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Question for plumbers

300D | Posted in General Discussion on May 26, 2003 07:25am

I am working on a rebuild of one of the bathrooms in our house. We are putting in a one piece fibreglass shower unit. My question relates tot he drain fitting. I picked up an ABS drain fitting from the local Home Depot. It came in a box with no instructions and the shower unit instructions do not say anything much either. The issue is the drain fitting has one rubber gasket. I assume that I am to put the fitting on from the bottom and then put the one gasket and the top part of the fitting on from the top and screw it together. The botton of the shower stall is rough so I assume the gasket is to go on the smooth side. If it had two gaskets the answer would be pretty straight forward but with only one, I want to make sure I put it in the correct spot and do not end up with a leak in the drain. By the time this unit is sealed in place, it will not be an easy task to get to the drain.

Sort of a dumb question but I thought it better to ask than to carry on assuming that I know what I am doing.

 

 

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Replies

  1. DanT | May 26, 2003 10:50pm | #1

    I have only used 2 types of shower drains, both brass.  However both have a top and bottom part that are installed intitially and you use plumbers putty on the top half and the rubber washer goes between the nut and the fiberglass on the bottom.  Often is a ring of cardboard that has teflon on it that actually goes between the rubber and the brass ring.  DanT

    1. 300D | May 27, 2003 12:19am | #2

      OK - interesting, I believe there is a cardboard ring as well but had not really considered that it was part of the assembly - assumed it was just packaging of some sort. I wondered about the plumber's putty as well but again was not sure whether I was supposed to put it on the top, bottom or both.

  2. Wet_Head | May 27, 2003 01:40am | #3

    Under the tub from top to bottom...

    1. Rubber gasket with light coating of silicone on top of it.
    2. Paper washer
    3. Nut

    On the top put in the drain with silicone for sealer.  Works far better than plumbers putty.

    1. DaveRicheson | May 27, 2003 04:19am | #4

      You never have to take apart your own work do you? I did your silicone thing on a kitchen sink years ago. Had to take it apart ten or fifteen years later....ugh. Saws-all!

      It never leaked though.

      Dave

      1. Wet_Head | May 27, 2003 06:55am | #5

        No, because I build it to last forever.

      2. Wet_Head | May 27, 2003 06:56am | #6

        Oh, and I can have a siliconed shower drain out in 5 minutes flat.  Same with a KS strainer.  But that is my job so I better be good at it.

        1. DaveRicheson | May 27, 2003 03:02pm | #7

          Ok, give me a clue. Tools, muscle, or just being smarter than what you are working on? I haven't run into it very often, but when I do, I usually end up tareing somthing up to get them out.

          Dave

          1. 300D | May 27, 2003 06:22pm | #8

            Am I missing something here? Why would a thin coat of silicone on the rubber gasket make it so hard to remove?

          2. Wet_Head | May 27, 2003 11:11pm | #9

            cut the nut off first.  I use a drill bit to cut them.  then use a screwdriver to gently pry the drain out.   slow and steady.

    2. User avater
      Dinosaur | May 28, 2003 12:51am | #10

      Forget the silicon goop. You'd need too much to buy a small tube, and you'd waste about half of a cartride. Plus, you'll be dropping things for days if you get any of that stuff on your hands.

      Plumber's putty is the way to go. Knead it in the bag before you open it, if you buy it in a bag the way most retail users do. Then knead it some more, and finally roll it into a snake with your palms on a flat surface. Don't pick up sawdust or other crud in the putty while you're doing it. Then wrap the snake around the drain fitting under the flange, and squish it down into the hole in the unit. You should have some squeeze-out all around. Clean this up with a dull putty knife when you're all through. Don't scratch the gel-coat on the fibreglas.

      Put on the rubber washer and so forth underneath (I've never seen a fitting that comes with a paper; new one on me), and tighten it all down. You can save yourself sweat and the brass threads damage if you wrap the threaded part of the fitting with teflon tape before you thread on the ring nut. It should be nice and tight--but don't crack the unit into which you're installing the drain fitting!

