Post and Railing Suggestions Anyone?
I finally started building a deck for myself last week, instead of all my neighbors and friends. I went with Trex decking for maintenance reasons, but the composite railing systems are way to much money for me. I was thinking about using 4×4 P.T. posts and then sleeving them with MDO. Maybe using cedar for the railings and rails, and then painting the whole thing off white to match the trim of the house.
I was wondering if any of you guys might have any other suggestions? I think using P.T. railings and posts will look silly with the composite decking. I saw a picture of a nice railing someone had posted in these forums a week or two ago but I can’t find it now. I think it was a mix of P.T. composite, and Cedar or Fir. Anyone got any idea’s, pics or suggestions??? Thanks!
I don’t understand! I cut it twice and it’s still too short!
Edited 7/23/2003 2:27:49 PM ET by Manroot
Edited 7/25/2003 9:46:08 AM ET by Manroot
Replies
for such a visible part of your deck, go with cedar, you'll probably have to be selective when bying it, and dont paint it for a while to allow it to dry
another alternative is pine or fir, either will paint well, easy to do moldings etc and probably much cheaper than cedar
dont use pressure treated if you want a nice paint job
caulking is not a piece of trim
Plan "C" could be redwood. PT any thing on the railing will leave a lot to be desired and only get worse as time goes on.
Dont use redwood unless all the wood is heartwood (no white parts). Dont use redwood on the decks, its too soft and it splinters are poisonous. If your gonna paint with solid colored paints, paint and prime ALL surfaces and ALL cuts before assembling. Avoid having any perfectly flat horizontal surfaces that will hold water.
Oh my goodness. Now I can show the folks that own 90% of the decks and railings here in the mountains your posting and I can change them (decks) all out. I'll be busy 24/7/365. I'll be able to retire early and do it well.
I think you mean you'll be busy 9/24/7. But you'd have to be a Jerky Boys fan to understand it.I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
Attached is a pic that I had posted a couple of weeks ago. It's what I'm doing for the fence/railing/wall around the deck that will surround my hot tub.
The posts are 6X6. The fence boards (pickets?) are milled from 1X6. The crown is milled from 1X4, and the trim at the sides is 1X4. The topper is 2X8. I have not yet decided what to do with the tops of each post. We might decide to put low voltage lights there, or maybe I'll just mill up some sort of cap.
All of my material was PT pine -- a choice which I would not recommend. The stuff just moves way too much. My fence boards are milled with a molding which matches the 50's-style pine paneling inside the house. It is also tongue and groove. I did all of the milling in an air-conditioned shop -- hoping to reduce the moisture content of the wood to the lowest possible point. I then took it directly from the shop to the fence, nailing it within a few minutes. (Again, hoping to reduce the effects of wood movement.)
The tongues are 1/2 inch wide, in the hope that even with shrinkage, there will be no visable gaps.
Since this photo was taken, I have used a translucent stain, and have done much of the work on the deck. Maybe I'll be able to post another pic soon. So far, the wood movement issue has not reared its ugly head.
OK, while I was posting that last one, the babysitter called, and I had a few minutes to get the newer picture. Please forgive the construction mess -- but I'm sure you understand.
It may take a bit of looking, but you may be able to find a place near you that pressure treats select SYP and then kiln dries it. We have one(near Raleigh, NC), and their stuff is the ticket for milling custom exterior railings, balusters and posts. But then, anything outdoors is going to move some... EliphIno!
I'm not really concerned with movement. I'm more concerned with continuity. I'm using Trex decking and I'll trim the rim joist with a piece of Trex, I just think PT for railings would look awkward with the Trex decking. I didn't know if anyone had any idea for something middle of the road....(better looking than PT, but not as astronomically priced as composite rail systems)I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
B Billy: I'd REALLY like to know the name and location of the lumber mill/treatment facility you mentioned -- with the select SYP PT stuff. I'm in Smithfield (Johnston County), and I had a very difficult time sorting through what was available.
Thanks in advance........
Vast projects should not be founded on half vast ideas.
It's: Tarheel Wood Treating, 10309 Chapel Hill Road/Hwy 54, Morrisville (near RDU). 919.467.9176.
They've got the new treatment, also.
And, stop by if you're in the neighborhood!
EliphIno!
One affordable compromise I like is to use PT 4x4 posts with PT sub-rails and bottom rails, PT balusters and a Trex Cap rail. The only part anyone touches and has a horizonatal surface is Trex. You can stain the PT parts with a semi-transparent latex stain. Since the posts, etc. are vertical the stain lasts quite a while.
