Just wondering if there are others investing in real estate (such as flipping houses) and willing to share some of your secrets.
What’s working and not working?
We’re doing it and most days it working but there are days we are struggling.
Edited 6/4/2009 12:36 pm by mrfixitusa
Replies
Tim, I heard about something the other day and I haven't seen it discussed on this forum.
I know someone who is investing in rental properties in a small town outside of a larger booming city.
The guy is buying houses outside of a city which is a fast growing city due to meat packing.
Meat packing is bringing a lot of illegal immigrants to town and many people want to move away from the crime, the headaches, and chaos.
So they move just outside of the city and stay close enough they can drive to their job.
They put the kids to school in the small town and they are very happy
This guy is buying older 3 bed houses for $20 to $25 K and he's renting them for $500 to $600 and he's happy as a pig in slop.
Just wondering if you had heard of this.
Dodge City or Garden City?
Just wondering, we're gonna build a wall around Johnson County one of these days....
Dodge City(but I'm sure GC is the same ;)
Thought I was reading somewhere that the Hispanic population in the counties that hosted Dodge and Garden was in the majority now. Major problem in the schools with not enought Spanish teachers for the ELL program (English Language Learner as opposed to old ESL, English as a Second Languate, not PC).
Was at the librarytoday and the hanicapped places are marked "Special Parking".
You know a lot about Lowes so I'll ask for your help with somethingWe're spending $3,000 a week at Home Depot and we want to change to Lowes.Will they give us a commercial discount at Lowes?What else do they do for their commercial customers?(i.e free materials delivery, discount when we "walk in" and buy without going through the bid room, anything else?
go to Lowes & tell them $3000/week at HD, what can you do for me?
Joe H
All depends on the manager....
If you get a good one, he'll do deals for you...
Most don't know this, but store is good based on their managers.
The guy you want to talk to is the Sales Manager, don't get switched over to the installed sales manager....they're all pricks...
If you don't get deliveries but are in a hurry most stores will pick your order ahead of time. If I rmemeber correctly they will also give you a quote or bid on what you need...
If I remember correctly you're in Denver now so I can't tell you which one's are good or not there. But in the MidWest I can get it right.
But I haven't set foot in a Lowe's store since I got laid off six months ago. but Depot is still run by pricks :o)
Lefty-This tagline removed due to the prevelance of the humor impaired.
Thanks Lefty - I've been in Home Depot at least once a day for about a year now.Really nice people working there but I waste a lot of my time there.If you purchase something on a commercial account you have to wait in line at the prodesk.LOWES IS DIFFERENTThey have a cashier at the Pro Desk.This alone would save us some time.Home Depot is not charging us for deliveriesLowes will reduce our delivery charge to $20 I like the people who work at Home Depot but again it's the system the management has put into place that wastes our time.Thanks for the tip about the sales manager
Thats pretty much what I did except I bought nicer houses. I dont believe in buying older houses because of the upkeep and time doing it .
You will only be as big as your business lets you be . I have hard time keeping up with 15 houses currently and trading. Trading is a construction business aimed at reovating and remodeling the finds . The same job trailer and shop, service the rentals as well. Its a full time job.
I buy what they are losing and let them buy it again so any thing that will cover a goverment loan. That puts me in as a middle man . These houses I have and the ones I buy are prety much uniform. They are all 5 to 15 years old so when Im done fixing they look new again. They show with new ones and Im cheaper of course. All 100 percent buyers using govermnent money.
Right now would be a good time to buy distressed homes like that in my area like I did 15 years ago when interrest was so high it brought the home prices down. I broke even for a while till the prices broke and then began my carreer of making money with them . They have been trading stock ever since.
Old homes are okay for rentals I guess but I beat them on a daily basis . I can sit down with a client and show them mine is cheaper . Most all of mine are energy built homes. Old homes dont have a high resale here and are slow movers. As long as you are using goverment money , why not get one that looked new? Thats the killer question against older homes.
Tim
I agree with what you're saying about new vs oldHere's an example of what we've run into with old houses.We remodeled a 1950's brick home and the front door looked really badI measured it and it was 6'6" or maybe 6'7"I took the door trim off to see if there was room for a 6'8" door to fit and clear the headerI did go ahead and change the door buy I spent 2 or 3 times more time messing around with trying to make the new taller door fit
You are probably not into your expertise of the real estate side of it right now . You are growing and learning a market you have been interrested in for a long time . I think thats great . Not many people get to go what they "want " to do.
You are getting right back to what I spoke about earliar. Watch all the flip shows my wife watches and its basically the same story although the stories get unbelievable somtimes. I wish they would just do a true reality flip show.
The main premise you are talking about is bringing these houses up to current standards in what people "want" . You are doing major remodeling and I want to talk about that vs the price .
When you start pushing numbers for these projects which you arent doing right now it tells the whole story of the business.
Basically its a business thats much like poker to me . Youre sitting there looking for someones weakness to prey on. Someone has to drop the ball and you have to be ready on a seconds notice to pick it up and run. That never changes , never.
Someone has to be willing to sell you a house below market for you to be able to make a living which most real estate sales people dont understand . I dont know why they dont seem to get it . But thats the real "key" to the business.
My problem with older homes is the price it takes to make it desirable for someone to get a goverment loan. Lets just say you find a home thats worth 75,000 on remodeled condition. You have to buy that home for about 25 to 30 grand . The problem first is the house is worth 400 dollars a month in its current condition. So those numbers dont work out . The numbers say its got a market value of 40 grand right now . But you cant give marker value , do a major renovation , pay a realator, pay over head of taxes , insurance , etc. Even is you bought it for 40 grand the seller has to pay from his or her money a realator and expenses.
If everyone gets paid the price just keeps going "down" on the purchase price . Id like to see the true numbers on these old houses that have major renovation. The numbers dont work for me . Ive done several and learned those jobs dont turn the dimes that the lighter ones do. Id be happy to do them if the numbers were there to support it .
The real problem in this discussion is appraisors. Every house had a birth of a market price someone paid not long ago if its a repo. If you look at records most repos were owned less than 5 years. 5 years is pretty close to market value today in steady markets . 2 years ago or so we had a market jump of 35 percent but I think we have just about lost 35 percent in the last year . Thats pretty close to the adjustment in the market as it stands today.
The problem Im having right now is repos are on the market that were sold on that 35 percent surge. So lets just say someone paid 75 grand for that old house 2 years ago . You need to buy it for 25 grand and thats a problem. To me , thats the major problem with what you are working on right now .
Newer houses in my area are out there that need paint and minor punch lists that will turn 10 grand profit . They used to turn more but its the 35 percent surge thing . Im selling rentals instead that I paid 25 to 35 grand for them. So IM like a squirell eating the nuts Ive saved for the winter until I start noticeing new nuts on the ground . Thats exactly what Larry should be doing if he is on his way out of the rental business.
Tim
One of the things that we're doing is opening the wall between the kitchen and living room.We've done two houses this way and it been a big improvement.Both houses had the dining room in the kitchen and we are I guess you would say eliminating the dining room and making a big kitchen instead.We put as many cabinets as we possibly can in the new kitchen and it really improves the house.The wall between the kitchen and living room becomes a counter top and wala the home feels like a new modern contemporary home.We've had a lot of positive compliments from the realtors who show the houses.
tim,you made my day. i've got 20 and they are running me ragged.lots of 12 hour day for the last 2 years,i thought it was just me. i hear of guys with 50 and wonder how many they have on payroll
as i say "i had a plan,it just didn't work out like i had planned"
phase one was accumulate
phase two was live off income [didn't have figured that health insurance for 18k and college for another 15k,so incomes a little short]
phase three was sell and retire
well i'm trying to figure out a exit plan for phase three now,i'm getting done with these things and it's going to take 10 years to get rid of them.hope i can hang with it em that long.YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
I think you guys just saved me.
I've always resisted getting into the landlording end of real estate but recently I was seriously starting to reconsider it. The rental market is strong around here due to the large influx of new arrivals pouring in from all over the US.
Your complaints have brought me back to my senses.
You get out what you put in. I have 6 units that we renovated and I dont get calls cause everything is new. I've also been blessed with really good tenants.
How can you go wrong with somebody else buying a house for you?
Family.....They're always there when they need you.
You cant as long as you dont mind doing landlord wotk.
Jim doesnt want to do that type of work.
i just spent the day on the west side of a brick house,107 degrees,putting in a new central air. my baldazz head is cooked to well done.
i kinda agree with jim................this landlording deal sucs
i haven't had a chance to check into that insurance yet,but i will ,it's one of the biggest problems i have with these rentals anymore.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Tims right. You gotta have the drive and desire to do the landlord thing. I know that I'm not the right guy for that. Anyways, at this point, I don't have time for anything. I just passed up a no money down lease option opportunity. I probably should have done it but I don't have any time to do that biz. It probably wouldn't be a lot of time but it's still more than I have.
Is the roofing biz profitable down there?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I'm so freakin' happy that I decided to partner up and do roofing. Yes it's profitable and it's profitable in your neck of the woods too. You might not get the volume...but maybe again you might. It all depends on your goals and methods.
I think there are some opportunities with the lease optionMy brother just sold a house that wayWe put it on the market a month or so ago at $220It sold once and then fell through and then one of his renters asked what he had that they could rent to ownShe saw the house and fell in love with it and they signed a contract and moved in yesterdayI said "do need to have your head examined"I said "sell the house and get your money out of it"He said "I know these people and they have a good track record"BUT THE MAIN REASON HE SOLD THE HOUSE ON LEASE OPTION IS BECAUSE HE DOESN'T HAVE TO PAY A 3% COMMISSION TO THE SELLING AGENTIN this case that would have been $6,600 !!!!!!!He in putting $6,600 in his pocket by doing it this way!!!!!!Sweeeeeeet !!!!!!He's in tall cotton.He will get his full asking price in a year or so.If they walk away, so what. We don't think they can really do that much damage to the house (other than ruining the carpet)
"We don't think they can really do that much damage to the house (other than ruining the carpet"
i love that statement,remember my little shoot em up incident a couple years back,didn't really hurt the carpet.........................
friend of mine sold a house a year ago,rent to own,about 6 blks from your old house. well the years here,they moved out overnight.
took a house with all natural oak trim,painted it white,badly. decided they didn't like a wall,started to remove it,said oh oh it's a supporting wall. then let the sewr back up in the basement,had it cleaned out ,then had some company come in and clean the basement,2600. billed to the owner.
never say "all they can do......................"the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Still think you should write a book about your experiences as a landlord.But getting back to rent to own - He's had the house on the market for a couple of months now and so it's not like going this way before you give it a chance.Also, this house is Tri Level home.that makes it harder to sell. I don't like tri level houses and wouldn't want to own one. I just prefer a ranch style.But I really liked this house and It doesn't seem like your typical tri level house This is because the upper levelr has only two bedrooms instead of three and this completely changes it.There is a large master bedroom and the second bedroom is smaller The second floor is probably 600 ft and it's the perfect size for two bedrooms, a bathroom, and small hallwayIt has a really nice feel to it.I just mainly wanted to emphasize that he's jumping at the chance to do a rent to own and that way he can sell the house for full price and not have to pay a commission.Was it the right choice?We;ll know in a year or two when they step up to the plate and get a loan and he can offically sell it to them and walk away from it.
If he didn't get a big up front option payment, that he gets to keep if they opt not to buy, then he's doing the biz all wrong.
In my case, I'm fairly certain that I could have just started making the payments and maybe kicked in an extra $100 per month that would go towards a down payment with the sellers that I ran into. They had a special circumstance in that they didn't need any of the money for at least a year and probably two years. So, my offer would have been something like this: Mr and Mrs Seller, if you sell the house for cash right now, and then go live with grandma to save up some money to buy a nicer, bigger house, and repair your credit, you'll probably make the same mistake many other sellers do: spend the proceeds! If you lease option it to me for 5k more than what you would net with a realtor sale, you'll gain in two way: 1) You'll be putting 5k more in your pocket at the sale of the house and 2)you won't have access to the money for two years and when we close, you'll have every penny available, including what you save while you live with grandma. It will be win, win. Also, there is a bonus: I'll be helping your credit score out by making all the payments".
Who could refuse that deal?
Then, I'd immediately find a lease option buyer but I would run credit checks, require a significant non-refundable option payment and get the first and last upfront (or whatever is legal) and also get a security deposit. I'd sign a one year lease option with the right to extend it one year (with another non-refundable option payment). I'd also have them agree to do all the maintenance (after all, they are "buying" it) if the repairs are "minor" i.e. less than full replacement of the HVAC system. I'd get the original sellers to agree to replace all major components (after all, they still technically own it and we are leasing) i.e. they would be responsible for replacing HVAC systems.
Lease options are good...not as good as taking properties subject to....
heres how i read your post,and don't take any offense to it,if you could do the deal there would be no way for you to loose,but as a landlord it has lots of down side.
so you lease a house from me for 1 year,with the option to buy at 100k [i'm making that up] you give me no option money. i would guess that you would want maybe 1/2 of rent to go to purchase.
now you immediatly go find someone to sublease it from you [lets say at the same as your paying] and you give them a option to buy for 115k,1/2 the rent applies,plus you want option money of lets say 5k. they are all grins and do it.
i as the owner of the property now have no idea whos in my house,and thats a big thing for me. now him and his wife are big partiers and well he gets a little carried away and beats on the wife now and then,a few holes in the wall etc. what recourse do i have? i don't have a lease with them it's with you. i can take it to court but by the time everyones out of my house the years up anyway.
so the couple in the 11th month split,holes in walls,carpets got beer all over it,oh the wife decided she liked pink and purples and since they were buying they did lots of bad painting. well now there split gone there seperate ways ,who cares about the 5k. there gone
now here you stand ,place is tore up,dirty ,you have no money in this deal,in fact you have 5k on the good side.
so you say to me ,sorry i dont want it. i'm screwed and tatooed.
oh and we forgot about you wanteing new systems in place,so maybe i'm out another 10k.
i like your side of the deal,but the landlord side sucks.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 7/15/2009 6:57 pm by alwaysoverbudget
I'm not taking any offense. At this point, I'm just trying to figure out which part of the deal you don't like. After reading your post, I realized that you are looking at as a bad deal if you sold your rental property to me.
It probably isn't the best exit strategy for you as the owner of the property.
I'm trying to explain why a lease option makes sense from a real estate investors' point of view, if he structures the acquisition correctly, then structures the disposition right. If he has written the contracts correctly, he'll gain three ways: 1) he'll make money on the option. 2) He'll make money on the monthly rent. 3) he'll make money if the house closes.
The other key ingredient is: the investor doesn't have to invest any of his money or credit in the deal.
Lease options can be win, win, win for everyone but like anything, if a bad apple gets in the mix, it will ruin everything.
Now, if you want, I'll explain how you would sell some of your current properties on a lease option and make the deal make sense to you.
i'll take you up on that explanation,because this is the next step as i am becoming older and will be wanting to be rid of these things someday.
it sounds funny but i know how to do the accumalation of assets,trying my best to manage them, but i'm coming into the time win it's time to dispose of these things. and to tell you the truth it seems like the toughest part.
sure i can put them on the market and just sell them.but after 6% sales fee,2k for closing fees, state taxes of 12% ,capitol gains tax of 20%,then theres the period when you they are vacant i see losing 40 cents on the dollar only to put the remaining in the bank at 2%.i just can't find a way to make sense of it all. i know i could do a owner carry but that has it's own set of problems and i'm not sure if i'm just taking payments i'm not better off just renting them until they fall down or i die and they go thru the estate tax free.
i had a plan, it's just that the plan didn't work.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
One of the ways that you can capitalize on your financial position with your units is to sell them on a lease option. You get to find good people, with dinged credit, that don't want to be "renters". You "sell" them the house and give them one or two years to repair their credit.
In normal markets, you would price the house with two or three years appreciation attached up front. For instance: if your property today is worth 100k, and you expect 5% appreciation, you write the sale contract for 110,000 because the sale will take place two years down the road. You write the lease portion of the contract for a couple hundred dollars more per month than normal rent rates. You also get a non refundable option payment. You get whatever is available for that....it might be only 1k or 5k.
You want to get as much non refundable as possible. You do that by getting the prospects to tell you what they are working with "as a down payment". You might be surprised.
Essentially, you are acting as some form as a credit assistance helper. You are allowing them to "buy" your house and give them a year to repair their credit. This is important for a lot of folks who can't get conventional financing. You might find many solid self employed people in this category. I'm one of them myselves. Right now, I could probably swing a 3k monthly payment but I can't prove that to any bank.
There's a lot of phychology to this type of arrangement. Don't discount it until you thoroughly research and understand this biz. Theres a lot I'm not saying...it would take more than a few posts to get it all out. Call me.
You can make a contract any thing both parties want to say.
Ill rent the house to you until you come up with the cash to buy it . Thats my lease option.
Youre right , its no problem.
I believe you might be in for a shock.
This may the last year for capitol gains .
Seems Obama wants to get rid of it .
Im selling every thing I can sell before the end of the year .
The lease option business to me is as stupid as taking 200 dollars rent instead of getting 600. Ive been asked the question. Cant you come off the rent ? For what reason? My properties rent the day they hit the paper . Now just why in the world would I take an option to rent at a later date ? Thats what HUD does. You can hold the property for them for a week while they do all their paper work and they MIGHT rent it at a reduced amount than what you get for it . I can do that or I can rent it that day for cash money with a cash deposit .
I just sold the second rental this year.
I fixed both up and had them in first class shape for the age of the house.
I paid 40 for the first one sold and got 100 grand .
I paid 25 for this past one and got 87.500.
Cash is in the bank . Very simple process. The only hitch is the last house sold on paper and it didnt go through becasue they didnt put any thing down. We sold it again in 8 days . Why would I listen to an option after I put thousands of dollars into both of them?
Did I mention murder/sucide ?
Tim
i think your right that capitol gain rates are going up,i don't think you will see them disappear,but go up ,yes.
what is the top fed rate? i think it's around 20 %.
when i first got into this deal in the 70's cap rates were, 60% of profit were tax free,then the other 40 got taxed at your regular rate [25%]
so if you made a 100k profit,less 60k free,taxed on 40 at 25% meant you paid 10k on this deal. then regan came in and changed the rules in the middle of the game. if i'm not mistaken you were taxed at normal rate for a while. this was when i started learning about 1031 exchanges.they were great for real estate,BUT now i'm sitting on all of mine at $0.00 basis,so when i sell mr.tax man does real well.thats why there call 1031 tax deferred :]
i don't think the cap rates can go away because it would slow down buying and selling in the stock market and real estate,they don't want that to happen right now. but come 3 years from now and it might be a whole new deal.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Alawys,
Re: 1031 tax deferred exchangesI was told this by another agent last year. He had a client who sold off his 25 rental properties, did a 1031 exchange and bought a large house and a few condos in Florida and then turned around and rented them out. He is going to retire in 5 years and move into the house and rent it from himself for a dollar a year until his death. He intends to sell his personal property and put the proceeds in the bank and live off that, his savings and the monthly income from the rented and HOA managed condos. Further he had a trust set up that avoided some (not all) of the taxes upon his death. Not sure how it all worked but a tax attorney and title agent who knows 1031's could explain it and set it up.There are only two certain things in this world, death and taxes, and you can only avoid each for so long.
-Day
Actually, the 1031 can be pushed beyond your death. The heirs get to start with new basisis when they inherit the untaxed props.
to tell you the truth that was my plan. 1031 my way into property, mostly with a zero base. hang on for 25 years and pull the income off of them,then when i kick my kids can go in at new basis and sell em with no taxes.
problem to my plan.......... i'm mid 50's and i don't think i can stomach these for another 20+ yrs. i will say if they would kill the capitol gains completely i will mothball and let the kids deal with them.
kills me to help support the goverment and all the nonsense going on.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
he's on the right track, but after renting them for awhile,he can then move into 1 and call it"home" after 2 years it's tax free. one of thos e loopholes you hear about.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
"he's on the right track, but after renting them for awhile,he can then move into 1 and call it"home" after 2 years it's tax free. one of thos e loopholes you hear about."They have drastically reduced the ability to do that. I believe that started with 2009.I was part of the bill last summer that did the first tax credit on house purchases..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
your numbers on these 2 houses are real good, i don't know how long you have held,but i have 1 i bought in 78 at 22 and it would do good to hit 57k here.
so i gotta ask some questions,maybe i need to be some where else besides ks.
how long did you own these? were they fixer uppers and as soon as you were done with them what would they have been worth?
i'm pictureing a 25k house needing 10 k spent on it and when you finished it was worth 55 back in 97,now i can see it 87. but if you only owned it for lets say 4 years and no fix up,man i got to get to ar and buy something. i have a cabin at beaver lake and it had went up alot by 2007, but now has dropped probably 30% since then. what goes up fast,comes down fast.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Just some random thoughts for you Larry*offer to sell your houses to your tenants. You will handle all contracts and you don't need a realtor. Steer them to a bank and help them get financing. Tell them they will qualify for the $8,000 first time home buyer program under Obama.But they must buy the home prior to December.Get to know the Loan Officer at Cap Fed Bank at Central and Maize as they seem to have the lowest interest rates in town.Send the Buyers over to Cap Fed and let them do all the leg work.Show your tenants how they can OWN their home for less than what you are charging them in rentThis will light a fire under them and get them moving.
your random thougts are in the direction i'm thinking. lets get down to it,if renters had cash in the bank for option money or a down payment,they wouldn't be renters.
so what i'm tossing around is this,i'll round my numbers to a 100k
tell the renter i will sell him a house for 100k, i will carry 10% [10,000] on a second so that they can get a 90% loan. they get the loan i walk with 90k. i carry the 10k till next may 1st when they get there 8000 tax credit back.if i never get the other 2k who cares,but if they sell someday i will have to release the loan.....maybe a few bucks then. the worst case is i lose the whole 10k,but if i sell thru a agent i lose 6k anyway.
my biggest problem with this is,once they think about it they may go shopping and buy someone elses house,already had that happen once there moving this weekend.
i'm going to have to read up on his and see what i can do.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I actually am a step ahead of you .
My wife is to be honest.
She approached all the renters and told them the deal the goverment has right now and if they had been good they could buy it . Several checked their credit and they all failed.
Bad news is none of my renters can buy. Good news is they arent going any where till I tell um they gotta go.
We have some exellent renters and we have some bad ones. Some mediocre .
We talked about a plan with the A-1 renters if they let us show the house and list it and it sells ;
Ill give them a thousand dollars . Ill move them. Ill do my best to help find them somthing else if I dont have it or move them into one of my others.
Years ago my lanlord listed the house I had rented. People came when I was in bed with my girl friend and watching football in my shorts . I moved out quickly.
Agents have told me to fergit the idea selling a rental house with renters in it and Ive been there and bought the Tshirt. Thats my very best plan Ive come up with at this point .
Right now Ive got 20 grand worth of storm damage I didnt want and some one ran into a rental with a truck. That set my plan back some . I was working on my cabin to sell when this house I have now came up empty so rush to put out the fire with water , Im working on the rental. Ive gotta get the tools together . Bring my backhoe home mainly but I gotta put in a french drain at the cabin and lay rock. Both need listed and the cabin likes a smitchen of work. Damn.
Wife says this money goes to the later part of November on the gov deal so Im pushin. Im gettin too old to push.
Edited 7/17/2009 11:53 pm by Mooney
I'm working on a red brick 1960 ranch house.We had 12 new vinyl windows installed yesterday at a cost of $3,600This price was for the windows and the contractors labor to install them.The house looks so much better now that we have gotten rid of the 50 year old metal single pane windows..We did as we have done before, and that is we left the metal "jamb" or window sill I guess you would say.We have been critized for this in the past (for leaving the metal jamb)
and we have been told we should have done the job right and replaced the metal with wood or vinyl or something and improve the energy efficiency by getting rid of the old uninsulated metal jamb.What's your thoughts on this?Would you go the extra expense?
Edited 7/18/2009 12:18 am by mrfixitusa
The government's First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit expires December 1, 2009.
If you expect to use the program in conjunction with a home purchase, therefore, you may want to consider yourself officially "on the clock".
Assuming a 60-day window between contract and closing, there are now 77 days left to find a home or a buyer for your home and go under contract for it.
The First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit refunds up to $8,000 at Tax Time for qualified home buyers. A few of the program's qualification criteria include:
Home buyer must not have owned a primary residence in the past 36 months
The home may not be purchased from a family member
The household adjusted gross income must be below $95,000 for single tax filers and $170,000 for joint tax filers
The tax credit itself is limited to $8,000 or 10% of the purchase price, whichever is less.
Remember, though: The refund is a true tax credit -- not a deduction. This means that a taxpayer owing $8,000 to the IRS and claiming the $8,000 First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit would owe the IRS nothing on April 15, 2010.
The complete list of qualifying criteria is posted on the IRS website.
Edited 7/18/2009 12:51 pm ET by CosmicCow
Thanks . My wife was close .
She also said she heard or read that they are trying to extend it . Shes not here to ask.
Im thinking Obama will have another somthin next year but thats thinking .
Thats why Im pushing . As long as that stays in effect its easy to sell starter homes .
Theres three things doing here right now .
The Tornado damage
The tax thing we are talking about
And the energy deal like windows , caulking . heat and air unit at least 12 seer I believe. I dont have that information either but I keep hearing about it on the news.
Other than that construction wise there isnt any thing going on that has any volume .
"And the energy deal like windows , caulking . heat and air unit at least 12 seer I believe. I dont have that information either but I keep hearing about it on the news."The lowest AC that can be sold now is 13 SEER.The tax credits that you hear advertisted is only available to the HO and it has to be their principle residence. So that leaves you out.And the equipment has to be fairly high end.For AC it has to be 16 SEER and 13 EER.And windows need to meet some specs which went up the July 1. And except for HVAC the credits are only the materials and not installation.http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?c=tax_credits.tx_indexAnd there is one for builders;http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?c=tax_credits.tx_hm_buildersI think that is only for new buildings, but check it out.There might be something here http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?c=tax_credits.tx_comm_buildingshttp://www.dsireusa.org/incentives/index.cfm?state=us&re=1EE=1And this list state programs.http://www.dsireusa.org/incentives/index.cfm?re=1&ee=1spv=0&st=0srp=1&state=AR.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
The deal is working for people doing those services . I dont want them.
You do ads talking about that stuff and sell it .
Im into selling the goverment houses .
thanks for the websites related to energy tax creditsmy younger brother spent a lot of money insulating his house and getting his a/c and furnace worked onI think he spent around $800 on insulation (blow in insulation in the attic and some walls) and another $700 to $800 having repairs done to his a/c (just getting it repaired and trying to get it to run better)The a/c tech has been there three times so far this summerHe's wondering if he's eligible for any tax breaks.I'll look through the info Thanks again
Sounds like an excellent program you've put together.BUT If you can't sell it to your tenant and you do put it on the market, I think we're moving these houses because of THE NEW KITCHENSYou get top dollar and you sell the house quickly.Also, Don't forget what happened to me when I sold my house.It took me a year to get rid of itI thought I had such as wonderful home and looking back it was just avg.No wonder it didn't sell.
120965.177 in reply to 120965.175
You said :
Also, Don't forget what happened to me when I sold my house.
It took me a year to get rid of it
I thought I had such as wonderful home and looking back it was just avg.
No wonder it didn't sell."
You just gave me a shot in the arm . Thanks .
When youre paying for every thing and the job draws it self out , you start questioning your self . Always the devil telling you to half #### it and get out of there .
I said one time [and I havent changed] that Id rather spend an extra two weeks and the house sell quickly than not do my best [considering the job] because if the son beech dont sell Ill blame my self . I dont want to go there. So far its always paid off and I recieve lots of compliments .
One thing I hear a lot at the closing table from the buyers; Its the nicest house we looked at in our price range . Thats the key as far as IM concerned . You dont have to beat custom homes that cost three times or more . I call it The Best In Class Award. If I can do that I always get paid off.
How long did you sell real estate?
Tim I was a licensed realtor from 2002 until a couple of months agoI sold my house in Feb and that was my last thing I did as a realtor.Right now I am on "inactive" status with the Kansas Real Estate Commission.I would like to get licensed in Colorado. I need to figure out what the process it.I started flipping houses in 1995.I'm just "small time" but my brother is what you would call a big time investor.I needed a second job and so I got started.I didn't know anything about real estate but I had worked in construction and so I did the remodeling and my brother was the guy with the money and he handled the buying and selling.I had to get more involved in finding the houses and so I began going to the office and sitting in the lobby going through the notebooks with the listings.This was before computers.Computers really changed things.Now the agent runs a search and emails it You sit at home and look at listings on your computer.I have been involved in about one flip per year since 1995. Until recently, I was trying to do all the work myself. This doesn't work very well. One guy can't remodel a house. It's too slow.Now we have a three crews of two guys on each crew who are skilled carpenters. We also have three laborers.My worst experience was a house I remodeled and when we were done all we did was break even.In other words we made enough money to pay for the materials. There was no profit.I did ok and made about $15 K when I sold my house in Feb. That was nice. I was the listing agent and so $2 to $3 K came from my commission. On one house we did I made enough money to pay cash for a car. About $12,000Along the way we bought one house and just resold it. Didn't do any work to it and I made an easy $4 to $5 K.Some of the houses only sold for $40 to %50 K. It's hard to make the numbers work.We sold a house in March or April for $300,000Most of what we are doing now are houses selling for $175 to $225I'll close by saying it helps you just have to get in there and roll up your sleeves and give it a shot.You'll get kicked in the teeth. Don't let it bother you. Don't get mad or upset. After I sold my house a couple of months ago the buyer demanded that I pay her $500 for some repairs or she would sue me.I wrote back and told her I would give her $200 providing she signed a contract amendment stating she was buying the house "as is" and that she wouldn't bother me any further.She huffed and puffed and finally signed the document and I wrote the check.It's how it goes. I try to stay calm and even have some fun if I can.Sometimes it's not easy.
I think more of you now that you arent an agent . <G>
Rez says he feels the same way about me now Im not a building inspector. .
You can hold your head up now . <G>
I think all the agents here are starving right now . They wont admit it .
In truth real estate knowledge and law is very essential to this business whether it be rentals or flipping . Actually getting properties for rentals is the same as looking for flips . Until a person gets familar with that , he hasnt learned the business.
I got the books they use here and studied them plus other stuff but nothing is as good as experiennce .
I fought with a lot of women realtors.Partly my own fault.I remember last summer I helped someone buy a house.The other realtor was a woman and we clashed.Me and the Buyer looked at a vacant house that no one was living at but yet there were still some things there like the dining room table, kitchen appliances, and some things in the basement and garage.My client wanted to buy the house and asked if she could request some of the personal items be included and I said "sure"I approached the other realtor and she reluctantly agreed to discuss this with the seller.By the end of the negotiations both sides were angry and upset.Apparently it really bothered the seller who was a single woman.anyway, The seller reluctantly agreed to include some furniture and the appliances and the new lawn mower that was in the garageThe other realtor worked for a large company of probabaly 100 realtors and went to her weekly meeting and she stood up in front of the group telling them my name and that I was a "hick" or "hillbilly" for asking that things such as a lawnmower be included in the sale of the home.(before I forget the personal items were in writing but not a part of the contract)To this day the other realtor probably dislikes me.I guess I just had a lot of these types of experiences that would sour anyone.Maybe I'm not really cut out for the glamorous job as a real estate agent.
Edited 7/18/2009 3:06 pm by mrfixitusa
Tim
Here in Oregon you can use that 8k tax credit as a downpayment. I *think* that is a State rule. IIRC it was not initially. Then the legislature passed a bill to monetize it.
Might check in AR. Made a big difference in sales here
Had to forgive Tim 'cause I knew deep down he was still a good ol' boy.
Figured everyone is entitled to make one mistake as long as they don't let it happen again.
Just keep an eye on him
We don't have much experience with inspectors, permits, and this process.We had an inspection last week and we passed and that meant we can "close up the walls".Here where I'm at the next step then is to install drywall, greenboard, backerboard, or some other type of material.We installed our backer board on the walls last week and over the weekend ---- BUT we can't go any further until the inspector comes back and counts the number of screws we used to install the backerboard (in the bathrooms)We have called and asked him to come back and do his inspection.Hopefully he will do it today.But it has really slowed us down and caused a lot of headaches
But it has really slowed us down and caused a lot of headaches
Whaaa? Gee, how could that happen?
Count the screws? Really.
Can't you take a digital pic and show him or email it?
wow we got a slap on the hand at our inspection todaywe are remodeling a basement bathroom and had gutted it completelyover the past few days we installed greenboard in the bathroom (walls and ceiling) and WE WERE TOLD TO GET IT OFF THE CEILINGWe said "ok" and took it off and replaced it with regular 1/2 drywallThe inspector said greenboard is allowed on a ceiling only if the structure spacing is 12"Our structure is on 16" centersLive and learn.
Please don't say any more.
Every time I read stuff like that I start getting mad at Tim again.
Edited 7/20/2009 8:55 pm ET by rez
Its a small bath right? Couldn't you have just slipped a 2x4 inbetween each joist and therefore created 8" oc spacing? I think the fix would be about five studs and five minutes of time.
Or, I would have laminated the ceiling with 1/2" (screws) and removed it after he left.
Did he elaborate on the why the greenboard wouldn't pass but the 1/2" standard would?
The inspector indicated the green board would sag, while the 1/2 regular drywall would not.The reason?Because, according to the inspector, the green board has different properties and is made from different materialsThe greenboard is produced using different materials, glues, adhesives, etc.
yep,no green board on the ceiling. i would guess that the new mold resitant stuff would be ok,but not sure.
that inspector isn't going to let anything cruise by.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
what would you think about contacting a realtor and just talkingYou could call a realtor who has a listing close to one of your properties and tell them you are thinking about selling your house.You can tell them right up front you are going to try it on your own first and then list it only if you have toThe realtor would say "that's fine" and you would ask them "hows the market and what's happening with your listing over on "valley view" or whatever street is close to yours.The realtor would then tell you what's going on in the market. Maybe she would say something like(1) I've had the listing for 30 days and we're getting 2-3 showings per week.(2) We haven't had any offers yet.(3) I've got the house listed for $100,000(4) There are 1-2 new listings everyweek and there are 1-2 houses going under contract so things are happening and there are buyers out there.(5) The feedback I'm getting from the realtors who are showing the house is .............................You get the picture.The realtor would be more than happy to talk to you.Would they really tell you anything you don't already know?I don't know but they might be able to tell you the details about the houses that have sold this summer and what they're selling forIf you've got some in riverside you could call Art Busch with PlazaHe lists a lot of houses in Riverside doesn't he?
One of these days we need to sit on a stump for a while or make a very long thread.
Ive been tryin to figgure you out for some time to be honest. <G>
I know youve had your property for a long time . I dont know how you got it .
I dont know how skilled you are but as long as youve been doing it youve learned what you do thats for sure. I didnt know any way but say it . Fact is I dont hear you talk a lot about construction. That could make a big difference on these prices your trying to figgure out . But I dont mind at all being helpful , but you gotta take stuff into account . All of it .
Ive been doing several trades for 45 years . I was raised by a builder . He was pretty big around here and put me with every one he had. I worked with him on weekends as well . I ran crews for him later and was his super later on after I quit and came back. He had a lumber yard as well and we both worked that and installed flooring because he had a flooring center. Then all the sub work I did and my own contracting I did building . I licensed with the state .
When I started out buying houses it was only because I could buy a repo 5 years old cheaper than I could build one . I wanted to build . Numbers werent there. Im a numbers guy .
I thought I was ready to do all this buying , selling, and landlording with all my experience. . These days a kid doesnt have the chance at getting the all around training I got . I found out I was only on a beginners course for I didnt know real estate , law , rental business which is a broad term which theres a lot .
I made my buys using my abilities mostly what I bought needed a lot of work . I knew that I couldnt do a full remodel on a dump and get paid . I did the numbers over and over . The better the place or newer I knew it would turn around better when the time came . I bought mostly under 10 years old . I bought 7 in a row that were 5 years old . I think thats why my numbers look good and the fact I did a bunch of work and like you said dropped 10 grand on some .
I said the above because I know the business inside out now . Ive studied hard and have learned probably more since I started it than I knew. I know enough it needs changed by me.
I bought at the court house sq. and that was cheap. I bid on burn outs and they are very chaep. Thats mainly how I did it . I said that above becuase IM trying not to show off but I do every thing well and Im tooled to do it . I used to be fast but IM not any more. On doing every thing well , I do rentals and repos well. I dont do the quality work I see on here nor do I get a chance . You know what I mean by that . I can get a house turned around quick. I know whats not enough and I know when Im over doing it for the market . Kinda like the painting I was talking about . Its not the best painting but its the best trail to money and thats all I care about .
Ive had some of these houses for 18 years. A bunch of them Ive had a lot less than that . Ive sold them like a farmer sells old cows . Once a house reaches 15 years it gets a different appraisel. I dont want houses 20 years old but Ive got some . After 20 years old they dont do very well on the market. 10 year old houses and under I can make look new . Thats when they need to be sold . Buy them at 5 years old and sell at 8 to 10. That gets it under capitol gains taxes and demands a high sell which is right now very quick. Reason why, they arent building new ones right now . So my 10 year old houses are hot items with first time buyers. They are paying new prices for them right now. Another reason why my numbers look good .
Ive learned the money is not in renting and its too time consuming . What it does though is get property over bad times as you know . This is actually a pretty good time to sell because theres no new competion being built. Here a couple cant buy a new house today because there isnt one standing . They dont know enough at 22 years old to have one built . Evidently.
If I could sell every house I would do it tonight . I would buy properties just like I mentioned and flip them and the heck with the taxes . I could sell a house per month if I had them ready. My rentals are keeping me from getting enough ready. I dont have enough time and I curse my self for getting that many. Im baby sitting renters and missing out on much better money.
Tim
pull up a chair ,i'll see if you can figure me out. i'll give you a quick background on how i got here. started out automotive mechanic and bodyman,by the time i'm 20 i'm working for myself,moving more into bodywork and painting.
as you probably know all bodymen buy a wreck and fix em and sell em. well when i wasn't busy with customer cars this is what i did. i'd get a couple done ,sell and would be 5k ahead,kind of a savings plan. seed money for real estate
well in 77 i get the bug to buy a rental, i have a 69 shelby thats my pride and joy and sell it to buy my first rental,still have it today,car is worth more than the house but the house is pumping 600 a month!. i find that the loan process is painful being as i'm self employed. so i start looking for va houses. back then if a vet had a house to sell if you paid him for his equity,you paid the va ,get this, 35.00 assumption fee and they didn't care who you were or how much you made. so this fit me perfect and i started buying equity with 8% mortgages. didn't make alot of money per month ,maybe a 100 a month,but i thought i was going to get rich! the prediction back in 80 was a 40k was going to be worth a 100 in 10 years. well that didn't really pan out did it?
so i'm cruising along with a few rentals and the mid 80's hit and commercial is worth nothing,remember the rtc? i pick up a couple commercials that i liked for around 40k each. by now i have a car lot and some days it does good some days it sucks,but what i did find was if i was driving down the street and a flat az steal popped up i'd would have a contract wrote and signed within 30 minutes and go back and wholesale some cars to pay for it. man those were the fun days.i didn't have a clue at the time how far those commercial properties would take me,but life would be completely different if i hadn't bought them,even though there were times that we were big time broke getting them up and running.
you've never heard me talked about working for others in the building field ,cause i don't. most everything i buy needs a rehab,i do every thing my self from clean sewers to building the cabinets for them. i probably spend less than a 1k a year in outside services.i prefer estate houses if possible.it's funny and i know it applies to alot of trades ,but my mechanical and bodywork skills spill over into the housing very easily. so i have never worked with anyone to pick up those skills,just try and learn them on my own and breaktime has added alot to that education. [ if you want to know how to make a heat pump a straight air i can tell you now. i did one this week ,screwed it up, hired a real guy to do fix it,next one i'll know how.lol]hard to remeber what it was like before the internet
i'm a landlord ,i can't find my place in flippin,just doesn't seem to be enough money around here for me. i see guys buying 80k houses and when the dust clears they make 10k. if i went out when i was in the car business and bought 8 10k cars,i'd make around 20k with a lot less risk,and much faster turnover than i am able to do on a house. i have flipped a couple because i bought them and didn't like them so i bailed. probably never made a penny at that.i have sold quite a few,but i always do a 1031,it is the greatest tool to get ahead in re that there is,period. let the taxman make the down payments.
we both feel the same way in the end,if someone walked up here tonight and said i'll buy em ,i would be one happy camper. i'm 54 and my plan was to be a landlord till my mid 60's,but i'm not going to make it,i'm getting pretty tired of all the problems that come with it,if anybody thinks they are going to buy a rental and set back and collect big money,they are the one that needs to pull up and sit down on the stump for awhile. i sometimes just cringe when some one says they are going to get into rentals,sometimes they ask for my advice,i always say["you want me to talk you into it or out of it?] they have been good to me ,i haven't had a boss since i was 20 years old,haven't missed many meals, but i'm finding as i get older that stuff that used to take 3 hours can now take all day if i'm lucky .i have had a couple incidents with these rentals that have rattled me pretty good,didn't really plan on that kind of stuff when i started.
now i have to find a exit strategy to get out,easier said than done.
so thats chapter 1,do you think i could get a book deal.lol
if your over in pea ridge sun-weds next week we'll be at the lake 20miles away. get ahold of me i just cut the stump down,but theres some big rocks.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 7/16/2009 11:13 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Edited 7/16/2009 11:15 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Edited 7/16/2009 11:32 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Email your cell phone number to me and Ill send mine to you .