      Dinosaur

      1. rasconc | May 28, 2003 01:45am | #11

        Not sure about the brass ones but the plastic ones use a cardboard or paper slip ring that lessens the chance that the nut will roll up the rubber washer when you tighten it.  Just like the sink drains.  I hate plumbers putty because almost every connection I have undone that used it was dry and crumbly and had more often than not leaked.

        A product that seems to do well for me is Permagum.  It is a HVAC product used to seal lines to shrouds.  It will not dry out and works like a block of clay and works like plumbers putty.  Just my opinion.  It is probably not food grade but I have doubt you would want to eat plumbers putty either. 

        1. User avater
          Dinosaur | May 28, 2003 02:27am | #13

          Okay, that's why I've never seen a paper ring before; I always use brass for drain fittings and tailpieces. I take off from there with the ABS using a compression fitting. Had one of those let go on an instant kitchen I built for an American girl last fall who wanted to rent out the basement of the chalet she'd just bought. Turns out the renters were all British kids, and they were hanging pots from the drain pipes under the sink to dry. Must be some English tradition I missed along the line somewhere. Anyway, after about a month, the weight had pulled the ABS pipe down the tail piece far enough for it to pop off. Naturally, it had to happen when the kids had left both sinks full of dirty dishwater and plates. Made a helluva mess on the carpet and swelled up the MDF I'd used to build the base cabinet carcase. When the customer saw how it happend, tho, she just paid the bill and thanked me for coming over at 9 o'clock at night.

          I'm sure I wouldn't want to eat plumber's putty (or silicon!), either, but since it's not on the potable water line, it shouldn't make a difference. It's true the stuff dries out after a while, but 'a while' in my experience is defined as 10-15 years or more. We use the same kind of putty for glazing traditional divided-lite windows, and we've learned not to even think about painting the window for at least a week or two after it's been glazed. If you think getting the plumber's putty out of an old drain joint is bad, you should try to clean out the old glazier's putty from a 16-lite storm window that's 35 years old! Bought one of those special tools from Prazi (I think) to do that job; all I succeeded in doing with it was chewing up the sash and cutting my hand. Another gizmo buried in the bottom of the tool box. Sigh.

          Dinosaur

          1. 300D | May 28, 2003 06:22pm | #14

            I have always liked brass, and copper too but it seems to be getting more difficult to get these. The local Home Depot only carries this plastic one so far as I can tell. I will check it out though and see if I can find the brass drain fitting. We used to have more plumbing type stores around here but the big box stores have caused some of them to disappear.

          2. User avater
            Dinosaur | May 28, 2003 07:16pm | #15

            No surprise the warehouse stores don't carry quality--they make all their money on quantity.

            Go to a plumber for your supplies. All the plumbers I know also sell fittings at retail as well as providing service for people who don't do the work themselves. You'll pay a bit more--maybe quite a bit per unit--but you will have the satisfaction of knowing that you're installing something that already has a 100+ year track record. ABS hasn't even been around as long as I have, so we don't really know what will happen to it under long-term exposure to the weird chemicals we now all put down our drains. I only use it for pipe runs because my customers just won't pay for cast iron or sweated copper unless code requires it.

            Remember 'Poly-B'? It took 10-15 years before it started leaking under exposure to fluorine in potable water. I believe the manufacturer was sued in the States in a good-sized class-action. I don't know how many contractors who installed the stuff got caught in the cross-fire; I'm just glad I've never installed an inch of the stuff.

            Dinosaur

  3. User avater
    VtMike | May 28, 2003 02:21am | #12

    I would......  Throw the plactic drain away and buy a brass one for about nine bucks. I replace more leaking plastic ones that have ruined ceilings. I keep a spare in the truck all the time. I think the plastic ones strip out and loosen after time. Maybe the base gives and causes it to leak too? I use Plumbers Putty under the brass flange, squish it down, clean off the excess on the bottom, put the rubber washer, fiber washer, then the nut on. The fiber washer is there to keep the nut from spitting the rubber washer out. Also slips better on it so you don't get a "false tight". Turn the nut - not the drain. I now have a big loop wrench from Pasco, but used to finish it off with a hammer and old screwdriver by tapping on the tut's nubs. Finally set the shower in a bed of mortar mix.

    Yesterday I couldn't even spell plumber, today I are one.

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