If you want a more formal look, you could use a router to tart-up the edge on the Trex cap rail and rip regular 5/4 trex to make sub abd bottom rails with a matching routered edge. Jazz it up even more by wrapping the posts in pine.
Al Mollitor, Sharon, MA
Al,
Thanks for the idea, do you have a picture or two you could post?I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
Don't know if it will work in your situation, but, I have used copper pipe for the spindles a couple times lately and have gotten nothing but compliments. I used Pressure treated top and bottom rails, with 7/8 " holes drilled in them that accept 3/4" copper pipe very well - nice and tight. I drill a 1/4" hole all the way through the bottom rail to allow any water to drain.
I know the Trex is not as ridgid as the treated, but, something like this might work if you slip a little piece of pvc under the bottom rail at mid span.
Will try to post some pics if I get over by the sites to take them.
Just a thought,
Shoe
Shoe, Thanks for that suggestion. Post a pic if you have one, I was thinking of copper pipe for spindles, I'd really like to see a pic. Thanks!I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
will see what I can do about getting you a pic sometime this week yet
we do a lot of trex decks.. here's one of our favorite rail treatments..
6x6 PT posts... merante' 1x1 balusters ( from 5/4 x 4 ), reante' shoerail and RC subrail..
trex railcap..Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
we also made our own postcaps.. but next time i'd buy the ready made onesMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike...Thanks for the pics, your railings look excellent. There have been a couple of good suggestions in this thread. Now I've got to try to decide what to go with! I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
Mike:
What do you use to get that nice white finish on the PT lumber? Thanks!
Al Mollitor, Sharon MA
al, i'm pretty sure we use BM Fresh Start primer, and BM 100% acrylic house trimMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Shoe
I think I might try the copper balusters. How do you attach them to the sub rails? You drill a 7/8's hole through the subrails and push the pipe through, but you can't just use friction to hold subrails in place can you? Do you screw through the pipe into the subrail? Let me know what method you used to secure balusters...thanks!I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
Manroot,
I use a 2x6 ripped in half for the subrails. This gives me top and bottom subrail that is 2 3/4 x 1 1/2. I also run a roundover bit on them for looks. I drill the 7/8 holes about 1 1/4" deep on the 1 1/2" side. Then I slip a couple 3" high blocks on the decking to hold the bottom subrail up to the height I like to install it at. Screw the bottom subrail to the posts, install copper spindles in holes, work the top subrail on, scew top subrail to posts, then gorilla glue and finish nail handrail to top subrail.
Oh yeah, forgot to mention, on the bottom subrail, I drill a 1/4" hole all the way through the wood in the center of each hole to allow for drainage of any water that might get in around the pipe.
Think I might be able to get you some pictures tomorrow.
You should be able to get four spindles out of each 10' section of copper pipe. I use my old Craftsman power miter saw set up with an old cabide tipped blade that I don't care about - set a stop and cut spindles in a hurry. The ends are a bit rough and the 7/8 hole is tight - so I clamp a belt sander upside down and give the ends of the pipes a quick de-burring on there.
Also - laquer thinner on a rag gets rid of the print on the pipes quite easily - lots of thinner - soak the rag.
Another nice thing about the copper spindles is that you don't have to stain them every year or two like you do wood - saves a ton of time - and if you happen to get stain on them when you stain the rails - Laquer thinner on a rag and your done.
Shoe,
Thanks for the quick reply. I will probably start the railings tommorow or Monday.I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
Homeowner just emailed me acouple pics for ya. Probably be seeing your pics soon though.
Shoeman,
Those railngs look nice. I don't know how soon I will be posting pics. The weather here in the North East is not cooperating with me! But if I ever get it finished I will post a few for ya! Thanks!I don't understand! I cut it twice and it's still too short!
If you set your railing 4x4 posts inside the frame rather than mounted on the exterior you might want to consider sleeving the post with white vinyl post sleeves. You can buy them at a fence supply co. in 16' lengths for about $40-$45. and at 36" you get 5 sleeves out of one 16' length. Then use your cedar top & bottom rails fastened with 3" screws through the sleeve into the 4x4 post. For the top rail cap use a Trex 2x6 not a 5/4x6 deck board . It's a little more but makes the railing sturdier and looks much better. The cedar spindles look great and take paint real well. The Trex decking does stain from spills and tree sap etc. but they also promote its paintability so you will have to do maintenance annually. Good luck.