I might just take you up on it . Id like to see you . I said might remember that.
Well first off KUDOS to you . Im very proud of you and have a respect for people that learn these trades on their own with out help. My wife has the same kind of respect for people who come over here and dont speak English. Namely what we do is several trades , not a couple , plus you know more in automotive. At least three more . You have studied harder than me . Mine was force fed . I didnt have a choice but I liked it . Im the only son that did and I was dads last . He was getting nervous by then,. He wanted to fully train a son . First two didnt get it done . Thats only because they didnt like it . Neither did . But they did it for the money not the love . Theres so much too it after spending so much time here that I say Im still practiceing . So much knowledge here tells me Ill never learn it all and most here wont get the opportunity to learn what we have had to learn . Now my Son is not gonna make it either . Hes hasnt taken it seriously and I doubt he ever will. Good worker but his heads not in it . I cant teach that.
From what you said and said before I dont think you were buying at the bottom line .. Ive never thought you did but Ive been surprized at how low you said they were worth. Both of those together is not good but you held on as I did . So since you asked before , the way I bought is probably the biggest difference . I dont know how else but say it the way I think it is . Ive heard you talk about estates and Ive been stumped because I havent bought a single one and Ive tried. From your post you were buying first from the convience of taking over a goverment loan.
My wife and I made a lot more money than we needed . We could put money back fast . Right after we married we lived on one salary and saved the other one . That bought houses fast at first . Then I learned how to buy. Ive never bought house from a realator that wasnt a repo. I always made low ball offers and walked away. I bought them when they came back to me . That meant no one else was interrested and I knew it . My offers were about 12 to 1 somtimes 10 to 1. I didnt need to buy very many a year because I was working full time as a sub . Finally I found out my money was in the buy and me having the ability to fix one quickly.
I dont figgure Ive ever made any serious money off rent . Sure they paid the note and held it . Theres money in that . But over all it hasnt been very much of a living just off rent for the trouble it is . After I quit subing I made it flipping but not rentals . Its always there of course but its not enough. Im much more advanced now than Ive ever been I just dont want to anymore. I feel like Ive really got it down. Now the want to is gone . I know better than to keep them when thats gone . Ive got to have the thrill of buying and selling . Ive always loved the dealing . I dont enjoy kicking renters out and cleaning up other peoples messes that cost me . Im tired of fixing things that should not be broken. Im sick and tired of renters lies and then the way they leave me after I treated them decent .I thought I made some of them friends and I guess I did only it runs out at move out time . Its not enough money for that.
You guys are starting to amuse me.
Both of you sound like you are both too stubborn to look around and see if someone else is doing something and making money and having an easier way with it.
The little lady that schooled me about lease options found a way to make a lot of money, without ever cleaning a sewer line. She never puts any of her money into any house and always makes a profit. She never answers the phone from a tenant to unplug a toilet and is happy when the "tenant" decides to quit paying. Yes, she does have to evict them....and happily finds another buyer who hands her another non refundable option payment.
But...I understand....this doesn't make sense and it doesn't work.
Oh, by the way, did I mention that she really didn't like "buying" junkers of any kind. She much preferred to buy house that were in fixed up, move in condition. Did I forget to mention that she never put any of her money into the buys?
Oh, I forgot....that kind of stuff never works, LOL.
Today was the last day that I could have picked up the lease option on that little 2-1 that I stumbled upon. The guy had just fixed it up as nice as he could to get it ready for the realtor. He even hired us to put a nice new roof on it. When I was collecting the check, he proudly showed me all the detailing he was doing inside the house. I had already had a nice conversation about his situation before he ever knew that I might be a contender for his house so I knew exactly the type of offer that would work for him. The lease option is by far the best situation for him and I could easily show it.
Keep in mind, he hasn't been a landlord ever and he certainly doesn't have thirty years of doing this, so when I explain things to him and show him how the lease option will put an extra five big ones in his pocket in two years, I'm sure he'd be very interested.
But, since I was too busy today (we booked six roofs) and expect to be much busier in the future (tomorrow might be the same as today), I never stopped for one second to think about him, his house or how I could help him out.
But....lease options don't work...
Not for us on this end .
Because our whole retirement is sunck into these houses.
We are getting too old to be slicked .
Sure options work like I told ya . Rent it and pay me in a year .
You want to put up 5 grand then fine Ill take it . But youll be paying rent the whole way. Becuase Ive got rent now and Im in control. You wanna buy it in two weeks cash then that beats what Ive got now . But thats the only way.
I dont have a clue why someone would take a lease option and loose control when a house is ready to "show" .
I can sell a house thats ready for a gov loan in 30 days and deposit the money in the bank . How is a lease option gonna beat that ? I believe in my mind that capitol gains will be erased by the end of the year and Im trying to get as many done as possible . I dont want them any more but I want cash in the bank and move on.
Tim
"I dont have a clue why someone would take a lease option and loose control when a house is ready to "show" . "
You don't have a clue because you've never tried to look at it from their point of view. You only ever think about it from your shoes. They aren't wearing your shoes.
"
I can sell a house thats ready for a gov loan in 30 days and deposit the money in the bank . How is a lease option gonna beat that ? I believe in my mind that capitol gains will be erased by the end of the year and Im trying to get as many done as possible . I dont want them any more but I want cash in the bank and move on. "
Are you sure you want to be in a cash position when the inflation skyrockets out of control and your million dollars will buy you only one house?
"you don't have a clue because you've never tried to look at it from their point of view. You only ever think about it from your shoes. They aren't wearing your shoes."
And they arent wearing mine.
Have you ever owned a murder suicide house ?
Have you ever owned a house where the public knows people died in the house ?
Have you ever owned a meth lab?
Have you ever owned a house that was busted for narcotics?
They put crime tape around the house and leave it for months .
In each of these instances pictures can be ran in the papers and the neighborhood knows . Coffee shops talk. You must tell the buyer of any activity the house has had like it . You also must tell every renter. What are you going to do with a house like that ? I know . Not because Ive owned one yet. I know because Ive seen them sell 25 to 35 cents on the dollar on the auction block. Ive never been able to figgure out what to do with one other than live in it for life my self and I havent been in that circumstance yet. I buy for profit so those I leave alone .
A realator told me a month ago that they had a house where the man had been dead for two weeks . It was 90 degrees inside and 100 degrees out side . They declined the listing . I thought that was overboard. But it happened. She told me from experience there wasnt a hand full of realators that would show it especially since the family wanted a decent price.
Ive rented a house and been exposed to 10 grand fixing it back up several times. Its like Larry sad, what are you going to do? You wont get payment from a judgement . Ive had three houses totaling 5 grand a piece in a year damage that I had to cover . Yes thats a bad year and not the norm. Thats why when that happens to people that cant fix it they are out of business. With the economy right now people are struggling to pay their rent . Its an step upped police affair for me to get these people to payor evict them. Evictions are costly for me . Normally around 2500 bucks time and materials . I do it quickly because I dont want the figgure to expand to 3500 or 5000. I can evict in 5 days after being due.
I dont know if you know but since 911 insurance has changed. They sent me riders telling me they would not cover terrorism . Im still not sure exactly what that covers because its not been tried in court to my knowledge. I know insurance didnt pay in Katrina because they didnt have flood insurance . The water above flood stage was driven by water. They covered wind damage but not damage caused by water. Tricky. Things may be different than they appear in the mirror. Insurance doesnt secure from risk.
You havent walked in our shoes.
"you don't have a clue because you've never tried to look at it from their point of view. You only ever think about it from your shoes. They aren't wearing your shoes."
And they arent wearing mine.
Exactly!
You and Larry are seasoned war veterans of the landlording wars. You've fought and scratched for every dollar and you are very keen on protecting them...forever.
Maybe you might consider selling off your stock, at your price and terms of course, then think about getting involved in the lease option business as the meat in the sandwhich. You'd probably be good at it if you could ever let go of the idea that you had to pay bottom dollar for a property to make anthing on it.
We had windows put in a couple of days ago and the old ones (12-13) went into the roll offThe next morning one of the guys pulled up to the curb at 8 or 8 30 AM and there was a homeless guy crawling around in the dumpster breaking the glass and throwing the metal over the sideHe said "is it ok if I recycle these materials?"My buddy said "what"The scrapper said "is it ok if I recycle this stuff"My buddy said "sure"I scratched my head and said "how did the scrapper know we had those windows in the trash"?I'm guessing these guys patrol the area and when they see a house with new windows they "go to work"I'm okay with it but there was a lot of broken glass in the roll offThere was quite a bit of broken glass that spilled over the side onto the drive way (guess what he didn't clean up after himself)I guess they have to be on their toes to get to the metal before the other guy doesKind of sad really. Seeing a homeless guy crawling around in broken glass and rusty nails digging for a piece of copper pipe
The last remodel I did, I set all the windows out by the curb with a sign that said "free". They didn't last half a day.
This may be a depression instead of a recession before its over with.
The thinking there is a bird in the hand.
i think we have officially hijack this thread.
a point i will make is there is a real estate investor,same as this thread implies.
and there is real estate management as a business
when i started i was a investor. i had income from my trade as a bodyman,as long as i had work,i would eat. same as you and roofing. now i had a few rentals and they were investments,made a little money every month and the hope was they would appreciate and i would sell.
well somewhere around 8-10-12 houses all of a sudden i had no time to be at the shop,i was involved with my "investments". i was starving being a landlord.
what happened was i would find a little lull in the investments and buy another and fix it.
this was and is no longer investment property, it's a business,it puts food on the table,and if tomorrow it would all go away,i would be hungry,my kid wouldn't be at college,my business would be broke.
now i have done a lease to purchase before. when? back when they were investments,the buyer ended up walking from her 2000 option money and i thought it was great.it was a return on my investment.
today i can not let something go wrong,i have to be in full control of my bussiness.i can not let someone else determine my outcome. no more than walmart is going to let me come in and run one of there stores,it's there business and they know how they want it done.now thats not to say things don't go wrong,i'm one of those lucky guys that has had a murder in a house,thats what happens sometimes in business,things you can't control take place.
i try to stress to people wanting to do rentals,to decide if they want that to be their business or a investment. because the differences are night and day.and the time factor plays into it.
what works for 1 guy on a rent to option doesn't necessarily fit the next guy.i have thought going on in my head on these and i'll throw it out there,but lunchtimes over, it's time to get back to bussiness [that means i got to go paint on a house,lol] the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I couldnt have said it better . Amen.
Working for your self theres not too much retirement . That is unless you make your own. The wife and I were making too much money and we were getting hit hard on taxes. When I say too much I mean whats the point in giving the goverment 1/2 of two good incomes? One of us working full time for the goverment ? Thats the worst goverment job you can have . We /I had the plan to get 5 houses. I can provide my part of the retirement on that I think? 15 houses is a business. Theres so much difference between 5 and 15 its like a different life. So I called 5 houses a retirement and 15 a business. I thought one day Id sell down to 5 and hopefully the other would pay it out and they will do more than that . But I didnt know when the end of the road would be or at what fork.
As you say its a poor business . Im set up to do a lot of repos and I cant so they are really costing me from making the money I want to. I remember how easy it was to have 5 rentals and my house and have time to work 40 to 50 hrs in my business. I never forgot that.
Im thankful I didn it because I would not have saved that kind of money any other way.
Tim
just marking this thread for future reference - pardon the interruption
pull up a chair,by the time tim and i get done with ya,you won't ever want to be a landlord......................
is that why your marking this,thinking of getting into rentals?the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Larry, my brother buys the houses at auctionHe won't buy one unless he can make at least $20He has made $50 profit on some housesWe put a house on the market today1000 sq foot brick ranch built in 1960Two car detached garageFinished basementHe's looked at the comps and if it sells at this price it will be at the top endThe price is $190The house turned out really goodI'll post some picturesYou asked about Denver vs Wichita and all I know is these are foreclosure homes and he buys them at the auction at the courthouseHE IS NOT PUTTING BANDIT SIGNS ON STREET CORNERS SAYING "WE BUY HOUSES"HE IS NOT FINDING THESE HOUSES BY RUNNING AN AD IN THE PAPERHE IS NOT FINDING THESE HOUSES BY RUNNING ALL OVER TOWN AND MAKING LOW OFFERSHE IS NOT WALKING DOOR TO DOOR TALKING TO PEOPLE HE'S NOT WASTING TIME DOING IT THE WAY THE TELL YOU TO ON LATE NITE TVI don't understand the details but since I've been here he had a bank call him and offer a house to him and he bought it I do know he's not afraid to buy a house with severe structural damage or moldHe is more open to dealing with mold more so than structural
how does he get past the redemtion period.
if i buy on the courthouse steps,the owner has a certain time frame to redeem. of course they don't. they just stay in the house and tear it up.
some guys will go to them and offer them some money to forfiet the redemtion,some bite some don't.
i have done a little of this and it never seemed to work out.
if it's a good property and the loan balance is below the market price,their will be 20 plus people there ready to buy. usally i felt that the price was to high for the risk involved. one of the risks is you have never been in the house,so who knows what your going to find.
tax sales is another high risk arena.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Hes not talking about tax sales and there is no redemption period with a forclosure sold on the court house steps .
There are even several types of them.
My very best sales are US marshal sales . They are cash or certified check with in about an hour of the sale . USDA sales are the same way.
Used to I had 30 days to pay but they changed it . I could get an appraisel and get a bank loan in 30 days. That was the best way for me . Then they went to cash sales . A bank wont loan on them becuase they havent been to a closing and number one theres no permant deed. I get a special deed thats good after the work to it has been done . Bank regulations normally wont let them do it . So I got a line of credit .
When I buy a house on the steps , its mine all mine . Matter of fact as soon as I am the successfull bidder I call my insurance agent . They arent under any insurance when they are bought . Ive always been scared about sombody torching one after I buy it . US marshal told me as soon as the gavel falls Im the man . Then I said Im actually the owner when the gavel falls and he said yes you are.
The previous owner has no redemption unless he or she was there bidding .
Ill make another post.
Tim
"if it's a good property and the loan balance is below the market price,their will be 20 plus people there ready to buy. usally i felt that the price was to high for the risk involved. one of the risks is you have never been in the house,so who knows what your going to find."
I want to address this ;
There would be 20 people there if it was a tax sale or we had 30 days . If there was 30 days Tom , Dick and Harry, can buy the house with a bank loan. Investors and first time homeowners would be competing together . That actually works if the house needs 10 grand of work to it . Mooney then becomes the closing bidder or second . If its a show dog I never get to say a word .. I just watch the show of ALL them bidding .
Cash sales are different . They separate amateurs and professionals most of the time . You gotta have balls to pay cash for a house you havent saw run the mechanicals and you had to break into it just to look cause there aint no one handing out keys. Ya gotta be a big boy and bid cause if ya dont bid you cant win. Thats the only kind of sales I go to anymore. Most importantly they are ABSOLUTE sales. You go to an estate sale they dont have to sell it . These houses are sold if they bring the minimum bid.
Theres no risk buying one of those houses if you dont give too much. Like fixit said you should be 30 ahead if its questionable . Pretty nice house , 20 is lots of money.
My rule of thumb is ; If they took care of the house then every thing should work. If its ragged out then roll the wheel gentleman were gambling . Its not a gamble if yer 30 above on profit .
We put the house on the market yesterdayMoved all our trash, tools, etc into the garage and the house is nice and cleanThis afternoon I was in the garage packing and getting ready to move to the next victim - I mean the next jobAnyway I heard a voice say "are you the owner"It was a young lady in her 20's I said - no, but I can show you the house if you likeShe said yes please I want to take a lookWe walked through the house and she told me she had rec'd the listing on our house from her realtorShe said she and her husband had specifically told their realtor that they only want to look at flip houses.She and her husband want a house that has been remodeledThey don't want to look at any houses that have not been remodeledThat was a new one on me.
Well there are no new ones are there?
That would be the reason here. Fpip house is as close as youre gonna get to new around here . At least right now .
We sold the house today to the woman who looked at it yesterdayFull priceContract came in at about 9 AMClose next monthThey qualify for First Time HomeBuyers Tax Credit of $8 KWe moved into our next project todayIt's a real doozy
I listed one Sunday. Im still on punch list with it . Gottta go pay the carpet store today and the layer tonight . Im going back to finish the cabin so I can list it before hunting seasons start Sept 1rst. Then back to attack another rental that just came empty. That will probably be all Ill get to this year other than the normal activites I have every day. Im still loaded with insurance work to do.
Edited 8/11/2009 12:15 pm by Mooney
you guys are making me feel lazy,fixing and selling and on to the next,
while you guys have been doing all this ,i've spent the last 6 weeks working on a 2story painting and replacing wood,i'm half done.
. maybe i need to watch a little sunday am infomercial on getting rich in real estate and see if i can get smarter.because i'm like fixit,i'm tired and sore.and pizd at my renters.............................the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I bought one of these back braces today at HD for only $13I think it helpshttp://www.backbraces.com/details.cfm?id=14I put myself on light duty yesterdayNo more heavy lifting
makes me feel better, i stayed at home yesterday and ate advil all day for my lower back . i never knew i'd be this stiff and sore in my mid 50's. i can't wait till 60'sthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Where ya been?Must be working on your boat
just got back from dropping dd off at college,let the money flow start now.
it's year 3 so i'm half way thru.
they keep raising tution i'm going to have to raise some rents..............
i hope she gets a job that will support her and her parents.called return on investmentthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I tell ya one thing , Im not happy about this much work. I dont like it at all. Ive been working every day I can and weekends dont mean anything. But Ive been taking off when I feel its wise as well. Rainy days normally help make the decsion. I hate working in rain even if Im working inside. You know darn well youre gonna get wet . Cant open a tool box . That truck that DanT sold to Buck is a pretty good alternative with the boxes on the side of the box truck opening UP.
Edited 8/11/2009 9:49 pm by Mooney
Edited 8/11/2009 9:50 pm by Mooney
I always thought the rain days were my vacation days too. I never could get used to working on rain days when I was doing commercial tenant work.
We have three houses under contractThe boss ran the numbers and the NICEST house is the one that will make the LEAST profitKind of dishearteningWe spent more time and money and put our hearts into the one house that turned out really nice, while the other two looked more like rentalsWe're going to have to sit down and figure out which way to go and just what we really want to accomplish
Maybe yall should try some of those low budget single wides.
Ive got a question to you and everyone .
How do I get some kind of a report of how the housing economy is in NW Arkansas?
Im hearing conflicting information. Im trying to settle it lazily with out beating on doors.
Same question put another way. How do big time flippers know what towns to hit ? How do they get the information and what is it ?
A realtor (or appraiser) has it at their finger tips.They have the ability to track what's going on locally by using their computer and the multi list sold properties.For example, lets say you are interested in homes priced $90 to $100 KThe realtor can tell you how many of these sold each month of this year.Then they can compare that to last year.I'm guessing sales are down.Do you agree?It's good information to have.Another thing to look at is how many of homes were LISTED so far this year.Again, they can pull up the exact number for each month and compare it to last year.Finally, it's nice to know the ratio of listings compared to salesFor example, if there are 7 homes going on the market each and every week and only 1 sale it tells you the inventory is growingAnd Sales are not keeping upThese are things you really want to know if you are selling a house.It helps you understand your competitionYou need to know if there is only 1 buyer for every 7 homes on the market.You could even go so far to say that the statistics prove that a certain number of homes are NEVER going to sell. THERE JUST AREN'T ENOUGH BUYERSThis can scare the bejezus out of you if your house is for sale and you start thinking about these things at night when you're trying to sleep.
lol-can't sleep tonight and read your post...I've been following the thread with interest.Some solid info in there...I live in a micro economy(northwestrn ontario) where house prices are increasing steadily. It's close to a seller's market-the realtor's often drive up the final selling price with offers from folks coming here from high priced cities or back from making big bucks in the oil patch.I'm thinking there must be opportunities for flips.silver
My theory is that most people don't take care of their houses and so when it comes time to sell it no one wants it.It won't sellThat's when a guy like you comes in and takes it off their hands (for the right price)Good luck!
My theory is that most people don't take care of their houses and so when it comes time to sell it no one wants it.It won't sellThat's an interesting theory...I'm just starting to explore but I do have some good resources at hand. A very good buddy of mine just bought a fire damaged house for 16,000, put 30,000 into it and just sold it for 85,000. One of his good buddies is a realtor who partners with him to help him find and reno the houses.I don't want to work that hard...and I don't want rentals so I'm reading and researching and figuring out what will work...I know you make your money when you buy...Like a lot of things in my life, I always thought it was too hard...just needed more knowledge really.silver
A cousin's husband, realtor from S.Cal, moved to Ohio and eventually decided to re-enter the field and took the courses necessary for licensing and whatever.
Told me many RE stories he had known from over the years. Funny thing is he got thru the needed Ohio requirements and decided he didn't want to do it anymore. Sh!d canned the whole thing.
He said realestate sales is one of the ugliest, fraudulent, cut-throat, crooked, and a bunch of other superlatives, business that there is.
After hearing some tales I would have to agree.
God Bless the honest realtor.
They argue and fight all the time .
I guess that's true...my buddy that bought the burnt house for 12,000
had a fight with 2 realtors over commission of 700. bucks...one of them was his usual partner on renos but this time Ron worked by himself on the reno...surprises me but the 2 realtors I had in woodworking class were both 1st class dicks that dropped out because of difference of opinion...
Hey
MrFix is right, a Realtor with the MLS has that info handy, either through research or through MLS/Board publications. Access to that info is EXACTLY why I got my license. I am a numbers guy and am constantly running them... solds, listeds, expireds, withdrawns, FSBO's, foreclosures, last 90, 180, 360 days, etc.
I had an agent before I got my license that would give me reports with filtered info but I wanted the raw data which is part of the reason why I got my license.
You may be able to get the local Board to give you their Statical publications, either through walking into the office or on their website.
Here are the stats for Springfield, MO (close to you) for example
http://stats.gsbor.com/reports-viewer/2009
This info is not always publicly available and not all Boards of Realtors have a decent website
What board covers your area?
-Day
hey
I knew that guys but its good information for the thread.
Now how do I get a total stranger in another town to give up all that ?
Do I lie ? Tell them the truth? Why would they give up an hour of their time to me ?
The agents I use would do it in a hurry because I spend money in the market and I sell through them.
If you need info about a specific area you do it through a local realtorThe local MLS info is protected information AND THEY WANT TO KEEP IT THAT WAYThey go to great lengths to keep the info protected and available ONLY TO MEMBERSMaybe they would let you join their MLS?Another way to do this is find the right realtor and then go for a rideIf they're on top of things they can drive you up and down the streets and tell you what's going on.Show you the houses and tell you what they are selling for and how quicklyShow you the desireable areas.Show you the parts of town that are mostly rentalsShow you the parts of town to stay away fromShow you the new homes and what they're selling forTell you who is flipping houses and maybe show you some of their work and what they bought the house for, what it sold for, etc
"If you need info about a specific area you do it through a local realtor"
I do know for a fact that our MLS is limited to a few small towns. They cant get across the river on their MLS.
Im pretty certain they couldnt do Rogers Arkansas for example . Im not sure what that corner of the state uses.
So if they couldnt use it , how would they find out ?
One time I was sitting in the chamber of commerce talking to the director . She had a bunch of stats I knew came off the MLS. She had called me in and asked me to build cabins to rent . Once I built them she didnt care she said . They would always be cabins so it didnt matter to her who owned and operated them. I could build them to sell as a business or rent them. In either case she had a program she could rent them for me through the Arkansas Natural site . She was well prepared . She had all kinds of numbers on sheets I knew came from the mls. Somehow she had more information about what cabins were available in the area and how close the competiton of other towns . Also what they offered. More and more fire power she had to drive home her point . Very well prepared .
I seriously thought about it but I felt like a guinnea pig and didnt do it . It was quite an out lay of cash and I was not sure of an instant return. I talked to my banker and she said it sounded risky. She suggested one cabin at a time instead of my 5 cabin plan to kick it off.
My thoughts were to ask the chamber of commerce because they want people investing in their economy.
Tim
Tim my brother has 1 million line of creditHe can buy a house tomorrow and pay cashNo financingHe's been doing this for 20 something yearsSeveral years ago he "heard about some oppportunities" in south texasResort type of communityMight have been padre island? areaHe bought several houses, lost money, and then got out as fast as he got inI don't know any detailsNo one talks about what happened when they took a hit
He bought several houses, lost money, and then got out as fast as he got in
To me that proves how localized RE investing is. You've got to have some historical knowlege of your own or get it from someone who has it.
Thats the reason I was asking about another area.
I always adivise knowing the area your working in but if I do this venture that isnt possible .
Its hard to get an agent up there to answer questions to and thats right off the press. <G> I got the feeling they know what they know and their keeping it that way.
Lot of difference talking to a stranger agent and a local one .
Edited 8/16/2009 4:05 pm by Mooney
Edited 8/16/2009 4:06 pm by Mooney
some may be willing to open up with a steak and some good whiskey.....
Yup, hard to do over the phone.
I said I was bein lazy.
Edited 8/16/2009 7:33 pm by Mooney
Sitting at a computer and looking at local real estate activity is just as addictive as this siteYou need a realtor who will email you info about what is going on in your city on a daily basis:1. each house that goes on the market2. the listing that expired3. the listing that went under contract4. the house that sold that dayYou would look at each of these and you would recognize the houses.You would say "oh I remember when that house was for sale 5 years ago""oh I remember when that house was a rental""oh I remember when these people bought that house - I remember what they paid for it - hmmmm - let's see what they're asking for it"You would see things that your eyes will pop out of their sockets:(1) you will see someone buy a house at a really good deal(2) you will see what they list it for after they've fixed it up and they're putting it on the market(3) you will see homes that are way over priced(4) you will see homes that sell in one day(5) you will see some bargains occasionally(6) you will see how each home was financed and who paid cash for their home(7) you will get a feel for how long homes are sitting on the market(8) you will see that "old timer" successful realtors are the ones who price the homes lower (this same guy has a television ad that says "I sell your home for top dollar"(9) you will see homes go under contract and then a week later "they're back on the market!" (in other words the inspection killed the deal)(10) you will see which realtors are listing a lot of the homes(11) you will see a realtor list a home, sell it the first day on the market, and you'll see that the listing realtor is also the selling realtor (you'll scratch your head and say wow)(12) you'll see homes that have been on the market for 3-4 years.(13) you'll see homes listed for sale and you'll see that they're in a flood zone and you'll scratch your head and say "I don't understand how that house is in a flood zone" Computers have really changed real estateMakes it easy to check things out and see what's going on locallyPlus you need to be able to look at your competitionLook at the pictures of the other homes for sale.Their kitchens and bathrooms etc
We'll be in Wichita labor day weekendMaybe we could meet at McDonalds and my brother could tell you how things work out hereI thought he owned the house the day of the auction, but I could be wrong.Out here the auction is every wednesday and he goes every weekWhatever the winning bid, THE BUYER HAS TO PAY FOR THE HOUSE RIGHT THENYou have to take a cashier's check with you.ALSO, He could tell you a few stories about being a land lordYesterday we walked through the house we had just finished and when he saw the indoor clothesline in the laundry room he told us about the old korean woman who rented from him She caught fish and ate themOnce he was in her house and she had many dead fish hanging from a clothesline in the houseJust a different custom from what we're used to
Edited 8/9/2009 6:58 am by mrfixitusa
You asked about Denver vs Wichita and here's one of my experiences that soured me on real estateMy phone rang last fall and I was asked to show some houses in College Hillcollege hill area is east of hillside to oliver and kellogg north to centralThe Buyer was someone who is experienced and has owned a few homes.Like many people, she wanted to live in College Hill.Kind of the same way people want to live in Riverside - where you own some houses.Anyway, she drove the area every weekend just for something to do (like many people do)And she saw a house come up for sale.She knows my younger brother. And she watched him buy a really nice old house about a year ago for $235Anyway, she asked me to show her the house and I did.Old two story house with some charm. These are big homes.She asked "how much is it" and I said $330She said "would you do a market analysis and tell me what you think" and I said yes.The next day I did the market analysis and my heart sunk. I felt the house was worth about $250.I called her and told her.THIS IS WHERE THE REAL ESTATE INDUSTRY BECOMES DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTANDI think my buyer thought I was incompetent and didn't know what I was talking about.How could the house be so overpriced?I think my buyer probably wondered "what kind of idiot realtor would list the house so excessively high"It left a bad taste in her mouth.The sad thing is that this happens a lot in Wichita.This is just my opinion.This makes it tough in Wichita. By the way the house in College Hill sat there for quite a while and they did drop the price and finally sell it for $260I watched it and I remember the day they dropped the price from $330 to $300 and I called my buyer and told herI think it makes it difficult to try to make a living flipping houses in Wichita (although there are people doing it today)I stayed there for six years and I should have left sooner but my mom is 80 years old and I stayed there and helped her quite a bitAlso, Did you know when I left wichita someone had flipped the house next door to me?This guy had been able to buy the house before it ever went on the marketHe had a relationship with a realtor who lists bank owned homes.Makes me sickThe point of my story is Denver is a lot bigger and my brother is making it work here I don't think he could make it work in WichitaYou've got your work cut out for youOne last thing. There are realtors with 40 years of experience with the wichita marketYou could call one of them tomorrow and tell them you want to flip houses and THEY WILL NOT BE ABLE TO HOOK YOU UPWhy?Maybe you can figure it out and tell me
Here is the kitchenWe used bull nose ? tile for the edge of the counter top this time instead of clear pine
The house had the messed up floor Here's the floor all finished
this house had the funky bar in the basement and we ended up keeping it and just tiling over the old formica
New main bathroom
New 3/4 bath in basement
Just trying to learn from your experience. Good info being shared here.
I wish you would quit talking so much. It gets annoying .
Edited 8/16/2009 4:08 am by Mooney
what are you doing at 3 am,you got to get up and work in 3 hours.
are you thinking about doing something up around rogers?the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I came in after laying rock. Had suppper , didnt take a shower , fell to sleep in the basement watching a ball game . Figgured Id shower when I rested a bit . Went to sleep at 6 pm and woke up at 2am. Showered and came in here to aggravate you .. Been thinkin you were out of pocket or missing in action somewhere.
Yes , Rogers , Fayetteville ,Bentonville , what ever you wanna call NW Arkansas.
Wife is moving up there with out me . I cant come with all this going on. Im selling out anyway unless somthing changes with taxes like I said before.
Anyway Im wanting to flip full time and this is too small a place . As long as the goverment is handing out 8 grand per first time home buyer. I told ya I was gonna find out what the goverment is giving away and get some of it . Agent told me Friday night that that taz rebate isnt really that . They send the buyers a check up to 8 grand , so according to her the house I just listed will be rent/ payment free for two years and they get a 100 percent loan. They can move in with out a dime from their pocket . Possible anyway if I pay termite of 425.
Meanwhile Im getting full taxed for my rentals while homeowners are getting a tax break. I figgure I sell them to families and then they get a tax break for the same house . Im figgurin on getting on the right side of the laws . <G> I was tellin it like it is up above. I just paid about 1800 for flooring in a 1100 sq ft house . They want 64.00 per sq for roofing here . 3 years ago I could buy a truck load for 20. Im figgurin Obama needs those houses for a while till he gets fed up with it . Figgurin on sellin him all I can get moved till then.
Were gonna tax the rich and spread the wealth. And do a little two step.
Edited 8/16/2009 9:25 pm by Mooney
first ,disclaimer, i'm around rogers some and don't have a clue what is going on in re except what a few people tell me,that said.....
that area has had a steady growth for 30 years and between 00 and 07 was booming big time, i don't think there was much you could of bought in 00 and sold in 05 and not knocked em dead.it looks like the area will continue to grow unless wally would pull out.
what i have heard is there are a tons of repos on the market. had a guy tell me that i would guess is pretty smart going by where he's at in life,that one of the things that has fueled this is there is alot of hispanics in the area working low pay jobs. they bought houses that they were only able to afford because everyone in the family worked and they would have extended families live with them also. now alot of them have lost their jobs and theres the problem.
now sounds like the houses are there ,are the buyers? i have no clue.
just a little of my experence, i have a little cabin out on the lake, would like to sell and maybe build new. i'm overpriced for the times. . so i've thrown a ad on cl in the area for the last year once in awhile. now not everyone looking for property is searching cl. in the last 2 months i have got more nibbles than the last 10 months. so i don't know if thats a sign or what. also out on the lake there has been quite a few repo's ,seem like good buys to buy and hold for awhile,flipping i doubt it.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/16/2009 10:09 pm by alwaysoverbudget
your in the cheap for roofing. around here 30 yrs run 90 a sq laying on the ground.
i know exactly where your at i had 11 houses hailed off 2 years ago. me being the smartest person on earth decided to wait a year. i got robbed at 50 a sq 14 months ago,then the roofing co nailed me another 100 for tear off and replace.i was crying and screaming since the insurance company was low at 125 for everything.
i only got 6 done ,because thats all the money they had paid,thought i'll catch the others this spring. now 90 a sq and 135 to put em on. they may never get roofs.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Could you explain your insurance claim dilema a bit more?
glady,any chance i get to rag on state farm ,i'll take it.
heres a example, bought a duplex,1998,they came out said hey need to be insured for 120k. ok
policy is 1000k deduct except it's with s f and they carry a 1% deductable on wind and hail. so deduct is 1200 with replacement cost
so state farm then changes to actual cash value,guessing sometime around 2002. i understood that was only going to apply from there on out. not retro active. so i moaned and groaned and stayed with them. my mistake.
so it hails,first thing the adjuster says to me is, your valued at 170k,deductable is 1700. what!!! my fault i didn't notice the rise in value and to be truthful if it blew down in a tornado ,170 might not rebuild it.
so he walks the roof,1 layer tear off, new 30 yr shingles = 6800.
oh,by the way the roof looks 15 years old [who knows] and we only pay acv so the payout is 3400, less your 1700 deductable,heres your check for 1700.,thanks for using state farm. checked with my agent,yea your policy says replacement,but you know those little pcs of paper about the size of a dollar bill that we send out,they stated acv. now i could handle one of these,but 11 was pretty hard to choke.
seems to me there was about 70k in total damage and they paid out around 40 ,so i was a little short. in hindsight i wish i would of went and bought about 300 sq of shingles and then hired the labor as i came up with the money. hindsight 20/20
state farm is a good company for your car and home,but it's lousy for rentals.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/16/2009 10:37 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Edited 8/16/2009 11:19 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Since this is a RE investor thread, this subject is certainly important to the equation.
So, am I to understand that all of your depreciation was "non-recoverable"? I'm assuming that because you've stated that they only pay the ACV. It's been our experience that they pay the ACV but then later pay the difference between the RCV and the ACV. They only pay after the work is contracted/completed though.
The other part of this discussion is the ramnifications of not putting the new roof on. Are you aware that if you have another claim and you haven't put the new roof on, that they will use that as an excuse to not honor the new claim? For instance, if a windstorm blows your roof off and you sustain water damage on the interior, and you haven't replaced the roof, they will deny your claim on the basis that you violated the terms of the insurance contract. Additionally, if you have a mortgage, the terms of the mortgage are violated.
This certainly is important information for anyone that is contemplating real estate landlording.
no,on the acv the deductable is not recoverable.
i understand that there is no insurance on the roofs for anything,today if it hails 3" hail and busts through the sheeting,it's all my baby. risk &reward..........
as far as mortgage companies,the only way they would find out is if it repo's and it has a hailed on roof. there main concern is ,are you paying the mortgage? if the house has good equity they aren't going to worry about it.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
The advantage he has is a slot machine slanted in his favor. Until at least the unexpected rise in shingles. Youre both right . But as long as hes good to replace the roof whose gonna beech? No one will get a chance . He has the money hes been paid so lets not forget that . Lets say just for kicks that hes been paid on 10 roofs and didnt replace even one . If hes getting a return on his money and still had it then he can afford a hit . Theres no laws against waiting till the labor prices come down. People been doing it for years. Wait till the rapists leave town and things go back to normal guys that take care of the work locally. So lets say he has the money drawing 10 percent on investments which someone in our profession can do easily. Lets say the money fixed a flip and the flip moves in 90 days . Nothing was ever lost . Nothing was ever a gamble really . Except in this case and its still not a lost gamble because he can cover the expense. Even if he sold one house in the fleet to cover the difference . He is insured by himself but not in trouble with the mortgage. House odds prevail and this time the house lost and will cover it with other gains .
edit ; that was for blue
Tim
Edited 8/17/2009 9:39 am by Mooney
I understand that the deductible is non-recoverable. I'm asking about the depreciation. Is that recoverable?
I've looked at about 75 insurance settlements recently and only found one out of the 75 that had all non-recoverable depreciation. If I understand you correctly, you had claims and were paid the ACV in a check. The difference between RCV and ACV is the depreciation. That normally is recoverable upon submission of an invoice proving that the work has been done (and the full RCV spent). From that, they reduce the check by the deductible.
So, I'm trying to understand what made your claim non-recoverable (if in fact it was non-recoverable). Is the fact that this is a rental a factor or was it some choice that you elected when you bought your coverage?
The other point about them not covering another insurable event doesn't necessarily have to be 3" hail. If a windstorm strips most of the roof and you take on water, they would use the fact that you didn't properly maintain your roof to deny your claim. If some kid climbs on your roof and stomps his heel in the valley and causes water damage inside, they could use the fact that you didn't replace your roof to deny your claim. If I were you, I'd change insurance companies if I hadn't replaced those roofs.
The mortgage companies do take an active interest in these hailstorm roofs. Yours probably flew under the radar because it was under their dollar threshold for having the check issued jointly to you and them. I agree, they aren't going to know unless you call and tell them, which is highly unlikely unless you take a bad dose of LSD or something.
i said that wrong, the depriciation was non recoverable.
acv is all they pay ,period.
now your in a different area so things might be different. but i'm in ks where it's hailing or tornados all the time from april till oct. so state farm quit writing replacement cost on rental property, non available no matter how much you want to pay.
why? because the dang landlords were using replacement cost to maintain there roofs. if i have a house insured with replacement cost here in ks, i will never spend more than the deductible over a 30 yr period,cause i would tend to guess every roof here gets hailed off every 12-15 yrs and sometimes every year.
insurance is a business and they just want to make more money,this is one way to do it.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
A guy I work with got a new roof on his house last weekHail or wind totaled out the roof and the insurance told him he needed a new roofThe ins co gave him $6,500Here's where he did things differentRoofers want to bid "whatever the ins company is giving you"He did it differentlyHe called a roofer and told them he didn't have any insurance and he would just pay him out of his pocketThe roofer bid the job at $5,500He says he put $1,000 in his pocket
they will take all you will give them.
roofers,mechanics,plumbers,bodymen[i'm in that one]salesman ..................
no need for them to leave money on the table.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Youre right theres not replacement . Full anyway.
I have two insurance jobs this spring I havent done yet and yes I will.
I normally meet the adjusters on the job and kick the h^ll out of the tires. I ask for every thing I can think about and some dreamed up if its there handy.
Its really funny in a way how they figgure . Im gonna tell a litle bit .
Adjuster found out I only paid 600 bucks to get a 60 ft pine tree off my house . I know for a fact that influenced what he gave for the one across the fence. He gave 150 dollars. I couldnt get the guy out a second time for that . Price was 400 dollars. So I dealt a little bit . Called the adjuster back and said he wants 400. You are a body man , you know the drill. Have the tree guy come out and just get it off the fence and cut it up and leave it for 200 cause he knew originally thats all I was gonna get . I threw in some more work not covered to get him 400 dollars. I called the city and had them pick up the tree I would have been charged for in the bid. I told them I had surgery and couldnt touch it . That was the truth as well. City cleaned it up no charge.
Im laughing at the way they figgured the bid . They gave me 6.24 to remove a facier board. Right below that was to fix a small spot on my ceiling . He replaced the spot with drywall and figgured 624.00 to fix it which involved paint the ceiling after repairing the ceiling and texture to match. Now this little type of job put my daughter through college . I can do the patch and shoot in an hour and blend it .
Shake roof fully replaced . It only needs repairing . You dont replace a shake roof 10 years old but thats what he figgured . You repair it and shoot it with special stain to blend it . Ive been doing that job for years as well.
So those jobs fell into my expertise from years having a painting and drywall business. Im not a tree guy and didnt touch any of it but the other experience paid for it .
I could tell those stories all night long with out running out of material.
