What would you wag as a price for completely redoing a bathroom in Georgia, 40 miles from Atlanta?
Demo, four layers of floor, remove wall paper and skim ( was not an easy quick job), set tub, set three piece vanity, templet and set vanity granite, sink, and backsplash, reframe a toilet closet for pocket door, install toilet, repair three toilets and install recir pump on water heater, tile custom soap/ hair hole and grout, set glass shower door, paints trim doors and walls, build a custom set cabs for closet, set mirrored 6′ by pass door in newly framed opening, trim and paint three doors. This does not take in the consideration of trips for materials.
The job has been held up because of special orders. I have about 80 hrs so far and all that is left is to touch up batroom and closet.
Thanks for any insight!
Luke
Replies
If you're going as far as replacing the tub, why in the world are you removing wallpaper? Just gut the whole bathroom, you'll end up with a better finished product.
Not from Atlanta, but you'd need to give me around 12k for that.
Family.....They're always there when they need you.
Thanks for your reply! I thought the paper would come off alot easier!
luke
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Took all the paper off the sheetrock just trying to get a border off. Next time I'm just pulling the rock off!
Thanks !
Just for kicks and giggles. How many people gut an entire room of sheetrock just to replace a tub/shower and floor? The rest just ........had paper on the wall:)
luke
Edited 9/2/2008 3:22 pm ET by luke
12k including all materials??
Not finishes.
Family.....They're always there when they need you.
What does not finishes mean?
Bump
I usually dont include variables in my estimates, unless they are specified. Things like toilet, vanity, tile. Lately though i've been including allowances for these things.
Family.....They're always there when they need you.
to save 25$ of sheet rock???.
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"After the laws of Physics, everything else is opinion" -Neil deGrasse Tyson
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If Pasta and Antipasta meet is it the end of the Universe???
No not to save the 25$. The lady has a recycle thing going on!
What?
Family.....They're always there when they need you.
I've been there done that....try to save $$ by not tearing out ruined DW and spending 5 times the cost patching priming smoothin.... seems like a luke let the HO talk him into that...Luckily for him he is T&M...The customer is always right, 'cept when they're not....
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"After the laws of Physics, everything else is opinion" -Neil deGrasse Tyson
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If Pasta and Antipasta meet is it the end of the Universe???
Lesson learned the Hard Way!
About 5 grand for labour, plus materials+5%. Figure 10-12 grand. And that is a WAG. But I'm not in Atlanta, either, LOL.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....
Thanks I am taking notes.
Just don't try to hold me to a WAG unless you've got a Wild Âss handy. You want an accurate estimate, you gotta pay fer it. <;o)>
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
may I ask what the dimensions of the bathroom are?
may I ask what the dimensions of the bathroom are?
The bath is 10x10. The closet is 28"x10'.
I'm telling the whoever's in charge that you circunvented the Prospero Censorship Board with that Ä.
Probably gonna kick Ü outta here for weeks.
Joe H
He can probably get away with all sorts of things with his french keyboard
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
He can probably get away with all sorts of things with his french keyboard
You probably have it built into your computer, too, if you're running XP. It's software; not the keyboard itself. I actually have a keyboard around here somewhere with the French characters printed on the keytops, but I never use it. What I'm typing on is a standard Compaq English keyboard.
But I can change keyboard layouts instantly, from Canadian French to Canadian Standard Multilingual to US English. All I have to do is hit shift+ctrl together and it cycles through the three layouts I have checked off in the OS. You can program your box that way through Control Panel --> regional & language options. Just add the language packs and keyboards you want to have available.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
I really don't need an estimate. I am just trying to see if I was fair or not. I will be paid py the hour. I try to log my actual cost compared to a bid. I only do projects that people ask me to do. I don't bid.
fair to whom?finalize the bill, get paid according to your agreement, post pictures and THEN have this conversation if that is your goal.Pardon me for being cynical, but let me explain.about thirty years ago, a guy painted a doctor's house in town. as he was almost finished, he realized he had more hours in than he thought he would have, but he had given a price to do it all.He had me stop by supposedly to show off his work.I was properly impressed with it all - good job he had done. Then he asked me how much I would think it was worth. I told him and that raised his eyebrows. Turns out my price was almost three times as much as he had 'bid' or estimated or whatever.He then raised his price when he billed for the work.
