personally booked out nearly a year with new residential construction...will finish 3 mid-sized homes this year and just inked an agreement on another starting early '04. 

   It's my observation that the current building activity has more to do with low interest rates and available cash from investors than it does with anything the Administration is doing.

   I've seen home construction booms and busts over several decades of my life and usually, new home construction along with remodeling and renovation, is an economic indicator.

   Today, however, it is kind of an anomaly in an otherwise anemic overall national economy.

   So, I say to myself, "suck it up and stay busy while I can: it could all go south in a heartbeat!"

    

8. 
   nmdan | Sep 12, 2003 03:24am | #10

   more work than time, I aint getting rich but I have more work than last year

   I'm chef, cook, and bottle washer.

   Daniel

9. 
   hasbeen | Sep 13, 2003 01:52am | #16

   I was in various roles of construction for twenty years or so, past 8 years in real estate.  I live in a small town with a poor economy (no, not all of Colorado is wealthy!). 

   Business is stable for us (work with my wife and sons). 

   In five different Sttes, through vastly differing economic conditions, changing skill levels and no capital or backing from anywhere, I've made it just fine and always found work.

   Anyone can succeed if they apply themselves.  This principle is why I have little sympathy for whiners who think they are owed something!

   Any jackass can kick down a barn, but it takes a carpenter to build one.