I'm trying to get a read on your stories. Are you complaining that they pay too much or too little.
For what it's worth: the adjuster, and their insurance company papers, specifically state that their numbers are just "estimates". The actual price is determined by real live contractors like us. We set the price for the repair, not the adjusters. If the numbers are too low and you can't get the work done, it's a simple matter to ask for a readjustment. You just make the request, send in the contractor's estimate and any other documentation that might support the request.
If the adjuster missed some things, a supplement can be requested.
I've met a few adjusters out there on the roofs. Everyone that I've met has been professional and helpful to the homeowner. They have found damage that the homeowners didn't even know they had. We had problems with exactly one of them. We requested, and received, a readjustment. We got the roof bought on the readjustment. We had that same adjuster on a roof witin a week. She was the same miserable person as before but she bought the roof anyways, even though she was talking like she wouldn't. It woudln't have mattered...that roof was a slam dunk and it would have been bought on the readjustment.
Adjusters don't want a series of readjustment requests, by either the homeowner, contractor, or home office. Like any professional, they try to do their best.
Doesnt work that way with me . Theres never a bid on my jobs . Since I do my own work I have to have an appraisor value it . No contractor ever sets foot on my property. I had to explain that to state farm this summer. One of their insured ran into one of my houses. They asked me to get estimnates . I said IM not getting estimates . You send an adjuster that has the capabilty to figure a job and draft a check on the spot . She liked to have the contractors estimates . She made one final run at getting it done . I said look lady Im a contractor that owns 15 rent houses . I flip houses and do that work as well. Every contactor in town knows Im gonna do my own work and they are friends of mine . Im not gonna ask them to bid my job. If you want them then you send them out here . She send an adjuster that could write checks . They have a schedule on computer they price from these days . THere estimate says stuff like demo per sq ft. . I meet with the adjuster on my job . [required by me ] If you own the house you have say about anyone on the property except goverment employees. My estimate is drawn from a computer using their data .
IM not griping . Im saying I get the work done with the money they give me . Yes Ive made money. I can make money off nearly any extensive insurance bid .
I make sure they miss nothing .
Tim
Edited 8/18/2009 7:53 am by Mooney
Tim, I understand how/why/what you are doing. I understand how/what/why the insurance company does what they do. I understand about the software that they use and I understand that they can figure a job and cut a check in the driveway. We are dealing with this databas (computer figures) every day.
The thing I'm trying to say, and you can ignore this information, is that the insurance company will pay MORE than the database. The reason is simple: the database is an AVERAGE of the local contractors and suppliers. If a homeowner solicited three bids from the three top contractors in the area, the insurer will normally pay off the estimate without fighting about it, as long as it is within reason. It costs them money to send readjusters out there and they often will simply settle the claim as a routine part of their job.
The other thing I will say is that it pays dividends to treat the adjusters cordially and recognize them as professionals. They have the power to dig deep and add things that even YOU wouldn't think about. The database is extensive and there are tidbits scattered everywhere. The "generous" adjusters routinely include all the tidbits. The "el-cheapos" routinely leave those tidbits off. It makes a big difference if the adjusters is an inhouse adjuster or a hired gun, a subcontractor. The subcontractors tend to be looser with their numbers and they find things that the "homers" refuse to honor. The "travelers" have to be careful though: they don't want a reputation for flagrantly building a job beyond it's real value.
In the end, the highest claims really are enough for a quality company to do a good job. No one is going to "rip off the insurance company". They do this everyday and they have a vested interest to keep the claims low but they also don't want to peeve off their customers.
I understand why your buddies won't bid your work but I don't understand why they wouldn't give you an honest written estimate, knowing that they don't stand a chance of winning the work. I know I would give you an estimate, based on you telling me what you need to do the work. I'd mark up your numbers by my standard markup and write that contract in the barbershop as I got my haircut. There is nothing illegal about that because that is what I do everyday, all day. And, if suddenly something happened to you, and your estate asked me to honor that contract, I'd send the boys out tomorrow!
I appreciate that information. Im sure its helpful fo the thread .
The problem is me . I wont ask for help.
For someone reading this thread that doesnt do their work or know the contractors so well like I do then it would be doable . Yes they would if they asked just like I would but I dont want to owe them .
Still very helpful information to the thread as I was trying to be helpful as well.
As an owner that does his own work its plenty of money. I got a tear out on the plumbing when the truck hit my house . He priced the plumber at 75 per hour. Im not gonna use any thing close to that and Im not replacing the plumbing . Im repairing it . Some of the estimates are outta hand to begin with. Im sure a contractor doesnt look at it that way . They would want all the money and me pay the deductable and bill some addtional work. Again it depends on which side of the football your on when its snapped. Offense or defense ?
Yes, the numbers reflect the rates that skilled, qualified contractors charge. $75 sounds reasonable to me. I think they allot $65 for a roofer! They also allocate a lot less for roofing laborers though. I think they are around $28 for laborers but it's been more than a month since I saw that figure, or cared to let it register in my brain, on some of the paperwork.
Us contractors know that we can never compete with free labor. So, when we run into homeowners or investors like you, that do all their own work, we know we won't get the job. I won't even try. I probably was dumb enough to work up estimates in my infantile days thought LOL. Nowadays, I don't get mad or feel used when someone asks for an estimate but doesn't intend on using us. I simply feel like it was my fault for not properly qualifying the lead.
I had an insurance adjuster tell me she could not pay me for several items because "the computer doesn't allow that".........or "that's not in the computer".........after she got through with the FIVE estimate revisions she had to do she had also paid me about 5 times what I had originally thought the job would take. It was simple stuff for the most part that she was just trying to cheat me out of at first because it was my own house and I was going to do the repairs and she thought she could get away with it. Simple stuff like not wanting to allow sales tax, O&P, reasonable emergency repair allowance to remove a limb that punched through the roof and to temp. patch the roof.
She said she had been an adjuster for 20+ years. My question was how many other people did she cheat over those 20 years that didn't know it?
I wound up putting a few grand in my pocket on that one and I never even went back and reclaimed the withheld depreciation.
Um...I'm not sure that your choice of words is appropriate. Heres why I say that. Its not cheating, when they send you your claim report and somewhere in that report it says (I'm paraphrasing) "this is an estimate. It is not the final number. Only your contractor can tell you what the real number is. If you discover that you need more money to do your repairs, send in the contractors proposal before you tear everything out and fix it."
Basically, they are admitting that their claims adjusters are not going to be able to be 100% correct, 100% of the time because they are working off averages (computer averages).
Of course, they do have their legal limits and the ajuster was probably just telling you the limits that she had to abide by. If she attempts to slip in something that isn't correct, the home office will kick it back to her and make her redo it. So, if they aren't allowed to give overhead and profit, or taxes....they aren't allowed!
Every insurance company structures their claims differently. Some build the O and P into their unit pricing. Some keep it separate. Some allow it on each trade. Some allow it on certain trades and not on others. For instance, I called one to determine what their criteria was for applying for a supplemental to get overhead and profit. The didn't allow it because we didn't have a situation that created "co-ordination complexity". They would have allowed it if I had any inside work. All the work was outside.
So, because each company creates their own rules, which theoretically satisfies their contract to you, I challenge the statement...but I get your drift.
Wanted to share somthing and give the thread a boost.
I told you I was spraying the whole interior with house paint .
I dropped my metal job folding chair against the wall the other day and it has brown paint and rust on it . Made a big mark on the wall leaving paint and rust . Always enjoyable to whizz dw off too. I got some warm ater and some dish washing liquid and I had to scrub pretty good . The paint held and the marks came off .
I really think IM on to somthing here. Flat hides a multitude of drywall sins but to be able to wash it like enamel is a real plus . About 10 bucks a gallon.
We were also talking about paint versus paint and prices. I havent used very much paint in my life time that truly covered one coat and then it was suficently the same color underneath and in good shape or primed. As long as youre two coating I always felt like what difference did it make .
Tim
Thanks TimWe're getting ready to paint the inside of a home that's pretty dirty Lots of cooking smoke Several rooms with unusual dark colorsCeiling has popcorn texture which has been painted semi glossI'll submit some pictures of the mess we have on our handsI know we're paying too much for this paintI just spent nearly $200 yesterday for 2 five gallon bucketsI want to cut that amount in half like you're saying
Well, paint is not a huge cost for flipping only. I need to make that point . If thats all your doing youre probably dropping 5 grand per year on the table . I go through a lot more than that so thats why its a big deal to me.
I paint after every renter trying to get them to stay in place and also pay top rents to make it . I didnt figgure my time before as I am now so the only cost was paint sorta. I still repair any thing I see but thats beside the point . I probably spent 200 to 250 dollars on painting the whole house on this flip I just listed.
I thought the virtual tour would be done and you could view it but its not ready. I need to get on their butt. <G>
Here it is ;
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Edited 8/20/2009 11:41 pm by Mooney
WOWLove the yardWould love to see pictures of the inside toohope you sell it for full price
Its one of the nicest lots I have in my opinion. Thats what my normal rental looks like and about all I bought to keep for rentals . Gives you some idea of what I was thinking and telling you about . Its 3 blocks from UofO and in a quiet culdesac addtion of only 5 homes. I own another one next door to it .
Ill check into the virtual tour tomorrow.
Tim
I've not yet gotten to the pictures but will do so later toniteThanks
Found out today we can only install one handle bath tub faucetsTwo handle faucets do not have anti scald valveTwo handle faucets will not meet codeSo we're going with one handle delta for $79 from HDThis is what I was told today by a master plumber
INspector is right but hes really reaching .
heres what i don't get,if your replacing a faucet,who knows?????
now on new construction,a anti scald thats it.
if you get into one that needs a faucet and it's 2 handle with tile,i would rebuild every part in it before i replaced.
there a reason people don't pull permits.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Actually the single handle aren't anti scald. Nothing to control the output temp. But there are pressure balanced so if that if you have a big drop in cold water pressure that the flow of hot water is reduced accordingly.But in reality they aren't needed in modern plumbing systems. Only in old system with clogged up galvanized lines where a flush of the toilet can drop the cold water pressure to near zero.They do have a mechanical stop that limits how far to you move the handle to the hot side, but it is adjustable.Now there are true anti scald shower head and maybe tub spouts that have a thermostatic valve that shut off the water if it is too hot. But those are individual addons.And there are pressure balanced systems for 2 handle faucets, you don't want to PAY for them..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Look under photo gallery , Im a dummy. Not a very good tour . Small house I guess doesnt help the tour.
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Price:
$85,000
MLS#:
109192
Address:
Clarksville , AR 72830
Property Type:
Residential
Bedrooms:
3
Bathrooms:
1.5
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Edited 8/21/2009 12:11 am by Mooney
Edited 8/21/2009 12:13 am by Mooney
You left the lid up!
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Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Now Im gonna have to go over there , lol.
I figured out how to see the pics and the house looks greatThe kitchen and bath look really good The outside of the home, the brick, the yard, the flowers, and the curb appeal are top of the line!Your house is better than most or all of the other homes you are competing with. I'm guessing.I'm guessing it will sell quickly.Most homes for sale just aren't this nice.If you are getting several showings a week you'll have it under contract in no time.Some people may look and then decide to spend more for something bigger.That's okI hope your realtor is getting "feedback" from the realtors showing the house and is passing it along to you
I agree. Tim's house is nice. I'd buy it. The price looks great even though the yard is a bit big. I'd need a goat to keep it mowed.
Thanks Jim
Well Thanks .
They are top of the line rentals . Im not sure if they will lead the market in sales . Most of my rentals are similar. Different yards , hoods, floor plans , but they all share a small floor plan, within 15 yrs old, and are nice. I didnt buy bigger houses because they wont bring any more money in rent . That house might bring 700 right now in its current condition but it might not . Thats how bad it is . It was bringing 550 for the last 6 years and they finally moved out . It would probably bring 650 tops in a reasonable amount of time . In rentals they cant compete with me except in size if someone wants to rent a house for the note payment but they normally arent nice and they arent making any money to put money in them. So the rental house market is normally pretty shabby pickings.
Agents have a tour of homes on Tuesdays and they saw this one . I got good reports from them. It was just listed so we will see. They should be first time home buyer houses I believe.
Edited 9/15/2009 8:04 pm by Mooney
Oh yea , thats thee only broker in town that offers the virtual tour .
I figgure everyone in Witchita does it huh? We havent had it but a year now .
Im hoping it helps in the future.
looking at that house,i would say your in a cheaper market than here. i'd say that house would hit around 105-110 here and rent for 750. house looks good, the yard sucks for a rental,but should be a great selling point,everyone wants a big yard till they get one. i'd guess this one will be in the bank before to long.
other misc.
the paint your talking about being so happy with,walmart...........but which one. i have used the kilz brand but it seemed to get high enough that i have went over to baher. my wife does the painting and likes to do some colors so what ever she likes to spread.always used sw but it has gotten so high we have went elsewhere.
picking up on your post on the fleas,talk about spraying the inside of a house .i had a friend live at a place that a fly would come in and in 10' it would drop. no bugs but they decided it might not be good for them. i wonder if they had chlordane the inside.......
you talk about having long term 6 yr tenants. at one time i thought that was winning the game on this deal.longer they stayed the better. but i'm beginning to think about 2.5 yrs is ideal. gives you a chance to catch some maintance items, raise the rents ,and start again. i have had several long term tenants{over 5 yrs] go south in the last year they were there. and a couple that was really bad. some of it's my fault,they have been good for 7 years ,i stop paying attention. they have a change of lifestlye,whether it's jobs,marriage,drugs alcohol,even health and they trash the place.it's hard to stay on top of them.i have 3 now in the 10 yr range,secretly i wish they would move. i could clean up and get more rent and if i don't get to them for another 5 yrs they will need everything to go again.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Walmart I call their " in house " paint . Its merly called Color Place . I dont use the kilz regular paint . Its too high and they dont have enough of it anyway.
My walmarts around here stock color place in 5s , 1s and 1/4s.
Since you had to ask Im assuming you dont have that big a selection er somthin or you would know about it . I live close to the headquarters,we have a Walmart DC, miles away. Our stores have a big selection. I never thought about others not having it .
I buy kilz by the case in oil at walmart . It runs about 10 bucks per gallon. Lumber yard gets 15 for it . I use lots of it on burnouts and heavy smoked ceilings , grease , oil, and crayon. I use it on woodstove ceilings and water stains and such. I also now use it as a primer for one day jobs on priming doors and raw wood. Its drys in 1 to 2 hours and you can top coat . Its as handy as a hammer on repos and rentals. Its very quick in and out paint .
I use undercoat enamel to spray a ceiling if Ive got time becuase it doesnt require a top coat . You need to notebook this tip and use it . Spray the ceiling one way and let it tack up. Thats normally an hour or two. Thencome back and spray it the other way such speaking as north and south. The ceiling will be covered but will take all night to cure and remove any masking . The final result will be a flat coating unlike kilz that has patches of flat and sheen that has to be top coated with latex. Its a beech to spray because it doesnt atomize. in the air . Its gets every thing sticky so every theng needs covered.
My next job I have to repair texture /popcorn and paint . The walls are 30 yr old paneling . I cant get enough money from the house to remove and drywall. Ive already met with the agent and broker. I can only spend about 5 grand on it and they said in the price range it is the painted panneling would work. 65 to 70 grand .
With that said ; The problem in this house is popcorn releasing from the ceiling at the light fixtures. Once its repaired oil paint will glue it up there . Ill spray the whole house inside with Kilz ceiling and walls . It will be 2 coats . Ill caulk and fill all trim and paneling and paint ceiling and walls 2 coats of latex off white Color Place . When I get done it wil look similar to the house in the pics. All interior doors will get the same at the same time along with hinges. They will be removed and get a mini roller coat of eggshell enamel off white .
Two houses ago I did the same thing and it brought top price on a 30 year old house . I put very nice light fans in it and upgraded sinks, tops , hardware , some expensive carpet everyone noticed.
Thats the quickest way I know to redo a house but I dont spend money on paint . I dress it up with new hardware and flooring . Cost money there but it doesnt take long . Doesnt take any more time to put new locks on a house when you had to take the old ones off anyway. Hinges are 1.50 a pair on average 12 doors so thats not a biggy either if you want to drop the old ones after spraying the whole house and use them as door hangers. You can enamel over them too and then remove them when you unhang for carpet.
My paint jobs take one to two days inside for the whole house . The paint job on the house posted was 2 days not including Three new metal entry doors. I always up grade the exterior doors and put some fancy in them when I sell. Hang a nice handle lock on them and makes them look like the home is a little richer . I didnt put handle locks on the last one but I should have done it . I had a side entry door to the garage that had dents. I used bondo and that red creme . Turned out nice with latex paint over it . I put new light fixtures in as well. Added three very nice light fans at a bill a piece which got lots of "ah those are NICE" . All faucets are new except the tub and I put new handles on them and chrome polish the rest . Wife spend a day and ahundred dollar bill on the plants and flowers out in the front. I pressure cleaned the exterior including the driveway, garage floor , and walks . Wife ordered new parts on the net,the dishwasher a new face and the top of the stove an uplift where they LOOK new. All the ceiling grills come out side for a pressure wash and sanding along with the treturn air grill . They go right back in to get the two coats of kilz.
I use a 1 gallon per minute sprayer that runs about 3 grand and its worth every penny. Fixit mentioned that. Its very fast . It paints a two foot section of wall 8 ft long every second. Ive timed it .
I keep hot mud on the trailer all the time to quick patch drywall and a few pieces of scrap drywall along with different tapes and patch kits. I can blow up a hole on a door with expanding foam and hot mud over it .[Hollow core]. Thats normally a rental door not sale.
I thought I would share some more of what I do.
Can you explain why you don't raise the rent on an annual basis?
it sounds like the thing to do. but if i have a house that rents for 700. how much can i raise the rent each year? 10.-20- no more than 25.00
nothing upsets people more than their rent going up,i don't care if it's 5.00 they don't like it.
so lets say i have a tenant that has paid their rent pretty well, mowed the yard,not inherited new pets,no dead cars in the driveway etc.
i have to ask myself,if i raise their rent 20.00/240.00 a year,what do i have to gain? 240.00 thats it.
what do i have to lose? they get upset,move. first thing i will usually lose close to a month by the time someone is paying rent again. this is because i need to spend a week do cleanup and maintenance,find new tenants,they have to give notice etc. so i'm out 700. plus repairs,plus advertising,plus and this is a big one,are the next people going to be as good.big question.
now the first thing as a landlord is learning not to be afraid of vacancies,they part of the bussiness.but i'm not looking to create them for 240.00 a year.you have to learn to pick your fights,as crazy as it seems i evicted one couple over a broken light switch! they started yelling at me how this was such a inconvenience for them. i looked at them ,smiled and said i can fix that. your moving in 30 days, good luck to you.[the funny part to this is,it was a 3 way switch,i had done told em to move before i got to work on the switch. turns out one of the switches was in the halfway position,flipped it off and everything worked. i got in the car laughing my butt off.]
i have places where the rent has not been raised for 7-8 years,thats their reward for staying and taking care of the place. but when they move it's going up a 100. that is one of the problems of my policy,i get to far behind.
i'm in this to make money,but money is not my pirority in life. my time is.i'm going to run out of time before i run out of money.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Good answer. Very good explanation of what I think is good perspective.
Okay, I kinda figured that was going to be your explanation.
But...then when I went back and read this: "i have 3 now in the 10 yr range,secretly i wish they would move. i could clean up and get more rent and if i don't get to them for another 5 yrs they will need everything to go again" I get confused.
If you have some that you might want to move, why don't you just try raising their rent? The worst that could happen is that they might move and you've already said that you probably think they should?
well were both confused. thats where i am on these rentals most of the time.
what you said about raising rents i have done to one,he was there when i bought the place in 03 at 525. i figured he would move after awhile, but nope. so i bumped him to 650. and he's still there. now if he moves i have about 5-7k to spend and 2 months work then it would rent for 750. not much of a return for the 5k and labor. i might tell him to hit the road anyway come winter when i don't have as much to do.
another one same story,there when i bought it back in 98 at 400,i have bumped her to 500 and she still stuck,place needed redone when i bought it and it isn't getting any better. but i feel bad about telling her to go and to tell you the truth the place really isn't worth much more than that in the shape it's in. redone it will hit 725,so someday i just got to get the gonads up and move her.
to add to my guilt both of these are now laid off work..........the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
"If you have some that you might want to move, why don't you just try raising their rent? The worst that could happen is that they might move and you've already said that you probably think they should? "
That's what I finally figured out. If you want to get rid of someone just raise the rent.
you are right on the shorter time being better in my opinion. I have had some tenants stay 5 years some stayed 10. I had too much to fix when they finally left.
Yes the virtual tour has been pretty big for 4-5 years nowI wanted to make a suggestionIn the future stay away from one car garageYou have to drop your price to get rid of it.If your house had two car garage it would sell quicker
what you say is true,but its one of those things of "they want everything for one low price"
tims house here with the addition of a 2 car will bring another 8-10k
i deal with this in the rentals,here is everybody's requrments: 3 bdr, 2 bath, 2 car , full basement at least 1/2 finished,out west area. sounds good, i would like to own 50 of them except one problem,they want to pay what it cost for a 3 bdr,1 bath ,1 car in south areas. wish in 1 hand and sheet in the other people.
i'll buy 1 car garages,but i buy them cheaper and when i sell them ,i'll sell em cheaper.
to tell you the truth,if i was out building new rentals and could make it work,they would have 3 car. the 2 car is on it's way out to being obsolete.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/22/2009 10:56 pm by alwaysoverbudget
when I left wichita the lowest priced new home was $90 KIt was two bedroom, two car, 850 sq feet, unfinished basement(I thought the building code was that all new homes MUST have two car garage)Anyway, one day I was showing a young couple a new home.They wanted to see the lowest priced homes and we looked at them out west of 13th and maizeAnyway, we walked through the model home and talked to the realtor sitting at the deskWe talked about base price, additional cost for fireplace, etcThen I asked if they had ever built an 850 ft home with A THREE CAR GARAGEAnd they said yesI think it would be a really unusual house.The garage would be bigger than the houseHave you ever seen a 850 ft house with three car garage?
every garage should be bigger than the house,it's man rule kind of thing.lol
i mananged that untill the last 2 house's,my garages and barn foot print is bigger than the house,so i'll let it go this time.
i would bet that in my rentals tonight there is not 2 cars that could get in the garages.they use them to store junk in . thats what has made the 3 car the thing. 1 stall of junk ,2 cars can park. how many 3 car have you ever seen with 3 cars.
as far as code i know a guy that built a new home with 0 car garage. he's got plans to build a big one detached someday. i don't think a garage is any kind of code. might be in the covenaces though.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
so have you done anymore searching for info in rogers?
i'd give the local board of realtors a call,see if they can give you a report.
local chamber of commerce
search for a big commercial real estate co. they usually have a state of the economy and re trends. the one here gets so in depth i don't have clue what the are talking about,the only thing is their info never says its a bad time to buy.
find out which paper carries the "on the courthouse steps notices" and take a day off and go watch.
a few years ago Walmart required all their suppliers to have person living within 30 mins of the headquarters. it blew the top off of nice property because these companies had to have someone live there. i would think the area around bentonville would always have a pretty good market.as long as walmart stays,alot of working families are going to be in that area.
it sounds funny to imagine walmart moving, but here in wichita we are dependent on boeing,cessna,beechcraft and lear jet. i'll never forget the night boeing came on tv and said"we put the for sale sign out" i about puked. luckily the co. that bought it has stayed put, but if it would make them money to go to mexico,their gone. so it can happenthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Ill probably be busy here for at least a year trying to sell out . Might take longer than that . Looks like Ill be living alone for a while . I did last week. Shes here for the weekend. We are goin to the cabin to work and kick back a little tomorrow and Ill be home alone for a week.
if your replacing all the door knobs etc,check these guys out.
http://stores.shop.ebay.com/The-Lockset-Discounters__W0QQ_armrsZ1
i buy all my locks from them. i can usally snag kwikset 6entrys with 6 deadbolts for 40-50.00
they also have faucets.
http://cgi.ebay.com/12-Price-Pfister-Portland-Nickel-Tub-Shower-Trim-Kits_W0QQitemZ360181135332QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item53dc77f7e4&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262QQautorefreshZtrue
these are just a trim kit but you can get to there store from here.
best i did on that was 6 price fister single handle pullouts 6 for 99.00
always have had really good luck with these guys.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/23/2009 10:30 am by alwaysoverbudget
We're looking to buy large quantities of:brushed nickel door knobs and hingesbrushed nickel door stops3/8 x 1/2 compression shut off valvesfaucets for kitchen and bathblue 1" masking tape1" regular masking tape9 X 12 plastic drop cloths (.5 mil)sawzall blades for democase of white painters caulkcase of liguid nails1 1/4 dryall screws3" metal screws (not interested in paying $8 per one pound box at HD)1/2 copper fittings1/2 shark bite fittingselectrical outlets & plateselectrical switches & plates12 X 12 tile (we're paying 88 cents)flat white paint for ceilings and closetssatin or eggshell wall paintwhite semi gloss for doors and trimmud & tapebackerboard and screwsseems like it's a never ending list
Edited 8/23/2009 11:11 am by mrfixitusa
i buy all these on ebay.
brushed nickel door knobs and hinges buy a 100 at a time less than .60
brushed nickel door stops also 100 at a time 33 cents
3/8 x 3/8 shut off valves bought about a 100/thats to many i might sell ya some .75 each
faucets for kitchen and bath look at the link above, pullouts 17.00
blue 1" masking tape buy it by the case .50 roll
1" regular masking tape
then there are, air conditioners,furnaces,freon, sinks, a coils,cabinet hinges,electric ranges,tile, trimwork,gfi's ,light bulbs, . i can't even think of all the stuff i have bought on ebay for these houses.
also cars ,tires,motors,zero turn lawn mowers,tv,lots of tools and just bought 250 of my favorite jobsite pens,my wifes laughing at me for that 1
once you get use to buying on ebay,it will save you a ton of money.plus it's easier than running all over to get it local.just watch the sellers feedback.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I don't think I've ever bought anything on ebayBut at those prices we've got to get startedwe're paying 3 to 4 times higher for this stuffhow about wooden carpenter's pencils?I'm paying 19 cents apiece for them at HD
your getting the deal at hd for .19,here they want 1.00 a shot. if you spend a couple 1000 they might throw you a couple. but just to show what ever you want,its on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/72-Carpenter-Pencils-NEW_W0QQitemZ190329803097QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2c508a5159&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
i started using these bic grip rollers. they are great for making cut marks,nice fine mark that i can see. i bought 250 for 17.50,so i have pens everywhere now!
http://cgi.ebay.com/24-BIC-BLUE-ROLLER-GRIP-PENS-FINE-07mm-POINT-SAVE_W0QQitemZ400066486189QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5d25d21fad&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116
if you haven't bought on ebay buy a couple 3.00 deals and learn a little about it. then when your ready to start buying something bigger let me know,there are a couple tricks that help.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
It said your pens were 12.22 for 12.
Where did you see them 250 for 17 on that site?
heres the ones i bought
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290332460268&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D290332460268%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1
email the seller they had 1000's of these a couple weeks ago.
.
if they don't have anymore ,just keep looking.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I have never liked larger houses for rentals either. Larger the house themore people and the more kids. More people and more kids = more damage, werae and tear.
i'm finding that exact problem on rentals with finished basements. 3 bdr with 2 adults and a kid or 2. then before long someone is living in the basement with a couple kids.
i just serve notice to get out.tell em if the house catches fire there is no escape route.
i hate basements,twice as much to clean up and maintain for about 50.00 more rent.
i also have 4 bdrm,people call with 5 kids! now we advertise it as 3bdrm with office.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I have a wood frame one bedroom that has been a great rental over the years. The single BR is large, can't remember off hand the dimensions, but a king size bed and large dresser don't cramp it one bit. Has two good sized closets also. House is older but nice with wood floors still in good shape. I've had great luck with single people and couples. But it has a good sized laundry room at the back and the people with kids look at it and still comment on how the kids 'could sleep in here'. I just tell them it's too small for their family and so far no problems.
Ive had two 4 bedroom houses and never did any good renting them.
I have one small two bedroom house and it does very well. I will allow a baby [silently] and thats about it over a single or couple. Ive had several singles that are professionals that are good but they dont stay a long time . I wouldnt either if I were them. I also thought long term was the best but not with 3 kids and a dog.
To me, the best tenants are a single or couple who stay about 3 years. You have them long enough to keep the property rented for a while without the expense of releaseing but you get a chance to re-evaluate the rent and do the needed clean up and repairs without having to work around them.
Had a college student getting his masters who rented from me for a year, when he moved out his GF moved in and too over for another year. He moved off to get his professional job and when she graduated they got married. I was invited to the wedding but didn't get to go. They were the nicest two tenants I've had in a long time. But, I've had some really good tenants. Some not so good.
so how do you handle telling the people that there are more people in their family than you want?
we try and find another point to say were not interested,but sometimes thats the approach," that the house is just to small for that many"
BUT twice in the last year we have been told" you can't do that i will sue you"
ok first ,before you ever move in your going to sue me,i will bulldoze the house before that happens. and second,your a renter ,you have no assets, and your going to hire a lawyer at 200 a hour,knock yourself out, my brother is a attorney if yours needs a address to send the paperwork to. lets go.
did i ever mention i'm a only child.lol
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I just tell them that with that many people you won't be comfortable here and it's not designed for that many.
Never had an issue.
The board of health has limits on how many kids can be in a bedroom, based on the square footage. That's what I use when prospective tenants have too many kids for the dwelling.
Paddy
Well thankfully that question was easy.
I start out with a credit check/ application form.
Im taking applications I clearly tell them. I can silently end it right there. All potential renters are questioned. Dog? Cats? How many kids? How many will be in the family? Either of you employed ? Where and how long ? Gotta water bed by any chance ? How long you kids excpect to stay? Why? Yall got references?
The winner of the applications is brought forward for a lease contract where they must pretty well sign what they told me . At the end of the lease they must name every member of the family staying there and state their ages. Lease says any false answers will be grounds for immediate eviction . I had to that with Mexicans so it didnt take long for me to catch on.
Has two lines for them to sign and two lines on my side . Gottum dont I?
I had a new couple living in a house one time with the leased couple gone . I called the police and the judge ordered them out that afternoon after I showed the lease . If they are not on the lease they legally cant be there .
Edited 8/25/2009 11:57 pm by Mooney
we're working on a house with a garageit has never had a garage door opener so we had one installed todaythere is no electrical for the openerI asked the installer what to do and he said "use an extension cord"I said what about code requirements and what if we were to have an inspectionHe said code will allow the use of an extension cordwe're not in any violation
Youre not in violation as long as you want to look an extension cord because it cant be hidden. Id run a box and wire from a closet or somthing .
Not sure what code, if any, applies where you are at. Here the fire code would not allow an extentsion cord to be used for more than 90 days. And it can't be tacked up or such.
See if you can think of the violation .
Any device made has manufactors specs. All codes follow them even if its against there better wishes. Door openers come with a plugin on them. They are pluged into a recepticle on the ceiling . An extenseion cord is UL aproved.
I was a BI and there simply aint no violation.
The fire marshall would have to be able to prove a violation. They think they are god but even a fire marshal has to answer to the law . They like to push their weight around . We have one here like that but theres been times he has to back up.
Tim
This is a manual for a basic opener.http://www.chamberlain-diy.com/doityourself/pdfdocs/114A3165.pdfIt won't allow copying, but clearly says not to use it with an extension cord. And if a receptacle is not in place to have a qualified electricain install one. And that all wiring must meet local code.And from the NEC."400.7 Uses Permitted
(A) Uses Flexible cords and cables shall be used only for the following: (1) Pendants
(2) Wiring of luminaires (fixtures)
(3) Connection of portable lamps, portable and mobile signs, or appliances
(4) Elevator cables
(5) Wiring of cranes and hoists
(6) Connection of utilization equipment to facilitate frequent interchange
(7) Prevention of the transmission of noise or vibration
(8) Appliances where the fastening means and mechanical connections are
specifically designed to permit ready removal for maintenance and repair, and the
appliance is intended or identified for flexible cord connection
(9) Connection of moving parts
(10) Where specifically permitted elsewhere in this Code And non of those cover garage door operators.And this would prohibit any logical way to run the cord."400.8 Uses Not Permitted
Unless specifically permitted in 400.7, flexible cords and cables shall not be used for the
following:
(1) As a substitute for the fixed wiring of a structure
(2) Where run through holes in walls, structural ceilings, suspended ceilings, dropped
ceilings, or floors
(3) Where run through doorways, windows, or similar openings
(4) Where attached to building surfaces
Exception to (4): Flexible cord and cable shall be permitted to be attached to building surfaces in accordance with the provisions of 368.56(B) {has to do with busways}
(5) Where concealed by walls, floors, or ceilings or located above suspended or
dropped ceilings
(6) Where installed in raceways, except as otherwise permitted in this Code
(7) Where subject to physical damage "Not have a receptacle (or hardwired) is specifically agains installation instructions. Thus not allowed.And the NEC specifically prohibits the use of extension cords for this kind of usage..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
http://www.docu-track.com/home/prod_user/PDF-XChange_Tools/pdfx_viewer
Bill, I downloaded this FREE PDF viewer.
It will allow you to type into Adobe PDFs that are protected and looks like it does a zillion other tricks too. Maybe allowing copying, don't know as I just got it the other day & have only used it to type into forms that were not allowed.
Joe H
It does allow copying of SOME locked stuff. But not of this one.I already tried it..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Sorry Tim,
Can't be used for more than 90 days or it is considered permanent wiring and extension cords can't be used for permanent wiring. Check the International Fire Code.
So if the cord on the opener was a foot too short , what would you do?
on a opener,if someone gave you a problem with a extension cord,why couldn't you put a new 10' cord on it?it's not a "extension cord"???????????the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Actually the NEC restrictions are on Flexible Cords. Can't be attached to the building or run through a structure. So if you don't mind it running straight down to a floor receptacle it might work. But hard to part the car..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
That was my point .
heres a article today here in wichita. first half applies here in wichita,but 2nd half is about buying repo's. pretty good reading for someone that thinks this is a easy deal. this thread is getting a little long i may throw it on a new one.
Wichita has tight foreclosure market»
View Image
Bo Rader/The Wichita Eagle
A home on N. Dodge in Wichita is offered for sale by Kansas Reo. A warning sign in the window says the home was acquired through foreclosure.
View Image
Bo Rader/The Wichita Eagle
A home on N. Dodge in Wichita is offered for sale by Kansas Reo. A warning sign in the window says the home was acquired through foreclosure.
Make big bucks on foreclosures! You see the advertisements all the time.
But is it really possible, for the enterprising amateur, here in Wichita?
Possible? Yes. There are bargains out there.
But the reality is that it's pretty darn difficult for amateurs to make quick money flipping houses, say local professionals already in that business.
The Wichita market isn't overwhelmed with foreclosures, so lenders aren't forced to sell houses for pennies on the dollars.
And there are professionals already buying and selling foreclosed homes. They know the system, they know the law, and they have the connections to take advantage of the good deals.
Troy Moellinger of Estates Unlimited Realtors suggested amateurs give up on the quick buck and focus on making money longer-term by buying homes to rent.
Investor David Duree advises people to do a lot of research, understand how much it will cost to renovate the house and stay disciplined in bidding.
"It's a numbers game," Duree said.
"Make lots of offers, and when one's accepted, you ought to be a little embarrassed you put one in so low."
Tax sale
The biggest bargains may be in tax foreclosures.
The first of three county tax auctions will be at 1:30 p.m. Monday at the Sedgwick County Extension Center on 21st Street and Ridge Road.
County Treasurer Ron Estes said he moved the auction from its traditional location in the Sedgwick County Courthouse because of the expected crowds.
In a tax foreclosure, purchasers are not responsible for the delinquent taxes, but they do have to pay the current year's taxes. All sales are final, payment is immediate and there are no guarantees.
Estes cautioned that tax foreclosure auctions usually aren't as good a deal as people commonly think.
The county recently published a list of 250 properties up for auction.
Typically, he said, if a property has real value, the owner will find a way to pay off the taxes. In fact, he expects most of those 250 properties to have been reclaimed by the owners before the sale.
"It's not the pot of gold some of the informercial people say," he said.
For a list and information on the auction, go to http://www.sedgwickcounty.org/ treasurer.
REOs
When lenders foreclose, they typically won't deal with individual buyers. Instead they funnel foreclosed homes, called REOs or "real estate owned," through a few local brokers.
People can find bargains in markets such as Las Vegas or Miami, where supply outstrips demand. But in Wichita, the bargains are pretty limited, said Bob Allen, broker for Kansas REO.
Local agents are graded on how closely their offering prices are to the sales price and given more business only if they are close.
The houses are marked at full market price, given the condition, Allen said.
Many of the houses have been trashed by angry homeowners or gotten run down during a long vacancy, so they may appear to be bargains, he said, but they really aren't.
If the houses don't sell between 14 and 45 days, depending on the company, local brokers mark the price down, Allen said.
Another issue, said Robyn Soerries-Funk of Realty One, is that some of the main REO brokers offer the homes first to a select list of investors before advertising them on the open market.
That, she said, gives them both sides of the meager transaction fee. But it also means that many of the best bargains never get advertised.
HUD homes
The sale of HUD-financed homes are similar to the REOs.
HUD works mainly through Allan Carpenter of Carpenter Realty Center.
There are deals, Carpenter said, but really more for the investor who wants to become a landlord, rather than the flipper.
The homes are listed at market price, given the condition, and marked down after 30 days. There may be some opportunity, he said, because many prospective buyers can't get bank loans.
There is no negotiation on the HUD price, and buyers have to have pre-approval or proof of cash.
He said the appreciation of the homes is not such that there is much of a chance for flippers, he said.
"You make money by hanging onto it waiting for the equity to build," he said.
HUD homes can be found at http://www.bidselect.com.
Pre-foreclosure
An investor can also buy a home from homeowners before the foreclosure is complete.
In a short sale, the price is actually negotiated with the homeowner, although the bank has to approve if it involves a reduction in the mortgage loan.
An investor can buy them from an agent who specializes in marketing them, such as Soerries-Funk, or Wendy Wilkinson of J.P. Weigand & Son.
Or, the investor can try to cut out the middle man, but that's riskier and more complicated. There is quite a legal process involved because the foreclosure process is ongoing.
There are also 15 or so full-time investors who search for homes going into foreclosure in which the homeowner has considerable equity. They try to buy the houses from the homeowners at a steep discount. If there is enough equity, they can pay off the bank loan, make repairs and still make a profit.
In these deals, homeowners, through ignorance or a desire to just leave the house behind, typically don't receive full value for their equity.
Attorney Frank Ojile does foreclosure work and said this business is a bit of a shark tank. He sees new guys show up at the sheriff's sale every week, trying to break into the business. It's complicated, and a mistake can be expensive.
"Every week a few new people come in," he said. "Within a few weeks they're gone."the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
The person that wrote the article isnt as infomed as we are.
I dont see buying in that market for rentals expecting them to rise . Im wanting out of rentals in this market . Im wondering if they are getting confused with the last bad market where homes were cheap because of high interrest? This recession/ depression doesnt have any of those factors or hopes. Right now I cant have hope for the country to get better . Theres more thought to getting worse .
Years ago Ill admit that I made some super buys . I know they are not out there now unless someone doesnt figgure right . I havent been in a buying mode so Im a little rusty with the market . I would say the market now doesnt fit amateurs in any sense. Especially with the last three I bought which were a burn out that gutted the interior , a termite job no one could get a loan on with out extensive reconstruction, or a house not finished with leans on it . I think Im earning them now . No one wants those types . The reaon IM buying them is because the prices havent came down and its still slow .
Sooner or later its gonna catch up with the economy. I dont have a clue why prices are holding this long . But they are right . I cant steal here at all.
Tim
my experience here in the midwest is if your buying a rental for just appreciation[some people are ok if the rent just covers the payment] your going to get discouraged real quick.
example.i have a house i bought in 78,31 years ago. gave 22k for it, today it would sell for probably 52,500,net me after cost and commissions maybe 45k. big deal in 31 years i doubled my money,a guy isn't going to get rich on a deal like that.
now as far as return on investment as a rental producing income monthly, it's a home run. every 4 months i get my total investment of 2400.00 down payment returned to me. thats pretty hard to beat.what is that 300% annual return?
it all comes down to what that article said about knowing the people that will turn you on to the great buys. thats when the money is made,buying. i have never been able to establish a relationship like that. the reason being for the realtor to call me within a hour of a listing to tell me, you have to have very deep pockets,so when the phone rings you can go. then in 2 days when it rings again you don't blink a eye,you are ready to buy another one.i think to be a player in the game like that you need 2 mil in your pocket and ready to play. now if your that kind of player ,you will be first on that realtors phone list. there have been some of these guys here in town play this game,probably 80% are broke within 7 years and have nothing.i'm not sure what happens to cause this.
i average buying 1 house a year. there have been years that i bought 5 .but i take it slow and easy. i steal a house every 5 years,thats just how its averaged out. rest of the time i would say i buy at wholesale. by that i mean the day after closing i could sell and pay the fees and break out even or a little on the positive side,but barely. but i'm in this for the income producing ability,not flipping. i wouldn't mind doing a flip but what happens to me is i get all done and it's like,ok i can sell make 18k or i can rent this house and it will produce 8k per year for many years,then i'll sell.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/31/2009 6:05 pm by alwaysoverbudget
"my experence here in the midwest is if your buying a rental for just appreciation[some people are ok if the rent just covers the payment] your going to get discouraged real quick."
