Yesterday I left work early and hauled Dad home from the hospital. He was in a bit of pain, and kinda shaky on his crutches. But he seemed O.K., I guess.
They gave him a prescription for some vicatin. (?) Those are supposed to be some strong pain killers, so hopefully he’ll be feeling good.
We have most of the house re-arranged so he can get around relatively easily. Moved a bed downstairs so he doesn’t have to climb the narrow, steep stairs to his 2nd floor bedroom. And cleared a path in to his desk so he could sit there when he wanted to.
One thing came up that I can’t quite figure out, though. The doctor said they should have a railing on the steps leading into the house. But those steps are a 30 year old set of pre-cast concrete steps, and I’m not sure how to put a railing on it.
It’s a set of 5 steps with a 24″ landing on top. I’d guess the total height of the steps is between 30″ and 35″. (Didn’t have time to measure them last night)
The steps they have look a bit like this:
https://images.finehomebuilding.com/app/uploads/2019/01/27024128/4r5w-gsy.jpg
The only difference is that they’re smooth concrete – No texture.
The steps are in a “mud room” between the house and garage, so they won’t be exposed to the weather.
I thought about putting a 4X4 in a post base at the bottom of the stairs. (Beside the stairs, not on it) Then I’d have to set another one by the top step so the railing could change to horizontal. Then I could attach a handrail on brackets between those.
But setting a 4X4 in a post base doesn’t provide any lateral support. How do I get that?
Guess I could skip the horizontal part of the railing – He just needs something to hang onto as he hops down the stairs. The doc said crutches in one hand and a railing on the other side were safer than just crutches on stairs.
I figure the pre-cast steps are too brittle to drill holes in and use anchors. (At least that’s what I’ve heard)
Obviously I want the railing to be sturdy – Don’t need any more falls and broken bones.
Got any thoughts for me?
Wanna jump start your brain? Do us all a favor and stick your finger in a light socket.
Replies
Ron , guess I missed the story about your Dad, hope he is OK.
This is one method that worked for me when a local church wanted to add a handrail to their existing concrete steps.
Obviously, the rail needed to be super sturdy, here's what I did:
I have a medium size hammer drill and 2.5" coring bit (you could rent if you don't).
I located the holes in from the edges far enough to not weaken the edge, then drilled down either 6" or all the way to subsoil. I placed 1.5" pipe posts into the holes after filling them with non-shrink grout. I spun the posts by hand to get the grout to fill the inside and outside of the pipe as I centered it in the hole. I plumbed the posts and let them set up.
Not being a welder myself, I got a local fellow to attach rails to my posts.
Result: Super sturdy easy to grab safety rail!
In two years and lots of use, still as sturdy as day one.
The (rather long) story is here:http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=54154.1The short version is that dad broke his leg, and had a pin put in it. The idea of a post set in concrete is interesting. But these steps are hollow, which would make it more difficult.
The Big Bang Theory: God Spoke and BANG it happened.
What is the floor in the mud room?
Concrete: use the core drill method.
Wood: build a truss type post (a 90 degree right triangle) and anchor the base with though bolts to blocking under the floor. This would set snug to the stairs.
Attach a standard grip rail with standoff brackets to either type of post arragement.
The braced post configuration will work on concrete also, if you use a couple of drive anchors in the base legs.
Dave
"Concrete: use the core drill method."
It's a concrete floor. But I don't get how it will work if the steps are hollow.
Assuming theere is a 7" rise to the first step, and the concrete is 2" thick, that leaves 5" of air space. I don't want to have to fill that all up with concrete or mortar.
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A: Breasts don't have eyes.
Core drill into the floor beside the steps.
If you are using threaded pipe, you can use a couple of ells to step the railing over the edge of the steps.
I can't find paint on this pc at work, or I would make you a crude sketch.
Maybe one of the guys with the CAD systems will come along and make drawing, if they understand what I am trying to describe.
Core drill and set the top and bottom vertical pipes. Make sure both pipe tops are the same height above the stair tread. Use an ell threaded onto each pipe turned to face toward the steps. A closed nippled into each of those ells, and another ell on the nipple. Adjust the pitch of the last two ells to match the rise/run angle of the stairs and then thread the connecting pipe (rail) between them.
The order of installation will have to be from one end to the other to get it all together. In fact I would probably assemble the whole thing first, mark the floor and core driil, then set the whole thing. Brace it to keep plumb and wait for the core grout to set.
Dave
This could be double post.
Here is a sketch, as crude as may be.
Well that didn't work. I'll try to change the format.
Edited 2/17/2005 7:05 pm ET by DAVERICHESON
I was at the farm tonight, and took a couple of shots of the steps so it would make more sense. The steps are 24" tall. The landing is 24" out from the house. Each tread is about 11" wide. The thing is a hollow pre-cast piece of concrete. We moved into place before the garage and mud room walls were built around it. Along with the steps, you'll notice the large amount of crap piled all over. Their whole house looks like that.Hopefully this will make the problem clearer.
Many people quit looking for work when they find a job.
OK. So it looks like the precast steps are sitting on a concrete slab,right?Core in a post into the floor slab near the front edge of the bottom step, then run a rail right to the wall beside the door, no need for an upper post, just have a flange made onto the upper end of the rail to connect to the wall.
It could all be made as a unit, the post and rail, and set in the concrete and attached to the wall all at once.
What the HECK was I thinking?
I guess I am not understanding how these concrete steps are constructed.I assumed they were one concrete unit. Are they actually just 2" thick rectangles placed on soil that is built up 7" higher each time? Where is the 'air space'?
Forgive me, I really don't understand.
Perhaps you could place posts adjacent to the steps?What the HECK was I thinking?
I've seen retrof-it railing systems....made to look like the old wrought iron....probably from the big box stores....hammer drill & anchor the supplied fittings....not a high quality product compared to having wrought ones made & installed but might work just fine in your situation....
When I have to add a railing in a location like yours I sometimes drill out the concrete like a previous poster and then grout in a piece of angle iron. Then you can build a wooden post and rail and bolt them to the angle. If it needs to be especially stout you can break out the concrete and posthole dig down a bit and set the angle iron deep. A bit stouter I think than anything that bolts down to the slab.
Tom
any chance of contacting the original manufacturer of the pre-cast steps? Pretty sure they would a railing "option" - as previously posted, you could also do the base to the side of the steps and tie the top into the house. the other thing is how "mobile" is your dad and does he really need to be using the steps without supervision/assistance? the "stubborn old man" thing "loses in circumstances like this - safety rules (especially after already getting hurt)