Replies

1. 
   allaround_ | Dec 05, 2001 07:55am | #1

   *
   These are addressed in plumbing codes as "sanitary sumps". Most are a fiberglass "crock" set deep enough to allow for slope on the piping from your fixtures. The pumps must be designed to handle solids as well as liquids - I've used both Goulds and Meyers and had no problems. The top of the sump must be sealed airtight and the sump vented just as any other plumbing fixture, with airtight seals around the discharge and vent piping.

   There should be a check valve in the discharge line and it's a good idea to install a manually operated ball valve as well. The discharge piping must join the existing drain line with a wye fitting, not a tee.

   There are other requirements that will also be addressed in the code such as the pump discharge rate and the gallonage pumped in each pumping cycle, based on the drainage rate entering the sump.

1. 
   Mongo_ | Dec 05, 2001 08:21am | #2

   *Jeff, Many areas do not allow the old "up-flush" toilets anymore. That leaves you with two options. One is a low-profile setup, where the toilet sits on top of a small platform. There is a macerating pump associated with this setup, which grinds and pumps the liquified sewage away. They are easier to install, as you won't have to crack your slab, but they have a higher profile than an under-the-slab can and pump. Both http://www.saniflo.com and http://www.plumbingsupply.com have these on their sites. They run, if I recall, about $700-800. This set up is not designed to handle sink waste, but with your main outlet being fairly close to the slab, you may somehow be able to tap right into it.The setup you mention is more common, and in some ways, more desireable. A sewage ejector pump set in a can. The can, lid, and a good quality pump will run you around $300-400. You want a pump that can handle, at a minimum, 2" solids. A good pump will run you about $225-275. The added benefit of this pump is that any plumbing can be connected to it...sinks, washing machines, etc.If I were setting one in a remodel situation, I'd use a diamond blade to cut a square out of the slab, with the opening being about 18" wider than the diameter of the top of the can. You can run it about 12-18" away from the basement wall so you don't undermine the footings, since that is a concern of yours. Cut the slab so you can trench the waste pipe from the toilet to the ejector can. After cutting, break out the slab with a sledgehammer. Dig down so the top of the can will sit flush with the top of the slab. Tamp the earth in the bottom of the hole so it is firm and flat. You can line it with an inch of sand, but it's not required. There are knockout holes in the side of the can to accept the waste pipe. Dig out the trench sor the waste pipe so it is adequately sloped. Use 4" pipe.When the pipe and can are set, backfill, tamping as you go. Hold the soil about 4" shy of the top, then pour concrete to seal everything up...the trench and the can. Don't cover the lid of the can with concrete. It should remain accessible.The pump sits in the can. There are usually two wires that come out of the pump, one for the float switch, one to power the pump. There should be directions with the can/pump that are pretty self-eplanatory. You'll need two pipes coming out of the top of the can as well...one with a check valve to eject the sewage, one to vent the system. Run them as required.Good quality pumps require no maintenance at all.There is a lot of work in installing a sub-slab sewage can and pump. The low-profile pedestals with a macerating pump could save you a lot of work if it'll fit into your concept of what you're tryng to do.

1. 
   darrel1 | Dec 05, 2001 06:59pm | #3

   *Here's an idea (it may be a bad one, but it's an idea):What about a wall-mounted water closet on a small platform (like a tub deck)? Would the combination of the both be enough to span the 24"?

1. 
   Dave_Richeson | Dec 06, 2001 02:08am | #4

   *Jeff, Zoller quikjohn is an above the slab install like Mongo talked about. They will fit under a 2x6 platform and a 24" lift is really small for them.I put one in my father in laws house a several years ago, and drained the vanity and shower into it also. I think it has been six or seven years and there have been no problems. It got heavey use for the the five years that my brother in law and his family lived with them. About $400 back then, but most likely higher now. My lift was seven feet. The unit comes with excellent instructions.Dave

1. 
   JeffCall | Dec 07, 2001 02:30am | #5

   *Thanks guys, while surfing around for the pump I did see the floor mounted ones, looks like a great idea except it's a 1909 house with what I'm sure was a hand dug basement. The ceiling height is at best 6'3, and with a 14 yr old already at 5'11 I need all the floor I can get. I was even thinking of making the shower step down, 6" would makes a world or difference.

2. 
   JeffCall | Dec 07, 2001 02:30am | #6

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   Ok, you guys have been giving me great advise/ideas on two bed rooms and a new kitchen in this 1909 house. But I am soon to tackle a new problem, I need a bathroom in the basement. Here are the problems, I’m looking of any and all advise/ideas. 1) Sewer plumbing is 24" up from the floor. So, obviously I’ve got to dig a hole and get a poo pump, ? how often am I going to have to tend to this poo pump? once a year, once in ten years? are there better brands? brands to avoid? 2) what is the best way to “dig” a hole for this thing. concrete saw? then rent a e- jack hammer. or just e- jack hammer. How close to the basement wall can I dig 1909 house and I have no idea about the footer, if there is one (walls are concrete 12" oncrete that flare out at the bottom). Once, I dig the hole for the pump thing what do I line it with, pour a small pad in the bottom and
   form up some walls. Thanks.