You cant do that . Doesnt jive .
Im probably not better off the way I buy but money wise I am. I like the other way you figgure a rental though. You forgot tax shelter and stuff like that to mention.
The way now I have to do it;
Every property has to carry its own mail from the get go. I dont invest much money. Somtimes nada . Depends. Lets say I buy a house that needs a lot of work for 30 grand. I fix it and its worth 60 grand or 500 per month. Thats about right for here. Well right now 400 per month will carry that house payment , insurance and taxes. That gives me a 100 per month. That isnt enough but I have to have that at least with no money down. If I can get 550 or 600 then good for me . Thats why I dont need money to buy properties unless I need to live off the experience . I dont get paid and that has been my money down I never give . I might put 5 grand in materials in it myself and I can ask the bank to repay me .
I buy the house on a line of credit , fix it , get it appraised , let the bank make me a bank loan off its fixed worth then. Now the renters are making the payments on a 15 yr note on 30 grand or 35. I could sell it for 60 grand then if I wanted to. Although I dont get paid Im not really working for free. A contrator would have charged that much normally but if he was involved I wouldnt be getting 110 percent loans off my investments. Ive never ever paid for a house myself although DW writes the checks and sends in the payments. When we were both working for money we would drop money in a house . What else do ya do with money if you dont need it ? She hasnt worked in two years now so we cant do that anymore. Idont work for the public either so I gotta make money on the buys or I cant do it .
ok,i'm the only guy in rentals that you'll ever meet that will go against the grain on the 2 points you brought up.
first taxes. when i got into this there was some tax advantage. but now the only thing your doing is borrowing money you owe irs tax free until you sell. now i'm not saying thats a bad thing,but i earn that little benifit when my heads down a toilet working on it.there are a few tax deductions that i get to take that without the rentals i couldn't such as car,tools, cell phone etc.
the other one. working on other peoples money. every book you read will talk about opm and leverage. i completely understand in one circumstance,high inflation and/or great appreciation. thats the only way it works for me. i have had lots of loans over the years and have done exactly what your talking about with fixing up and borrowing back what i have in it finished for a zero down.and go on to the next one.i work on the same sweat equity program you do,never get a paycheck on friday!
it's the only way to accumulate with out the deep pockets, but as you talked about when the money is flowing well,get that bank paid as quick as possible.
heres how i view that,if i have a 9% loan at a bank for a house,those guys are making the first 9% of profit before i make a nickel. i'm greedy i want that 9% on my dinner table instead of the bankers. anymore i would never consider buying something that can't pay for itself in 15 years. 15 years is a long time and a lot can happen.
now everyone in real estate will tell me,you should refinance and go put the down payment on 5 houses, but i'm getting to old for that stuff. i need to sleep at night and know the next morning i still have income and not the bank serving repo notices.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/31/2009 10:09 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Im enjoying the site.
Well what do you think about buying right now and holding renting them?
Tim
Edited 8/31/2009 5:32 pm by Mooney
"Well what do you think about buying right now and holding renting them? "
that is the hardest question in this 400+ thread.
i have people ask me alot about getting started,usually they are in their 20-30's.
my first hair trigger answer wants to be are you nuts!?
but then i take a deep breath ,they have been good to me,and ask,
"why do you want to own rentals"
answer to make money and have something for retirement
next question "do you want to make money now or later when you sell?"
their answer will start me on how i think they can do that.when i got started,things were bad,interest on one of mine was 12.5 variable and could go to 18.5. nothing was selling. i was young and dumb i didn't know it was that bad. my dad would just shake his head and say" i hope you can make the payment".
back then if i had a house i wanted it to make at least 40-50 a month,some didn't i had one that for 2.5 years lost 12.00 a month. doesn't sound like much,but i owned it to make money.
so when someone asked today i try and be upbeat,tell them it has to make money,somehow.
now for the answer to the questioned you asked:i don't know,it's about risk just like it was 30 years ago.from what people that know about the economy,they say we are sitting ducks for high inflation. if that comes to pass,in hindsight a guy should of bought everything in site. you have mentioned buying some bargains back then, did they seem like absolute steals then?
so today around here i can buy a nice 2-5yr old,not a fixer upper,economy built 3 bdr ,2bath,2car,with a basement for 135k.i'd guess the payment on a 15 yr 10% down would be in the 1500.00 range.thats all it would rent for.if you need money monthly,your going to have to go 30yr. but lets say a 25 yr old does this deal,today it makes nothing but in 3-4 years it's making 150. a month,by the time he's 40 ,he has invested some time and hassle into being a landlord and it's time to sell. lets hope inflation has taken the house to 170k. he sells and has 150 in the bank. as bad as all these 401k's are doing he might be ahead of the game.so it's hard to tell a guy "no you shouldn't buy a rental"
now me i don't want to own that nice of a house, i have a couple and i find them hard to rent. i prefer the under 100k with rent under 900.00 if possible.
i think for someone like you or me and that these are meal producing properties,it comes down to if you see one that will make money the first day you own it,no matter how little,then i don't see why not buy and hold.
unless your like me ,i got all the children i want to baby sit right now.all daycares have limits on how many children you can watch,and i'm at my limit.!lolthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I found one that will make a little money off the site you posted.
3 bd 1 bath with single garage. Has a huge yard. Its up where DW is right now in Pea Ridge. I called her and asked that she go by and view it . Asking price is 42,500.
It will bring 600 per month up there. 15 yr note and let it pay its self off. Not really an option to re sell it right now as many repos as there is up there. It probably can be bought for 35,000. Only disadvantage I see is it looks like it needs a roof other than love me tender things around the place . Looks to me like its 30 yrs old but will have drywall and modern wiring and probably single hung aluminum windows. Cheap replacements every where on that house. Its around the mega job force in Arkansas . 15 of those and be a millionare in 15 years with no money down.
https://doc1.hometracker.com/fmae/forms/broker/Jul/wk1/1504-436438_12824985.jpg
That what yur talkin about ? <G>
Edited 9/1/2009 5:31 pm by Mooney
Edited 9/1/2009 5:33 pm by Mooney
that looks pretty dang good to me,but you got me confused [not hard to do] what site did i send you to? must of not been my favorite #### site.lol
was it in that newspaper article?
pea ridge might be a pretty good place. it's really growing right there,but 10 minutes and your in rogers.
HEY,i thought you was getting done with rentals.lol it's hard to stop........the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Yea its in the paper article ;
HUD homes can be found at http://www.bidselect.com.
She checked on another one tonight thats not but three blocks from her.
See if this directs it ;
https://www.bidselect.com/PropertyDetails?p_plum=&p_last_access_time=2009-09-01+17%3A34%3A58.002&p_client_id=0&p_property_id_list=0704-437098%2C1504-436438%2C1504-436424%2C0704-436477%2C1504-436447%2C1504-436446%2C1504-436413%2C1504-437357%2C0704-418943%2C0704-425170&p_reference_num=0704-437098&p_index_in_total_count=11&p_num_per_page=10&p_num_total_results=22&p_search_url=%2FSearchResults%3Fp_process_page%3DPSPropertySearchResults%26p_build_page%3DPSPropertySearchResults%26p_search_type%3D1%26p_region_list%3D%26p_state_id%3DAR%26p_county%3D%26p_city%3D%26p_address%3D%26p_price_low%3D0%26p_price_high%3D10000000%26p_bedrooms%3D0%26p_bathrooms%3D0%26p_property_type%3D%26p_search_channel%3DHUD%26p_search_channel%3DBANK%26p_program_type%3D0%26p_bidder_type%3D%26p_zipcode%3D%26p_property_status%3D%26p_sort_order%3Dcase%2520when%2520pa.contract_status%2520%2520is%2520null%2520then%2520%25201%2520else%25202%2520end%2C%2520case%2520when%2520pa.auction_id%2520in%2520%28100%2C%2520101%29%2520then%2520%25201%2520else%25202%2520end%2C%2520city%2C%2520zip%26p_sort_dir%3DASC&p_sort_order=case+when+pa.contract_status++is+null+then++1+else+2+end%2C+case+when+pa.auction_id+in+%28100%2C+101%29+then++1+else+2+end%2C+city%2C+zip&p_process_page=PSPropertyDetails&p_build_page=PSPropertyDetails&js_changed=&p_form_action=CUSTOM
She got information I didnt have in the listing .
1753 sg ft . Trey ceilings , pan ceilings, cathedral ceilings .
Counter tops are granite .
Two car garage , privacy fenced back yard . Lot is level and in good shape .
105 grand asking price .
Thats very cheap!
She says its ready to move in.
Tim
Edited 9/1/2009 8:23 pm by Mooney
wow!things must be tougher there than i thought.thats at 105 and it's open for bids. here that house would do 160 easy without the basement.
did you notice on the listing it says ,possible interior mold???????on a 3 year old house?
i can't imagine a first time buyer not grabing that. nice house and the gov pays you 8500 to buy.so that brings me into the mid 90's.
hows the rental market? it's always hard to get a real feel for that until your setting with a for rent sign in the yard.
i'm like you though on that 45k house. i'd like to own a block of them for 35-38k. thats more my type of rental,even though this one at a 100k would make a nice one to live in.things pick up ,profits tax free,oh yea.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Rentals are much higher than here.
LIke I said , that little house will bring 600 up there. The one IM selling will only bring 600 as a good comparison. I understood from you that you had a better market than I do for rentals . What would the house I have listed rent for there?
i went back and looked at your listing. i have some that are real comparable to that in what i would call,good stable areas. they rent in the 750-800 range,but after looking at your listing i see that you have a .5 bath that would probably bump it another 35 a month. so i would put that house in the 795.-850 range. at that price you would have enough intrest to pick some good tenants. market value i think would be in the 105-115 range.
so much for tthat old 1% rule???????????
funny thing i see is there are guys that will rent that for 1000. a month. but the only people that look at have problems paying rent. they don't really care what you charge,because they are only going to pay a month or 2.
that 42k house in pea ridge is almost a twin to one i have here ,rents for 735.00.
just tonight i had a tenant show up,been laid off.pays 685 for 2bedrm no garage. real nice clean brick house. ask us to pull the rent back 85. a month. goes without saying i don't want to,but.............. if he moves and i lose a month i'm behind in the game for 7 months. probably do it but i think i'll see if i can get something in return. maybe help me prep a house for paint or something.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
You mentioned Larry's number for rental is higher than yours. For perspective, I can only get $450/month for a three bedroom ranch. If it's really special, and new, they will pay $550. So, to me, you're sitting on easy street. :-)
OTOH, 2-3 bedroom units on Long Island, in NY easily bring $1400-1600+. But there, the real estate taxes are $8K/year or more. Other carrying costs are higher too. So's the purchase price.
so your 3 bdr for 450,what do you think it's market value is? it all kinda follows the same rent to market value. i do see some talk about being in a high dollar area,the house cost 300k and rents for 1800. i'd throw newspapers before i did that.lolthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
One of the 3 bedrooms is a doublewide, in town. I paid 45 for it 4 years ago, and I think current value is 65 tops. A second one is a brick ranch. It was purchased with the 2 bedroom next door. I would guess the value might make 100-110.
As far as the example you gave, if I figured correctly, that's about a 7% return (before expenses). I've seen worse investments. What do you consider a minumum return on a rental?
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
have you ever done a 1031 tax exchange?if your thinking of moving to rogers and keeping some rentals there,you need to look at a 1031.
listen i'm going to pull numbers out of the air so don't get offended if i miss.
the house you have listed for 85. lets say you paid 50. depreciated down to 35. sell for 80. uncle sam want 20% of 45k,so there goes 9k,then the state wants another 7%,another 3k gone.you have 68 in your pocket. so you go to pearidge and buy that 42k place with the money in your pocket. you have 26k to bank.
wouldn't you rather buy it cheaper! by doing a 1031 and rolling those funds into a 1031 you have 80k in the bank. now you go to pea ridge and buy 2 of them with the 80k. it's the same as buying them for 34 a piece vs 42k.now you have 2 rentals for 600 a month. you can have mortgage on either or both with no effect to the tax consequent.
i did one a year ago, had cash from the sale,rolled it to replacement. now i own it so i financed it for 80% of purchase. this is done in 3 minutes after owning it. so i walk from closing with the cash.
there not all that hard,they do put a little pressure on you to find replacements in 45 days and close within 180. i did one time fax my replacement in at 11 pm on the last day one time.thats a little nerve racking. the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I think you did miss and Im thinking you missed my earliar point .
Straighten me out if Im mistaken.
For one thing this house Ive got listed Ive had for 6 years Im thinking.
Its eligble for capitol gains tax of 12 to 18 percent .
I dont have that high a depreciation.
I would live in the nicer house up there and keep it for two years.
Id fix the older house and rent it and sell it as a rental. But I wouldnt keep it .
YOU said somthing earliar as the article did . Its ok to buy for todays value and hold on to the investment as a rental but you said somthing about getting depressed. A banker told me one time on the subject of buying one rental house that it was a good investment if it didnt make any money per month. Kind of a slide rule kind of formula he had . He said at the prices I was buying these deals, it would be the best to buy them and finance for 10 years. Break even and show a loss actually which it is but the renter would buy the house quickly. It would not matter actualy what I paid as long as the house would turn even for the 10 year note. I guess Id be supplying the carpet , roofing , paint and labor . I said that to him. He said that would be alright because I got all that done wholesale or for free looking at me . He told me to find a 10 year investment to beat it . I never could do it and I tried.
His principle was on what I could afford to sugar daddy through the loan period. Im thinking he wasnt far from being right . I said before I worked full time when I had 5 houses but that was maxed. Lets say I made 100 grand per year for 10 years in a commercial business and had 5 houses now paid off today at 80 grand x5 houses =450,000. His total would reflect 1,450,000.00 in earnings with a minimum of 450, thousand in savings . In that reflection my new earning total would be 600.00 times 5 per month=3,000 x12 =36,000 +100,000 =136,000 per year .
Next year selling a rental could be straight income taxes.
Im not making a 100 thousand per year but I have a lot more value than that . But Ive lost those earnings which needs to be evaluated. Makes the value a lot less .
I can make more money off flipping if Im in the right territory. Thats what Im geared to do. Holding on to my value in rentals like I cant make more money isnt my position. I could teach it in seminars to trademen. I know it that well. I couldnt teach it to people that cant do the work. If I could do that Id be speaking in seminars. <G>
Someone like Calvin could double their income easily where he lives and not work any harder. Im not sayin he would get rich like the seminars say. <G>
Ive tried to teach it here for free and nobody has ever done it . They thought about it . Most say they cant find the properties . I found two off that site in 5 minutes. I normally look for several weeks and bid on dozens . I buy cheaper but those two houses would work.
I bought that house you guessed at 50 grand , for 42,000 on a cash sale on the court house steps . I gave 25,000 for the last one I sold that brought 78,000. I did a lot of work on the 25 grand house and carpeted and painted the one that was 42,000. Making money isnt the problem. Getting to to buy them with all these rentals is the problem. I feel like a mama hog with a pig on every teat.
Tim
Edited 9/2/2009 12:14 am by Mooney
Edited 9/2/2009 12:18 am by Mooney
Edited 9/2/2009 12:26 am by Mooney
i've got to digest all that a little, but it is a possibility that cap rates go up.
i wish i had the crystal ball,but i don't see them raising for at least 3 years. the reason is the gov. cannot slow the recovery down of the stock market and housing market.
now the bottom line to this is someone is going to have to pay for all these 8500. rebates,clunker cars etc. that is going to have to be paid with taxes and i don't think cap gains will be left untouched by any means.
what scares me is,i sell my real estate to save on taxes, then inflation fires up and i would of been way better off to of held and got the gain from inflation.
my preferred tax strategy is to leave them to my kids so the taxes can be avoided. couple problems with that, one i have to die! and there is a good possibilities that they will mess with inheritance taxes also.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Better read it again I was adding to it as you were posting .
That area up there has become high paid people . Im not saying its high tech but the work force sure is . No its no Boston Mass. People up there are working for high demand vendors with the college educations. Every vendor Walmart has is there . That includes Sams Wholesale . Then there the university, the 5 biggest trucking companies , Tyson Foods , on and on. I dont even know the number of corparate offices there but they out number the indians in Oklahoma. [jest] Their growth has balloned the other things . The main thing is a lot of professionals .
Now a professional will invest their money for equal value if it doesnt take time kinda like the banker was tring to teach me . A 10 year payoff is exellent to most investors . Many wish they had one right now . 15 years is now acceptable in the current economy for a pay off rate. That doesnt include interrest. Thats being a sugar daddy to the investment . If they can get a real estate firm to do the management thats fixed into the price of pay off they will do it. They are even steven right now . The months it doesnt rent they are out of pocket and also the carpeting and the painters cost . They will do it for the payoff in 10 to 15 years and the write off while they are making the money. Thats considered sound investments for a doctor , lawyer , vet, etc.
A big portion of multi rentals are controlled by professional people otherwise management would not be a business thats viable .Think about it . Part of the rentals are agent owned that have access to foreclousures and man a management firm with their real estate business.
My brothers fatherinlaw said a long time ago you have to hit a double lick. Doesnt matter at what as long as you are doing it . He was a food companies trash man. He hauled cook offs away at a tv dinner plant . He came in one day and said were paying a big amount to the dump. Youre payin me 300 per week. Youre payin the dump more than me . Let me dispose of the stuff for 600 a week . That was in 1960.
The manager of the company picked up his morning sunday paper one morning 3 years later and saw his trash man on the business page. He was the leading independant hog producer in the state of arkansas. He was keeping 2,000 head in a feed out facility before slaughter. He had the same deal with three plants . One was a sweet potato plant and the other one was a cannery.
The manager put the cook offs up for bids and ruined the whole thing for the trash man. He lost his job and the cook off bid was 65 grand per year and the bidder furnished the trucks . Finally the run off shut the system down by the epa . But the trash man was already rich. He moved on to cattle on a paid for 700 acre ranch. He came up with a system to fertilize his bottoms with water from the hog ponds after it was agitated making it liguid ferilizer. Also it was one of his irriagation methods. Meanwhile he damned a creek and paid for a pond irrigation system that put him into the hay business big time . He shipped briar free hay to horse farms in square bales with paid for equipment . He wouldnt run chickens for tyson becuase he said they were already making all the "licks".
He said a cow eating free fertilized grass as he slept was a double lick.
You still need to go back up and review a post I edited.
Right now there are people out there with money of course. No one talks about them. I am. Everyone that has money needs to have investments . They, like you are critical of any gambling with their retirements . They still want to use them and they cant help it . Just like you are using yours.
The first time homebuyers is out there now with the 8 grand . We know that cant stabilize anything . Its just a shot of insulin. It has to be a temp thing at best.
Meanwhile the economy is in the tank and I dont see it comming up because I dont see any viable signs .
Meanwhile theres still people out there with money . There always will be . So heres a deal.
In the next five years at least with the economy showing very little gains or signs have yet came up announcing any thing different there will be more and more people loose their homes . The goverment cannot bail that out . Meanwhile the people that loose their homes will be renting . What other choice do they have right ?
I believe rentals will be strong sellers in the next 5 years . Theres an increase in demand and people sitting around with money that are afraid of investing it . Tie up all the loose ends and let a management company manage it . Sounds good to them but you and I know it aint .
The rentals that will do well are the multi smalls like duplexes , tris . and fours.
Im pictureing two professionals making 200 grand per year minimum and only need part of it . They could sugar daddy a couple duplexes. Nice stuff next to a library , hospital, etc. No junk at all. Prime rentals in exellent condition and hoods. They dont ave to make money off it now like we do.
Next thing is location of operation. I dont have it here. Its in NW Arkansas . It may be where you live . The only area that has it but I havent had a need to study other areas. Needs to be a solid area with solid jobs like the one Im considering .
lets cover a couple things.
your capital gain rate is in the 15% range,but then arkansas takes their share,here in ks thats another7% .so your losing 25% i'm like you though,i know it won't ever be less than it is now.on this house looks like a 1031 could save you 10k,after buying the fourth house with 1031's you using the governments money. if you pick up that i'm a believer in 1031's ,i feel it's the only real tax advantage to owning investment re. can't do this in the stock market.
and buying a house and living in it for 2 years tax free is the absolute biggest tax advantage there is. i wouldn't be surprised when they change the cap rate they don't also mess with this.
on the surface i like the advice your banker gave you on the 10 yr payout,but i'm not sure how you could ever break even. i punched in a 65k house at 6% for 10 yrs= 721.00 plus taxes and ins. so you could be at 900 pretty easy. not many 65k houses are going to get to that 900. but if they could it would be sweet. i'm afraid i couldn't afford to be that big of sugar daddy!
my problem with buying a house,cleaning it up and renting it,then selling it as a rental is,once your only in the investment arena,everyone wants wholesale.
i had a agent sit down with me 20 years ago for 2 hours ,giving me advice,best 2 hours i ever spent. he showed me how a single family house is a retail property,when you get ready to sell,there are lots of buyers. once you go to duplex on up to huge multi units,everyone is a wholesale buyer. the property is worth what the income makes it worth. he got way more in depth,but thats the jist of it. i wwas looking at a 60 unit apartment complex. he talked me out of it. i owe him.
i do agree that everytime the stock market tanks,people run in and cash out, and start buying real estate. it can really tighten a market up for buying. on the other hand i see these same people bailing out in 18 months -2 yrs because they didn't realize that this is a investment where you have to manage ,people and property. by that time the markets recoverd and they jump in to stocks again.
as far as that freddie mac thing and the banks wanting the goverment to back them.
i understand the basics of fmac,but thats about it. but what i read from the article. the banks are looking for a new way to play the game and screwus in round 2 about 7 years from now.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I was talking about a duplex to a four plex.
Ive seen time and time again that professionals give the going rate for a duplex. The duplex is my best analogy. I actually talked to a man last night that bought a house up by my cabin. He bought a repo and thats why hes where he is but he almost bought a duplex. Hes single . He bought a two bedroom house . He was looking at 2 bedroom duplexes. He said the duplex would have been as good a deal as the cheap house figguring he could rent out the other apartment and they could share paying it off. I mentioned he would have more at the end of the loan with the duplex. He agreed and it was also a cheaper payment on his half with the duplex. But he didnt want to live in town. He didnt mind being a landlord.
You keep looking at it from your own situation. You offered up some exellent points but this wasnt one of them if you dont mind. <G> Feel free to get me back. Im not selling a duplex to you . Im selling a duplex to someone that makes more money than they need and are thinking about investments and retirement. Someone who has been burned in the stock market mebbe.
It doesnt matter if you were them if you were the sugar daddy on a 10 yr note on a new duplex as long as it was chump change. The return is still there provided the price is inline .
Remember the banker said it didnt matter what I gave for a property if I got a 10 yr pay out . The 10 year deal is at my cost . Thats buying a house for 25 grand and getting 500 per month for it which I did do.
Anyone could adjust the deal out to 15 years if they chose to. It depends on whats the point . If Mr DR wants to get even every year than he may choose the 15 or 20 yr plan. If he wants to spend his cash then he may want to be a sugar daddy. If you do the math being a sugar daddy is the cheapest route as long as the price reflection is the same . All depends on how you want to run that rabbit out of the bush in the open.
The wonderful thing about this business is that real estate will do what you want it to do with in reason. You and I chose to let the properties pay for themselves from the get go. But thats not everyones point . Some people could actually pay cash for a duplex every year or a rent house . Because they arent making their money from the rental business . I dont want to either .
Anyway there was an old rule of thumb on being a sugar daddy. My banker confirmed it to me . On my price of houses , if I pay 100 dollars per month extra on the principle every month, the loan will be cut in half in years.
Edited 9/3/2009 10:54 am by Mooney
about 3 years ago duplexes were the hottest thing on the market.
what caused this was people out on the west coast selling their single family home for a mil and coming into the midwest and buying a nice single family home to live in for 200k and spending the other 800 on duplex-fourplex's. for income. this was their retirement income. they were selling like hot cakes.
i was stupid enough to get into the fray on one. great location,needed work,lots! plus it's a poorly built structure. i called on it the 3rd day, the agent wouldn't even talk to me. he's got 5 contracts working and it will surely sell. well they all fell and i was the last stupid buyer standing ,so he decided to show it to me.
even today i question what i was thinking about,it's all about the area. cheapest house on the block sold for 210 upwards to the 275 mark. so mine might be a knockdown someday to build new.heres a pic of it. 123962.12
you have talked about building new ones. that might work real well in nw ar. you talk about drs. etc,they like the new stuff.because the see the value of low maintenance for 15 yrs.
around rogers do they have zoning requirements? thats the tough thing here ,finding a lot zoned multi family.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I dont know . I havent been able to build for a long time now because I can buy cheaper . Me doing the work on both if I can. Other than price adavantage of repos , theres a distinct labor advantage . I cant do the mechanical on a new structure . I dont have a framing crew or a concrete crew and I dont lay brick. Im getting too old to hang. My wife made a statement yesterday that hit home hard. She said you are a disabled man still working . Im not even sure I could run automatic tools all day long finishing drywall and I know Im not near as fast . Theres a lot of physical work involved in new construction and so much of it requires a crew that can compete with subs doing one thing . If I could ever carry a multitask crew on my back so to speak , I sure cant do it now . We wont even get into the full list of inspections that kill you on time only building one structure.
Ive been doing repos and damaged properties such as fire sales for 17 years. Ive studied hard and practiced technique to turning repos around mostly by my lonesome . Theres no inspections except fire houses that loose their trusses. Otherwise I shut the doors and work. I do it all and have all the equipment . Mostly Ive learned to make time doing it all. That was the hardest thing to learn. Somtimes you have to throw a few incompletions to get a touch down. Plumbing was the hardest for me to get down. When I was an inspector I got to watch all day long . I saw that plumbers made money in two ways cause they sure dont get in a hurry. Ive always made money off speed . Not the time for speed if yer not comfortable . I can finish a drywall joint not looking at it . I can be looking and talking to someone else while I running a joint off stilts. Plumbers have the parts on the truck or they make detailed lists and hit the supply houses at 630 in the morning for the days work. They dont seem to forget any thing or its stocked on the truck and they restock at 630 in the morning . That took me a long time . Forget the part or buy the wrong one was sure to happen. Electrical is not that bad but it will catch you off gaurd.
Since I dont have a plumbing truck or an electrical set up van etc. fixed up like a shop and a store like they do I had to find my own way. I went with storage bins marked on the out side . That made me do the same with the other trades I do. My tool trailer is carpentry only that stays on the job but theres stuff on it I use for every thing almost like the big compressor . MY drywall and painting tools are in bins . My poles are in the trailer as well as stilts and such that wont fit into bins . Ive got a drive in shop I can pull into and turn on the lights and watch a ball game while I load and unload. I make lists and keep cards in my shirt pocket I wright on all day and take them to my recliner . I build the job in my mind for the next day and list it . I dont leave the job and go to town anymore . I stock the things i use the most in the shop and buy in quanity. I take home from the job the things i wont use tomorrow . I keep spray guns in paint instead of cleaning guns . I learned that from my body shop friend . I wash the head and hang it like he did . My airleses get cleaned every night . They arent designed to stay in latex so I have to run them and put them away. Ive designed ways to spray in one day and be done . Thats why I run fans . The airless goes home like I was renting it . I do run a small airless for laquer and it doesnt hurt to keep it in it till the job is done with it . I learned that from commercial work where I did doors in a nursing home for a week. I keep a cheap 300 dollar unit hooked up in it . If they steal it no big deal. The 3,000 dollar unit goes home . The small unit will do the same thing running kilz in fire jobs . Just clean the head and seal the paint its in. Run it on prime after whizzing the paint and yer in business for the day. Most trim is prefinished with a hlvp gun since normally I have to protect the out side yard. I used to spray trim out side in new construction and made a rack in the garage to accept it. I still use the rack but cover the whole garage floor with plastic.
My set up and practice is for repos and fire jobs .
Ive got trailers for different things instead of a dumpster . Burn trailer , dump trailer , metal recycle , etc. I use a normal 90 gallon trash bin to roll out to the curb for residential trash pick up at 14 bucks per month instead of a dump bill on every thing I can pack in it that gets picked up once a week.
New construction, is a thing of the past for me unless I hired mostly all of it done and then they are making the licks , not me unless I stole the land .
i'm headed through pea ridge this am. i'm within a block of that repo. i got to take a drive by and see it. still can't grasp a 100k for a house like that. i see it shows under contract now?
your tool setup is just about the same as mine except i use a van. i stock a lot of small stuff in it,but i live 6 blocks from a hd and lowes ,so a stop almost everyday is req.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
DW said its really a nice house . I didnt put the offer on it .
Probably a first time homebuyer with 8 thousand dollars of goverment money to help on the transaction. So really its more like 92 grand .
Would you like to build new houses and compete with that?
That house should be around 100 dollars per foot contracted . . The framing package on that house would be out of sight expensive for people like us . Nearly every main room has an expensive ceiling detail.
Tim
We had a house go under contract 3 weeks ago? and the inspections were completed and issues resolved.So far so good.Then the appraisal came in $5,000 low.Ouch!the house went on the market for $195 and quickly sold for full priceSo now the appraiser has valued the home at $190The realtor working with the Buyer got aggressive with us and demanded the price be lowered.Our response was to provide documentation (recent solds) to the appraiser supporting our price.The appraiser's not budging though.We responded to the other realtor by telling her we're not lowering our price and that we will put the house back on the market if we have to.Consequently, she's now turning her anger and frustration toward the appraiser and breathing down his neck.We'll see what happens during the coming week.
I normally come down if necesary but last time I didnt feel it was fair and didnt . Lost the deal. So on the second deal and appraisal. It came in way over the same price I was asking .
you don't have to be much smarter than a rock to be smarter than me,but if i got a house for 195k sold at full asking price .and i have to go down5k to get to closing? the only reason i wouldn't take 5k less is pride. holding cost a 6% is 1000k a month with no taxes,ins and utilitys figured in.
other than that i don't know how anyone can tell what a house is worth within 2.5%. maybe the rock could ,but i couldn't.lol
i'd tell the agent to knock 2500 off there 12k comission,being as it took one showing,i'd do the same and lets get this thing sold.
remember i'm a old car dealer,lets get that profit in the bank and buy another one.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/8/2009 8:44 am by alwaysoverbudget
good point.....we'll see what happens this week....also, thanks for the ebay info....we've got to get rolling with some of that...thanks again
This is a bit of a digression....
You mentioned earlier and I think had a bit of one in a picture, that you are putting decks on the front of the house.
Are you putting this on top of an existing cement stoop with steps?
Just wondering because I'm getting ready to do the same on my house and don't want to have to tear the steps out if not needed...
Thanks.
LeftyLefty-This tagline removed due to the prevelance of the humor impaired.
Here's the pictures of a front deck we did on our current projectOn this house we removed the old concrete stepsThey had sunk pretty bad and were in bad shapeI would encourage you to add the deck on the frontIt really changes the looks of the houseGood luck!
About 10 years ago my younger brother said "I've got a chance to buy a commercial building at a really good price and it's at a great location"I said where is it and we drove over to 21st and Rock Road and he showed me the empty bank on the corner.He said the amount of traffic that drives by here is incredible.After all, real estate is all about location, location, location.He didn't buy it and someone else did.It's currently a jewlry storeDo you know which building I'm talking about?Anyway, I opened the Wichita paper this morning and looked at the real estate and saw that the above-mentioned property is again for sale.The jewelry store didn't make it and has closed.I wonder why they're not making it there?I think there is a long history of commercial failures in that building.Nothing seems to make a go of it there. Wonder why?
thats kinda funny. about 3 years ago they had a article in the paper about that property and how being on the corner was such a big deal for the jewelry store.seems he said he had people try and buy it from him,[krispy creme?]but it made his business being there.commercial property is fickle, you might have 50k a day car count,but have median strips that make it impossible for 3 directions of traffic to get to.maybe your parking is a little tight or even you have to much parking so it doesn't ever look like your busy.or your knocking it dead and then some guy comes in a block from you and ,bam,he just took 1/2 your business.
small business is hard,doesn't really matter what it is,it takes a lot of cash flow to make it work. i would throw out a number of a million dollar inventory and realestate that guy had invested.at 8% thats 80k a year ,then taxes takes another 20k for property,insurance could be in the 20k range, 5 employees at 30k a year for another 150k,pretty quickly your looking at a 350k nut to bust before you as the owner make a nickel. you have 312 days to do it in,so every day you have to make a little over a 1000.profit just to get your overhead paid.
it would be tough to do i would think.
on the other hand i would love to own that property,i'd feel like i was running with the big dogs on that one!any idea what that property was priced at then?i don't know why but some places get a stigma of failed business',restaurants are the worse. i swear if a building has had 4 restaurants go belly up,it's time to do something else.
i have a couple of small commercials and i see these people come in with great hopes and within a year they are dead broke and have no idea what to do next. i have that going on right now,the guy is bankrupting his family trying to keep his business going and pay me rent. i've got a eviction notice served on him right now,it would be best for him to lock it up,but we'll see.with things the way they are i just hold my breath because there is so much commercial vacant.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/13/2009 10:20 am by alwaysoverbudget
How do you treat a commercial renter when its time for separation?
Id really like to know .
I would hate to evict right now in commercial. No tellin when you would get another tennant or if you ever could .
I dont think it will ever come back . With the huge stores and the internet .
lets talk perfect world.they have fulfilled their lease,left the place without me needing to take the dump trailer and clean up,they get all their deposit back.perfect world.
really no much different than residental. except the court gives them 10 days instead of 3.
a lease for a landlord leasing to a regular guy,not mcdonalds or wendys etc,is the most worthless pc of paper there is. i'd rather go month to month and tell em to leave when i want.
if a guy is in a building,not making money,and doesn't have the money for rent.my only concern is i want my building back,so i can find someone to pay rent.
first you have to serve papers,10 days,then head to court. around here we get to court pretty quickly.within 10 days you will be in front of a judge. if the tenant shows up,he can request a court hearing. that puts you off for another week. get in front of the judge for trial and both sides tell their story. if rents not paid he will boot them.but that takes another week to finally get possesion of property.
now if all that has taken place,there is a good chance that there is still remaining time on the lease.
i have to try and release,so if i find a tenant the first day after court, he is released from his obligation. maybe it takes 6 months,a year whatever.
lets say he has 15 months on his lease at 1k a month. i rent the building at the seventh month ,he owes me 7k. now this is the fun part. he's broke ,he doesn't have any money,his house is mortgaged to the hilt. there is no reason to spend another dime on this,he has nothing. now lets say he has something,i can go back to court,get a judgement,then try and collect.
but to tell you what thats worth i have a judgement on a guy out in denver.started at 17k,17 yrs later it's probably 40k with intrest,but the guys good ,he keeps everything out of his name and you can't touch him.
i'd sell you that judgement for 500...........................................
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/13/2009 3:03 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Edited 9/13/2009 3:21 pm by alwaysoverbudget
"I would hate to evict right now in commercial. No tellin when you would get another tennant or if you ever could "
ha ha ,thanks for the encouragement!
my stuff is little stuff,2000 sf rent in the 1300 a month range. so what i get is mainly guys getting started,so that right there sets things up for problems. kinda what i said about the jeweler. most guys have no idea what overhead is going to cost them.
i will say,a guys attitude means everything to me. if a guy has tried and failed and is broke,keeps communication open with me,please just move on so i can go again.thats really where the guy is i have now.
now if a guy has the money and drags on paying just playing games i will spend a 1k just to get a judgement,just to dog him a little.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I'll find out what the price was 10 years agoBut I think you're right - there is a history of failed businesses at that locationProbably many other similar locations in town - if you really wanted to research itYou were talking about the business and it needing $1,000 in profit per day to make ends meetThat seems like an incredible amount of money to try to keep your head above waterWhen I was a small child back in the early 1960's my parents bought a dime store and I worked there through high schoolAt the end of the day everyday we would count the money and then put it in the deposit bag and take it to the "night drop" at the local bankWe would make about $100 per day - that's what the business gross receipts wereWe made a living on that $100 per day. Paid a couple of employees. Paid all the expenses etcWe didn't have much anything. Kind of lower middle class lifestyleHome cooked meals everyday though. Great food.Dad worked six days a week and then part of sundays to clean up and do some maintenance to the building
You cant do that anymore . Honestly that doesnt sound like near enough.
I had a farmers market . It had to take in 1000 dollars not profit to operate. You have that turned around I believe . At a grand per day I didnt get a dime . Some days dont make it and some do kinda thing . I worked Sunday alone so it could make it and was seriously understaffed, lol. I didnt do any cleaning , stocking , or working produce. I just manned the registrar. The girls didnt like comming in Monday morning but they didnt understand . I only ran about 800 on Sunday so it wasnt a win but I fought off losses a little bit. I didnt have a day off so I took the liberty to read the paper while I was taking care of customers. That chapped them as well if they dropped in .
They just didnt understand and neither do you . If I had not ran 90 hours a week which most of it was on the route I would not have made it . My wholesale business kept me afloat . When I bought the business from my dad that wanted out becuase of sickness, I asked if I really needed those coke machines out side . It seemed like a ot of trouble to me . He said son you will soon learn you need it all and then some . As it turned out he was right . Not only was I working 90 hrs per week with out a day off I still had to look forward to seasons to pay taxes and such I could not have paid with out those seasons . Most stores prey off holidays and for part that went along with me too but only a spin off effect. I sold about 5 truck loads of oranges and grapefruit . About Jan 1 till March 15 there was nothing other than cold storage stuff to sell which dont very well. Strawberries are first and mark the starting line for the year that ends Jan 1. All taxes and stuff has to be paid up before jan 1. The paymnets needs paid up and everything else till april 1.
Those that dont operate like that or have it in the bank dont make it .
Tim
when i first got in the used car business,i had about 10k inventory,maybe 5-6 cars.but i was working in the shop doing bodywork on customer cars, so maybe 8 hours a week in the car sales.
would sell probably 5 cars a month,probably made 900 per car,it was great,i thought i needed to get bigger. so over a period of a couple years spent alot of maoney setting the property up to sell cars. i'm plowing all profits back into inventory. finally was running about 200k in inventory about 40/50 cars on lot. selling 20 cars a month,profit about 2k a car. man i'm getting rich! no time for bodywork anymore as i'm putting in 60 hours a week on car sales.
at the end of the year we've moved 200 cars,made money on some lost on some,one thing,then another =lots of overhead.hail storms ,thief, other fun stuff and at the end of the year i'm making maybe 15k. finally got smart and closed the deal down, overhead chews you up so slowly sometimes you don't see it.
as i go back and read this,sounds like rentals,somehow they slowly take up all your time to the point you can't see daylight........................
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/13/2009 10:03 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Edited 9/13/2009 10:05 pm by alwaysoverbudget
I talked to my brother and he said the price was $465,000 ten years agoPrice seems really high, but I guess don't know anything about commercial
i can see the right buyer for that property at 1/2 mil.walgreen,quicktrip etc. it is a great location
talk about overhead p&i is probably 4500,taxes on a 1/2 mil would be around 1500. a month, then insurance for another 500. so your payment will be around 6500. don't think i'm interested for a rental.lolthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Guys like you and Tim have probably saved a lot of money over the years by doing the repairs yourself.It's got to be a lot more difficult to make it work as a landlord when you're paying someone else to do the repairsCase in point.About a year ago a realtor called me and asked me to bid on a fence for a rental(the realtor is the property manager)I went and looked at it and the fence was falling down in a nice home Probably built in the 1970's or 80'sThe owner of the property is a physician in calif and he owns 50+ rentals in wichitaI wasted a couple of days looking at the job, determining the cost of materials, submitting my bid etcI think I bid $1,500 to install the fence in an ordinary back yardMy bid was $1,000 for my labor and it seems like the materials were about $500.Never heard back from them.I wonder what kind of numbers they were hoping for?Looking back, I was bidding at about $20 per hour for my labor to do the fenceI'm guessing they found someone to do the job for $10 an hour (or less)Live and learn I guess
Ill take a shot at this one .
"
Guys like you and Tim have probably saved a lot of money over the years by doing the repairs yourself."
Ive never looked at it like that . My insurance agent thinks its odd . Ive got commercial policies in a group on my rentals . All this guy handles is commercial so I guess what I do is odd. Larry too. Most people hire work done in this business.
