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A retired friend is creating a fine
woodworking shop (for pleasure, not
major production) in his attached
garage. The tools are heavy duty, some
requiring 220. We want to add 4 220
outlets and 6 110 (one of which will be
used for lighting and the garage door
opener). We got one bid from a company
recommending upping the household
service to 200amp (oh by the way, there
is a hot tub and central air involved;
not in the workshop, but already part of
the house). We agree that would be wise
– their bid was $6000. but they seemed
to understand what we wanted. We got a
2nd bid from a company that rescheduled
the estimate twice and the guy that came
out didn’t seem to think we’d need an
upgrade of service, however his bid
including an upgrade of service was
only $3000. I’m confused. While we
really like the demeanor and attention
to detail of the first company, we’re
inclined to get a third bid just because
there is such a huge discrepancy. Any
advise? The garage is currently
unfinished and we will drywall after the
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Get a third bid! A consumer reports study showed that by a large margin consumers who solicited multiple bids were more likely to be happy with the finished work, and that they tended NOT to take the lowest bid. Not always true, but interesting.
Someone here will be able to tell you which bid sounds more reasonable. Your need to upgrade the service should be a simple question of math. Note that your friend will be unlikely to use all his high-power tools at once!
More detail needed: length & difficulty of wire runs, outlet installation, lighting, other complexities. $3-6k should buy a lot of labor, the materials are cheap.
*A Green, get a third bid.In my area a new service is about $700-1000 depending on conditions and six grand should just about wire a whole new house.Vince
*Mr. Green, third for a third bid. Three thousand is too great a spread. You did mention attached for the layout, so running a service to a outbuilding isn't the issue. I'd tend to go with a 100 amp subpanel in the workshop however, converting the house main to 200 amp. The question is: Do you need a new service drop from the utility, a new meterbox and service entrance cable, or was it all overwired earlier?
*The guy probably rescheduled the estimate twice because he was too busy working. The company that bid 6 grand probably had a salesman.Do get another bid.Volts is not the issue. Neither is the number of outlets. Does your friend intend to use more than one tool at a time? What is the amperage of the largest tool? Inspite of what many people think, motor loads are seldom very large. Probably less than an electric dryer. What size service is in now? Does it handle the AC and hot tub ok? I would suspect that your friend may be getting much more than he needs from both bids.
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A. Green--
What's the service rating now? 100 or 125 or 150 amps? Are there any problems with the existing system? What's the age & mfgr of the existing service (Is it Federal Pacific stab-loc? Is the panel new enough that breakers are available at a reasonable price?) All these things ought to be considered.
If the homeowner intends to use professional machines, there could be a pretty good load. Imagine the starting current AND the running load if the guy's sawing or planing thick hardwood.
I agree, get a third bid, and ask the others why so high & so low. If the guy's sinking thousands into his tools, he probably ought to spend the $$ to upgrade the service--especially if it's a 100 or 125 amp. Or, an option is to run the feeder & subpanel from the old panel (assuming you've got the space in the SEP), and see how things go. If he's out in the shop making sawdust and the Mrs. is baking a pie in the electric oven, and so on, and the main breaker pops, well then. Upgrade the service. Or do some load management...which most people don't want to put up with.
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Speaking of load management, we lived in a 300 sf 1-bdrm. apt that had been divided off from what once were luxurious residences in an old building. One 15-amp breaker for the entire apartment. We could run the 8000 BTU air conditioner if everything else was off, but that was it, the microwave had to take turns.
Sorry, typical irrelevant digression. just got me thinking.
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More info on the garage - the utilities are
underground - but run to a subpanel when they ran
the new breakers for the AC and the tub - the
first company seemed to think they could run the
new breakers into the existing subpanel where
there is room and leave the existing house panel
alone; the garage is standard 2 car 18'0" x 19'0";
the table saw and planer can run on either; the
dust collector needs 220; he'll be cutting fancy
hardwoods alot (purple heart, jarra). Nothing
will be running at the same time except the dust
collector while he's using the other tools. We
tend to think an upgrade would be wise, and y'all
confirmed my gut instinct about a third estimate,
but I must say that the first company's estimator
was obviously a guy who knows his stuff and seemed
to really want to make sure everything was right
for the tools and our needs - in other words - he
seemed to care about what we needed (this is a big
local company, too). I agree about price - the
cheapest is not always (or
*
A retired friend is creating a fine
woodworking shop (for pleasure, not
major production) in his attached
garage. The tools are heavy duty, some
requiring 220. We want to add 4 220
outlets and 6 110 (one of which will be
used for lighting and the garage door
opener). We got one bid from a company
recommending upping the household
service to 200amp (oh by the way, there
is a hot tub and central air involved;
not in the workshop, but already part of
the house). We agree that would be wise
- their bid was $6000. but they seemed
to understand what we wanted. We got a
2nd bid from a company that rescheduled
the estimate twice and the guy that came
out didn't seem to think we'd need an
upgrade of service, however his bid
including an upgrade of service was
only $3000. I'm confused. While we
really like the demeanor and attention
to detail of the first company, we're
inclined to get a third bid just because
there is such a huge discrepancy. Any
advise? The garage is currently
unfinished and we will drywall after the
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Let us know the 3rd estimate! Getting "everything right" can often mean "over the top" -- the changes might be techinically appealing but nonfunctioning. If the subpanel/wiring is already adequate you are in good shape.