I’ve been asked for proposals to reroof this house:
My options so far are:
1)cedar shingles 2)copper shingles mimicking cedar shingles 3)dimensional asphalt shingles. 4)some other type metal shingles – custom fabbed to mimic cedar shingles. I’ve just bid a roof using kynar coated terne and I’m warming up to the idea of that product especially at the price.
The house originally had a cedar shingle roof but that is long gone. I’m looking for options for the radii at the rakes. My 1st thought and the one I keep returning to is to start of with the shingle butt against the rake and fan each course around 90 degrees through the radius kinda like this:
Any thoughts or suggestions?
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. – J. Handey
Replies
Astro-turf?
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
Thatch? We had someone here from the UK a while back who did thatch.
jt8
"God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." --Voltaire
Or a fishscale copper?
jt8
"God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." --Voltaire
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Just make sure you fix the chimney while your up there!
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i was thinking Hatteras or Grand Manor
i like your fan idea... but i don't think i'd try it with cedar
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Edited 10/30/2007 6:39 pm ET by MikeSmith
i was thinking Hatteras or Grand Manor
I've considered them, but in the fact that they're tabbed makes the randomness harder to obtain with them.
One other kink is that the owner wants the bottom courses to "wave". http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
There are bunch of those around the lakes in Minneapolis. The only good looking ones I have seen are with cedar. Most of the ones with three tabs or archies look like total abortions - like you are dealing with.If they could afford copper....why not?
I don't see them here where I live, but when we visit family in Chicagoland, I see houses with roofs like that.
The great majority are done in cedar shingles, and those have swooped courses, in addition to the rollovers at edges.
Some are a cob-up done with asphalt composite shingles, and are an obvious reroof job over what was there originally in cedar.
Have you researched the methods required to re-do it in cedar, to make it look as it did originally?
"False thatch" is what it is called, and it looks like this. You'll need curved shingles to do it in cedar, and there are sources for that if you do a web search. I fouView Imagend one easily.
Edited 10/30/2007 7:05 pm ET by Gene_Davis
Have you researched the methods required to re-do it in cedar, to make it look as it did originally?
Of course. It regular courses rather than the fake thatch you're showing. I'm seeing cedar roofs failing at about 15 years around here and at $300+/sq for materials, I'm looking for options. We want to be true to the house, but we want it to last for more than a decade and a half.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
You must live in a harsh climate.
My inlaws in Chicagoland have a neighboring house to theirs with a roof like the one I showed in the pic, and it lasted at least the first 30 years of my marriage.
You must live in a harsh climate.
It's the humidity and the fact that cedar is farmed now. Most of the old growth stuff is gone. The growth rings are farther apart and it just doesn't last as long on the roof. Old growth cedar used to last 50+ years here with few exceptions.
Furring or cedar breather won't help much on this roof (it originally had split sheathing, but has been plywooded for the existing asphalt shingles). At $300/sq + shipping just for the shingles (and that's a 5 1/2" reveal to make them go that far - there's gonna be lots of waste on this job), other mat'ls that keep the texture and feel, but last longer start to be attractive.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
l'd like to meet the Hobbits and talk them about using cedar once again. That would be made easier after a bowl or two, I suppose. BTW, are their feet really as big as we heard?
What about a synthetic slate?
the copper fishscale shingles will roll the rakes well,
but all the roof in fishscale would not be my choice.
cedar works well,looks good.
there used to be a number of bungalows in one area where i work(toronto)
built in this style,sadly,most have been demolished and stucco Mcmansions have replaced them.
but all the roof in fishscale would not be my choice.
Not an option, AFAIC. If copper or other metal, it would be shingles the same shape, size, and thickness as cedar shingles.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
I could be way off, but wouldn't that roof job, done in the false thatch patterns, but using copper shingles, cost an owner about $70,000?
I could be way off, but wouldn't that roof job, done in the false thatch patterns, but using copper shingles, cost an owner about $70,000?
I got sidetracked yesterday after I started this thread and haven't calculated the quantites yet. But I'd say that's a ballpark figure. More than likely, we'll try to do something creaative with asphalt shingles.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
seeyou,
It looks like my house that I'm working on right now.
Here's what I'm doing on my cedar shingles.. (shingles not shakes,, you can't steam bend shakes no matter how hard you try, trust me)
First you must get fresh shingles, sopping wet green fresh shingles.. don't take any dried ones,, this won't work.. bust the bedsheets into no wider than 4 inches.. and always make sure any shingle you use has perfect straight grain.. Use blue lable perfects.. now buy a big plastic tub or two put the shingles in the tub (butt end down)and fill it with water. they will want to float away so put another bundle on top to hold them under water.. let it soak a minimum of a week.. while they are soaking make yourself a steam box I made mine 4 feet long and put the form I wanted the shingles bent in every two inches (cut it out on a band saw), remember to allow for over bending because they will want to spring back. Make the box so that the condensed water will run back into the steam generator (more later) That means 4 differant length legs.. the longest in the back corner the shortest in the corner where the steam is. Line the box with plastic and cut the corner of the forms to allow drain back. The lid should be just above where the heavy pipe is to hold the pipe in place once bent. I put two towel on the top ends of the pipe so I could move it around without burning my hands. (steam is 212 degrees which the pipe will get to ) Now you will need something really heavy and formed to allow you to push the shingle into the form.. I went to a scrap steel place and got a really heavy piece of pipe with about the correct radius on it. slightly smaller is ok but it should be extremely heavy wall. My wall thickness is about an inch thick.. when you put the shingles in push down firmly but carefully you'd soon figure out when you're doing it right (you won't bust so many)
then get a big powerful microwave and put two sopping wet soaked 4 inch shingles in it for 4 minutes Pull them out and instantly go to the steam box and press them in place with the pipe.. close the lid and let them steaM FOR AT LEAST 4 MORE MINUTES..
If you are working ahead of the install crew you'll have to pull them out and keep them in another form untill they cool down and dry for them to retain their shape.. If not you must work right next to the roof and send them up on a pulley instantly, 30 seconds is almost too long..
You will have a minimum of 9 minutes per pair of shingles.. or 4 1/2 minutes per 4 inch shingle..
When you build the steam box make sure you make it 24 inches wide so you can move the shingles around.. Some shingles will need that radius right at the butt some more towards the middle and some near the top..
With practice I got it to the point of braking one shingle in twenty but when I first started out it was more like two out of thee.. You soon recognize what shingles will bend and whiich ones should be intalled straight which saves on the breakage..
Make sure you use a cedar breather under these shingles.. It would be a crime to do all this work and lay them on a roof without it!
Use copper flashing again it's a crime with the intense labor these roofs require to use anything less.. I also use really wide swaths of Ice and water shield in any valley and on any edge/peak. .. I've tried to get aspault shingles to bend and demensional ones are worse.. time won't do it nor will hot sun..
If the original roof had been done with skip sheathing and or cedar breather it should last 30 to 40 years because most of the cedar shingles I'm getting are from old growth trees not the new plantation grown stuff with growth rings as much as a 1/2 inch apart.. A nearby house with that type roof was last done turn of the last century and it's still sound.
Oops I forgot to explain about your steam generator, I use a propane gas hot plate, a really big one because I use a 5 gallon steel gas can (New one! don't want to blow things up) ;-) I remove the spout and buy a heavy duty radiator hose to fit and stick it up into the steam box. not so tall that water won't run back in but tall enough that it will fully go up into the steam box Get one that is straight hose so you can cut it to length. . you'll need to start steaming about 20 minuts before you start bending so that will give you plenty of set up time..
Edited 10/31/2007 10:19 am ET by frenchy