Im sure when Larry was in the auto body business he did the fender repair and the painting . A brick layer actually lays brick and so on that you call on the phone . When I had the painting and drywall business I was the lead man on the job most of the time unless I had two crews and I would float back and forth. I finally settled in drywall so I could stay on the job.
I never figgured this was any different .
Theres not enough money in rentals if you dont own them out right to hire help. This is where Ill answer Blue.
Tim
"Guys like you and Tim have probably saved a lot of money over the years by doing the repairs yourself.
It's got to be a lot more difficult to make it work as a landlord when you're paying someone else to do the repairs."
Here's a question that has been rolling around in my ever since you guys started this thread.
When you say "paying someone else" and are suggesting it costs a lot more, are you saying that paying someone else to do the work includes paying their overhead, profit, etc.? Or are you saying that it costs more to pay someone else because you can do it for only the cost of materials?
I can understand that paying a plumber may cost $75/hr., whereas you can do it yourself for $35/hr.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
As a lanlord labor doesnt matter if its your own. What ever the task.
When you work for someone else you are taxed . You only get paid one time and you are square. You are never SQUARE unless you sell a rental. Theres people here better at math than me including you. I dont know how to arrive at a formula for it but its a great difference between money spent and none spent . More than it looks like . Not only do you have to pay the plumber but mebbe interrest on him for 15 years and every time you get a rent check for the next 15 years a little bit of that plumber is comming back to haunt you. That 275.00 doesnt get clear till 15 years later and even then hes cost you a little profit every month for 15 years. You can never get that back. Its like sex as they say.
Had I done it my self it would have been a loss of my time , one time , and then Im done with it . No taxed income involved. NO profit margin to pay the plumber . No inspection fee. First thing a plumber will do is get a permit and the building department loves return inspections. Then every thing else is up for his display. I dont have to worry about keeping my plumbers license . <G> One of the hardest things for a BI to do is run rank on a homeowner that doesnt open the door . I learned a long time ago talking in the trades is a bad deal. Even a visitor can eat up some profit . Lock the doors and work. Dont ever give up any information that doesnt pay benifit . If I had been fixit there would not have been an inspector pondering over a garage door opener.
"Had I done it my self it would have been a loss of my time , one time , and then Im done with it . No taxed income involved."
That's my point exactly.
If you're working on the rental (for "free") you're not able to make money on the big drywall job you had to turn down.
I'm not willing to look at my time as not having a cost associated with it. Even if I don't "charge" myself for my labor, I would still like to know that the rental house that the tenants "bought" for me cost me 500 hours over a 15 year time span.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I've always looked at it the same way Jon.
There aint no free lunch.
"If you're working on the rental (for "free") you're not able to make money on the big drywall job you had to turn down."
Mebbe better said , thats the issue.
Checks and balances.
I never said my work to the rentals was free. Far from it .
You could pay me the going rate to drywall a job and I could mark that time spent . Lets just say it was 40 hrs ,. Put profit or what ever you want on it I dont care . Im gonna owe taxes on it . You are gonna give me a tax form. So after its done Ive realized half of what the amount you paid me in the neighborhood.
Thats 40 hrs of work for 20 hrs of pay. Dont make excuses its any different to me . Theres no retirement in there either . I break my back its on me . I get old its too bad.
That 20 hrs of work could possibly pay me back for 40 years in a rental. We dont know . 100 times , 1000 times? Theres no way to know . I know one thing and here it is ;
I can figgure my time for both your job and a flip. Come up with a value per hour. Ill be way ahead in value with the flip. Now it can be a flip or a rental. So the rental pays more value for worked hours than a job.
Now the trouble is it doesnt pay on friday. Its an investment over time .
Tim
Tim,I understand what you are saying.One question- if I pay a plumber $275 for repairs, won't that come off of the basis for capital gains?So in effect, the fact that you are performing the labor yourself means you are missing out on a deduction of $275?I've never sold a property that I've held over two years so I'm not quite sure.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
NEVER,ever spend money for a tax deduction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
because all it does is give you a 30%? reduction in what you spent,if that.you eat the other 70%.pay the plumber 275,uncle sam eats 90, the other 185 is out of your pocket. thats my wages right there.
now if you HAVE to spend money,make sure you can deduct it somewhere.
to answer that question,if you pay a plumber 275.00 you deduct that in that tax year as a repair to offset rental income. now if that plumber comes in and says you have to have a new sewer cost 10k,that is a capitol improvement. you would depricate over a 7-10 year[?] period. so you would have a 1000. a year deduction. lets say you decide to sell at year 3. you would have a basis of 7k more for the capitol improvement that you have not fully depricaited.i try and make sure anything i do is repairs not capitol improvements,it's a fine line.i want to deduct what i spent the year i spent it.
now back to working on these things for free.
i do almost all repairs to mine also. like tim said,there anit no paycheck on friday. if i wanted to i could charge my labor against the rentals, lets say 20.00 a hour. so on friday i get a paycheck for 800. for 40 hours. then i pay 14% ss that i will never see,pay state and federal tax. so i could net maybe 550. i lost 250 in taxes but i could right off the expense on the rentals. with a 800 deduction doing repairs i would save the same in state and fed that i spent up above,but would lose the 14%ss. plus if i was to write off 800x50 weeks = 40k plus what i would spend on materials,irs would have me sitting at their desk telling me what all i have to set up on a deprication scheldue.
i have 20 of these rentals,they keep me busy,i don't have time to go make a living doing something else,that is the big drawback,what i make on the rentals is my wages. i'm like tim i had 8 and could cruise with them while making money somewhere else,by the time i hit 10 it became full time. and to tell you the truth i never planned on being a full time landlord,but here i am.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Larry answered the business questions . Hes much better than me at that.
No more to say on that. Hes correct.
Tim
Ive got a story kinda like that .
I bought 1 acre at a tax sale for 775.00. It was a property that a gas company had owned that went out of business. Another company called me and wanted to lease it to drill a gas well on. That would totally ruin the land and one acre doesnt pay enough royalties. We are talking about just a lease for 600 per year for a 10 year contract. I want the money up front .
What is the value of my time?
That seems like a good investment. $600 on a $775 investment is an annual ROI of 77% (not adjusted for future value). Even if it's wasted at the end, if you have no liability, where's the problem?What did you tell them?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
"(not adjusted for future value)."
That was really my point . It has to to adjusted over 10 years because I want the full amount up front.
Im waiting for them to cough up the full amount . The spot has been pilot tested and it conforms . Thats why they want it and because it was selected to put one on. Most of the time a gas well site has to be bought and bying a piece of someones land can be tricky because of the noise and ruins. No one wants to live close to one going bump bump bump , 24/7, 365. Ive got what they want but its going to be a high price to payup front . They want to pay it out a year up front per year . I said no. The property is worth 10 grand to me . One acre surrounded by national forrest. The goverment isnt selling or they wouldnt be talking to me . This has been going on for three years but they got some Obama money from somwhere comming shortly.
So the ROI is on the full amount .
My point was too that the same type of thing can happen in rentals . So this story was for your problem of working for free. This is the type of thing I do. I bought a house for 25grand , rented it for 5 years and sold it for 79,900. I made about 300 per month off the house for 5 years above payments . I never ever put one penny in it out of my pocket . So if you want to figgure profit theres no deductions on it except my time . Free labor isnt a problem. Getting paid for it on friday is becuase bills come in every month. The proportion of value to time spent is so minor I dont even bother figgurring it . It was a 100 percent loan.
You have to pull dollar bills from my clenched hands though unless it holds value to me . I try to live off what I didnt have to spend. Thats the landlord way. Thats why the thinking of paying 275.00 to a plumber is against a landlords thinking systems. Theres no data for that in his mind. Theres no understanding .
Tim
Edited 9/15/2009 6:43 pm by Mooney
"I bought a house for 25grand , rented it for 5 years and sold it for 79,900. I made about 300 per month off the house for 5 years above payments . I never ever put one penny in it out of my pocket."
That's one of my problems right there. I cannot seem to touch a house for less than $90k, and that will require $20-30k (retail, paying myself {actually the company} for labor) of work. Who knows what it will sell like in 5 years.
But the problem is I think I would be hard pressed to make $100 net a month on the rent. With PITI and minimal management time (=money), it just doesn't seem like a winner. If I could risk my funds for the future payoff, that would be one thing, but that's not the position I'm in.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
"That's one of my problems right there. I cannot seem to touch a house for less than $90k, and that will require $20-30k (retail, paying myself {actually the company} for labor) of work. Who knows what it will sell like in 5 years."
Things I always think about ;
If yer not in a hand , you cant win it .
If you dont go fishin yer not gonna have any fishin stories.
The way wolves work you would think they would eventually starve . But ever now and then the make a cache. As the old sayin goes an old blind sow will find an acorn every now and then.
I take on a lot of different kinds of projects. Youre out there lookin and you find all kinds . Every time you match your self up with the property. Fire houses have been good to me . No one seems to want them and contractors bid them very high . Carps want to work in nice conditions putting up crown molding I guess. They are perfect for me . Most of the tme I use the washer and dryer on the job to wash my work clothes I keep on the job. Somtimes I shower on the job. I look like black sambo for a while . Other wise I bring a carry on luggage bag and change on the job. I eat there as well. Theres so much haul off thats wet and junky that no one wants to get in there . Normally theres black everywhere with a ton of water dumped on it . I bought my last one for 21,000 and it sold in three months for 100,000. I got 90 grand . I did most every thing on that job by myself .
Torn up repos are my main stay. The more green slime the better. Roaches running across the cabinets are a welcome sight . A ton of old clothes and furniture laying around help as well. The worse they look the better I like it . Busted doors and holes in drywall , bring it on. Ruined carpet that smells so bad you cant stay in there is always a nice buffer. What ever would make your wife throw up is my best buys .
Those are the houses you are looking for . They arent found by an agent . They are in the paper as burned and you go see. All house fires make the paper . The repos are in the last page under legals ,you will lose your property ads. They list the address , the name , and somtimes you have to call for a pay off or starting amount . You get used to doing it . You get a system and get comfortable with it . I have to break in most of them because theres no keys left with anyone . Thats always good too. Most people wont break in a house . How are they going to bid if they havent been inside ? Finances needs to be in order to move quickly. If you cant buy the day of sale yer wasting all your time looking . That has to be in order.
Larry and I find one house per year to keep. I can get by on a couple more to flip.
More peple tell me they cant find a house. I told Larry about two in a site he posted. One was a flip or a live in for two years and the other was a rental. My wife looked at the flip and so did larry. It was the real deal. None of us looked at the rental but it looked like it would work.
They are out there but you have to be as well.
Tim
"as i go back and read this,sounds like rentals,somehow they slowly take up all your time to the point you can't see daylight........................"
Exactly. Thats the problem Ive been complaining about . When I had 5 and under I worked full time somewhere else . Of course I was younger and in better health. In a better mood with a better out look . etc> LOL
You guys sound like Dr Jekll and Mr Hyde. When you talk about the benefits of owning rentals, you claim there isn't a better vehichle. Then, when you talk about the realities of dealing with tenants and houses, you sound like you'd never do it again that way if you could start over.
There must be a better way in real estate, eh?
theres not a day that goes by i don't wonder "what if" i would of done something different. this deal is tough,not everyone should be in it.
i'm just a high school grad, with lousy academic skills,aka not that smart,but with some great common sense.that hasn't had a boss since i was 20, {34 years ago}. so far i haven't missed a meal. i know there are people that would shovel the brown stuff to make a living working for themselves,so i know i am fortunate to be able to do that.[although today i got the new premium for health ins,working for somebody doesn't seem that bad]
but once in awhile i take a deep breath and see where i'm at. real estate has had a few bad days for me. but i know deep down nowhere,and i mean nowhere ,could i be where i'm at doing anything else,and thats what keeps me plugging along. that is why i would recommend to anyone to look at investing in real estate,then decide if thats something they want to do.
there are something like 500 post on this thread,most related to rentals.if anyone thinks owning real estate is like what they see on sunday morning infomercial tv,making millions while crusing on their yacht with 5 models,they just need to read this thread.
it's like everything "if it was easy everyone would do it"
signed
mr. hyde.
p.s jekll will be along shortlythe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I can see where it sounds that way.
I dont really know all the ways of being in it .
My way and Larrys way we got in it was from a poor mans game . His is a little different but also a lot the same .
After Jesus was born I started out with a 100 percent loan with a banker that trusted me that was also the president . I had the money to fix the house and it got appraised for the loan . We did the loan as a construction loan so the appraisel had to show the value when I was done . The numbers worked . I still worked full time earning a living as did Larry. My first one was bought for 32 grand on the court house steps with a letter of credit good for payment in 30 days or a good deed on demand . The house rented for 450 dollars and away we went . The house paid for it self . Its worth 75 grand right now .
That is an exellent savings plan. After I got 12 houses I realized I had a business that took a lot of time .Ive got 15 now and paying for them its not a good living . It would be if I owned them. Id like to sell down to what I can own out right . Ive just stumbled along doing this with out professional training . I could have done much better with an advisor I believe. I am a professional at getting a house ready to flip doing the work or getting a rental ready for business. It seems that as the business takes time away from my specialty the worse I do. I had thought seriously of quitting at 5 houses. Work full time and handle those 5 on 15 year notes and viola . A solid retirement . Take nothing from them until then. A good plan.
Ive always been told about the 5 rule and it applies to rentals . 5 painters can make you a living . No less and no more. Good arguements there. My father agreed with the principle . You can still work lead and handle 5 men and the business. Its a full time job and a half . I ran 4 on a drywall crew . I could be gone for a awhile but I stayed on the job most of the time . I hired 5 when I started commerical work. Just for kicks I layed back and let them do the work under my supervision. In other words I didnt get any mud on me . I coached and taught all day and gave light orders . I unlocked the job in the morning and closed it up at night . I made sure things were put away and things done . I made the same amount of money. I was expecting a difference. But it was easiar . Ive watched the 5 rule all my life .
Id like to own 5 and still flip.
It was a saving vehicle to real estate for a poor man. Not an excellent living paying for them. It was always a saving plan. I just didnt know how or where it was gonna end up. It did make an exellent savings plan. Ive never been able to save big amounts of money any other way. Some people can bank 10 percent of their net to savings and make a relegion out of it . I never could do it .
Tim
i came in from the north side of the house,interesting neighborhood,then all of a sudden you pop out onto a nice paved street with new house's!
if you can figure out how to build for that,let me know i want lots of em.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I re-read your message about your system and organization and you've really got it down I wish we were running like a well oiled machine, but we're not.I'm trying to get better organized and avoid wasting time running to home depot for a wax ringI'm putting together a cheat sheet to help me get better organized.This is info to help me put together an accurate materials orderTry to cut down on trips to home depot.Here's what I'm looking at:*buy contractor packs of masking tape, blue tape, plastic drop cloths, masking paper, caulking, liquid nails, white nylon plumbing tape, paint try liners, etc* 50 screws per 3 X 5 hardibacker* 77 ft of tile for bathtub (tub to ceiling)* one 50 lb bag of versabond thinset per 80 feet of tile - gray is cheaper than white* one 25 lb bag of grout per 175 ft of tile (1/4 spacing)* Texturing walls and ceiling - one 48 lb box of mud per 11 pcs of 4 X 8 drywall* 400 ft of coverage per gallon of paintWe're going to start going with the "speed connect" bathroom sink faucets. They cost a little more than the glacier bay but we're tired of fighting the cheap glacier bay faucets and wasting a lot of time with the pop up drain assembly (we install them, they leak, we take them apart, try again, they leak, repeat process,(.Here's what we're going withhttp://www.homedepot.com/Bath-Bathroom-Faucets-4-Centerset-Sink-Faucets/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xhfZarze/R-100684604/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
i'm going to pitch ebay to you again. your paying 40 for that faucet plus what 7% tax.42.80
heres a much nicer single handle at 16.00 each,8.00 shipping each .24.00 and it's deliverd to your door.
http://cgi.ebay.com/6X-Price-Pfister-Chrome-Brass-Bathroom-Faucets-NEW_W0QQitemZ360185766126QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item53dcbea0ee&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262 it even comes with 9.00 worth of lines attached.
heres some at 13.00 to your door.
http://cgi.ebay.com/6-Price-Pfister-Pfirst-Pol-Chrome-Sgl-Cont-Bath-Faucet_W0QQitemZ360185846092QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item53dcbfd94c&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262
with what you guys are doing i'd buy a couple cases at a time.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/7/2009 10:51 pm by alwaysoverbudget
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Industry-group-proposes-apf-4230709987.html?x=0
What do you make of that?
Either move the box (recpt) or see about maybe getting a longer cord on the opener (thats, listed and has been approved by the manufactur).
Moving the box would be my first choice, so that the whole cord change -out scenario doesn't have to be repeated when the opener gets changed out.
We had the garage door opener installed last week.I was talking to the installer and asked if we were supposed to pull a permit to install a garage door openerHe said "yes"It is my understanding most people DO NOT pull a permitHe said "did you notice I don't have my business sign on my truck?"And I said "yes"I said "why?"He said "because I don't want the city officials to see me sitting in a drive way installing a garage door opener when I don't have a permit"He said "If I got caught, I pay a fine of $50 to $75"(I don't remember the amount)He said "the homeowner gets a fine of $250"I said "you're kidding"
Thats giving me and Larry the hebee jeebees.
Shouldnt be an inspector involved in our opinion. If you did the work there wouldnt be .
why does there need to be a permit?did he do electrical work also,or just hang the unit and plug it in?
i swear how do you screw up a door opener to the point they need to inspect all installs.
my biggest problem with them are setting the dang codes. if the inspector would do that as a kind of co deal,i'd let em inspect.lol
you ever move back here you won't know what to do without all those inspections,and thats a good thing.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
If I leave I would be missing out on all the fun we're having.Here's where I'm at as of today.I started on our current project two weeks ago.Our demo crew had completed their work.Memo to self.Do not let demo crew work unsupervised.Our demo crew took sledge hammers, chain saws, and crow bars to the inside of the home.They are like a swarm of ants destroying everything in their path.This is fine EXCEPT WHEN WORKING ON A WALL WHICH CONTAINS A LOT OF PLUMBING AND ELECTRICAL.The other problem we're having is if they demo a wall and the drywall is soaking wet from years of plumbing leaks THESE GUYS ARE NOT TELLING US.We'll get it worked out.
Here's our current projectIt's about 900 sq ft, 1 car, built in 1980's?, 1 car, 2 bath, finished basement, and SIX BEDROOMS
here's the pic
Here's the kitchen with the demo completedWe've open the wall between kitchen and living room
better picture of the half wall between kitchen and living room
we scraped PAINTED popcorn texture off the ceilings
Im gonna be sleeping with the devil.
Im changing real estate agents.
I picked an investor agent . Hes also a broker that owns an office .
I was working on the cabin to day and he met me out there.
We had a long talk. He was about to leave and he said , by the way Im gonna give you your fist lead from me . I said ok. He said theres a little house down town that 20 grand will buy it and it will take 5 grand to fix it . It should be worth 40 grand fixed. 2 bd 1 bath 950 sg ft with a one carport .
Thats as cheap as Ive heard about . Nothing but a small frame house . Still very cheap.
Most people would read your message and say wow I could buy a house for $20 "I paid more for my car than that"Something we're just learning is what a difference a small 8 X 8 or
10 X 10 deck will make ON THE FRONT OF THE HOUSEA lot of those old houses have a small concrete step and the deck will really change the look of the houseWe just did this to our house and I'll take some picture of it to show youIt took day and a half to buildThe guy that did it has built so many he could do it with his eyes closed
Thats why I switched agents partly.
The lady Ive got isnt doing any thing extra for me . I told him that and he got stone faced . I busted out laughing . I explained she didnt know what a good deal looked like or where to find it . I told him she was a pretty lady that was good at showing houses but lacked what him and I know . She works for a a better agency but its full of wimmin. I wouldnt have got that tip from them. I know since he does what you and I are doing he knows what to look for and Im sure the tip will be solid .
Ive asked agents before the same question and they sent me to dumps that wasnt worth repair.
I figgure Ill give him some work and see how he handles it . PLus Im just a little whizzed off . That house has been up for about two weeks and its been shown once that I know about . They have it for 90 days and IM thinking mistake . I told him he could have the cabin for 30 days . If he got a contract within the 30 days I would extend it out to the due date of contract. So hes got 30 days to get paper on it . I was a little surprized he took it . He was hard selling 6 months . I said we have nothing to talk further about . Youre not getting this cabin for any thing close to 6 months. He thought we could settle on three months and I told him we couldnt . I doubled his percentage and he took the 30 days . Mebbe now he will "work" to sell it instead of putting it up and waiting for another agent to sell anything hes listed. I believe thats whats happening on the house right now .
How bout some tips in that area ?
How does one move agents away from the coffee pot ?
They set the price . Broker today said mebbe they set it to high and will wait a while for you to come down. Old trick he said . Aint workin on me . They will loose the rest of my business for a stunt like that .
Tell me if Im weird on this or not ; [I can take it ]
I look at an agents job being like one I would do for them except to be fair one thing . I have control of the job if they leave me alone . An agent doesnt have control of buyers. Still I expect more times at bat than one in two weeks . I know its Friday but Ill be back next Friday to finish your only bathroom. That wouldnt hunt .
Just a few thoughts1. Have her show you the 10 homes currently for sale that she feels you are competing with.I'm guessing this would be:*other ranch style homes the same size as yours*larger homes needing work*homes with two car garage that are needing work*homes with a basement needing work*newer homes that are smaller*bi-level homes*tri-level homesOthers?Ride around with her and let her show you some of the homes that are the same price as yours.Your realtor can drive you by a house and tell you how long the house has been on the market.Have her show you the most recent home that went under contract that's similar to yours.Check it out and see what you think.Have her show you the most recent home that sold.Check it out and see what you think about it.Are you competitive with them?I would like to see you getting 2-3 showings per week Ask your Realtor to have an open house this weekend and then get a full report from her (1) how many people attended. (2) what did the people say about your house and the price.Your realtor probably doesn't have any prospective buyers.Is she getting any calls from having her sign in the front yard of your house? YOu might ask that she get on the phone and call at least one other local realtor EVERY SINGLE DAY and tell them about your house and ask if they have anyone.Have your realtor report back to you what she's hearing from the other realtors.Ask her to have one of her friends (another realtor) take a look at the house and see what they think.I'll close by saying you can't expect her to pay for a newspaper ad every single day. Try it in the Sunday paper in the real estate section. It's a long shot.Does she have signs on the street corners directing traffic your way?What's your thoughts?
I think;
If you hired me you wouldnt have to hold may hand to get me to do my job.
She was the one that came up with the comparisons and then the price . That was her decision. If I have to do her job then yea mebbe I better go look at the comparables. I trusted her because shes a pro and Im not at knowing the market.
Ive got a pet peeve on doing drive bys any way. As you know a lot of money can be tied up inside a home or a lot of neglect . Seems to me we are still trying to wash our feet with our socks on doing drive bys .
Still on that subject . Its my number one pet peeve with apraisiors . You polish off a house and they get comparibles that haent been remodeled .
I guess IM gonna have to sit her down and have a chat . Im very unhappy right now . Shes very soft so Im gonna have to do it with gloves on.
A sign in the yard wont sell that house . 95 percent of the people dont know where that addition is and the same number didnt know it existed. Its in an older part of town. Someone bought a house that had a mini horse farm of 4 acres behind it . They made a culdesac and there ya are. Its one of those houses you have to make several turns just to get there . When you leave the house theres 6 different ways to get out of town. The house is on Miller Circle which is off MIller St which is a dead end street on both ends. You have to enter Miller from an interjecting street becuase you can not enter MIller from either end. Theres no thourough fare street connecting Miller either . I say its nestled behind the college three blocks and that it is . The college in its growth has cut the streets off around it . That caused the jig and jagging . Its now a university with the fine help of the walton foundation.
It was the hardest location to rent I have and they are both nice houses . Once I got them to view it they rented them. Once you are there its a serinity feeling becuase of the lack of traffic and noise. Its very quiet especially in the culdesac. Thats what she needs to attack.
It does have an awsome yard as every one has noticed. She needs to reach out to the other realators as you say . She needs to tell them she has a wonderful place to raise a small child. I think that needs to be the lead in the paper . The kid could not be ran over unless it was sleeping behind the passenger back wheel. NO one passing by to steal a kid although it doesnt happen here. Theres not any thing but local traffic on Miller .
I think you sell the house and the location instead of comps for a deal. If Im high we will adjust it but it wasnt me that priced it .
You bring up another good point Ill address . The best realator Ive ever seen continually calls people . He starts at 7 am catching people at home before they leave and calls till 10 pm in the evening . He doesnt burn gas unless hes showing or listing . Come by to see me and we will discuss it . Drop by when you can the message will say , Ive got somthing for you . He always leaves a come on message.
My gurl works 8 hrs a day at light and water as the head mans secretary. Shes good looking and very personable . Shes exellent on the phone and in person. What else would you expect ? Shes gonna charm you not pin you down like a closer. Shes a no pressure girl and apologizes for bothering you . Shes just what her boss needed. She is very comfortable to be around . She works evenings and weekends as an agent . Shes divorced and has been for some while . Her Ex died last year and theres no remorse over him. She has nothing good or bad to say about him so she doesnt carry that baggage in conversation. She claims she works 40 hrs a week in RE. I dont doubt it but shes not efficient with her time She will come by to get a signature and eat supper and spend the evening with us . It was very hard to think about pulling the trigger on another agent .
My best thought on an open house is it wont do any good unless they can call her for directions . I dont think thats how open houses work.
Tim
Tim;
Your paperwork and "application" approach sounds pretty solid as far as being able to screen the renters. One trick I've heard is to refer to the HUD rules on how many feet a person needs to have in a bedroom. If the rooms are small, you can usually restrict it to one person, no double bunking. It's illegal to discriminate based on the fact that they have kids, probably federal law. It's not illegal to say no because the kids aren't well behaved or something along those lines.
As far as getting a judge to evict somebody the same day, I think you're pretty lucky. In NY, the laws are too tenant oriented. We had one where the tenant was arrested or convicted for child molestation, and there were kids living in the other apartment in the same house. It took over a week to get into court, using an expedited procedure, and but for the fact that he went to jail, it would have taken another 45 days.
In VA, things move a little quicker, but the "residents" still need to be served and court dates are often two - four weeks away. Also need to get the Sheriff to put them out if they don't go voluntarily, and that's a few more weeks.
You sound like you're in a good area. Lots of potential tenants, affordable houses decent rents. Good for you.
Proabably somthing got lost in meaning and mebbe not .
I offer to move them out on the day they say they dont have rent . First I say its a good day to move . I will actually argue about it . But I have no legal right to evict them that day. I can threaten to ruin their credit which I cannot unless they never pay it can go on their record. I use all the leverage or bluff I can within the law . One time I told a tenant to be out that day becuase I was going to burn the property down the next morning . One told me she would need two weeks to move out . I said I dont think you will really want to be here after tomorrow .
Legally after they are 5 days late I can serve an eviction unless several factors of damage to property , kids mistreated , too many guests that are damaging the property , Over night guests not on the contract , utilities turned off , etc. Several reasons such as those give me rights to secure my property. If DHS is called things really get going fast . After the eviction notice is served they have 10 days . If they are not out by then they get served papers by the judge to appear in court for not abiding . They are gone by then. 15 days max is all Ive ever had a renter not wanted past eviction notice. Im banging on the door every day trying to get them out verbally. Most of the time I can talk them out . Ive thrown their stuff out and changed the locks illegally. But then Ive heard of a landlord havig to pay for all the items . Ive moved their stuff out to a rented storage and handed them the key which is illegal. So far we have never had a ruling against a landlord here for doing that . If it happens Ill write a check . It will be the best money spent . As long as people owe you leaving they dont normally have any thing to say in court. Odds are in the 95 percentle.
I have a right to refuse a rental to anyone as long as its not sex , relegion , race , etc. The law says I can refuse service to anyone , except,.... Im not sure they have a legal right to know with out a court hearing . I know they have the right to know but I dont have to give the answer until its in court . They have to make that happen and they need grounds if they are going to take it to a judge.
Posession they say is 9/10s of the law . I dont know about that but it sure weights the odds a bunch.
i always heard that posession is 9/10 of the law,but got to test that awhile back.
had a trailer stolen,i had built it 20 years ago so nothing special ,but i liked the size of it [4.5 x12].
so it comes up missing ,i make areport on it. now you would of thought this was a 40k trailer,i alsways kept my eyes out for it. no luck
2.5 years later i'm headed to lunch,go through a intersection and think' "that looked like my trailer" it was. so called the cops,had my report in hand.his story was "he bought it at a bar". cop knew it was mine.
long story,but it came down to he had it,i didn't. if i had it to do over again i would of hooked on to it and went. i had pictures showing it behind my car years ago.now he would have to prove it was his.
ready for the ending, i had to negotate thru the cops to buy it back! guy said he'd spent 50.00 on it in the 2.5 yrs he had it,so i had to pay that. told the cop i wanted 10.00 a day rental but that didn't fly.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
1/2 of this job is reading people. then run the bluff if you can. some you can't they know what they can get by with and i think the internet has helped that. i swear there must be a site "my landlord is evicting me,what can i do?"
if everything goes to plan here. i serve on the 3rd of the month a 3 day notice to cure. no money it then goes to court and file,takes a bout 7-10 days to get to court. they don't show up,move on to eviction. if they do show and ask for a trail that prolongs it another 7 days.
then you get in front of a judge and who knows,i had a couple that hadn't paid,they told the judge the couldn't pay. she stood there crying it's her "home",judge says you have to move, i'll give you 30 days,bam hammer drops.to bad landlord,your rich ,you don't need the money.
but i have had 2 instances where i read that these people were at the end of there rope. a guys married,has a black gf on side,gets her pregnant,wife ties up his bussiness completely so he can't even move to a motel.i serve a eviction notice and he lays a 357 on his desk and i had no question in my mind if i wanted to stand there and push him he would pull the trigger,then on himself. i just backed off and it took about 30 days for the wife to get his inventory and i changed locks.
one that just happened this year,evicted a guy from a bussiness,which effectivly put him under. 45 days later he hung himself. what really bothered me is he only lived about 3 minutes from me,so he could of blamed me for his problems and been here to settle the score.lawyer tells me my judgement is probably going to come in at less than 100.00 from his estate.lol
you have to know when people have nothing to lose and figure out someway else to get them out.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
On the 5th of the month my brother figures out who hasn't paid their rent and makes out a listI've seen the list laying on the counter top in the kitchenTwo of the renters are working with us now and both are good workers.Both are good guys and a pleasure to work with.
I still have no offer on that house . 5 weeks?
Got any suggestions?
Ive been talking to that agent . She says its priced right . Not low , not high. She says its market . Its the top of the market for that house but the house deserves it .
So now what ?
Edited 9/15/2009 8:07 pm by Mooney
do you think it's getting shown? if enough people trip through,pretty soon there will be a buyer. i know agents hate open houses. but it only takes 1 buyer.
i know that this isn't how this is suppose to work,but if i have a house for sale i'm personally placeing ads in local newspaper, craiglist, weekly church ,etc. i will put my number and the realtors number in.
a few years ago i had a real estate guy call that had a house of mine listed. asks "did you put a ad in sundays paper,yep. he had 3-4 calls and didn't know why.
i have my cabin halfazz for sale. told the agent heres a key,sell it i'll pay you. i think she has shown it twice. i keep a ad placed in kansas city,wichita,tulsa,rogers on clist every couple weeks. i have had 4 good nibbles from that.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/15/2009 9:59 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Its getting shown some but no offers.
Im proud of you getting aggressive . I havent done that . Looks like Im gonna have to. My cabin is ready now . I havent listed it yet . I told that agent she wasnt getting it because she hasnt sold the house .
That helped thanks .
Tim
The easy answer is to lower your price My brother puts these houses on the market and he prices them too highHe says, lets run it up the flag pole and see if anyone will bite.If nothing happens he lowers the price after 30 days.The clock is ticking for first time homebuyersTHEY HAVE TO GET IT UNDER CONTRACT BY NOV 1ST IN ORDER TO GET THE DEAL CLOSED BY NOV 30TH AND COLLECT THE TAX CREDITThey said on the news yesterday that there are no plans to extend the tax credit program
how'd you guys do on the one that was a little short on apprasial? sell it or put back on the market.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
It closed yesterdayHe told the other agent (the woman working with the buyer) that he was not budging on the pricetherefore it was her duty to "work it out" with the appraiserthe appraiser took a second look at appraised it for the purchase price(he raised the appraised value 5 K)I guess we had a happy ending
Yall concercerned over the tax rebate ending this fall?
Has it been a factor thus far with your buyers?
Ive been thinking about the marketiing of the cabin Ive just got done .
How about a course here on selling my self and offering one time showings to realators that call the ads wanting to list it ?
Ive always heard that if a person lists a house for sale by owner they will get covered up with agents calling . I thought that might be somthing to counter to them. Or am I crazy? Ive noticed yall arent selling your own where you are and I have wondered why with your back ground . Give us the scoop.
Feel free to put on a clinic. I need one .
Tim
The house we sold yesterday was to a young couple and they are first time homebuyersI happened to show the house to her (buyer) and she told me about how excited she was about the first time home buyer tax creditI was cleaning out the garage the day she drove by the house (her realtor had given her the address) and she was so excited she asked if she could look at the house and I walked her through the house and told her about all the work that had been done.She wanted the closing to be well in advance of the tax credit deadlineShe didn't want anything to happen and the deal fall through.She didn't want to lose the tax credit of $8,000 !!!Tim, to give you a little bit of background on how we're doing this - what we're doing is my brother is a realtor and so he is both the seller and the listing agent on these houses we're flipping.He owns the houses.When we're done fixing up the house he puts it on the market and puts his sign out in the yardSo, He gets a commission for listing his own house.It would kill him to have to pay a realtor to list the houseYou mentioned FSBO and having a flood of realtors contact you.I think you are correct on this.Here's how it would go down.You would list your house and interested realtors would have clerical staff send you a "packet" in the mail.The packet would include a warm cover letter and a few business cards. The packet might also include some brochures or even some CD's or DVD's (some are even professionally produced) showing the realtor standing beside his yard sign and talking to you about how he will help you "sell your home quickly and for top dollar"Some will have a gimmick.On realtor will offer to buy your home if he can't sell it in 60 daysAnother realtor will have a picture of him holding his dogAnother realtor will have a group picture with him and "his team" (office staff and realtors who assist him"Another realtor will offer a gimmick and say that he will "market your home not only locally, but statewide and nationwide"Another realtor will send you a list of the homes he has recently soldAnother realtor will send you a refrigerator magnet with a sports schedule on it.Another realtor will send you a key chainSome realtors will offer to pay for a home inspectionSome realtor may contact you telling you about his website and how many hits per day he is getting. He will claim to be able to sell your home via all his internet marketing.Someone will brag about how many homes they sold last yearAnother one will brag about working for a large companyThe next one will brag about working for a small companyOr they will have a brochure telling how they sold a house in only one daySome will talk about how many years they've been in the businessSeveral realtors will probably have the same slogan "your friend in real estate"In the end you will probably choose the young, attractive female realtor to list your cabin.
That was wonderful. Thank you . But keep it comming I dont want to stop laughing . Best laugh Ive had this week.
I dont think this town is in that select group but Ill be looking for a sports calender .
All their gonna get is a phone number in the paper . They will get the house address[cabin] but its very rural and will be too much trouble to get their butt out of their chair to find it . I guess since its a 911 address they might be able to look up the owner on data , com. Mebbe. If I give the house phone they will know who I am and could send mail to the home address . If I give a cell phone like I normally do they wont have a clue unless they call me . Right , wrong ? Renters never know when they call my cell phone and I dont give my home phone in the paper . Our phone directory has a cross reference in it . Id rather talk to them in person. I guess if I get sent cards I can call them all. This might be lots of fun.
Ok so your brother is an agent . I know the drill on that . They tried to recruit me several times to become one . Ive been told every thing about that.
I wanna know about selling it myself . An agent said she has stats it wasnt a good idea. Said the success rate was low . If it is , what are the faults that make it less desireable ?
They say it will be adverized but here it only gets in the paper once . I can run it every week .
They put a sign in the yard and somtimes arrow signs to the house . Ive got all that with rental signs . Ive got heavy realtor stands . Just change the sign.
Realator.com has a place , for sale by owner . Other internet places as well.
Then theres dial a trade radio for free. Agents cant use it for free but I can. 3 shows a day. I could pay for it too and not call in myself . Im wondering if I gave my name on the show people would remember the name and look it up after they miss the number.
Its on the mountain. Its hunting season. Thought about listing it as a cabin and the signs saying the same thing to draw traffic . Id have to have those signs painted or do it my self .
Thats all I got .
There are drawbacks to selling it yourselfRealtors will point those out to you as part of their pitchOne of the drawbacks is that statistically homes sell for less if they are FSBOThat's what they say anyway.When you think about it, how would the average person know what to sell their house for?You see, when you're a realtor you have access to the multi list data and informationYou can see what's on the market and current home prices.You can also see what sold last week. You can see how many days it was on the market.All of this is good information to have.When a realtor puts a house on the market and prices it, he has FACTUAL EVIDENCE to support the price of the home.Would you be able to defend your price if you list it yourself?Another obstacle for you is showing the cabin.You can run an ad in the paper and put your sign out in the yard and then go home and wait for the phone to ring.People will call you and want to see the cabin.You will drop what you're doing and go meet them there to show the house.You will walk them through the house.Will it be uncomfortable? Yes, probably, because they know you own the home and they will not feel comfortable about criticizing the colors you've chosen or the quality of the kitchen cabinets.The Buyer will expect you to lower the price since you're not paying a commission.Here's my final thought.Try it yourself for 30 days.If you don't sell it, go ahead and list it with a realtor.If you play your cards right, your realtor may even give you a set of pot holders as a gift to you at closing.
"
If you play your cards right, your realtor may even give you a set of pot holders as a gift to you at closing."
Nope , thats not what you said . Im holding out for the sports calender. I either get my sports calender or Im walking out of closing .
Well lets see. When I list a house for 85,000 and list it with a realator they charge me commision. Then when the buyer makes his offer they cut the price by 15 percent . If I take that were talkin about 20 percent or more of a cut . How is that any different selling it cheaper to the client myself ? NO body around here gives listed price for any thing .
Now I guess a realator never thought about this ;
100,000 dollar house listed with a broker . 7 percent commission . 15 percent deduction in offer . House sits for 6 months @ a cost of 600 per month equals 3600 dollars. Youre at the end of the 6 months and no aplause for that cowboys ride cause he didnt stay on 8 seconds . List her again? They dont talk about the negative that goes on every day.
Sold my last three FSBO.
You know as much or more as most realtors, you should be teaching classes.
Pick a number, put up the signs and see what happens.
That 6% will buy a lot of advertising. RE agents don't want to spend a penny on advertising,
Once they have the listing they think half the commission is theirs no matter who sells it.
Their advertising is put a sign in front and wait for the force of gravity to suck in a buyer.
Tried realtor.com on the last one ONLY because I needed a MLS # to get into the local give away real estate for sale magazine that is in every supermarket/7-11/hotel lobby in the area.
View Image
Think this ad was $275 for a full page. Also tried ebay, that was a waste but maybe for your cabin it would work. Assuming a smaller price tag?
Craigslist got a lot of hits and a few lookers. Also the local NiftyNickle got some interest. Actually sold it with a FSBO sign in front and fliers in the Take-me box.
Guess there's no telling which one will bring buyer, try them all. 6% is a bunch of advertising, way more than any realtor will buy.