I heard thru the grapevine the Doc was mad at ME! I went to him to ask why - turns out that my 'friend' had somehow managed to imply that I told him to charge more, which was not true. I ironed that one out.Since then, I have seen the same scenario more or less a good half dozen times, always when the tradesman is nearing completion, he asks what you asked and always for the same reason, then he adjusts his billing upwards, after hearing that others may have charged more.So, all that said, I would likely charge $22K for that job up here.BTW, pricing with a vague description over the web is not really worth much.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
No my plan is not to charge more. I will be satisfied to get payed our agreement. I enjoyed the project.
OKWhy the guessing game?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Not a guessing game! This is a big project and I trying to figure out whether I am slow and the real cost. I have been payeed less for more work. I keep records to evaluate me, profit, and loss.
Luke
Here are a few rough pictures.
OK it isn't a guessing game. Sorry.I must have misinterpreted when you asked for a WAG to mean a wild ast guess. What made it seem a game to me was when you asked others for their guess but didn't share your guess
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I really would have lost my butt if this was bid! I am tracking cost to use in the event that I need to bid. You guys have more experience in that area....I assumed. At a fixed hourly rate I usually come in around the middle bid.
The reason I asked for a wag is because it would just be a set of numbers to compare to my real cost. Thanks for your input.
There is nowhere near enough information for me to offer a WAG. You would have to describe the whole thing in excruciating detail to get useful comparable information. Last bathroom I did cost $32K including everything, even ink for the guy to sign the checks with. Gut the whole thing, fix the floor framing, replace a window and add a new one, rewire, repipe, insulate, rock, paint, tile, fixtures, trim, etc. $12K might have been approximate on the labor not including supervision.
"Not a guessing game! This is a big project and I trying to figure out whether I am slow and the real cost. I have been payeed less for more work. I keep records to evaluate me, profit, and loss."
Believe me, I know exactly where you are when you say you're trying to figure out if your slow and thinking about what the "real" cost is. I'm always trying to find ways to be more efficient- I think it's critical to always be improving.
Still, one can get too focused on what the "real" cost is and how your time compared to what others would do. The thing is, if you're not going to hire the "other people" to do the work, why does it matter how long they would take?
If you're running a good business, it's very important to be competitive. But, it's even more important to charge more than it costs you to do the work. If you know that you will need 100 hours to do a job (@ $65/hr), and your competitor will need exactly 90 hours, what are your options? You can figure out how to work for $59.50/hr (trimming overhead or just not making as much money) or you can focus on trying to sell the job at the price you need to be profitable.
You're always going to lose some jobs because of cost or a myriad of other reasons. There's not much you can do about that, at least in our industry. What you can focus on is doing the best possible job for your customer and honing your selling skills so you can communicate the value of your services to them.
So, strive to be efficient, to be good, to charge what you need and you're golden. It may seem simple, but I think that's the only way it is.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Funny, I just did a similar job (not my job, I just helped) I think the final was $47k in an upscale neighborhood in the Detroit area.
gk
What you describe is a pretty major project.
At 60 an hour, you are already at $4800 for labor alone- not including all your side trips. Hopefully you do not charge less than that for professional services.
You probably have several thousand in materials alone on top of that- unless the customer has supplied everything.
Consultation and delivery fees?
Your profit hasn't even been discussed yet, and this is at or over $7800 right now.
Have you figured half-days of work as full days, or were you able to go somewhere else? In other words, who ate the downtime- you or the customer?
What did you charge?
There was no down time. I was able to go some where else! The lady has been great to work for so far. The question was asked because bidding always bites me in the rear. I was just looking to see what others thought were realistic numbers. I have found with me that the hourly rate was the fairest way for me and the customer.
Luke
so, tell us. what are you gonna charge?
Well it looks like it going to be around 9 grand for labor and the home owner is going to pay for materials. It seems to be going well so far! The lady lady is already gearing up for the next job. I have completed several jobs over the last two years, but not as big as this one. It may be an expensive lesson...we will see!
Luke
sounds fair to me.
with several guys guessing twelve grand in your area, that must be fair for both of you.Important thing ( other than did you make a profit) is the both of you are happy.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
After several weeks of waiting for special order doors, tile, ect. On paper I made a profit, in my mind I lost.
Edited 9/2/2008 10:35 am ET by luke
OK
Let's not feel bad about that, but ask what can we learn from that to help profit profile in the future?First off, I like a better markup on special order items simply because those delays are more likely with them. Also, you mentioned that the owner did the procurement. Owners typically do mess up schedules because they simply have no idea. So when an owner is handling the materials to 'save' themselves money, it usually means taking it out of your pocket. so they need to understand that when they cause delay, it will cost them, not you.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!