Hi All,
I’m a newbie to the list, so first let me say, hi, and happy holidays to all!
I’ve read all the posts regarding radiant heat solutions, and still have a few questions, but first the basics. I’m planning on building a new home in NY, about 40 miles north of NYC. It’ll be stick-built, about 3300 sf plus a garage (mostly 1 story, 2 bedrooms on 2nd story) using 6″ insulated outer walls, wood-framed floors (combination of TJI’s and dimensional lumber), hardwood floors throughout except tile in kitchen and baths, combination of full basement and crawl spaces (no slab on grade anywhere except garage), average glazing (no huge windows anywhere), clerestory windows in a south facing great room (for winter solar gains), with a cathedral ceiling. Master bedroom and bath will have cathedral ceilings too.
I’m seriously considering radiant heat throughout if I can afford it, utilizing either an oil-fired, or propane-fired boiler. My questions are: a) has anyone out there priced up the difference between the installation cost of a hot water baseboard system vs. radiant? If so, how do the 2 systems compare? b) given the fact that I want hardwood floors, which manufacturer’s radiant system is better suited to my application? c) and this might be a really dumb question, when installing the hardwood flooring, how does the installer avoid nailing through the tubing, assuming that the tubing will be below the underlayment?
If anyone has any suggestions on recommended manufacturers for the radiant system, I’d love to hear them. Let me know if more info is required.
I’m a PE (mechanical engineering), so feel free to get as technical as you want. But I can handle layman’s terms too!
Thanks in advance,
Anthony
Replies
in general, a baseboard system will work 'just as well', but a radiant floor will distribute the heat more efficiently.
One easy comparison is to calculate the operating temp of the water in both cases. With the assumption that lower operation temp is more efficient you can see that radiant is likely to be more economical (on the order of, say, 118deg for baseboard heat, and 85deg for radiant, in a typical case of heat loss, water heating equipment and SF being the same).
One down side to radiant can be when sudden temperature swings occur outdoors (the mass of the floor can take a while to change temp, while the baseboard can cool down/heat up more quickly). So, for instance, commonly used rooms with tile floors may benefit from radiant slab construction, and rarely used rooms or vacation homes might best be served by baseboard, or even (gasp) forced air.
To improve the responsiveness for radiant systems an outside air 'setback' thermostat is a great idea to improve comfort during cold night/hot days in the 'swing' seasons and to improve efficiency almost all of the year.
Hope this helps!
Norm
My solution to the hardwood nails would be to install the tubing last...
Costing: Are you doing the work yourself? Presumably your radiant would be installed under the subfloor in dispering panels...It goes in pretty quick and easy...but the tubing and plates add up. There are systems were the tubing goes in "grooves" in the subfloor...not sure how good they work...I have heard folks say they are happy with them.
I am a DIYer...I have to get my boiler installed and running to heat my floors...can't wait! No experience living with radiant, yet.
The folks over at The Wall on http://www.heatinghelp.com are hardcore hydronic heating guys...and they are great. They'll push you to the very best in hydronic heating.
I'm sure radiant will cost more...not all that much more, but more.
Run your system on an outdoor reset, so the water temperature in the tubing actual modulates to the outdoor temperature. When done correctly, you'll never notice a change in indoor temperature. The system controller works off pre=programmed heating curves with feedback from the outdoor sensor.
I'm a research engineer in astronomy...so we have similar backgrounds. I had a blast designing the system...looking forward to getting it all together. Wish I could increase the number of hours in a day...
If you are really interested in a cost for radiant heat floors, send me an e-mail. I am just finishing phase 1 of a 8500 sq ft and in the process of finishing a 1100 sq ft job. I am a finish wood craftsman, vinyl window salesman, pex plumbing installer, and anything else a owner wants done. [email protected] I can give you the high points, and after 6 years putting in radiant heat, some of the pitfalls.
What are some of the pitfalls you have come across with radiant?
I to am considering using just Radiant heat in my new house, however I am wondering about the feasability of varying the temperature in this type of system. In my current house I have a programmable thermostat for my forced air system. It turns the heat on and off throughout the day according to programs that I set. So I can have the house cooler at night, warm up just before we get up, set back to cool for the daytime when no one is home, and then warm up again just before we arrive home. How feasable is this with radiant. System would be in a slab in the basement, but just attached to the underfloor on other floors.
Robert
It wouldn't be too difficult, especially with the upper floors. Mostly it'd take experimentation over the first year or so to learn how responsive the different floors are in different outside conditions. Don't expect to get the tstat programmed right the first time.