Joe H
i have sold all mine myself except 2.
first listing with a agent has some negatives, first you loose complete control over how it's being marketed. alot of agents are listers,not sellers. they want to list ,get the sign up and forget about it. it may be your number 1 priority ,but not theres. another one is, they take 6% of the property. now if i was in ca 4 years ago and it's appreciating at 30% a year. ,who cares. but around here you have to own it for 5 years to get that 6% appreciation.
so selling on your own has it's problems also. one of the toughest ones is ,getting the buyer talking,you have to have dialogue to sell something. they don't want to say to you"thats the ugliest carpet i ever saw" because you just spent 1000 laying it. if their talking to a agent they can say"yea it is ugly,lets knock 1000 off and make them a offer" it starts getting them involved.
your the kind of guy that has no problem lowballing someone. but can you take it?lets say your asking 100k,i tell you i'll give 45k cash. how will you react? my wife can't take it [i got a whole story on this lol],i just smile and say thanks for your offer,but i'm just not able to sell it for that, but if your a cash buyer and can get to closing next week,i'd take 98k . now he's not going to bite,so here comes the next offer. you can never get upset with a offer,because i don't care how low it is,you don't have to sell,but your both talking and thats what it takes.the worst i ever had was a place at table rock,asking 40k,first offer 10k. nice thing is it doesn't take long to think about it. he finally came to 35. same day i got a offer from another guy at 35,i sold to him.:]
also if your selling yourself,have a contract with you,be ready to write it!!!!. know exactly what the taxes are,legal description,lot size,zoning,what will be their payments at asking price @ such and such interest. roughly what the closing will cost etc. if you have to get back with them in a couple days with this stuff,they maybe gone.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/17/2009 5:15 pm by alwaysoverbudget
i'm lmao,
"Nope , thats not what you said . Im holding out for the sports calender. I either get my sports calender or Im walking out of closing . "
only a guy that has got up and walked out of a closing can truly appreciate that comment.lol
ok so are you still thinking about selling yourself?
i know you have it ready ,so in todays world the next thing you have to do is take pictures,everybody wants you to email pics,so take lots.
next a nice 40.00 for sale sign in the yard with a info tube on top,i always laugh when a guy has a 100k house for sale and a 2.00 sign to advertise it. also being as it's a cabin i would guess it's not driven by alot,so get signs clear out to the busiest hwy/street with your address and everytime the have to make a turn you need another sign. you know where mooney lane is,but no one else does. stock that info tube with folders,you will go thru a lot,all the neighbors will empty it for the first couple weeks. being as it's a cabin you might even have a 2'x3' sign made listing it's amenities,in case the info tube runs dry. now heres where i go back to my car days,i put the price right there on the sign. whether it's high or low,it's your price and the guy driving by may think it's a steal.
being as it's a cabin, your distance for a buyer really goes out a long ways. i don't know for sure where this is, but look around at your neighbors, are they from ar,okla,ks,mo,tx? if they are you need to be out that far on cl. you can have ads running in lots of different cities for free. lets say you find most your inquires are coming from little rock,well then it might pay to spend some money in that town on advertising. if this is a hunting area maybe the sports stores there have a bulletin board etc.
this is all stuff that a average re agent won't go to the trouble doing,maybe it works maybe not, but you only need one guy to write the check.
oh,once you have your pics,if you can put them on a page that someone can view like snapfish,then you can just link them to it and they can look. i'm not smart enough on the computer [just look at my thread on ipods!] so i get the kid to do it.
showing it, what a pain.ours is 5 hours away,i don't know how far you are from yours but on my place when i talk to them on the phone,i tell em where it's at,tell em to make themselves at home,pull up a chair on the deck,watch the lake etc,told one guy to bring some hot dogs and fire the grill! if they like what they see i can have a guy come and let them in. if they call while sitting on the deck,i get them in with a key.i have there number and name by now and these are not the type of folks are going to do any harm.
now i haven't got mine sold yet so take all this with a grain of salt,lol i'm just not real motivated on ours and i have it priced accordingly,but next summer i might fire up to get it sold.
there are still buyers for this kind of property and hunters are a crazy breed,around here there are guys bying 600 acres of farm ground for 1.5 mil so they can hunt!
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/17/2009 5:47 pm by alwaysoverbudget
oh,if you have a agent call and say they have a buyer,tell em you will co-op and pay 3%. if you want to get their attention tell em 4%. thats more than they will make on 97% of there sales.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
step 1: get the cabin spotless cleanstep 2: make a brochure desribing the cabinstep 3: put your signs in the yard and run an ad in the paper. Offer to pay up to $3,000 of buyer's closing costs "with acceptable contract" (if you're agreeable)step 4: choose the title company where you would like to have the closing. Go talk to the office manager and tell her you have put your house on the market FSBO. She will give you a packet of what they will want from you and the buyer. It will be blank contract and maybe some of the other local forms they're using.She will walk you through the processstep 5: show the house and find the buyer. step 6: get contact signed and submitted to buyers lender and title companystep 7: coordinate with buyers lender and complete inspections and help the buyer get their homeowners insurance in placestep 8: go to closing and hand them the keys to their new home
you forgot, pick up the sports calander from closing.
or it's not happening.......................the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
lolLarry do you own any condos?
i own 1,it's over behind the old albertson store.i'd like to sell as i see those starting to take the slide.
what are they changing?the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Regarding FHA loans and condosCurrent requirement is at least 51% of the units be "owner occupied"This will change to 70% owner occupied.Another change will involve homeowner's association (HOA) dues Things have gotten so bad that many condo owners are not paying their duesLots of foreclosures & obviously those people are not paying and are falling behindIf dues are not being paid, HOA cannot pay for building & facilities upkeep and maintenanceFor the condo to be approved for an FHA loan, delinquency must be below 30%How on earth are they going to keep up with this and know who is compliant?This is going to result in additional headaches and expenses to a homeowners association (maintaining their FHA approved status) Edited 9/19/2009 8:19 am by mrfixitusa <!-- MRFIXITUSA -->
Edited 9/19/2009 8:21 am by mrfixitusa
well that will kick mine out.
those are some of the problems with these units. they are probably 70% investor owned. our dues run 500 a year and it's not enough to maintain the units.i bring up at every meeting we have to raise dues to get ready for roofs and siding someday. they all whine their not making money,so the roofs are 6 years out and no money to replace.
this is why i'm thinking i want out,they sell for 65 for a 3 bdr,2 bath,full basement.no garage. so lots of shelter for the money. i can't decide if i'm better to bank the 65k or just let it keep cranking rent at 700 a month and someday sell it for 35 all run down???????????
i wouldn't buy into another one.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Wow am I learning a lot .
I had no clue about condos .
Since yall mention this , I was in Hot Springs ,Ar. several years back looking for a house for my daughter . We looked three days straight and hard like we were doing it for a living . <G>
Anyway we found a house with the arangement of a condo in a gated community. I guess this is common around golf courses and such. But this wasnt the same thing as that . It had a quard house at the front gate with no guard. That should have been my first clue huh? It had an 8 foot fence around it and the entry was awsome . Exept the gate was open too. Inside it looked like a country addition but it had jogging sidewalks as they were called and they had conctrete paths for jogging through a pasture and through some woods that the community owned. In the middle of that was a volleyball court , tennis court , swimming pool, country baseball feild , an office that took fees with a community building attached. Behind that was a maintenence shop.
I went in and sat down with the lady. Got the scoop. I forget how much it was but it was cheap for all that if you would use it . The whole thing was run down and I figgured then they werent charging enough. Grass was growing up in the tennis court in the cracks and the pool didnt have any water in it . She said there would be as soon as they found a maintenece man. She said the pool needed some repairs . That should have sent a flag but it didnt because she wasnt interrested .
Her and I disagreed. The house was a repo and it was the best deal I had found . I fergit the prices but it was right around 50 percent of value and needed 10 grand of material and 30 days of work I was gonna donate of course with her with me working too. That might have been the reason why she wasnt interrested. She bought another repo that didnt need much of any thing and paid wholesale for it in a crowded addtion with small lots. We cleaned and painted the inside about like a rental schedule .
I never forgot that house she didnt buy and began wondering about its future . 3 years later having thanksgiving dinner over there I said lets drive over there . It was worse than before and there still wasnt water in the pool. I didnt stay very long . Just a drive in and out but I was convinced I had been wrong about the whole thing .
Had it been my decision she would have been living there . She sold and moved in a 5 year period from that to Pea Ridge. She didnt make any money just like I figgured but she was able to get of of town quickly. Then I began to think what would have happened in that gated community. I dont know but Im glad I wasnt responseble for leading her there. Always figgured there had to be a reason that house was so cheap even if it was a repo.
I thnk about that lesson of my lack of knowledge of another area which I brought up in this thread . I could have made a mistake there very easily. In fact had it been me I would have been living there . I had asked the lady if I could pull the camper trailer innthe back yard and stay there while we fixed it . I was gonna do it but she wouldnt so I know I would have pulled the trigger on it quickly.
I still dont know how it would have turned out .
Tim
Edited 9/19/2009 11:26 am by Mooney
i guess i'm a control freak,thats why i really don't like the condo deal. ihave no control over who is on the other side of the wall, no control over how the place is kept up or what we spend our hoa money on.then if your in real good with the pres,your unit gets a little extra.......... i just pay my dues.
so ultimatley i have no control over how this property will hold it's value.
the president of the hoa is a homeowner there, and she has a thing about guttering,were always fixing guttering,this is 32 units. but if i wanted to be pres,all i have to do is raise my hand. nobody wants the job.
it's been a good cash cow, gave 35 for it 11 yrs ago,rents for 700,so it doesn't owe me anything.it's in a real good part of town as soon as you get 2 blks from the condos. so we just keep plugging along with it.
but if you can't own the whole building [mines a 4plex] i'd stay away.that is what i'd really like to do is pick up the other 3 then i could at least personally maintain my unit how i want.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I sold two condos as a realtorOne was north and east of 13th and Tyler (the condo community all four plexes and I can't remember how many)These are one story with a basement and no garageHOA dues are about $50 a month and you pay quarterly if I remember correctlyThere were no amenties such as community swimming pool, playground, walking area, club house, etc
The second was what you would call a town home type condo South and West of 21st and Tylertwo story with a basement which gives you 3 levels and kind of a nice feel to the home. Each level was about 500 feetIf I remember right that placed it in the maize school district which was a plusAnyway, I always looked at a condo as an opportunity for someone to live in a "newer" 3 bed 2 bath home in a nice area and have a payment of only about $600 per monthYou don't have a garage, but you're living in a newer home and many of them have fireplaces and that newer home feel compared to a living in a dump in the middle of wichita or on the south side
the ones your talking about at 13th/tyler thats where mines at ,without the garage.
hoa dues are real cheap.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Larry are you familiar with the condos on the west side? (west of 235 and north of kellogg)Which condos do you think are the best and which ones are the worst?I think the nicest condos are the ones South of Kellogg and MaizeI think they have a swimming pool. They are built with kind of a loft for a second floorThe community is called tree top or tree house community? Goddard School DistrictI think the worst condos are South of Central and TylerI showed one or two and they have an odd layout and the washer is somewhere in the house (maybe on the second floor?) and the dryer is located in the garage !!Those are always really slow to sell. Might be a good opportunity to buy one cheap?
Tim or mrfixit, that $8K the gov is kicking into new buyers -
Is there a site that explains it so that a non-bureaucrat non-lawyer can understand it.
Daughter & SIL want to buy a house, got no money (surprise) and need some help from us.
J
I'll try to find a websiteit's a tax credit - rebateYour daughter will buy the house and then when she files her 2009 tax return there is a form the tax preparer will fill out.The tax credit FIRST applies to the taxes she owes and the remainder comes to her in the form of a check from IRSThe tax credit is 10% of the purchase price of the home (up to $8,000)
She won't owe, they'll get a refund from the with holding from this year.
What I'm wondering is if we are on the mortgage with her if it would still qualify.
We haven't had a mortgage for years, would we qualify as 1st time buyers too as the rule is written?
Seems I read somewhere we would but I don't know for sure. Lot of conflicting info out there on the world wide web.
Joe H
The rule is three yearsSo if you haven't owned a house in the past three years you are considered to be a first time homebuyer.If she wants to buy a house with no money out of pocket (very common nowdays) she needs to just talk to her lender and spell it all out.Don't be shyAlso, it's common nowdays for people to ask the seller to help them with their loan costsHope it works for her and she gets good interest rate
So if you haven't owned a house in the past three years you are considered to be a first time homebuyer.
Own a home, but we paid cash for it.
Not good?
Joe H
I ran a google search about a buyer having a co-signerThere was a reference to IRS site and it's slow and I gave upI'll keep trying
It looks like your daughter would receive the tax credit even though you own your homeHere's the question and answer from the IRS websiteS2. Taxpayer A is a single first-time home buyer. Taxpayer B (parent) cosigns for A and does not qualify. Both names are on the mortgage. Can Taxpayer A claim the credit and, if so, how much? A. Yes. Taxpayer B is not a first-time homebuyer and cannot claim any portion of the credit, but A may claim the entire credit ($7,500 for purchase in 2008; $8,000 for purchase in 2009), if the home was purchased as Taxpayer A's primary residence.
good digging to find that.
reading that i bet there are alot of married people that don't think they qualify because one of them owned a home
i read that that this sitation would be fine.
jack and sue get married 1995,they move into jacks house have lived there all this time. deed is still in jacks name .
they go out find a house, sue purchases house and jack co signs on loan. sue has a 8000 tax credit. jack sells his house for a 75k profit,tax free and moves into sues house. three years they change the deed to etux.
what a deal 8k plus 75k tax free, you gotta love this country, unless you don't qualify for any of this krap like me......................
thinking about this i would guess they would file,married status,but file seperatly.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 9/23/2009 10:06 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Good point about all the various combinations of married, divorced, previous homeowners, etcWhat gets confusing is there are some programs even for someone who owned a home six months ago.The one I'm thinking of is a program for what is called a displaced person.An example is a low income single woman recently divorced There are programs to help her even though technically she has been part owner of a home in the past three years
Yesterday I was called to go work on a rentalI got there and looked at the shower in the basement.There was no shower curtainI asked "do you guys use that shower?"He said "yes we use it all the time"Note to self: Install shower rods and curtains in all rental properties and don't assume the renter will be responsible and do it themselves
Lots of info, thanks guys.
Daughter is going to talk to builders lender tomorrow & see what the deal is.
This a new house with a preferred lender.
Joe H
I've asked around a little bit and people are wondering what's going to happen to the real estate market when the tax credit program ends?Will things slow down?If so, how much?If someone has a house for sale, they would prefer to get it sold now and avoid the uncertainty of what's aheadMaybe your daughter will have some leverage and be able to negotiate a little?Wish her good luck and I hope she gets a house she really likes.
people are wondering what's going to happen to the real estate market when the tax credit program ends?
Exact same thing that happened to the car mkt when Cash 4 Clunkers ended.
Tanked, what else?
Joe H
Last fall or early this year the national assoc of realtors proposed the tax credit program be increased to simply include ALL HOMEBUYERSIn other words anyone who bought a home a would receive the tax creditI helped a first time homebuyer buy a home in June of 2008.She qualified for the tax credit programHowever she had never heard about itI explained it to her and she said "why are they doing that"?I told her "the program is intended to free up some money and this money will likely be used by first time homebuyer to do repairs or updates to their home and this will stimulate the economy"That was my understanding of the program. Fast forward and She and other people were getting their tax credit money earlier this year.Where is the money going and what are they spending it on.How is it impacting the economy?
Larry, I ran into something this week.I've started working on a new house1950's ranch style houseIt has a basement and a 40 ft I beam running across the ceiling of the basement.The I beam is supported by two polesThe poles are not adjustable.They are welded to plates which are bolted to the I beamThere is a concrete slab floor Anyway, here in colorado they have problems with movement of slab floorsThe slab in our house has raised a half inch or maybe an inch over the years and consequently this has resulted in the floor above raising up.We had an engineer look at this and we will remove the sold poles and install poles which are adjustableI just don't remember this being a problem in KansasMaybe it is and I wasn't aware of it
Still no offer on my house . Times must be really tuff. I lowered the price and have heard nothing . Ill give it another 30 days and rent it . If they cant sell a house like that under rebate times things are bad. Nothing down and 8 grand in their pocket for doing nothing. They can live there two years with out paying a dime. Rebate will be history in 30 days .
Kids are at the "builders lender" right now.
Last time I co-signed anything both my lawyer & my insurance agent told me not to.
So, how wrong can this go?
Joe H
i'm sure not telling you you shouldn't. but sometimes we as parents try and do all we can to help and then it blows up.
i let my dd live in a house of mine for a year while they found a house. they paid the payment ,no problem then when they move,no one even vacums. we were a little upset,they were upset about something, things just haven't been the same.
if i had it all to do over again ,i wouldn't ,just because it wasn't worth the straining of or relationship.
you know your kids, but you have to ask yourself"if i end up making the payment on this someday how will i handle it?and how will they if they have to move?
money does funny things with people.
on the other hand ,their our kids and we want to see them do well and help them acheive that.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Have you tried the new shut off valves that push on 1/2 copper like a shark bitethey have them at HDhttp://www.homedepot.com/Building-Materials-Plumbing-Plumbing-Parts-Repair/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xhfZaqw7/R-100644760/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
looks pretty slick.i haven't used any sharkbites. i find it hard to accept some of this new stuff,when a soldered fitting or a compression/ferrell nut are both proven to last 20,30,40 years.just getting old i guess.
plus i have probably 80 shut off that i have bought off ebay, so if i ever get through them,sharbites may be proven by then.lolthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
We're finishing a house and will put it on the market next weekI ran into something I haven't seen before - maybe you've seen it LarryThe main bath is pretty good sizedThere was room for a 48" vanity but we didn't want to spend that kind of money (over $400 at HD)I bought a 36" vanity (price $179) and took it out of the box and tried to slide it back against the wall and it didn't fitI took out my tape measure and the rough in plumbing was 10" from the wall.Like most vanities it had two drawers and the drawers were about 12" from the side of the cabinetI scratched my head and said "what the heck"I went to home depot to see if they had vanities with the drawers on the left side and they didn't Seems odd?Anyway, I had to move the cold water shut off valve JUST TO GET THE VANITY TO SLIDE IN AND AGAINST THE WALLThe reason for all of this?I don't know but I think it has to do with the home having dual sinks in the bathroom at one time in the past. Having two sinks causes the rough in plumbing to be "out of kilter" I'm guessing.You ever had problems like what I'm describing?I must have spent 8 hours just putting in the vanity.If it ain't one thing it's something else.
thats a classic "i'll get this done in1.5 hours, 2 days later you have it finished. i love plumbing.............................
you guys are rolling these houses out aren't ya. is the market staying pretty steady. here it seems a little slow,some are selling ,but more are sitting gathering dust.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
we've been hitting it really hardwe have two houses going on the market tomorrowboth have turned out really niceI'll take pictures and put them on in the next couple of daysHad something odd happen a couple of weeks ago.Our other crew (two guys) was working on a house.They left for lunch at noon and left the garage door openOur drywall guy was working in the basement.They came back from lunch at 1 PM and one of the guys' $700 compound miter saw and an air compressor were missing.Stolen in broad daylightThe next day he went to the closest pawn shop and asked if a miter saw had come in and they said yes.He called the police and the police investigated and found it to be his sawThey took finger prints.Next they went to the records and the pawn shop has records and a photocopy of the driver's license of the guy who brought the saw in !!!They arrested him. He lives four blocks away from the house we're working on.HE IS A CAREER CRIMINAL WHO HAS COMMITTED MANY BURGLARIES Don't know if he will even go to jail though. Police commented that he will probably plea bargain
Edited 10/7/2009 12:06 am by mrfixitusa
that kicks but, it don't matter if he pleas,pretty soon they will get tired of him and lock him up.
i can't imagine he had hocked it that quick.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I went to the foreclosure auction yesterday with my brother at the courthouseAuctions are held every Wed at the "Office of the Public Trustee"There were about 25 people thereThey auctioned 10 propertiesMy brother goes every week. He knows other people there. There are several attorneys who are investors and he knows them.Prior to the auction you fill out a form indicating your interest in a specific property. You write your opening bid on the form. The winning bidder is required to pay for the property on the spot with a cashier's check. No personal checks.My brother filled out the form to bid on one property. When that property came up there were three interested Bidding started at $161,000Bidding went from $161,000 to $203,000 in one thousand dollar increments.It took a long time.Back and forth. Each bid went up $1,000 It took 10-15 minutes.Went it hit $203,000 my brother said "pass" and an attorney investor bought the property.We left the courthouse.I asked who the other guy was and my brother said he is there every week and he buys houses every week.My brother has watched this attorney buy four houses in one dayThat means he came to the auction with $800,000 (or more) in his pocket.
We finished the house I've been working on.We put it on the market a week ago for $215,000Nothing happened for 3-4 days and so he dropped the price to $199,000The next day several realtors showed it and last night he got a full price contract on it.Hope it goes through.I don't know any details such as who is buying it and if they are first time home buyers using the tax credit program.He started high and when nothing happened he dropped the price and sold it.I guess you just have to try your luck and roll the dice. If you roll 7 or 11 you smile and buy everyone a drinkIf you roll 2, 3, or 12 smile and don't look back and try again tomorrow
you keep messing with me and next thing you know i'm going to be out buying a flipper and trying to do this.lol
i look at this post and it stuns me a little.
"on the market a week ago for $215,000" nothing happened for 3-4 days!
i can't imagine rolling 15k that fast,unless i knew that i was 20k to high to start with. after 4 days i haven't even thought about doing something,because i have always kind of had the attitude if i can get a contract in 30-45 days i'm good to go. i can't imagine getting a contract the first few days.
i'm impressed that you guys ,know what people want,get it bought and fixed up and can get it sold immediatly and turned into cash.then repeat
i read what you guys are doing and try to think if it can be duplicated here in wichita.
now i have never been accused of being a optimist,i feel i'm a realist and i just don't see the oppurtunity here. wish i was smart enough,but until then i guess i'll just read your stories.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
He jumped the gun on this one because of the tax credit program.He's worried about where we're going to be when the tax credit program ends.He wants to get these two sold and let the dust settle a little and figure out where we're at.Larry, I would like to buy these shark bite fittings that sell for $6.00
at Home Depot and I would like to buy them on ebay or through some of your connections in the back alleys and street cornersHow could I buy these in large quantities for a good price?we go through a lot of thesehttp://www.plumbersurplus.com/Prod/SharkBite-U008-Straight-Coupling-1-2-X-1-2/48809/Cat/1200
wow!7.00 each.
i hit ebay ,didn't find any
how come you use these instead of a .40 coupler and solder? it's really nothing to solder copper.
i go to hupps hardware once in awhile.i have seen them have sharbites clearanced . if i see them again i will let you know.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
We use them when we connect the new to the old The new pieces (dry pieces) we use the 50 cent coupler I've done some things lately with pex.The shark bite connectors will join 1/2 pex to copperReplace a section of pipe for 20 cents a foot (pex) versus a dollar a foot for copperI had checked on ebay and didn't see anything
Edited 10/13/2009 11:57 pm by mrfixitusa
on houses with copper,the most i usally get involved in replacing copper is cutting off and replacing a few feet for new faucets. but i'm am ready to start going to pex for anything more than that,and for a complete replumb it's going to be pex. i'm going to have to get up to speed on fittings and tools for this.
i know everbody everybody thinks the sharkbites are great. i can't convince myself that they are going to still be there 20-30 years from now. if one of them fails the results are catastrophic over saving 10 minutes. i feel the same way about these rubber hoses with stainless wrapped around them. i have had a couple fray out,but so far no bursted. but like everyone i still use them cause they are easy.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I dont have a problem using copper and normally go back standard fittings.
the old cut offs are cheap so thats what it is
I wouldnt think of giving 7 bucks for a cut off when I buy them for 3 bucks . I dont get it . So it takes a second to turn down a regualar one . Chances are I wont do that but once.
Ive got three offers on the house at once . All are tryin to come in under the tax deal. They couda did this a month ago.
All are trying to steal it and make me pay all kinds of their costs . No money. I offered back and put the costs back on him and he rejected becuase of no money. Meanwhile he had cut my price by 15 pecent and asked for everything to be paid . Meanwhile he would get 8 grand . Makes me sick. Im still looking at the other two offers trying to figgure out what to counter back and how . If I knew it would be easy. Im not sure they need to cut the price . Id pay their costs if I got full price but I dont have one offer like that. By the time you add the costs and the cut its 20 percent . I dont think so. Then again mebbe its me that needs a reality check.
All I know is the houses still rent great so thats what I might do.
Tim
i would think as a buyer if i was trying to get under the wire for the 8k,my bargining postion would be a little weak.
i know you have other goals in mind,but if your looking at having to pay all this bs ,re fees, then mr irs .you have to look at the big picture of if i go home with #### $ versus it will rent for 6xx a month for 5 years then sell it needing cleaned up for 70 ,pretty good return on what i was going to bank at 1.5%
thats exactly my postion,i would pack up and go home today ,but after everybody gets done with me i would have no income. like i said i look at fixit and whats happing in denver and think if i could even start to duplicate that here,i would.
i didn't know this when i bought my first rental,but do now:
it's easier to get in ,than it is to get out......................
down in your neck of the woods today,trying to burn a brush pile,you guys must of had rain everyday for the last 60 days! not burning well..........the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
" didn't know this when i bought my first rental,but do now:it's easier to get in ,than it is to get out......................"Thats not entirely true. Your problem of selling is one of price. Drop the price low enough and your buyers will be there.
ur right i could give them away and be rid of them,but then i'd get on welfare and you would have to feed me.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I was hoping I could marry a rich woman some day;)
I didn't say "give" them away. I said "sell" then at the current market price, which is the reality that we all live in now.
Mebbe it is market but it sucks worse than keeping them and reiceving good rents
Lanlords dont have to sell like a lot of people .
Like he said as well if your gonna drop the price , pay for all their costs , pay uncle same , you might as well keep them. They are viable . As long as they are that you cant give them away when they deposit money in thebank every month for you .
They are better known as cash cows.
I would rather get out but Im not stupid. Kinda like a sweetie hangin on her sugar daddy.
.
.
Edited 10/16/2009 12:16 pm by Mooney
I understand all that. I guess the old saying..."you can't have your cake and eat it too" applies here.
we finished the last house a week ago we did some things differently in the kitchenused birch cabinets instead of maple and went with a complicated tile back splashhere's some pictures
here's a few more pictures
couple more including family room in basement
i like that back splash,is that from a big box?
on the tile counters, is that outside edge a grout edge or a pc of trim?
kitchen looks great, are the birch cabs a stock item out there? about all you see here in prefabs are oak.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Yes the cabinets are stock item at a small cabinet shop we go to.Cabinets for these kitchens we're doing cost about $2,500Birch with cinnamon finishWe're installing crown moldingThe metal trim piece for the counter top is called a 1/4" edge protectorHere's a link to ithttp://www.northlandconstruction.com/product.php?pid=3707We're getting our tile for counter tops and back splashes at a franchise business called "Tile World"Tile world has a bigger selection than home depot and the prices are cheaperBut we still buy the HD 77 cents tile (hacienda) for bathroom floor, kitchen floor, and shower wallsWe bought another house last wednesdayWe have three to do.Our other crew also finished a house and it's been on the market about a week and we had some showings todayI'll post some pictures of the other house - our other crew used some 16" tile on the kitchen floor and it turned out really good
i was up at the maize road lowes tonight, they have some sharbite fittings clearanced. they are not sharkbite brand but same thing.
they had 3/4 tees 3 or 4 to a pack,they were 8.00
3/4 90's 5 t0 a bag 8.00
1/2 tees 3 to a bag for 5.50.
looked like there were 20 bags total?
if this is something you could use ,i'll pick them up and send em to you. i think we could get them all shipped for less than 10.00
sorry no couplers...............................
let me knowthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
thanks larry I really appreciate itI'll get back to you
they said a lot of people are scamming the IRS and making false claims for the tax creditthey said on the radio they would end the program Dec 1st and not extend it any furtherAnyway, I took some pictures of the second house we have on the market It's a three bedroom, three bathroom, two car garage. We bought it with an unfinished basement and we finished the basement.We used 16" tile on the floor in the kitchen. Kitchen cabinets are mapleDark tile countertops and back splash
we refinished the oak floors in living room, hallway, and the bedrooms
the house is priced at $215 and it's been on the market for a week and a halfThere are two buyers that are quote "very interested" and I think we're close to selling it.here's some pictures of the basement
one of the things I've learned these past few months is to "leave it alone" when it comes to the shower in the basement.This is the shower we re-tiled (without completely tearing out the old one and starting all over from scratch which takes a lot of time and headaches)
I really like the 16 " tile on diagonal from HD that sells for 99 cents a footYou need a large room and I don't think I would use the large tile in a small kitchen or small bathroom
a detail i noticed,i want to know how good you guys are or how lucky you are.
the wall with the desk,you have half tile running at the bottom of the backsplash,as you should. then when you jump up to the base cabinet, you also have half tiles. you that lucky or are you guys that good................
what are you using on the floors ,water base poly? are those the orig 1960's floors or are they new. they look good.
i laid some 16" tile awhile back,looked good ,went down fast. but i did have trouble keeping the edges flat with each other. they had a pretty sharp edge that wasn't to forgiving.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Larry the floors are originalThe floor guy has been doing floors for 18 yearsIt's a natural finish (no stain) and it's oil based polyurethaneIt's the cheapest poly they sell at HDAlso, you asked about the tile and the two guys who remodeled the house have many years of experience with tile.I just stand back and watch themWhen they do a countertop, the first piece is a full piece at the L(they look to see where it falls on the sink they check the size of the last piece but they really like to start that way if there is any way possible)We have done 10-12 kitchens since January.You would not believe the pile of left over tile we have been moving from one job to the nextI finally returned it todayAs far as the half tile and the desk, these guys are so good I think they do everything for a reason and they deliberately did it that wayDo you see any mistakes they made?I'll close by saying we've been hitting it hard for month after month and we're all tired.We started a new house and have been there a week and a half and we did some things different and we've doubled our productionPlus we got a new drywall guy and he did an entire basement in 4-5 days - start to finishWe have not been able to do that in the past.Our drywall guy would work a day and then be gone the rest of the weekA one week job turned into a month and it was killing us
We've changed some things that have helped us get more work doneI'm now in charge of the materials.What that amounts to is I go look at the job at 8 PM and see if we have enough of whatever we're doing the next dayIf we don't, then I get whatever we need that night or early the next morningIn the past you were kind of on your own.If I was painting, I would get the paint and whatever I needed.If another guy was working in the kitchen and he needed something, he would go get it.But the problem is these guys working for us really don't want to incur the expense of driving back and forth to HDPlus there's the irritation of dealing with the system at HD (waiting in line for 30 minutes, etc)Another thing I've noticed is these guys who are working for us want to be productive.If they've spent all day working on their project they get a lot more done.They can easily lose two hours of production as the result of running to HDThe other thing that I'm doing is trying to get the materials organized on the job siteIt just takes time.But when you can't find the materials you need it's just like having a tool and not being able to find itOur biggest problem is plumbing materials.Lots of small items.Shut off valves, washers, copper fittings, hose clamps, etc
plumbing can drive you nuts,seems you never have the right things.i do mostly copper. so i have a 5 gal bucket with those drop in 4 compartment containers. the 5 gal bucket will hold 5 layers of the containers. so each container has seperate sizes and functions. works pretty well. have to remember to stock it up.
plastic fittings is tough to know what you need, i try and keep a couple 1.5" sink traps,tailpieces,lots of washers and nuts.electrical same thing,have a 5 gal bucket with nuts, screws,ground connectors etc,in the stack things like plbg.
all this saves some trips,but there are still some parts runs.i could see with 2 houses going at the same time you guys could almost use a guy to do nothing but run. when he's doing nothing he's at the next place your headed to cleaning,getting a list together etc.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
You own a lot of toolsDo you own a soil pipe cutter?http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001HWQ9C8/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B0009W6T6I&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0HDWFGJ7KK1B0SAGXXPBWe're looking for one that will cut cast iron drain pipes that we have to repair on a regular basis.Would like to buy one for about $100 and so I'll be watching CLLooks like retail is $500 +
Edited 10/23/2009 10:22 pm by mrfixitusa
i don't own one. what i use to cut cast iron is a 4.5" grinder with metal cutting disc on it. will cut a 4" in about 3 minutes.
my only thing is,if i don't wear a mask i hack stuff up for the rest of the day. i don't know if it's the metal or the stuff inside the pipe??????
yoou can rent one of those at hd.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
One of our guys is an excellent plumberHe takes a sledge hammer to the Cast Iron and then a rubber couplerHad something unusual happen yesterdayOn every house we call a drain cleaning company and they run the main line and any of the others that need itI pointed him to the wash machine drain and he ran it and had it working in a few minutesThen I pointed him to a floor drain Old house and floor drain in an old bathroom in the basementHe spent 15-20 minutes and gave upHe said the floor drain had probably never been used and had 50 years of dirt compacted in itHe could not get the snake to go through He removed the clean out plug and we'll leave it open Water does drain through the clean out so we'll just leave it that way I guess
i have several of those the same way,they just drain thru the plug. could get sewr gas,but hasn't been a problem.
i hate busting with a hammer. your never exactly sure where it will break.
try the grinder deal sometime.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
we'll try it next time Larry.We've got several grinders laying around.They mainly get used for tile.Change of topic - I've still got my real estate license and it's going to expire in December.I need nine hours of continuing education and so I took my classes this weekI took my classes on line and so now I'm licensed for another two years.One of the classes I took was entitled "home inspectors"It told about home inspections starting in the late 1970'sVery few homes were getting inspected that first 5-10 years and there were no standardsStatistically most homes are getting inspected now.Lots of inspections going on if you think about it.Couple of interesting things I learned.(1) a home inspector should perform his duties and NEVER mention the words "building code"(2) a home inspector is not an engineer, health expert (mold expert), architect, or code expert.(3) interestingly a home inspector should walk through a home and look at how things were installed - if something was installed incorrectly to begin with he should comment on it.(as you know we're working on old houses and we don't touch anything that is working properly - no matter how botched up it looks - in other words if a water heater is installed and the installation was sloppy we leave it aloneMaybe we will rethink this and start re-doing some of this stuff.But the Problem is almost all of these houses have these kinds of problems and issues.Don't you see this kind of thing a lot? (kind of botched up or even just sloppy but yet it's working ok)(4) a home inspector SHOULD NOT just walk through a home and scratch out a punch list of issues on a blank piece of paper.The course states "If a home inspector points out any concern, HE SHOULD DOCUMENT AND STATE HIS REASON FOR CALLING OUT A CONCERN""The following is an example of what an inspector should be doing and the proper way of communicating his findings as a "disinterested third party""loose electric wire was found in unfinished wall on south side of garage""Wire is hot and is a shock hazard" and "Licensed electrician should be consulted for repair"PEOPLE WOULD NOT ARGUE AND FIGHT OVER THINGS IF THE INSPECTOR WOULD COMMUNICATE THIS WAYInstead< a lot of inspectors are walking through a house and slapping together a punch list No justification or explanation
Been rainin non stop , but clear now
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091015/us_nm/us_usa_housing_auctions
And some people question the role of vigilanty justice.
We thought it must be someone in the neighborhoodStealing from a house in broad daylightI told our electrician what had happened and he relayed a story that he had a 35 ft fiberglass ladder stolen from on top of his vanThis happened in the last month or soHappened in broad daylight while he was working on a housePretty bad when things like that happen to someone working hard to make a living
We had one stoled in a sub when we left to go set a window in another house. We saw the thieves and radioed to our other crew to block the south entrance. They blocked the road with the forklift and the van jumped the curb and Baja'd around him. It was the painter's crew in the sub but nobody could identify exactly which thief was the culprit. Here in Texas, we get to shoot them dead. We are legally allowed to protect our property and the property of our friends.
As Ron White said:
"Texas has the death penalty and we use it!"
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09l38Yjecbs
thanks - I kind of worry about leaving tools in the house - most of the surrounding homes are rentals filled with college kids
Sorry to hear that Tim
I hope you sell tomorrow, but...
Your note gives me the "go" on calling about that nice, convenient, hard to build on property.
The "real" price is just about right.
A La Carte Government funding... the real democracy.
Tim when a house doesn't sell a lot of people get frustrated with their Realtor.They expect their Realtor to find a Buyer.But that's a false assumptionStatistically, most homes are sold by a second realtor - the "Buyer's Agent"Ideally, though your Realtor would be providing you with a lot of feedback.Feedback is information from other realtors showing the house and includes comments their clients have made while walking through your house.Feedback like the following:Are the other people (buyers) who've seen the house even buying anything?Or are they just tire kickers wanting to look at houses for months and months.Some people actually start looking a year in advance.Some of the people who looked at your home a month ago may have actually bought something by now. What house did they buy?What do they think about the price of your home? What is their rationale for their opinion?What are their criticisms?Good luck!
Here are some examples of comments from buyers1. I like the house but the yard is too big2. I like the house but the yard is too small3. I like the house but I want a house with a basement4. I like the house but I don't want a basement because the laundry room is in the basement5. I like the house but the price is too high. For this price I can buy ______________________ (bigger, newer, two car, that other house that has been completely remodeled)6. I don't like the floor plan7. There's no master bath and for this price we should be getting one8. House is too small9. We like the other house better that has the hardwood floors10. This house doesn't have air conditioning? You've got to be kidding11. Bathroom is too small - no woman wants a bathroom with just that tiny little sink and no counterspace for women's items12. We like the house but the street out front is too wide, or too narrow, or too much traffic13. We like the house but we're concerned about the neighbors who have cars parked on the front lawn14. We like the house but we're concerned about the neighborhood and the run down houses 15. I showed the house to an investor and he said he likes the house and the work you've done but "the numbers just won't work" for himBack in March? we had a house that did not sellWe discussed the comments we had rec'd from realtors showing the home.We chose three things to change:1. Replaced kitchen countertop and left the rest of the kitchen the same (we had not completely remodeled the home - we had painted inside and out and installed carpet and that was about it)2. We replaced the interior doors (removed the ugly painted slab doors from the 1970's and installed new six panel doors which we painted)3. We replaced the pink outdated floor tile in one bathroomWe did these things quickly and really wasn't a big expense.We then sold the house a week or two later.BUT WE WERE HAVING A LOT OF SHOWINGS AND JUST WEREN'T HAVING ANY LUCKWho knows, maybe you just need to do one thing - such as changing the countertop in the kitchen?Good luck!
Who knows, maybe you just need to do one thing - such as changing the countertop in the kitchen?
Nah, needs to throw in a free Sports Calendar.
Joe H
tim,any luck on your house? last you said was a low ball,did he ever come up?the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Its under contract
held my price within a couple thousand
they took it
no money yet
ty
We're starting a new project tomorrow.We bought an old rental that is pretty run down.It's brick and has no garage.It has a Finished basement.It would normally rent for around $1,000 a monthBut this house will rent for $2,000 per month.Here's how.It's a house right beside a college. It's literally next door to the campus.The renters can walk to class. We will add one more bedroom to the house will have a total of five bedrooms.Each tenant will pay $400 per monthThis place will be a gold mine.This is a trashed out rental that he bought cheap
did i ever tell you i'm a pessimist?
your right it will be a gold mine.
keep the word trashed in your vocabulary.
you have 5 young people,who have never had responsibilty living in a house/apartment. those five will have on a average 3 vistors a night.
who takes out the trash
who knocked the whole in the door
look,someone got a puppy,who
answer: i don't know.
what a nightmare,lifes to short to rent a 5 bedroom to a bunch of college students.
oh,by the way,my daughter is looking for a place at school. just today she told us about a house instead of a apartment.
i had 2 questions for her. who's mowing the yard. whats trash cost?
huh?????????????
remember this girl has grown up with rentals/renters.
TRASHED,you will be using that term again.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
you know i just clicked to post and thought thats some negative kraap.
so i'll take the postive on this.
clean it,shine it,just like you guys do ,sell it ,make a 100k to some guy that just sold his mutal funds and wants to get rich investing in real estate.show him what a great cap rate it has.
make your money and be gone.
or go to the college and see if they are looking to buy.flip it in 30 days.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 11/2/2009 10:45 pm by alwaysoverbudget
Larry,My brother knows exactly what he's getting into and he knows the place will be trashed It's got hard wood floors in some of the rooms.We bought better faucets and toilets since he will be keeping this one for a while.(delta instead of glacier bay)I'll try to take some pictures - we're just getting started over there But again, this place is a dump now and it will be a dump here in a few weeks when the renters come inHe wants to get it rented in December and get ready for January and spring sememsterIt will have new paint, new sinks, new toilets, and that's about it.Oh and the bedrooms will have new inexpensive $6.00 a yard beige carpetI'll post some pictures.We're just finishing another house that will go on the market at the end of the week
this college housing is a little different,my daughter needs a place for next august 2010. looking now. the landlords know whos leaving in the spring and what will be vacant.
i have no doubt you guys know what your getting into.
"But again, this place is a dump now and it will be a dump here in a few weeks when the renters come in"
i did put in my mind that you were going to go after this like you do the houses. new kit,baths etc.
but if you don't polish it to a diamond,they can't tear up as much.............the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
You need to find a source for some of that carpet they put in casinos.
You look down, you see carpet.
You don't see the chips, the trash, the barf, the odd dead body in the corner.
That stuff hides anything. Drop anything, it's gone. Just what you need for your goldmine.
Joe H
We're wrapping up a flip house this week.It took us four weeks.Carpet was installed todayPictures in the next couple of days.You mentioned Las vegas casino carpet and we do have a business here that sells casino and hotel furniture but I don't know about carpet.We'll have to check it out.But we're only paying about $6.00 a yard for carpetDon't think we can buy it cheaper than than for something decent
See the house is passing a bill to extend the $8000 buyer tax credit, good for your business.
Joe H
Only going to be $6500 this time around tho....
