Replies

1. 
   john7g | Jun 23, 2009 03:47am | #1

   It won't hurt to go ask.  Depending on where you are you might be ablt get different levels of quality but mine always beats the quality from the BBs.  I have no idea who they buy from but it's better than the rest qualitywise. 

   For me delivery is free so I don't have to handle the wood 2x before I even get to the job site. 

2. 
   MikeSmith | Jun 23, 2009 03:57am | #2

   those are marketing gimicks... the real and  ONLY grade for lumber is stamped on each piece  ( eg  DF #1,  DF #2,  Sel Struc )

    

    

   or in our part of the country  the species will be SYP

   SYP  has a wild grain, and it's wet from the treating process... you have to make a visual inspection....over buy the quantity you need... sticker it to let it dry.. then cull your stock  and return the twisted ones

   Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
1. 
   enrare | Jun 23, 2009 07:43am | #5

   Thought I read somewhere the 2x lumber HD and Lowes sell is from the cuts of the tree which are more prone to twisting, etc.  I don't know if there is a way to tell by looking at the grain of the wood or if it even matters.

1. 
   MikeSmith | Jun 23, 2009 03:25pm | #6

   nope... they  buy  lumber  on  the  same  market  as  anyone  else

   it  comes  out  of  the  mills  with  the  same  grade  stamps..  they  can  then  have   the  vendor  stamp  it  with  their  "made-up  grade"

   but  if  it's  structural  framing  it  has  to  have  a  grade  stamp  on itMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

1. 
   IronHelix | Jun 24, 2009 05:12am | #13

   Western Red Cedar is not a good choice in wet environments, such as mixed humid, coastline, and sub tropical where annual precipitation is above 30 inches. Red cedar rots if it cannot thoroughly dry out between rains. Definitely no ground contact.Your profile does not indicate where you live..so I do not know what applies to your building environment.................Iron Helix

1. 
   observer | Jun 26, 2009 11:10am | #18

   I'm changing my garden fence line so I've been pulling and replacing split log red cedar fence posts that were direct buried for the deer fence more than 25 years ago. I can't stand to waste good wood so I'm cutting them up for kindling, even the parts that were underground. I live about a half mile from the ocean in the rain belt on Vancouver Island.You sure you're talking about Thuya plicata, the Western Red Cedar?

2. 
   IronHelix | Jun 26, 2009 02:14pm | #19

   The western red cedar is what is available from the distributors if lumber products in the midwest. I do not know the genus/species of the product. I sold it for 25 years in my lumberyard.Soft, pinkish tan, low density....timbers were avaiable, but mostly sold 1x12 and beveled siding....no resinous wood involved. Somewhat similar to the upland cypress in softness and workability.What you describe is a different species that what I commented about. Had lots of customers replace ground contact pieces of "western red cedar" lumber. Open fences on treated frame, siding maintained and painted do quite well as they can readily dry.But not ground contact here in Southern Illinois with the "Mixed Humid Building Environment!..........Iron Helix

3. 
   observer | Jun 26, 2009 07:06pm | #20

   I'm right in the middle of WRC-land and use lots of it acquired direct from the mill. Colour ranges from that pinkish-tan to fairly dark brown and grain ranges from very tight to wide open. I've found variations in durability dependent on tightness of grain and sapwood content. Darker, tight-grain heartwood is more durable. Price has gone crazy over the past 8 years or so but it dries quickly and I surface it myself so mill buying gets around the worst of the price premium.

3. 
   Dinosaur | Jun 23, 2009 07:14am | #3

   The real question is, 'Why are you going to use PT lumber of any grade?'

   http://forums.taunton.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=tp-breaktime&msg=120551.1

   Dinosaur

   How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
   low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
   foolish men call Justice....
   

   

1. 
   gfretwell | Jun 23, 2009 07:40am | #4

   I ask the same question as dinosaur. Even if you don't get that green washed junk he shows in the picture, PT still will not hold up as well as the new plastics.
   It took me a while to come around but I am looking at 20 year old plastic and my 20 year old .40 CCA that were installed at about the same time and have the same exposure.
   My PT decking has checks in it and I have a couple boards that probably should be replaced, the plastic looks almost brand new.
   The PT was resealed several times, the plastic has never been touched.
   (docks over salt water in both cases)I can get some pictures tomorrow if anyone wants to see them side by side.

1. 
   Dinosaur | Jun 24, 2009 02:17am | #11

   I'm not a big fan of plastic decks, either, although I suppose one has to do something with all those empty Bic lighters and blister-paks <;-(>

   The most obvious problem with plastic decking is very well illustrated by the following photo I took in a children's playground in Rhode Island.

   View Image

   One piece of the framing gave out...and the deck couldn't compensate at all. Wood decks don't do that.

   Dinosaur

   How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

   
1. 
   MikeSmith | Jun 24, 2009 03:27am | #12

   if that was Jamestown.... that playground was built by volunteer amateurs.. and the "leader" wasn't much better

    Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

1. 
   Dinosaur | Jun 25, 2009 05:52am | #14

   Yeah, that's the playground right off the main drag. I was killing time there with Ryan while we were waiting to meet you and Helen at Chopmist Charlie's after we picked up the truck in Connecticut.

