I’m going to create a subpanel in my garage based on an existing 220v 30amp appliance line. The existing run has the two hots and a neutral, all 10ga. stranded. I will need to add a ground wire to these. The line run is about 45 feet. Present plans are to run a pair of radient heaters on dedicated subcircuits during evening meals, as well as provide two subcircuits for outlets for basic power tools and another pair of subcircuits for lights. I don’t see going anywhere near the 60 amps total capacity of this line.
Here is what I’m imagining doing, just wanted to run it up the flag pole before I opened up the breaker box:
1. Shut off the main breaker and tape it down.
2. Pull the panel cover, pull the breaker for this circuit and release the hot lines from the breaker, release the neutral from the neutral bus.
3. Bundle the three lines together and join them to the fish tape line.
4. Unspool a length of fish tape, then walk back to the garage and start pulling the three lines through. Periodicly go back and unspool more fish tape.
5. When the fish tape emerges at the end of the run, attach the new ground wire to the rest of the existing wire bundle. Unwind enough so it will easily feed back though with the other three wires.
6. Walk back to the main panel and start pulling the fish tape back out again. Periodicly go back and unspool more ground wire.
7. Attach ends of wires to their corresponding locations in the new subpanel box.
8. Attach new ground to ground bus, old neutral to neutral bus, and the hots back to their original positions on the breaker.
9. Reinstall breaker in panel, turned off.
10. Turn main breaker on – if all well turn subcircuit breaker on. If all still well, reinstall panel cover.
4 wires of 10ga is going to be no fun to pull, I’m sure. Any tips or advice to save having 6 false starts like I normally do? Should I be running bigger wire for this since I’m already there?
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Replies
On tip vs, running back and forth.
set up a big pulley or bar over the conduit entrance. Lay out all the wire in a straight line on the gound or floor with no obstruction to kink it, then pull all in one pull. Same with the fish tape.
Did 500 ea. TSP ito a 5" conduit once thru a 100 ft length having 4 90 deg bends with a winch and gallons of lube on a test flight airplane. Of course, there were ten people pushing and laying parallel strands and the winch on the pulling end, and teflon wire to boot.. Who says a conduit cant be 100% full.
Don't forget to use plenty of wire lube on the wires!!!
Also, according to CEC, (may not apply to you, but a US guy might be able to look it up in the NEC); a #12 ground would be sufficient for with #10 power wires.
locolobo
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Forget the fish tape.
Leave the two hot wires on the breaker and turn the breaker off. Unhook the present neutral and tie a new neutral and new ground to it. Go to the other end and pull out the old neutral while pulling in the new neutral and ground. Saves wire time and labor.
For a one person pull it is safer to pull from the garage toward the panel box. Tie the two hot wires on that end to the conduit or something to keep them from pulling back into the conduit. If you get a knot or snarl in the wire being pulled in, it won't be near the hot busses in the panel.
An even safer way is to have a second person feeding the wire into the remote pull point. That way there is less likelihood of a snarl and skinning a wire. On the panel end cut and fold a piece of cardboard to cover the SE cable and hot lugs.
Hope this clear.
Dave
Thanks everyone for those excellent tips! Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Paul: however you do it, as you know, shutting the main does not de-energize the SE lugs in the panel (or on the main breaker if they run direct to it). I'm sure you're gonna do this, but make sure the lugs are well insulated before you get a metal fish tape bouncing around in there.
An easy way to be safe is just shut the main and pull the meter.
For the pull, get your better half to help or if you don't have a wife, get a neighbor to help. Make the job go 10x faster.
"Let's get crack-a-lackin" --- Adam Carolla
One item I would also add is to use a lot of pulling lube. The easiest way to apply is to get a handful of lube in your hand and then make a fist around the wire while it is being pulled through the conduit. The lube really cuts done on the friction on the internal walls of the flex or conduit and prevents the wire from being stretched or broken.
Hey dallasfred, there's no need to use big giant letters. In a forum that's like screaming in our ear and considered rude. I see you're new here so I just thought I'd tip you off on that. Other's might simply ignore your posts and you'll never know why. Anyway, welcome to Breaktime! :o)--------------------------------------------------------
For a good time, visit MyToolbox.net See some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
Hi Paul,
I didn't read the other posts as I have to get out the door like 2 minutes ago, so pardon me if I'm repeating someone else. When running flexible conduit (greenfield), I try to push the wires through beforehand. If I have to pull the wires after it's installed, I strip the insulation back about 4" before looping it through the end of the fish tape, thus keeping it as thin as possible. Finally, it helps to use plenty of lube and if one person can push from one end while the other is pulling at the other end. --------------------------------------------------------
For a good time, visit MyToolbox.net See some of my work at TedsCarpentry.com
IIRC, code prohibits installing conduit with the wires already in it. It would be possible to install something that way that would work, but be impossible to replace wires in the future by pulling. It could have a lot more than 360 degrees worth of bends.
-- J.S.
Is this an attached garage or a separate building more than 5 ft. from the main house? If it's a separate building, you might be allowed to leave the 3 wires alone if you give it its own ground rod.
-- J.S.