View Image
Proud Resident of Obamistan
I haven't heard any of the details yet on the new tax credit programOn a side note I heard a lawyer talking about a lender todayHe was talking about a lender, Washington MutualWashington Mutual was a big lender a few years ago and they went underONE THIRD OF THEIR LOANS WENT INTO DEFAULTThey were making a lot of loans to people that had no business trying to buy a home.The lawyer stated that Washington Mutual even made a loan to OJ Simpson so he could buy a homeThis was in the past couple of years.Apparently when OJ went to prison he stopped making payments on his home and Washinton Mutual CANNOT foreclose on the home because OJ lost his case in civil court with the Goldman familyThey have a 30+ million dollar judgement against OJApparently the goldman family has filed a lien against OJ's home and they will be in line ahead of the lender.I just heard this today and don't know all the details
T-111 all the walls, 5/8ths, "Nobody's gonna put a fist or foot through that stuff. For starters don't paint it, leave it natural, paint as needed when it does get trashed. Solid surface the shower, tub walls, make the place as bullet proof as possible.
tim,i need your help. if i come down there will you take me out in the arkansas woods and just kick the hail out of me.i need someone to knock some sense into me.
finishing up a nasty eviction today,small commercial, guys been in 6 months ,paid 4. took me for a ride,through the courts etc.left one heck of a mess.then to top it off,stole the 200amp breakers off the main ,i don't know what else he has sabatoge till i get juice back on. took greasy hands and wiped all over the wall. plus left me with a frig that hadn't been on for a month ,with food.
i know better,but i liked the guy. so i overlooked every warning sign there was and went ahead and leased it to him. bad credit, not enough capitol to work on, didn't have all the deposit,[so i took 1/2]likes his toys,4 kids and a wife to feed.blah blah.
did i mention i liked the guy and didn't think this would go this bad.lol
after 30 years of this,i can't believe i find myself in this mess and it's my fault for not looking at the whole picture and running.i preach this to people,when you let money start making your decision [as in it's vacant i got to rent it now] it will bite you every time.
can you tell i'm pretty piz at myself?the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
You've been there forever, you must know some local cops?
File a theft report for the breakers just to F with the guy. Figure the cost of calling an electrician to replace them, whatever you can think of to get the total value up.
Joe H
tonight i feel like i've been in rentals for about 2 months.
part of this job is when the tenants going in you look at what he has. this guy has nothing,i knew that,just one more overlook on my part.
so when you make these decisions going in you have to know when it blows up you just have to cut your loses and move on.i could take him to court and probably get a judgement in the 8-10k range,but it's not worth a plug nickel.
i have a victory..............i have the keys to the building and he doesn't.
so it's time to move on,clean it up and go again.maybe next time.
oh,i don't know any cops and really not wanting to meet any!the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I don't know about you Larry but I fumble around from day to day trying to "have something done by quiting time"It's all I can do to get the materials in place to try to keep everyone busy today, tomorrow, next week, etc and yet try to get something productive done myselfYesterday we hired a guy to do something and in the middle of the afternoon when I'm trying to fix some rotted out windows he asked me for "an advance"I said "huh"He asked for $150 and I mumbled "sure, yeah, okay"Not smart on my part but I did it and I've gotten burned on several things here recentlyI was nice enough to loan a co-worker a $250 nail gun for him to use at home and I can't get him to return it.I've asked politely several times now.I think the secret is as follows.THERE'S NO PREDICTING HUMAN BEHAVIORDon't let it bother you and eat you up (your situation with your tenant)Keep going and put it on the back burner and give it a week or so and I bet you will come up with a creative solution
Edited 11/6/2009 8:34 am by mrfixitusa
rotted window sills,have somehow become my deal this summer. i've probably replaced 30!
how bad are yours? i have used body plastic to repair, made my own sill from cedar, and used aztec, for some. looked at another project this week, i think i'm going to wrap those sills with metal and just cover them.on my own house i would use the aztec,i think that is a good permant fix.
they are a royal pain in the arse.
if i was you,i'd just take a drive over to the guys house some eve. for the nail gun.then he's on the "do not loan list" . i have a good friend that i won't loan a screwdriver to,he will never bring it back. had my biscut jointer for almost 2 yrs ,and i had to go get it......the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
We're flipping an old house and on Wednesday the window contractor replaced all the old windows.I never know what they're cutting out and what will remain as far as window trim, jamb, sill, etc.Anyway, the window contractor replaced all the windows in about six hours on wednesdayPretty good. These guys are fast. One window on the west side had a rotted out sill and so I dug it out and built a new one yesterday out of some 1 X 4'sTurned out pretty good.I'll paint it today and we'll wrap up this house in the next few days.I'll close by saying we run a "loose ship"Our workers come and go and do as they please. Set their own schedule.One guy took off on tuesday to go fishing for the rest of the week with his elderly father.Another guy will spend the next 7 days on a hunting trip.As I understand it they will spend 7 days out in the middle of nowwhere in a tent.They're taking lots of food and supplies etcAnother employee took off three days this week to do volunteer work for his church.When everyone gets back maybe we'll get something done next week.We have three houses waiting on us and my brother bought two more at the auction on wednesday (although one is a condo that only needs to be painted)I don't know if I mentioned this yet but we're trying to move away from the killer "completely remodel the house" and we're trying to move toward houses we can complete in 3-4 weeks rather than 3-4 months.We'll see what happens
Edited 11/6/2009 9:03 am by mrfixitusa
Larry,
I'm curious, what kind of pet policy do you have? I've rented a lot of houses in the past and it seems to be all over the map. The nicest house I rented said, sure no problem, bring them on. Others renting dumps have said no f'in way.
Do you have guidelines you use or not?
Jim
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Proud Resident of Obamistan
Edited 11/6/2009 10:13 am by leftisright
yes i will take on a pet,sometimes 2,but heres the catch. 250.00 pet fee PER pet.
heres what i discovered probably 15 years ago,i was automatically rejecting good people because they had a dog or cat,then with the prospects narrowed down [because "no pets" eliminates at least 50%] i was ending up with not so good people.
so we started the pet fee deal. heres what i discovered. for someone to plop down 250. for fido ,that dog is very important to them. the take care of it like it was their kid. now if they had went to the local pound,got a dog,and didn't really care about it,they would shake their heads and say no way am i paying 250 for a dog that i got free.
with this in place i would guess i went 14 years with perfect pets. last year i had a lady with 2 dachshunds,paid the 500. and within 3 months they had completely destroyed the carpet. so i lost on that one ,new carpet was about 1500.although i was fuming about it, i have probably brought in 10k over the years with the pet fee.
now i have had bad pet experiences with people getting pets after they move in ,and of course never tell me................the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Ive been on one for two weeks full time that sounds similar
. Busted 8 doors with his fist. Kicked holes on panneling walls I cant rematch. Let a doberman stay in side against the agreement and he chewed the corners of every out side corner. Drawers were missing and cabinet doors torn to h^ll/ on a set of homemade cabinets.
Law wont do a thing . judege wont either . I couod sue but I wont get a cup of coffee with a judgement in this town. Thats the way it is . They go after drugs cause theres money in it . Had an officer look at it and he laughed at me mainly becusae I shouod have knwojn better. He said they were at that house at least once a week but they never told me. He thot I was stupid and I think hes right .
The guy has a really nice pickup truck that he really loves . I cant keep that out of my mind working over there.
Don't suppose there's a way to get a lien against the truck?I'm thinking we're going to see more and more jurisdictions go the way yours is. I'm hearing it's that way in New Orleans, LA and Arlington, TX.Heard of one judge who said, "Where's he and his family going to live if I throw him out?" Nevermind who's going to pay the mortgage if you don't since the tenant wasn't paying rent.I'm sure something will befall his truck...
ok,you win,you got a bigger mess than i do. with mine being a commercial about 3 days and everything is hauled off,and i'm ready to paint and go again.
your right on the judgement deal.their renters, that says it all right there,they have nothing to get.
i got 1 a year ago, the guy was good and knew how to keep stuff out of his name ,with llc's etc. well then he decided to check out the strentgh of the tree in his back yard and hung himself. my lawyer called" you'll be able to get your money now". well guess what by the time the probate lawyers billed for all their expenses,there was nothing left,imagine that. judgement on renter is worthless.
i completely understand the truck deal, but somehow you gotta go on, because he can sue you and get something,because you have it.
1 bad tenant in 20 can sour the heck out of this deal.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
We were talking about rentals tonite and my brother has had rentals for 20 years or so. Maybe longer - I can't rememberAnyway he was talking about a woman tenant he had 8-10 years ago.Very attractive and singleShe would come into re-max office to pay her rent.All the guys would watch for her to arrive on the first or second of the monthAnyway, she tried out for a reality show and made it She was on the program "Marry My Dad" Kind of like the Bachelor show.She made it to the top 2 or 3 on the show.She was a good tenant and always paid her rent.Sometimes being a landlord can be fun.
lenders use a standard loan applicationI'm not very good with computers and don't know how to give you a link to itGoogle "form 1003" and that will take you to the uniform loan applicationthis is what she will fill out and take to the lender to apply for a loan
first,this is worth what you paid for it,because i haven't waded through irs docs.
you have to be a first time home buyer
you own a home so your out.
no one says you have to have a mortgage,you could pay cash for the house and still qualify.
so i would think that the contract has to be without your name,just hers the deed will be taken in her name only
the mortgage will be in her name with you as a co signer.
irs really has very little intrest in mortgages,lets say you buy a house for 50k,but get a mortgage on it for a 100k. you then sell it for 75k. lots of people will jump up and say they lost 25k,no way. irs says you made 25.they have no concern over what you owe,only what your basis is.
another way to jump at this is ,if you could borrow money on your house, loan her money to buy hers,then next yr 2010 she refi's and pays you back with you as a co signer.
i'm curious how this is handled ,sy you daughtre has paid in 5000 in taxes, but with her normal deductions she gets back 4k,does the gov send her a check for the whole 8k even though she hasn't paid that much? the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
heres something i dug up from the realators site.
http://www.realtor.org/wps/wcm/connect/f6ee3f004d2465a491f6f526a9949436/government_affairs_homeb_tax_credit_new.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=f6ee3f004d2465a491f6f526a9949436the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Thanks Larry - the national assoc of realtors likes the tax credit program (for selfish reasons of course)
The government's First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit expires December 1, 2009.
If you expect to use the program in conjunction with a home purchase, therefore, you may want to consider yourself officially "on the clock".
Assuming a 60-day window between contract and closing, there are now not too many days left to find a home or a buyer for your home and go under contract for it.
The First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit refunds up to $8,000 at Tax Time for qualified home buyers. A few of the program's qualification criteria include:
Home buyer must not have owned a primary residence in the past 36 months
The home may not be purchased from a family member
The household adjusted gross income must be below $95,000 for single tax filers and $170,000 for joint tax filers
The tax credit itself is limited to $8,000 or 10% of the purchase price, whichever is less.
Remember, though: The refund is a true tax credit -- not a deduction. This means that a taxpayer owing $8,000 to the IRS and claiming the $8,000 First-Time Home Buyer Tax Credit would owe the IRS nothing on April 15, 2010.
The complete list of qualifying criteria is posted on the IRS website.
The very existence of flame-throwers proves that at some time, somewhere, someone said to themself, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done".
Edited 9/24/2009 6:08 pm ET by CosmicCow
Thanks for the infoI make a mistake when I just automatically assume someone will receive the full $8,000 as this applies to home purchases of $80,000 and more.The avg home price where I'm from is about $100,000
Effective Oct 1 they're tightening things up regarding FHA loans on condosIt's going to make it more difficult to get an FHA loan for a condo
i didn't know your brother was a agent. so back 30 post ago when i said to bust the agent back 2500,probably wouldn't of worked out,lol
he's smart to be a agent with what he's doing,gets you in multilist,lots of sales info,etc,plus you save 3%.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
My brother failed shop class in high schoolHe is the worst carpenter in the worldWas involved in any sports in high school.Would not be capable of fixing a leaky faucet or installing a light bulbProbably would not be capable of changing a flat tireSeveral years ago he asked me to get up on the roof of his two story houseHe and I got up there to change the swamp cooler filterHe had shake roofHe slipped and fell on the wet shingles and nearly fell off the roofScared me to deathHe was a C student in high schoolNot a good student and not talented in any way as far as skilled trades goHe's good at real estate - one of the things that has helped him is he is not afraid to ask people to borrow money (for business)He pays them 7 to 8 percent return on their money and he borrows money from several people this wayHe will borrow $50 to $100,000 or moreHe's been doing this for a while and it works for him and also the person getting the 7 or 8 percent
no 'home office' looks over every estimate an adjuster writes in the field. they pretty much have autonomy to handle their business within the scope of a certian amount of authority - like up to $15,000 for some, higher for others.
she either wanted to just hit the high spots, tell me some line and thought I would buy it and she'd be off to the mall or she actually just didn't know what she legally owed for on a claim. I really think it was the former.
In my state the Department of Insurance has ruled that the insurance companies OWE sales tax on materials and that they OWE contractor's O&P even if the owner is electing to act as his own contractor and do the repairs himself. Many insurance companies try to add an extra layer in there that IS NOT mentined in the insurance commissioner's bulletin and say that they will pay O&P as long as three trades are involved.
Now, how many individual HO's are actually looking at insurance commissioner's bulletins and are knowledgable about something like that? Not many. She figured I was a regular HO and would not know better and she could blow me off with 'well, the computer doesn't allow for that.' Which was alsoa load of #### because the computer is set up to figure O&P; all they hav eto do is hit the rigt keys.
Each company may set their own rules for some things but they are still REQUIRED to abide by the insurance commissioner's bulletins if there are any which apply.
I want to add to something in the exchange between me and JimBlue about insurance and dealing with insurance adjusters.
Anyone involved in owning and managing rental property for themselves MUST be fully aware of what insurance covers as well as what insurance companies are required to pay for in addition to what they usually pay for as a matter of practice in the everyday world.
There can be a very big difference between wha they actually pay for in everyday practice and what they should be paying as a matter of requirement.
I've been involved in many insurance claims over the course of many years and I've NEVER had an insurance company come back and say their adjuster misfigured something and they should have actually paid me more because it was caught in an audit by home office staff and they actually owe me more money.
It is up to you to protect yourself and make sure that you get paid for the coverage you are apying for. If it's replacement cost or actual cash value you should be paid for the coverage you bought and it's your responsibility to see that you do. They won't do it for you.
Edited 8/25/2009 10:48 pm ET by lankford
"I've NEVER had an insurance company come back and say their adjuster misfigured something "I have. Although it might have been from a question that I asked. But it was sometime after the they paid the inital claim.The adjuster though that my Timberline roof was shakes and that it could be patch. But I did not know that is why they paid what they did at the time. But it has been long enough ago that I really don't remember the details..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
The adjusters won't do it unless someone inquires (as you already mentioned). Once they file those claims, why would they open them up without an inquiry?
We aren't having too much trouble getting the claims re-adjusted if we call them on shortages.
The point is that the ins. co.'s don't have someone reviewing every estimate to make sure the policy holder is paid enough on the claim by the adjuster. You had to initiate the review by asking why they were figuring a patch instead of a replacement. Had you not asked the 'ins. co.' would have been content to allow you to remain underpaid.
From my limited experience around her, for common moderate losses building, they pay replacement cost for the repairs.Otoh, in one I lost some personal property and they made me list the purchase price and when I bought it for things like a $7.95 plastic garbage can and then send in the receipt to get the replacement value.But I suspect that they might have been because they (and I) got ripped off by their independent adjuster had had his "contractor" friend help him figure the job. And I did not know any better at the time. All I saw was units of work for each thing..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Time to move over to the Housing Market for part of the dicussion weve had.
http://forums.taunton.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=tp-breaktime&msg=123473.1
That may answer some of your questions.
Edited 8/18/2009 11:55 am by Mooney
That roofer obviously doesn't understand his costs. There are lots of them out there.
I had a guy ask me to give him a price before he would share his insurance data with me. I was within fifty dollars. The prices that the insurance company pay are based on real life, local data.
One problem with your story is that the guy can't legally "put a thousand dollars" in his pocket in most instances. The insurance payout, with most companies, witholds the recoverable depreciation. On that guys bill, they would be witholding anywhere between $1000 to $3000. If he pays less, they reduce the payout by that amount. The roofers would have to be working free to get below the recoverable depreciation amount.
Some people don't mind risking a felony though. We run from those types.
I made a post that was supposed to be to you but went to Larry.
While IM here .
People talk about the fish that got away and it gets longer . That makes the fish they catch smaller . A sorry man dies and hes a saint by the time someone gets done .
Larry is griping and I am too about costs . We also arent bragging about the gains . Just sayin when you hold that much property it didnt get done all by the sweat of the brow. All the decisions werent award winners but some actually were . You cant win them all but if you can win the majarioty then you might be in the black. Everyone has had good jobs and bad ones . You just hope your decisions are on the plus side good ones. Ive also had some windfalls like buying a house with extra land that I really didnt pay for and sold . Things like that . So Im due a loss every now and then and try not to get down about it .
Mooney,
I'm waiting for the book.I and a partner had 7 rentals once and didn't know what we were doing.
One of my best days ever was when we finally dumped them...no profit, just relief.What you know is so worthwhile. As you say, learned at the college of hard knocks.Pete
look into Germania Ins. if its sold in your area.
roofing ? this may be a investment thread but what the heck.
if a guy bought a truck load of shingles and they were stored inside for lets say up to 10 years,do you think there life would be hurt much once on the roof.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I would like to get paid that 125 labor on a bout 6 roofs.
Thats how I come out . I pay two boys to lay for me and I hire a worker at the lumber yard to come out and stock the roof. We do it on Saturday and Sunday if its not supposed to rain. I pay them both a 100 for two days .
i can't find anyone that hungry,that i would trust not to fall off the roof and sue me.
one guy here will nail em down for 35 a sq,tear off the same.but i have to furnish the trailer and do the dump runs,not a huge deal with a dump trailer. then run around and get what he needs .he's not the best but on stuff that don't matter without a lot of valleys he's ok.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I would do it alone before Id pay 125. Even in my shape. YOu arent paying 125 either . Just sayin thats where I come out . Tear off a sq and replace it from the bottom up is 250 cash /tax free per day. Pretty easy day at that .
Depends on the roof like you say. Ive uncovered half of a straight roof or exposed side. Covered it with a tarp and then Im set to roof till I get tired and cover it back up. Roof is still covered under insurance with me doing it if the tarp flies off. Reason I say that is I asked my agent what would happen if I cut a tree and it fell on the house ?" It would be insured. But if you hired it done we would be looking at your contactor ."
The advantage is doing your own work. The best one I ever had was a simple hip roof . They paid me three times on the tear off and extra money on the steep pitch. One story that easily fell into the trailer with no shrubs or obstructions . I did one section per day by my self and didnt work very hard. Every time I see a simple hip roof I think about it when Im bidding repos to buy. I dont see very many.
Tim
Im getting tired of the rental business as well.
Its a hands on business. A lot of investors are scornful of it because it takes so much time . They seem to look for hands off operations that run them selves or investments that just gain value or were underbought to start with.
I wish I could sell every thing and be liquid immendiately. Id still buy and sell but where I wanted to. Id move into areas and strike . Goverment loans are the way to go right now and I want to sell every thing Ive got to them.
Larry , you didnt go quite far enough.
Lets make it a meth lab.
i'm not picking on jim,but his idea of what he would do if he had bought a house on a rent to own is exactly why i would shy away from one.
your still a landlord,still responsible for repairs,but you have lost total control of the property,he's releasing to someone that i don't even know who they are. they can tear it up and walk, and your hung out to dry.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I think my brother has done this before and he must not have gotten burned.I know he's done it with other people he's had as renters.I'm bouncing around a little bit here but we got hit with getting permits on the house I'm working on.The permits cover three areas:(1) electrical (we had the electrical panel moved from the stairway to the outside of the house = we ended up moving it about 15 ft)(2) plumbing (re-doing the shower in the basement and major change to the drain)(3) Remodeling (remodeling both bathrooms)Under remodeling they require you to insulate any exterior walls which have been opened up Anyway, we had our inspection on monday and passed except we installed the insulation incorrectly.We installed R-13 insulation in the bathroom walls incorrectly and had to re-do it.Want to take a guess what we did wrong?
Edited 7/15/2009 8:07 am by mrfixitusa
I don't think so.
The lease option consists of two separate contracts. The lease portion of the contract would be the exact same language that you currently use in your leases, if you so choose. I think that would be foolish, given that you can eliminate your normal landlording duties with a few simple clauses.
The option part is nothing more than a pre-arranged purchase agreement. It doesn't give the optioner any more control of the property than what you want to write on the paper.
Its the way I see it as well. Ive never GOT it to be honest. Why anyone would turn a perfectly good home over to strangers with out supervision.
People that get it normally arent the ones under exposure of losing thousands.
Really , actually , a lease is much better for us . You wanna buy it , fine , go to the bank or hand over cash. Ever bodys happy about it .
i don't know how your market is going there,but here there seems to be alot of moving going on. everybody is just trying to reduce their cost for housing.
were keeping them rented,but it's a full time job. sometimes i get fed up with lease's. we have had probably 7 broken this year. what can you do? if they want or need to move see ya. so far we have been able to get them released without incurring much vacancies, so their off the hook for the lease.
what i hate about a lease is i am completely tied up ,but the tenant can walk without much consequences. i had a commercial lease,13 years left. jimmie johns sandwich shop wants to buy it. sorry it's under a lease. their lawyers even took a look to see if they could break it. nope.
6 months later [dec 08] tenant doesn't pay rent,go to court ,judge tells him he's out, but then rules that the way my 10 day eviction notice read,he's not responsible for the next 13 years. [doesn't matter really,first he's broke, second he goes home and hangs himself so that kinda makes the whole point mute any way]now i'm in probate trying to at least get my last months rent,at first i felt bad about this,i even liked the guy,but after a little soul searching,he did what he wanted,not my fault.
the day of court i go to jimmie johns,they already bought.
i don't know about you but i'm having fun..............................the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
i'll tell you what i really like best about his deal,he's held it over a year, it's long term capital gains. that could amount to way more than the sales commision.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I'll ask him about that.I have no idea and I appreciate you throwing that out about the tax advantagesI was going to tell you that we got in trouble with the inspector for using insulation with a paper facing.You're not allowed to do that here in a bathroom.So we had to tear off the paper and everything was okay
so no paper,do you use any vapor barrier?
what are they worried about? mold i guessthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
They don't want anything that will absorb moistureSo unfaced unsulation in the wall is what is req'dGuess it makes sense
Saying the paper facing will absorb moisture and the fiberglass batt won't?
I need to clarify what the city building inspector said about the paper face on the insulation.The inspector said to get rid of the paper on the insulation because it is a vapor barrier and you don't want a vapor barrier in a bathroom because of the moisture
I see.
Specifies no vaporbrrier in the bathroom?
Seems that would be the one place you'd want one.
What am I missing here?
Larry, did you know Tiller drove a bullet proof car?Did you know he was charging $5 K per each late term procedure?They said he was a millionaireVery wealthy guy from what I hear.Sorry for the thread hijack.
I thnk I answered you in the post to fixit.
Tim, we're trying to sell these houses by making ours better than the other starter homes.We're trying to come up with things we can do to the kitchen and the bathroom to make the home appeal to the woman of the family.We're trying to do this on a budget.Something that's working for us is to open up the kitchen and also put as many cabinets as we can plus install as much countertop as we can to improve the kitchen.I've got some pictures I'm going to attach.I now have a MacBook computer and I'm learning to post pictures so bear with me.
Here's another kitchen we just finished where we opened up the wall between the kit and liv room
What Tim says is exactly true. All the money made on real estate is made on the buy. Buy it wrong and you won't make a dime. Buy it right and you can sell it in the morning for more than you paid.
The things you are doing are simply marketing tools. You always hear home owners say they just put a new roof on or new window in and that should raise the value. BS. The house was supposed to have a roof and windows or few would buy it. But if it has a new roof and windows it is certainly more marketable when people comparitive shop. DanT
Thanks Dan - I don't have the numbers but we are not having trouble finding the houses.By "we" I mean my brother. That's his department and my end of things is doing the actual work on the house.He's in a position where he can buy the houses and pay cash. That puts him at an advantage over a guy like me who would have to finance a house.His money comes from a line of credit.The line of credit comes from the equity on 30+ rental properties.Getting back to remodeling, we're trying to make the kitchens look modern and attractive to the woman of the house and we're doing that by making our own countertops.We tile the countertop with a dark tile that matches the backsplash.It's a lot of work and I would like to come up with something faster.The problem we have is Lowes and Home Depot DOES NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO GET EXCITED ABOUT IN A FORMICA COUNTER TOPSo what else can we do?What are you guys doing for a reasonably priced counter top for the kitchen.I wanted to mention that I talked to a Interior Decorator recently and she said tile countertops in the kitchen are out of style. She said women don't want them because they're out of style and hard to clean the grout areas.We've had a lot of positive feedback about the tile and we have another house under contract as of yesterday.
I wouldn't take everything a realtor says as the Gospel truth. If you talk to ten different realtors, they'll give you ten different opinions and you'll be running around like a chicken with your head cut off.
Thanks Jim and yes you're right.I came from Wichita and am in a different world here in Denver.Several months ago we walked into "our next project" which was a bank foreclosure.My experience has been that people trash the homes as they are leaving.They kick holes in the walls, pour bleach on the carpet, let the dog go all over the carpet, etc.Anyway, we walked into a house that was clean and tidy.The owner left these items behind:Front loading wash machine retail $700 to $800
Front load dryer same as above
Large baseball card collection
Leather coats
new Wool men's suit size with price tag still on it
Working televisionWhy would anyone leave such nice things?Who knows.
"Why would anyone leave such nice things?"
The more time you spend thinking about that the more it makes a person sad.
I have garage sales selling their stuff and what renters leave but its really sad.
I believe it has somthing to do with their state of mind from the condition they are in when they leave it . Probably depression.
The kids clothes , furniture , and toys dont do me any good.
When ever I step on a repo property I try to put together the story.
Tear up the house and leave stuff is their MO everywhere.
When I find out what they owed , many times they could have sold it and came out . They arent in that good a mind set.
Kids are the only thing in it that bothers me.
Tim
Tim, we started a new house last week A lot of stuff was left in the house.We placed an ad on Craigs List under "Free"Our ad said we had furniture, non working mowers, bicycles, washer, dryer, metal cart, and miscOur first visitors were four kids about 20 years old who wanted the washer and dryer.I said "where's your pickup"They said "we'll tie it on top of the car"They couldn't make the washer and dryer work so they didn't want it.They did want a large shelving unit and they tied it to the top of the car and each person held on to it through the car window as they drove away.By the end of the day a "scrapper" had taken every piece of metal we had.It really helped us clean up the placeIt's a good system to use.We have something unusual to sell, trade, or give away.The previous owner left us about 15 concrete forms.These are heavy steel 10 ft long.They will form a sidewalk or driveway that is 6" deep.They are old and rusty and well used but I think they are worth somethingIt is pretty heavy just picking up one form.
You better get to thinking a little better.
Wife just sold 400 dollars worth of stuff off what one renter left. You proably gave away 2500.
I would have repaired the washer and dryer.
Thats part of this business . Metal goes on the metal bin to be sold etc.
You learn to work on everything and sell everything .
The latest "revenge" trick around here is dumping cement down drains.Apparently, people who couldn't work out some kind of loan modification deal, "get even" with the lender by creating some real serious sewer line problems.
"Loan Modification" programs have not worked as plannedThey interviewed an attorney and his advice was something like "don't even bother"I can understand people becoming angry & frustrated and then trashing the house as they're leaving.We see it all the time.Holes punched and kicked in wallsClorox poured on the carpetLeave the dog in the house for a few daysThe house I'm working on right now was not trashed but what's worse is what the owner did while he was living thereHe took a three bedroom house and turned it into a one bedroom.He made the living room bigger.We're putting it back together and making it a two bedroom but it's taking a lot of work.
this is a picture of the "new and improved" living room Two walls were removed and an 11 X 11 bedroom is now part of the living roomThis is a standard ranch style house and if you use your imagination you can picture where the bedroom was with the hallway on the left (going back to the bath and two additional bedrooms
We want to go back to hardwood floors and when the walls were removed this left a void in the floor (where the 2 X 4 plate was attached to the subfloor)I have spent many hours trying to blend or weave the new flooring into the old floor in the hopes the repair would not be noticeableEdited 7/22/2009 12:28 am by mrfixitusa
Edited 7/22/2009 12:30 am by mrfixitusa
I think its noticeable. I can see the short pieces that you've put in :).
Jim, we have had the city building inspector in the home twice and I wondered if he would say something like "looks like some walls were removed"But He didn't say anything.For the record, We did not remove the walls.It was that way when we got here.I got up in the attic and looked around and a beam has been placed in the attic directly above where a wall was beforeIt seems to be workingEverything is holding togetherNothing is saggingNothing is crackingI wanted to go on the record here.When people start taking walls out of a home or making two bedrooms into one bedroom, THIS IS A MISTAKE, and the house doesn't feel right.Leave it a alone. you are not improving the house by chopping it upAn architect or a builder designed the house and you are not going to improve it by changing things around
Tim, I found another.
The guy is going to sign the deed to me and leave his mortgage in place. I think I'm going to take this one. I'm researching the rent rates tomorrow.
Well the short of it is ;
Its wonderful holding power [a rental]
You wont make any money or money to brag about while you have it but it has built value for me . Hold it for three years and who knows capitol gains might still be there. It was the best used poker hand in the bush years to play.
I read a book one time [ I have it somewhere ] about harvesting the crops in real estate. Thats what Ive done shall we say the smartest or just dumb luck to have happened on it through a 10 dollar book. It was dumb luck but if I wrote a book it would be in it .
Depends on the situation at hand . If you make money its a tax shelter.
I suggest you think it through what it will do for you and what it wont . Moving houses in and out of my fleet has worked the best for me and letting renters pay 15 year notes. Ive got some 30 year pays but those were to sustain the effort in the early days . They worked well because of the gains in value . Now I fear that plan may not work.
If houses were bought cheaper then the investment would stand on its own as i always say . In other words those would sell the day I bought them or any time I chose to haul those cows to the sale for some quick money in the bank.
Still others were bought on easy terms to graze slowly from the pasture while making me some income from rents.
I wish I had got into mini storage 20 years ago. Too much competition now.
Im glad I was able to do what I did . I wish it had been more . Theres books that taught that too . I didnt agree at the time .
I am not sure where everyone is getting this idea that capital gains might be removed. Everything is pointing to an increase in capital gains tax. No politician, not democrat of republican, would ever vote to remove it completely.
Last week me and another guy built a 6 X 8 shed for the bossEnclosed is pictureIt took three days.We went to HD to buy 8" hardie lap siding and they didn't have anyI asked why and they said "because we're getting rid of hardie siding and won't be stocking it anymore"I said "why"They said they weren't selling enough of it and the avg person does not want to mess with it.We bought the 8" masonite pre primed siding and took it home and installed it.We tried to "blind nail" it and it really didn't work as well as I thought it wouldThe bottom seemed to lift away The ends lifted away and we had to nail each endWe made our own doors and next time will use metal studs for a frame work (rather than regular 2 X 4's)The doors are pretty heavyWe installed a cat door in the left hand door
Yea but you got some heavy hinges to hold it .
I can see them not stocking hardie siding . I can also see why they stock 8 ft drywall instead of 12s . Always loss leader stuff. I bought 5 thousand blocks when they were selling them for 89 cents delivered free. I waited and waited till that deal was long gone and sold them cash and carry for 1.25. You could go to the bank and borrow money at that return at 5 to 800 per gig. THEY WERE GONE IN 6 MONTHS. I put them behind the shop so I was there but I didnt load ,they sit them in pallets of 100 and I counted pallets taken . They couldnt steal because Lowes wrapped them in plastic.
When I was hanging drywall I bought from them all the time and made 5 cents per foot selling it versus nothing from the lumber yard.
Just because they wont be selling hardie doesnt mean hardie is going away. Buy it from a lumber yard or other box store like Lowes. They still have it cause I bought some and also ordered som from the lumber yard recently. I really dont care in reason what it costs because theres nothing like it if you takeing off from ground level like that storage building . That siding you used will last about 10 years tops. Thats why using it on rentals Im keeping I dont care what it cost with in reason. Its well worth it .
Tim
I'm going to be painting for the next couple of days with a rollerWe buy our paint at KWALWe have an account there and pay contractor's rateYesterday I bought a 5 gallon bucket of interior primer for $68.01I bought 5 gallons of flat white for ceilings for $65.67I know the guy at the counter and I said "how much is a 3" tapered purdy paint brush"?And he said $32I said wow, you're a lot higher than home depot. They charge $18He said "buy a KWAL paintbrush, they're just as good"I looked at then and they look goodI bought two 3 " tapered brushesRetail price was $10He sold them to me at a contractor's discount and I paid $5 each for what appears to be some pretty good paint brushesI like the biggest tapered brush I can find for painting the top of the wall where the wall meets the ceilingI'm getting better at painting a straight line
I bet you didnt buy the qaulity of a purdy though.
You used it yet?
I get the Purdy's at Lowe's or HD. They are worth the cost.
sounds great - hope you hit a homerun
I actually came on here to tell you somthing and found blues msg.
I had two kids helping me today @5 bucks an hour .
I had some carp stuff to finish up- this morning . We broke from lunch and hit the house at 1:15 unhanging doors and preparing to paint a 1400 sq ft house inside. The boys did most of the work. I sprayed it two coats complete . Ceilings , walls , doors , trim , closets, etc. Tomorrow we will finish it . MIni roller the enamel using kids on the doors and casings. Ill be on a brush tomorrow and do any cutting . That will be 12 hrs for that crew complete.
Speedy Gonzalez
I'm not really looking for a homerun. I'm looking for a bunt single.
Heres the numbers and my plan.
The existing mortgage is 109k. If the guy sells for 125k, and it takes 3-4 months to sell, he'd have to put out about 5k out of pocket to sell the house. For all intents and purposes, he's upside down.
Realistically, the house won't sell conventionally for 125k. It might sell to someone that needs to repair their credit for 125k because those types of folks have less options available to them. So, since I'm able to "take over the payments" with no money out of my pocket, this deal could work for me.
First things first: I won't take over those payments until I find a buyer. That reduces my risk substantially. So, the sellers have to stay in the house till I line up the buyer even though I'll have it under contract.
The buyers will most likely have dinged credit. A lot of the hardworking folks leaving the midwest and moving into this area fit that profile. They can't get a conventional mortgage because their credit score has slipped or their income had dropped. Many self employed people cannot get conventional credit nowadays but they still somehow manage to pay their bills.
The numbers look like this:
I'll owe about $1100 for the existing PITI. That will be paid into an escrow account because the sellers have already asked for that. The new buyers will agree to give me 3-5k as a non refundable option fee and pay $1500 per month rent on a one year option. The selling price will be 125k. I'll designate $200 per month as payment towards the down payment. I'll offer them a one year option renewal, with an additional $1000 non-renewable option payment.
If they exercise the option at the end of the first year, the numbers will look like this:
125k purchase price with 109k payout to clear the existing mortgage. That leaves 16k. I will also have cashflowed $200 per month in "rent" for a total of $2400. That brings my income total to $18,400. That sum will back out the option fee of $3-5k, because I'll already have that money. It looks like a 15k payday if they exercise their option. Of course, I will have some expenses: credit check, background check, etc. The actual closing fees will be paid for by the original seller and the new buyer.
Invest in some books if you havent already.
No book will fit you or your area but its always good to see others point of view. I know you like to read .
I bought in tough times when interrest was high and at that time there were doom sayers. The world will fall into a depression and the skies will fall down. Always possible but before now not likely. Now IM not sure where its gonna turn. Then again I didnt know interrest would drop in half back then. Im not sure what to think of our current problems . Rates are cheap. Prices are dropping . Nothing like any thing Ive ever seen. Im selling as fast as I can get them ready becauase of it . But theres to many and too little time IM afraid . Ill be doing good to get two more sold before the end of november. They are selling very well but the work is the problem. I guess what IM trying to say is IM not sure Id buy a rental right now . Im sure not looking at any more to flip or investments to keep. Could be a mistake .
One thing I forgot to mention in the other post was that when things were tough before I heard the term rooted. Theres a lady in town I used to work for and everyone said she would survive because she owned her stock of apartments out right . Well I didnt own mine but I saw pretty quicky its a good idea to at least be under 50 percent of value . NOthing but a depression could bother 50 percent equity. Think about it and push the numbers.
Invest in some books if you havent already
I agree. I tell anyone that wants to get started in real estate to get at least 20 books and read them before they do much of anything. I've probably read 50 myself, some of them twice everything from simple residential stuff (there's a gem or two in everyone of them) to commercial to real estate accounting (I couldn't finish it).
I wouldn't fear a recession/depression as long as I'm not on the mortgages. I've cleared all my mortgages in recent years...of course I took some substantial hits to do that but I've escaped with my credit and it is serving me well right now as I launch the roofing business here in Texas.
I don't think I'll ever put my name on a house mortgage again. Theres just no reason to do that.
Edited 7/23/2009 8:45 am ET by jimAKAblue
Something that has helped me understand what your doing is actually meeting people who want to "rent to own"I already told you about my brother selling a house via rent to own.He sold a house this way a couple of weeks ago but I don't know the numbers such as downpayment, monthly payment, purchase price, etc.This allowed him to sell the home at full price and avoid paying a realtor.He had tried to sell the house for a month or two and this was kind of like going to plan B.Anyway, I am the one who showed the house to the rent to own Buyers and so therefore I got to know them a little bit.these people want to own a house but can't. Credit problems.BUT THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT DEADBEATSShe is working full time in a school.She is a responsible person.He is working full time as a truck driver.He is retired military and is a responsible person. THEY HAVE A THIRD FORM OF INCOME IN THAT HE IS RETIRED MILITARYWe feel good about this Again, it's really an eye opener to meet the people in personDON'T SELL YOUR HOUSE TO SOMEONE WHO IS FLAKY, EVASIVE, AND NOT "UP FRONT" WITH YOUDon't sell your house to a loser Don't sell your house to a loser on welfareDon't sell to someone with unpredictable income Don't sell to someone with a criminal backround or drug and alcohol problems.Don't sell to someone who tries to live a lifestyle they can't affordDon't sell to someone with an "gimmee" attitude - the people who think they have a right to own a homeTHERE ARE LOTS OF GOOD PEOPLE OUT THEREDo you realize some people are really "stepping up" and getting out of a rental and getting their kids into a home they own AND THEY HIGHLY VALUE THIS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!They do not want to go back to renting and they will do anything to keep their home !!!!!!!!!!!They will work two jobs if they have to!!!!!!Just my two centsGood luck!
I used to be speedy . As fast as they came .
But not any more.
That was more the plan than speed. I made it as stupid as possible for those kids and the speed of the airless. A coat was put on in one bedroom that I timed. Ceilings , walls , trim and the closet in 60 seconds .
That was a big airless pump shooting 3200 psi through a .021 tip with a 16 inch fan . It moves on. Its faster than I can walk . I shot shopping centers with it and new apartments inside.
Tim
Sixty seconds to paint a room is commendableYou're a good teacherSounds like you've got a high dollar spraying rig.Did you know that you're supposed to go to a larger tip for spraying exterior paint?Why?Because exterior paint is thicker.
The real value of "rent to own" is pride of ownership. While the landlords are constantly worrying about people tearing up their properties, the "owners" are making them better. It's a day and night difference in attititude.
I sold my condo to a lady in MI on a lease option. She didn't exercise the option but I didn't care. One of my conditions about selling to her was that I was still allowed to show it to prospective buyers. If a buyer made an offer, she had first right of refusal to match the offer or exercise her option, whatever suited her. When a new buyer came in and made me an offer, she moved out. The place was in perfect condition.
No system will ever be perfect but I think the lease option angle stacks the deck in the landlords favor.