   Dinosaur

   How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....

2. 
   MikeSmith | Jun 25, 2009 01:13pm | #16

   no flys on meMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

2. 
   CooperDBM | Jun 27, 2009 05:23pm | #25

   I don't like plastic decks but in this case I would commend it. The problem here is the framing. If the decking had been wood then you might not have known about the framing failure, aside from the extra bounce, until the decking split. A potentially harmful brittle failure. The plastic decking gives good warning of the problem and looks like it could perhaps be reused after the framing is fixed.I also hate vinyl siding but love the ability to bend it out of the way when I have to do something to the wall.

4. 
   WorkshopJon | Jun 23, 2009 04:33pm | #7

   Enrare,

     Please tell me you are only planning on using PT for the framing, not the decking.  So many better choices for the latter., and that new green PT isn't one of them.

    

   If cost is not an issue, you can't beat IPE' also known as Brazilwood, Brazilian Walnut, Ironwood, and a few other names.  A second more affordable choice is Western Red Cedar, but some of the composites (man made plastic woods) look OK and weather well, but are a tad flexy.

    

   WSJ

1. 
   enrare | Jun 23, 2009 09:58pm | #8

   I'm using the pressure treated lumber for the framing only.  Not sure if finances will allow for a composite decking like Trex,etc...so most likely I may go with redwood or cedar.

   Right now I'm going back and forth on how much I want to invest in my home since I owe significantly more than its value, the neighborhood is on a downhill slide with more and more homes becoming rentals or foreclosures since they won't sell, plus the backyard is completely torn up and in shambles from all of my half finished landscaping projects I started before the housing market decline.   My wife and I were hoping to move in the next year or two into a larger home before the prices go back out of our range.  Unfortunatly the current deck is rotting and starting to come apart and is unsafe, so that along with the landscaping needed in the yard is going to add up costs I would rather not spend on this house, but I suspect needs to be done in order to either sell or rent until housing prices improve (which I'm sure will happen in my neighborhood).

    

1. 
   Snort | Jun 24, 2009 12:19am | #9

   I just got a small deck package at Lowe's. I did have to do some picking, but it was better, and about 1/4 less expensive than the lumber yard.If you can, get it nailed up right away, SYP doesn't like laying around in the sun unattended.http://www.tvwsolar.com

   Now I wish I could give Brother Bill his great thrill

   I would set him in chains at the top of the hill

   Then send out for some pillars and Cecil B. DeMille

   He could die happily ever after"

2. 
   CooperDBM | Jun 27, 2009 05:13pm | #24

   If you just use PT for the framing then you're using 2x8s, 4x4s and larger. These sizes are generally stable. It's the 2x4's and decking that really twist and split.

5. 
   JTC1 | Jun 24, 2009 01:34am | #10

   What Mike Smith said --- mill grade stamps tell the story.

   I suspect if you go to your local yard and ask for #1, you will be happy -- go look at it if in doubt.

   Jim

   Never underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
6. 
   birdwatcher | Jun 25, 2009 07:12am | #15

   Be very careful when you buy PT material. I suggest you use a Borate treatment brand such as Timbor, Pac-bor, or any other brand you can find. I've had to research the different treatments used to treat lumber in regards to their effect on fasteners. Most treatments are quite corrosive on mild steel fasteners. If you read the specs on the common treatments available(CCA,ACQ,etc.) they will require hot-dipped galvanized or stainless steel fasteners. Borate when used as a treatment will not corrode smaller fasteners.

1. 
   IronHelix | Jun 25, 2009 02:46pm | #17

   And borates are not rated for exterior exposure because the borate compounds will leached away by water/rainfall. Use borate lumber for framing and blocking when it will be covered/protected from the elements. Deck application or ground contact do not meet the criteria for the use of borate.........Iron Helix

7. 
   wrudiger | Jun 26, 2009 10:32pm | #21

   In addition to the grade of the lumber and the perservative used,as mentioned by several posters, there is the question of amount of perservative.  This gets to the question of where you will be using it and your climate.  There are typically three levels of treatment.  The heaviest is for direct water contact (e.g. docks).  Middle is for direct ground contact, e.g. posts.  Lighest is for everything else.

   The only level I've ever found at the big box is the lightest - even on 4x4 posts.  They also tend to only have basic construction grade vs. the higher grades you would want for higher span structural situations, for example. 

   Agree with most other posters here - just use the PT for the structure.  It is not very nice decking. 

8. 
   alwaysoverbudget | Jun 27, 2009 12:15am | #22

   around here, no one can beat the quality of lowes pt wood,not that it's fine wood or anything,just beats everyone elses.

    

   YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'T
   MOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THE
   DUCT TAPE.

9. 
   WINSTALL | Jun 27, 2009 03:57pm | #23

   I think you answered your own question, didn't you???? If at all possible, I would look for kiln dried treated lumber. Also known as K.D.A.T. With the lumber being dried after being treated, most of the time, what you see is what you get!!! It does cost a little more up front, but, well worth it in the long haul.

   As long as GOD makes "bad builders" and rich people... I will have a job