Jim I bet there are many many Buyers out there for "rent to own"I wanted to show you guys a picture of the house I'm working onThe house has a detached garage and the space between the house and garage forms kind of a breeze way which I have come to realize is really a nice feature of this homeThe roof connects from house to garage and it's the same roofline across the ranch style houseIt's a place to store bicycles, mower, garden equip, rake, etcIt's really a nice feature of this home
Breeeze way picture
on your wood floor,do you know about "trowable wood filler"?
used to be hd sold it here, now the only place i can find it is at star,have to buy 1 gal size which would do about 3000 sf.
anyway once all the boards all laid ,you trowel this stuff on and sand it while doing the floors. makes all the joints and cracks disappear.
wish you were here in wichita,got some i'd give you.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Thanks LarryWe're getting ready to do the floor in a bout a weekAnother guy will do the floor and I'll watch to see how he does itWe're going to refinish the oak floor in living room, hallway, and both bedrooms.I guess you could say I went to school on this house when it comes fixing oak flooringI learned how to cut out one plank and replace itthis will help me in the future if I have to fix floors that need to be replaced due to pet stains, etcOr if a piece has cracked or splitThe planks measure 2 and 1/4 wide and if you ever need to make a straight cross cut on a board in the floor, this is the tool to use:http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Category.taf?CategoryID=116&pricetype=
Didn't you refinished some floors recently?How did it go?
the floor i did i had to replce probably 10 board. i would run a saw down the middle ,then pry the old one out. i cut the tounge off the replacement and then glued and nailed it in. worked good,but i lucked out with being able to steal some boards out of the bathroom floor[yes it had oak in the bathroom from 1925] so they matched perfect.
what did you use ,the harbor freight multi master? i went to get one and they didn't have any extra blades so i passed. i've got my hf tile saw in the paper today,if i can sell it i'm going to buy a new one from hf,they have them on sale for 190.00the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Yes I bought the harbor freight multi master and it worked goodI also own the Dremel multi master from HD and IT DIDN'T WORK AS WELLThe wood is old and difficult to work with.Kind of like an old carpenterAnyway, it's funny you should mention multi master and tile sawTwo of the guys I'm working with are really good with tile.I've been here 6-7 months now and we've done a lot of tile work.We tear out old tile and put in new.WE USE THE MULTI MASTER TO SCRAPE THE OLD MASTIC AND IT WORKS GREATWe tile right over old messed up concrete, old plywood, old subfloor, etc.We just use a trowell with 1/2 notches and put it on thickGood luck selling your tile saw
Our "company pickup" is a 2005 dodge ram 1500 four dooor four wheel drive pickup with hemi engineThe tires were worn out (inside of tires worn down to metal) and very uneven wearTook the pickup in for new tires and was informed it needed ball joints, front end parts, wheel bearings, etcIt cost $3,200 for the tires and front end It's kind of a shame because he bought the pickup brand new and it only has 78,000 miles on itThe A/C quit working a year ago and it needs everything. It will cost $900 for the new compressor etcThere are times it will die on the roadPull to the side, let it rest for a minute, start it up and it runs for another six months.This pickup has a lot of power.But it's a shame to have to put these kinds of repairs in a newer pickup.The cause of the front end wear is from pulling a trailer all the time according to the mechanicThis is a common 10 ft? enclosed trailer like you see everyday.Is pulling a trailer really that hard on a pickup?
I was told 70-80 was common for front ends on 1/2 ton trucks. I have a ford and its on its 2nd (soon as I fix it). MIL Ranger wore out at 115K parts were about 150. Mechanic wanted 1K. I fixed it.
Lightening the front changes camber or caster one, cain't keep em strait and toe. Probably don't help
Thanks for the infoThe truck had been driven all over town these last couple of years and they just leave the trailer hooked onEven when they don't need it.It's just easier to leave the trailer hooked up and pull it aroundI think we're going to cut down on thatThanks again
if you like purdy brushes hit ebay, guys have 2nds [?] on there. i buy alot of 2" for around 4.00 each.never saw anything about them a that made them a 2nd, just doesn't come with the cardboard wrapping around it.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Thanks Larry, I'll check it outOne guy I work with has used the same Purdy paint brush for 10-15 yearsHe even keeps it in the card board coverWhat kind of Paint are you using on your rentals?I think Tim uses Walmart paint. Maybe we're wasting our money buying KWAL paintThey're always busy at KWAL and so it's a slow process getting our order
i bounce around on paint brands. i don't do the white wall thing. as tim has talked about you have to stand out in the crowd and this is where i do.all the rooms are different colors.
if i had lots of money,it would always be sw. on exterior it's always sw duration
i use some of walmarts kilz brand
also use baher
getting ready to try pittsburg again.
seems all have there drawbacks.
my favorite wall treatment is wallpaper! i could wallpaper a house and not touch the walls for 10 years.it was great. but people don't like it anymore. i still have a 1/2 dozen with wallpaper but as we redo them going back to paint. problem with paint is ,everytime they move .you have to paint.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Larry we had our oak floors sanded and finished these past few daysThe guy who did it has been doing it for 18 yearsHe charges $2.75 per sq footHe owns his own equip and I watched him sand the floorI figured out why my floors didn't turn out very good in the pastI DIDNT USE GOOD TOOLS AND EQUIPMENTThis guy has a $3,500 floor sander (belt sander)IT RUNS ON 220 VOLTHe sanded the floor down and made it look easyHe sanded the large room and two bedrooms and three four closets in a few hoursHe made it look easyI'll submit some pictures and you'lll see what I'm talking about
These are the before picturesThe floor was pretty messed up
Sanding the floors
A coat of sealer was applied this morning and two coats of poly will be applied as top coatsHe uses a thin sponge applicator (commonly used to paint with) and he likes using it better than a lambswool applicator
He used a large paint pad to apply the sealer and he will also use it to apply the polyHe has a pad that is 10-12" and it has a handle on it to make it easy to usehttp://www.paintbrushesandrollers.com/paint_pads.htm
your patch job come out good. when you did your floors here,did you use a belt sander?
i own a orbital,it does a excellent job,but is very slow. on the up side i usally turn my wife lose with it and let her do the sanding while i'm working on something else. just a rough estimate, but i would probably take 8 hours a room to sand. sometime i just got to rent a belt and see what i can screw up.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I've been watching this thread and others on the flooring issue. I've got three rooms that need to be stripped this week. Back and forth on the orbital vs. belt issue.
I think I'm going to go with the belt and see if I can screw it up. [G] Floors are 50 y/o SYP and two are painted.
I'll let you know how it goes.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Start in the back, that belt can be a bitch on small areas. Did my first 10 years ago.
We did those floors this week with the drum sander.
I wasn't really thrilled. The equipment was new and in good working order, but the belt was only 8" wide. It was a 110 volt. Because it was narrow, it took some time to go over the floors. We used three sizes of paper - 20 grit, 36 and 100. I started with the heavy stuff because two of the rooms had been painted. One room had been stained. On that one I started with a used piece to not scratch it as much. I could have used a 60 grit in between, don't know if it would have made much of a difference. It would have taken more time.
Holding back/picking up the drum machine took some effort, especially after about 45 minutes. We switched off to give each other a break.
It took a full day with 2-3 guys going, to do all three rooms, three times. I can't tell you what the paper cost was. The leftover paper was on the back of the truck and blew out when I took the machine back, so I don't know how much I really used. I know the edger used more than the belt sander, especially with the 100 grit. BTW, the edger left more damage than the belt sander. Those arc gouges hurt.
The machines rented for $39/day for the belt and $20 for the edger. Total cost with the wasted paper and tax was about $110. It probably should have been $25 cheaper.
The wood wasn't the greatest. It looked okay at first, until you looked close. One bedroom was #2, too many knots. Living room had no knots, but had some old termite damage that I hadn't seen. (Both of those were the painted floors.) It was too late to change it out once we had the machines there, and a PITA to boot. The kitchen had some old water damage and had been stained dark. It got stained dark again to cover the damage and the stain we couldn't get rid of.
We're waiting on the stain drying so they can be polyed. Wet/humid weather here; it's going to take over 3 days to dry.
Cost so far is about $125 for equipment, maybe $300 labor, $75 in stain and I'm not sure of the price of the poly. Is there a savings by doing it yourself? Don't know. Like Fixit says, the pros come in with the bigger machines, and move faster. You pay for that though.
Is there an advantage to doing it yourself? Yes, you can do it on your own schedule and not wait for somebody else. Does it look as good as a pro's job? Probably not, but it's the first one so for me it's a training exercise. Would I do it again? Likely yes, but I'll see how the numbers work first.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Larry I rented every type of floor sander in wichita Heincluding the belt sander at HDOur floor guy uses the large belt sander for most of the floor and then the edgers for the perimter and the closetsBUT YOU CAN'T STOP THERE BECAUSE YOU HAVE TWO DIFFERENT SANDING PATTERNSHis next step is to use a floor buffer and this give the uniform sanded surface which is then ready for sealer and polyI asked if he had ever finished a floor with Shellac and he said "no, in 18 years I've never heard of anyone doing it that way"This guy brought his equip in the day before and put it all in the bedroomI'll post a picture of it if I can find it
Here's what I'm looking forDo you think these are factory rejects?http://cgi.ebay.com/PURDY-Lot-10-paint-brushes-3-XL-Dale_W0QQitemZ330347937849QQcategoryZ41990QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp4340.m183QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DSICDD%26its%3DI%252BC%252BS%252BIA%26itu%3DSI%252BUS-BWR%252BUCI%252BIA%252BUCC%252BPSS%252BCRS%252BIT%252BUA%26otn%3D8%26ps%3D33
you will find in purdy that there are several different type of brushes.
the ones you have marked on ebay are xl dales.that is the one that i like to use. i would guess those are the same "2nds" as i buy being as they don't come with a cover. i wonder where these guys get them from?
15 yrs!how do you use the same brush for that long? i clean the heck out of mine ,but they still get paint up in the top of the bristles and finally hit the trash.
ebay is great place for this kind of stuff. i bought a 100 roller covers also,i think i paid about .40 a pc for them.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
The only reason I use walmart is becuase I make it easy.
I only use two colors and buy them out several times so Ill have enough . Im at about 50 gallons and off white in flat and eggshell enamel. Ive probably got 35 gallons of white in the same .
Here while back I let my stock run out . I had to do a house and thats what I get into if I dont prebuy. They may only have 1 gallon in stock somtimes of white . I dont undertatnd it . Anyway I needed to paint the inside of a house so I bought house paint . It did well. Just a couple more bucks per gallon. Im using house paint now on ceilings and walls . Its flat and washable I found out .
Thanks for the info TimWe buy our paint in 5 gallons and we're paying about $65 Bottom line is we probably should be saving money and going with walmart paint I guess I have always felt the walmart paint was thin and of poor quality and therefore I have stayed away from it these past few yearsI did use it at one timeWe really need to go in and paint these houses in 1 coat of paint if possibleI got stung this weekI used good quality primer and good quality flat white paint on the ceilings in the basement AND THE PAINT DIDN'T COVERI ended up putting on two coats which is disappointingThe other day I told you about my cheapo paint brushes (I paid $5 for a 3" tapered brush) and I feel they are ok brushes for what we're doing(painting filthy run down houses and trying to just put apply the paint as thick as possible)thanks again
Theres not much that will paint one coat and cover to sell. Old houses is not one of them. Walmart paint used to be bad stuff some 30 yrs ago. It got a bad name . Its not premium paint . Color Place will hold up with any contractor paint Ive used and beat most of it . Thats right , beat it . It will outcover Ben moore contractors grade . Anyway two coats of it while the spray rig is hooked up is no big deal . Im a fan man . Ive been one for years finishing drywall and doing painting . Ive got 6 commercial fans on the trailer that I use . Ive got a couple turbines in addition to them that are small that will doing any thing from dry a waxed floor to dry a spot of drywall mud repairing door knob holes. One patch wonders they are . They will dry a room as well.
I put a fan in the room Ive sprayed and open the windows and close the door or drop it off with a runner. Using flat its ready to spray again in about 15 minutes on a normal drying day. Ill give it another coat and remove the fan to another room. Thats how to two coat a house in a day.
I almost bought a ridgid high power fan last weekend for $199 at HDInstead of buying something I would like to try to make a high power fan by taking the blower out of an old furnaceI've seen it done beforeThis is what I'm talking abouthttp://www.yukon-eagle.com/FURNACEPARTS/EAGLEIV/BLOWERASSEMBLY/tabid/203/Default.aspx
Sounds like you're buying a lot of paint at walmartHave you ever asked them if they will sell it to you at contractors prices?
Keep a running tally on your paint bill.
I've been here since January and we're spending a lot of $$$ at Home DepotThey know this at the HD pro desk and they have thanked us over and overWe're the number one customer at one locationHD has given us scanner cards to put on our key chains (to use if we go to another HD store)Then we get credit for the purchase and it adds to the running totalSomeone said HD gives these scanner cards to anyone who buys $100 K per year or moreAnyway, I was needing some tools and I went to a guy at the pro desk and told him what I was needing I feel that HD should give us a discount on anything we buy there due to the volume in what we're spendingThe guy at the pro desk is a friend and we looked at some tools and I told him I wanted to buy some cordless tools and we looked at talked and I told him I would think about itHe didn't offer me any discount on the tools other than what was on saleHe said "I'm sorry but I just can't do any better than that"I can buy the tools at a 20% discount if I buy put the tools on our list of materials (you qualify for 20% discount if you buy $2,500 or more at one time - it's called the bid room)Anyway I thought about this and I'm guessing the employees can't just give discounts to whoever they choose to. The tools have to be rung up on a computer and HD probably keeps control over things this way.Again, I feel that we should not have to pay retail for anything we buy at HD due to the volume of money we're spending there.Maybe I'm off base.
you've talked about a tile saw, i got one today i'm real happy with.
the harbor frieght 10" saw on sale for 229,with a coupon 189, used a 20% off and got it for 151.
if your interested and let me know i think i still have both coupons and could send them to you. i'm not sure you would get the 20 off as it says you can't use 2 coupons,but the girl had no problem with it.
somehow they even through in the 2 year warranty................the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
tim i'm not sure this fits into what your doing now,but have you every got involved in doing a 1031 when you sell? it is the biggest reason i can think of to invest in real estate,the stock market doesn't have anything to even come close on this.
the biggest thing i see is,if you think cap gains are going away,then paying now instead of paying more later.
but as you r flipping these ,it will really help with keeping your hands on the cash
to buy another one.
it is the only way i have every gotten ahead of the game since i started doing them back about 1990. the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Yea I know . Right now Im trying to move as much as I can get sold through say October. Then regroup and see what Obama implements.
Eliminating captitol gains was in his list of things to do . It was in print . If not eliminate it would only be used for our household . All commercial property would be subjected to federal income taxes at sale time .
That however doesnt change a flip for me . I was putting them in the rental fleet for a couple years . Now they would be directly flipped and I would pay income tax on the profits . Same as these guys building specs .
Two things that always bothered me was you need to buy more expensive Ive been told . Like sell one house and buy a triplex. Theres been several carpenters here paid for their house just this way but used the home credit thingy. Build a house and live in it two years and sell it and start over again. I know about a dozen carpenters here that have done that . They never paid any principle out of taxed earnings. Takes 5 houses to live in a new one paid for . Flips could work the same way. We did that for a while but got tired of moving years ago. I kinda enjoyed it though. We got to enjoy a different house every two years.
need to buy more expensive Ive been told
Not necessarily true.
You would pay taxes on any "boot", which is many things. Any money not spent on a replacement property would be boot. So, you still could 1031 most of your sale price and avoid/postpone the taxes and then pay your normal tax bill on the amount considered boot.
1031s are not applicable to flip property, as you already stated. Flips are considered dealer property and are subject to taxes just like a spec home.
where you been on all this discussion,we lost you back at post 50
i really disagree with you on the flips not qualifying.
with regard to real estate there are alot of fine lines.
first off always consider yourself a passive investor, now if you hold a re license ,you can still be a passive investor, but i would hate to flip 20 houses and be holding a re license,i think they will call you a dealer and they are inventory and the 1031 would not work. if your a license contractor i would not want to push this much over 2-3 houses a year.
i'm never going to put on my tax return "flipper"
but if you look at my tax return under occupation,mine says "retired". the tax man filed it once as real estate investor and i about hit the ceiling.
i am retired from doing my profession [bodywork/painting] and i am now a passive investor in real estate. i have bought and resold on a 1031 going in and on the way out in less than 3 months on house. never any questions, as long as i do the 1031 correctly, and the main point on that is,I NEVER TOUCH THE MONEY,REPEAT NEVER NOT ONE DOLLAR DO I EVER TOUCH THE MONEY, my intermedator does all the transactions.
you are right in calling it "boot" that is what irs calls it, i just called it "difference"the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
We all know that there are gray lines in the IRS code and turning a house in 3 months in a 1031 certainly is gray. Yes, it can be done. It all depends upon the intention when acquired, during it's holding period and when it is disposed of.
I would not want to be intentionally flipping houses and classifying them as 1031s. But, thats just me. I like to keep my taxes paid and prefer to be out of the gray area. A three month hold is very grey. If you have one every few years, I suppose you could make a case if you are audited. If you have fifteen in a row, I highly doubt that anyone in the IRS is going to buy into your theory.
so i went in a did some reading on the 1031 rules, nowhere did i find a holding period specified. here is a quote out of irs.
"Like-Kind Exchanges - Real Estate Tax Tips
Generally, if you exchange business or investment property solely for business or investment property of a like-kind, no gain or loss is recognized under Internal Revenue Code Section 1031. If, as part of the exchange, you also receive other (not like-kind) property or money, gain is recognized to the extent of the other property and money received, but a loss is not recognized.
Section 1031 does not apply to exchanges of inventory, stocks, bonds, notes, other securities or evidence of indebtedness, or certain other assets."
so as long as i'm not inventorying my houses [and i do see where a guy thats spec building would] evrythings fine with irs. really the 1031 rules are pretty lenient. i could trade you my rental property for your roofing business,then turn around and trade it for 100 acres in Nevada, as long as i'm holding for investment purposes. thats really not hard to prove. i buy a house today with the idea i'm investing to make money,tomorrow you walk up and offer me 50k more than i paid,i can roll that into a 1031 and buy another within 45 days[thats identified,i have longer to get to closing].
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/7/2009 9:53 pm by alwaysoverbudget
your right in that you have to buy something that cost at least as much as what your selling or you pay on the difference
my plan of attack works something like this:
property 1 is depricated to 50k, i sell for 100k
now if i just walk up to the tax window,i'll owe about 25% between fed and state,so about 12,500
instead i buy property 2 and property 3 at 50k a piece ,and clean them up and like i said i'm not really a seller,i'm a acumalater at this stage.
then i turn it again sell 2 & 3 for 100k each ,now if i walk and pay taxes,my base is still back at 50k on the orig house plus what i spent. so now your talking about 150 profit= 37,500 in taxes
that is almost enough to buy 1 house,so i buy 4 at 50 protect all my money from uncle sam. now that free one is turning 6k a year in profit and will do it for 10 years. thas 60k that i have made off of the gov. money.
now the bad news is someday [as i'm getting older every day it's getting closer] i sell all 4 of those houses for 100k each i have a profit of 350k that i have to pay tax on. it's called a 1031 tax defered for a reason!
i am a real believer in this and think everyone that is looking to acumalte should be using it,but i do agree that if you want to downsize the rentals that the tax may not be lower for many years than it is right now.
i do think if i started flipping i would use this as much as i could from one house to the next.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
In order to set up a flipping station you have to have a malfunction . That being houses are being forced sold at the court house steps . When thats happening daily in your area you got your bogie.
Yer thinkin of paying what these houses are worth. Nanana . You pay what you will give or walk away. Walking is easy because you dont have any thing invested but a visit to the site and the auction. Set up a cash base at the bank off what you own just exactly like Fixit said . I talked about it for months before I did it . I put up three houses I own and established a credit line . I pay cash to get bottom dollar . That has power because the sales are advertised cash. Not many people can get that done that want to be at the court houses steps . Fixits brother and I are doing the same thing exactly. He got his wealth to do it holding rentals . Now hes putting his paper wealth to use while still getting rent every month off the houses he put up! Think about it . You just buy dirt cheap becuase you cannot lose those houses . You have to make more than 10 grand you got that figgured out . You need 30 grand . Get a realator thats savy to the knowledge . Explain he or she will get all your business but they will be giving you information with out getting paid on every thing . You arrive on site and do a survey of a house going to the steps of the court house and make a call to your realator to do the research . They dont get paid for that but they get the house listed when you get it fixed. They might have to reseach several houses for nothing . Once you learn what you are buying then you dont need the research as much but its a good crutch to know going to sale what you can pay. Dont gamble .
You also dont buy somthing that you cant do or wont move . It has to be sold in 30 days . Those houses are your bogie. Irst time home buyers .
Tim
Edited 8/7/2009 12:06 pm by Mooney
Edited 8/7/2009 12:08 pm by Mooney
i guess maybe thats the difference here. there are houses being sold on the courthouse steps everyday[maybe 20]. but the lenders bid what they owe on them,which is usually way more than they are worth.because we are not so saturated with repos that they won't put it on the books and try and get out. no one is hurting enough to let a 150k house that has 137k owed on it go for 80. we just are not in that bad of trouble yet.
i completely understand what your talking about , i was there in the mid 80's cocked and ready with cash and made some nice buys. but there was no way i wanted to flip them at that point, i hung on to them,rented them for 10-15 years then sold. one sticks in my mind that i bought for 40k,it was the steal of a lifetime for me,but there wasn't another person in town that would of gave me 5k profit.
now when you start talking about buying what people want,i'm as dumb as a rock. heres what people want around here. 3bdrm, full finish basement 2.5 baths ,2 car garage. most of them are buyers in the 110 range. well good luck to them,there aren't any. other than that i don't have a clue what would sell and what wouldn't.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Im not there but thats the realators job.
Other than that dont expect the realator to help you find them. For some reason their eyes are not clear. If they knew what they were looking for they would buy it or turn one of their peers onto it.
Im gonna talk a little about that . Its seldom mentioned.
Everyone has watched the flip shows but agents have been skimming the best properties for years. I see several a year go to agents.
I did a study of what they buy. They buy the easy ones of course. But they also buy what they can sell with out risk. I found out one thing that they dont know remoedling or construction. They know what they know but its not enough to compete with everything that comes up . If you push some numbers around you can see that they will invest with 10 grand above expenses for a cream puff . I wont compete with that because they are selling show cars that dont need me .
My broker I had for many years used to call me to bid on somthing . It was always rough and needed acting on now because it had not sold . So actually she was using me as a closer to a listing going bad. She had nothing to lose . She wanted a bid always . They would turn that down and by the time the smoke cleared she would use that offer to spur someone else . Yea she was using me . So I didnt have time to bid her properties anymore. I started finding out what happened to them . She would give me an address and somtimes even the owner. I moved on them after she lost them becuase several went to the court house steps .
All that running around trying to catch a dollar taught me and not knowing she taught me more than she will ever know she did . I started making offers good for 6 to 8 hrs. That shortened the time agents can act with peers. They hate it and seriously defend the time given them as unjust . Truth is they have to take and present all offers. Ive looked at a house at 2 pm and made an offer till 5 or 6 pm. They call back and say they need it extended because they cant reach the owner and I say just forget it Im looking at somthing else youre not involved in. Thats sends a message like an all in at a poker table . This guy will walk legally.
What then happens is they call you back the next day and the next. I call it momentem changing . That takes the cookie out of their mouth. When their in that mode they will often tell you what the owner will take because its been talked about by now . They are not supposed to do it but in a whisper many of them will. They are now playing into your hand not thinking about their own.
One weakness a women has is suspense . They are really pretty good at solving issues like that unless youve set out to act against it . They dont seem to be able to stand it . A man can walk away and not know but its hard for a woman.The woman instinct is to fix the problem. If she tells me what she knows , Ill fix it .
When an agent tells you what it will take to buy a house then a 2 hour offer is enough. It will be too high or it will send that offer . Either way its over . By that time the owner is ready too.
They were using me as a price buster. Say someone wants 100 grand as you always price imaginary. It wont sell. I move in and offer 60 and they refuse . The next day after questioning themselves they get another offer for 65. They are crying in their beer at this point if they need to sell. I leave it now and someone else is found to offer a fair 80 for it and its sold . When a house hasnt sold for a year then I believe Im the one that got it down 20 grand . Especially when an agent ends up buying it .
I came up with that to counter act a slick agent . The good agents are always slick but some have morals and some dont . Some like the one I had didnt have a problem using me but sorrowed over telling me what I needed to know . That method got me the information just between her and I of course . I quit price busting houses.
I don't know if it works in all states or just here in Nebraska, You can make an anonymous bid. Buyer to to be disclosed at closing. I've done it to drive down the price of a property I wanted to buy.
I had made what I thought was a fair offer with the listing agent and it was not even countered. I made a low ball anonymous offer through a different agent and a day after it was rejected I made another offer with several things I wanted corrected before closing with the listing agent. It was accepted.
I have a friend that wanted a property that had been for sale for sevearl months. He made his first offer at $65k. He bid $60k the next month then $55k a month later. HE got it for $45k. He swears that if they had countered he would have paid as much as $75k for it. Some things are hard to figure.
You have to sign an offer or its invalid as an offer isnt it ?
Tim,
I think you are technically right about written offers. Most states require real estate sales to be in writing - to be legally enforceable in court. On the other hand, you can make a verbal offer and just follow it up with a written confirmation if it's accepted. I think some of it depends on the broker that's handling it.
One question I have for you - What kind of government loans are available by you? VA used to be big, but hasn't been used much in a few years. FHA seems to be the only other big one. My experience is that they drag their feet on the applications. 4-6 weeks is not unusual at all. Then they nit pick the property.
Most of the lower priced homes here are older ones that need lots of work. On an FHA deal, that means everything's got to be ship shape. That's hard to do with a 40 or 50 y/o house. I got involved with one last year and it's turned into a complete renovation - down to the studs, and then some. Problem is that it's cut out the profit and raised the price to a point where it's going to be harder to sell.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
They took the restrictions away. No longer does it get a goverment inspection. They require termite here is all. On a goverment loan which is FHA they dont even require a licensed inspection.
Heres the deal about FHA I dont like and never will:
All the buyers are you might as well say 100 percent buyers. With the tax credit deal they can actually be 110 percent buyers. Theres no money changing hands to the seller until it hits the table . The buyer gives their signature that ties the house up and takes it off the market for you named the tune , 6 weeks till the deal is done . They order an appraisel that takes all the time for some reason. It comes in days before closing . Seems to me it would be one of the first things to get done . But its not up to me . I had a house I was selling under contract and we waited 5 weeks till the appraisel was done . The appraisel didnt come in high enough to cover the contract. I refused it and would not come down to it .
Selling price for house and 4 lots 95,000 . Came in for 90.500. Rejected by me.
Listed the house on two lots for 95,000. Offer came in for 90,000 and I countered back for 92.500. Accepted. Came in for 97,000.
I sold the two lots for 5,000.
Total price 97,500.
All that took nearly 3 months . It could have happened again ya know . Or somthing else like cold feet . Nothing from keeping them from walking with nothing down.
An older house is fine as long as they want it . Thats why I sell under 10 year old houses though and thats the reason. I can make a 10 yr old look brand new to them.
Edited 8/8/2009 12:17 pm by Mooney
Yes, it is a signed offer with an ernest money deposit. It is made by your agent but the seller doesn't get to see the buyers name until the offer is accepted.
To this day the listing agent doesn't know that I made the low ball offer after my first offer was rejected. He told me that there was another offer. He had no idea that it was mine.
It worked for me as I got it for what I thought it was worth.
And some become licensed agents solely for the purpose of chasing flips.
"And some become licensed agents solely for the purpose of chasing flips."
Thats a big debate . Been discussed for years.
Ive been told its not worth it and Ive been told its a gem thing to do.
Theres a problem with most that they dont have the knowledge . Unless they are just buying show dogs.
I think you fergit what you know . Not what you know but take it for granted everyone should know and they sure dont . If you know construction you can figgure the repairs on a house . You know in reason what it will cost . Can you do the work or if not who can you trust to hire and come in under your price . yada they cant get it done .
Good time to tell another story on that .
Realator called me to go bid on a house she was losing that had set over a year with out an offer. House was priced at 56,000. I found the house and it was weird . There was this very nice two story addition built on to a shack. I opened the front door to the shack and nearly fell through the floor . I was on two acres in the country. The land was awsome . The two story part was awsome and had about 1200 sg ft. Not hard to do a little math and a little logic. The shack had to go. Too nice a place for a shack. Every agent in town had looked at it and would not show it . It wasnt safe as termites had ate it up. I called back and offered 14 grand . The banker called me directly. He thought I was trying to steal which is always a good option but I told him to go look at it . He said he had an appraisel for 59,000. I told him to roll it up and smoke it . I did do that. He went and looked and called me back at 9pm. He told me he was accepting the offer because he fell through the floor.
I sold that house for 76,000 after a new additon to the front .
There were no realators chasing that house . No one but me wanted to touch it . One of my all time best buys . I finished it with 25 grand in it and a lot of my time .
Those people lost it and it went to the court house again trashed. where I bought it for 22,000. Ive still got it and its brought in 10,000 in rents. Im gonna move there if I sell my own house . I love the property. The land gently slopes but for all purpose is flat and its inbedded with rocks under the surface . I can drive a back hoe on it in wet weather and the ground doesnt move . You can drive all over it with trailers which is what I have .
Edited 8/8/2009 3:49 pm by Mooney
We're talking about what you've been doing and it's giving us some new ideasWe're trying to figure out how we can do some of what you've been doing
I'd like to play poker with him, I could use a lesson.
Joe H
Thanks for that gem Tim (five hour offers).
Larry, my brother is making some unbelieveable money flipping houses.He is having a 600 ft deck built on the west side of his house so he can sit outside and look at the mountains.He's buying foreclosure houses at the auction.We're going to finish a house today and we have THREE MORE HOUSES WAITING I'm tired and my back hurts.I'm moving about as fast as an arthritic snail.Anyway, my brother has a lot of equity in the rental properties and this gives him some money in a line of credit.He uses this money to buy houses to flipI don't need to know any dollar amounts & how much equity you might have (I'm not trying to ask you for any personal information) but have you thought about that?The main thing is you've got to be able to do is find the houses.we're selling a couple of houses a month. the tax consequence is not a concern for my brother.
tims flippin,your flippin,everybodys flippin, i want to flip something also.
you talk about what your doing out there and it sounds pretty interesting,so i got to pick your brain. you have the advantage of living in ks and colo.
so from what you are seeing out there ,do you think that oppurtunity is here in wichita? i don't feel it is but i'm the biggest pessimist there is.[i tell my wife i'm a realist].
i have not looked at a house for sale for a year,but i have the feel that the market here is ok.sure there is some repo's but not so many that the banks are ready to have a fire sale. without going shopping i would guess that there are some houses here that would retail out at 150,that you could buy at 115-120. i would have to clean them up [myself ,2 months]spend 12k,put on the market [sales fee at 9k]another 90 days till i'm sitting at closing getting a check. so my holding cost at 6% would be another 3500. taxes ,600,insurance 600. so total cost would be around 140. so if everything goes to plans i make 10k if the buyer gives full asking price.
it just seems to tight of call for me. because to tell you the truth i can guess what they ask for a house and be pretty darn close, but i really don't know within 10k on a 150k house what it's going to bring. maybe the buyers don't like the color of the roof, one weekend the neighbor hauls in a demo derby car and parks it in the yard, or boeing lays off another 1000 people, i just can't make the call within 10k
so as a former wichitan,give me your prospective.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
tim,i'm going to see if i can steer this back to investment property, we've all talked about everything else in this thread.lol
everyone has different situation,goals,etc. ,i'm not even sure what mine is to tell you the truth. but as quick overview i'm mid 50's and unemployable as i haven't had a paycheck for almost 35 years.so it's up to me to feed myself for the next 20-30 years,by then some cute little nurse can give me some baby food on a spoon.
like i have said i found it easier to get into real estate than out.
you talk about selling all yours before we go into a depression, and i cannot argue with that as it is possible. if i knew for sure i'd be selling as fast as i could right now. but my problem is,what if that doesn't happen? alot of people are saying that we are setting our selves up for crazy inflation over the next few years. this is what has me frozen in place right now,i'm just going to throw out some make believe numbers and see what you think.
have a house,rents for 850 a month,less tax and ins,nets 650/ 7800 a year
i sell it for 100k,heres my partner in crime ,irs they want 15%,state wants 8%
i go home from closing with 65k in my pocket.
put it in the bank a 2.5% ,it makes me 1500 a year
gas goes to 4.,loaf of bread cost 5. heck even a coke might cost me 4.00
my 1500 a year isn't going to buy much.
so i decide i'm going to go buy me a rental, same house i sold now cost 130,i put my 65k down and have a house payment of 600 a month,taxes insurance are another 200, and the rent is 1050 a month. so i clear 2400,better than the bank but not by much.but if i would of held i'd be looking at 9k income a year.
so i guess what this comes down to is how to produce a income for the next 20 years.
i've made a lot of mistakes over the years,always with enough time to make it up,but i feel if i get out of these,and it turns out to be a mistake,i will not be able to get back in. on the other hand if a guy is all cashed out and we go deeper into a depression, you could double up your assets .
it was a lot more fun being 35 and just doing what was fun and who cares about 10 years from now.
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 8/4/2009 9:51 pm by alwaysoverbudget
thanks for the offer on the couponsI'll get back to you
I think we are some different but I can tell you what Im thinking .
Im too old to struggle to make retirement again.
My rentals dont bring as much as that house you mentioned. Not even the ratio. Im fixing up a house putting 5 grand in it that supposed to be worth 85 grand . Its been a rental for 5 years and it was 5 years old when I bought it . 1100 sg ft 3bd2ba, single garage. Brick. Very nice lot in a very nice hood. House looks ultra sharp.Ive been getting 600 for ones like it . Ive had the renters in it since I bought it at 550. The one next door I rent for 600 and its the same house basically. I dont go up on renters as long as they stay but damn I needed 600 a long time ago. Good renters paid like clock work and kept a nice place. I never waited a day on their rent . But Im not gettin rich at that . Ive got several more like them and that aint helpin cause they arent as good a renters.
Once I do the long term numbers of what carpet costs which is my major and always has been .Roofing is out of sight . These two things scare me because of oil. Here Im getting the same rent I did 5 years ago just about but its harder. Why? cause theres more hard luck stories and Im evicting more . Im staying on top of them to pay the rent and truthfully I used to just sit home and wait on it .I had a really good set of renters back then. Mebbe they were doing better than these are now with the economy.
As you know nothing is safe except cash in a bottle under the house in a depression. I dont even know what to do in a depression . This world doesnt look good to me at all. NO the sky is not falling yet but Im not gonna be a sittin duck either.
Ive lived my business life like I play poker . I wait for people to make mistakes and Im there and ready . I play the odds all the time . Dogs, too many kids, mexicans that team up are all losing bets for a landlord. Theres no money to be made servcing them. So I dont . I play a pretty tight game and Im having to get tighter to make profits I wanna make off what I get off rents. Its getting more expensive to own rental property. Insurance has went up and they now dont cover vandals . You mentioned what insurance was doing to you they didnt used to. Insurance used to be a blessing as every storm I got blessed . Im not getting near the blessing or windfall.
Rental property has become too much work for the pay here. Especially when I compare it to a flip. Lets say you sold 5 of those houses or 6 and had 500 grand in the bank. Lets say that happened right now . The goverment is giving first time homebuyers a rebate that will get them in a house easily . Mexicans pay their bills so they are my prime target. They qualify for the houses I have here working at the chicken plant . They all work remember . All are two income homes at least and normally Dad and Mom stay with them as well with them working too. Mexicans are also paying cash for houses . Right now the goverment is making a mistake doing it and Ive got the supply. I could sell a house a month right now if I had them ready. Thats mostly due to what I bought . They are nice houses just small. That was the plan all along . I could cash out any time I wanted . So the houses met that criteria or I didnt buy them. I tripped up on the plan a couple times but thats all.
I told you before my strength was doing full remodels . I do it all and Im tooled with lots of experience . Thats why I do flips . If I didnt have rentals right this minute taking up my time and 500 grand in the bank, Id be flipping a house per month and be running a crew doing it . NOw that may run out just like capitol gains taxes. Obama was talking about making it straight income taxes. If he pulls that trigger Im in the rental busiess for the long haul cause Im not giving him 50 percent . If things change Id have to play different hands. But right now Im trying to work for the goverment and furnish them homes to loan money on . Its working .
your ratios are really pretty close to mine also,around here a 85k house will be in the 700 range,but the difference i do see is the age of your homes. 85 will buy you a house 45 years or older. you can get into some newer areas for around 120,but the problem is you can look around and see the owners of these properties are young couples stretched to the limit and not able to even plant a tree let alone up keep on the house, so i stay away from these areas,i'd rather be in a older area that has leveled off.
you are exactly right on the upkeep of these things,they cost lots more to maintain,and for what ever reason the people tend to tear things up more than they used to. i went for the first 15 years and never kept a single deposit,now i keep probably 80%.
that is one thing i do ,is get a strong deposit,usually what the rent is,plus if they have a pet we get another 300 for the pet. that was working very well but in the last year the pet thing has bit me in the rear.
don't feel like your alone on the hassle factor,i'm right there with you, i blame some of it on get older and grumpier,but the renters give me some real reasons for being grumpier.
in another thread you mention how small the town is, were quite a bit bigger,400k and i see where in good times the little town is very desirable,but can go down very quickly also. here we are really tied to aircraft industries,it has started it's dive in jan 09 so we will be going downward for the next 2 years at least. i have a hard time seeing if the rentals are going to get better or worse. right now there is lots of moving going on as everyone is trying to lower there rent a couple hundred a month,but were filling them back up with no problem. i have a couple small commercials that i see could eat my lunch big time,both business' are struggling and notice could come at anytime. the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Another thing is ;
Property went up 35 percent three years ago. I raised rent 50 across the board except seated renters. As they left I went up. But I did the caps and they were still down from before cause 50 bucks is not 35 percent . See? 33 percent of 600 rent is an adtional 200. No way . I should have sold then and I would have enjoyed a great couple years of high price sales as they couldnt build enough yada yada.
I wouldnt mind having 5 again paid for because I remember house easy 5 used to be. I could work full time with 5. Im down to 12 now from 15. Well Im fixing to be , lol. Im finishing one up to sell right now . Ill be done with it this weekend. I cant work for the rentals so to speak. Not enough time to do other things . Every time I get started on somthing shid hits the fan. Ive been to the cabin 4 times trying to finish it to sell it . If I was just sittin around rentals would be fine to have and hold but its not paying much for me right now considering what a flip brings for the effort . You have to look hard but 20 grand net flips are out there. That brings 10 grand to the bottom line in 30 to 60 days roughly. 30 days of work more or less on average.
YOu mentioned what would you do if you wanted to get back in. Look around and price duplex lots or houses with extra land . I could build duplexes cheap right now . I dont want to but its viable . Be your own GC and hire cheaply . Last time I figgured a duplex was a few months ago and it was about 40 per foot . Land cost is the deal that changes its focus. Duplexes sell well especially new in good hoods. They actually beat a house right now on cap rate. Gotta find land cheap. Ive picked up some lots here and there. Most are extra property with a house I dont have any more.
Look for smaller towns out side the city that still is within driving distance of somthing . Look for new plants or such which is an oddity right now . There should be some power plants going in per say Obama. Those are good for a 20 thousand surge locally doesnt matter where they are.
Your post to Tim talks about one important issue that I am fighting with - the rate of return in things other than property.
My original "plan" was to use the rentals to get to a certain point, then sell and put the money into "safe" bank and stock investments. Right now, my rentals are making way more, by percentage, than any "safe" investment would make - some are 10% plus. I can't come even close to that elsewhere. So, selling doesn't seem so good.
I did sell two last year that were vacation rentals. I did it for various reasons. One was that these were fairly high dollar properties for me and I had a strong feeling that the capital gains rates would be going up. Another was that the particular properties weren't earning what they needed to to be worthwhile. Another reason was that I wanted some cash. Having the cash available has allowed me the chance to invest in other properties and keep paying workers instead of doing it all myself.
It's helped my lifestyle, partly by giving me more time to do other things. I'm at the point where I just don't enjoy doing it all any more. So, if I don't want to do it, I have the option to pay somebody else to do it. (Finding the right person at the right price can be a challenge. That's a different issue.)
We also needed a new kitchen on the house. I was able to do it, add a bathroom and a porch. Like you, I'm in my early 50's, and I decided that it's about time that my personal well being and comfort came into the equation.
I've seen three of my close relatives die in the last two and a half years - all of them younger than me. I watched my Dad work all his life and never want to spend a dime. For what? I have lived for a long time in the accumulation mode, denying myself things in order to keep buying. I finally decided that it was time to do things a little differently. If I take 10-15% of my worth and spend it on things that I want, it still leaves me 85% in the business. You need to decide if you want to enjoy some of it now, or save it all for a cute nurse to feed you that oatmeal 20 years from now.
Another thing that I've considered is the need for diversification. Putting all your eggs in one basket can be risky. That applies to real estate, stocks, gold or anything else you can imagine.
I'm looking to sell a couple more properties this year. We have a limited market and I may not be able to, but I'll try.
Don K.
EJG Homes Renovations - New Construction - Rentals
Personally I don't like tile countertops either. But then anyone that uses my taste as a standard to make anything will have a quick lesson on bankruptcy. But why don't you make your own laminate countertops? And there are several supplier that make beveled edging with the same patterns.And some of the stone look laminates are very sharp looking..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
I agree w/ Bill. A beveled edge hd ("high-def") laminate looks fantastic if professionally done. You could save more by chamfering a wood nose and attaching it yourself...but you would lose the pretense of stone. Check local shops. they should be able to work out pricing and show you quality and samples.Takes a week or 2 to order and make and then an hour or 2 to install....
Well I agree as well.
Their working on 75 thousand dollar sales , old houses fixed up , 100 percent loans. Nothing to demand anything but formica. Only thing realy that holds up for the price .
Good enough to sell.
Tim
Thanks Bill - you can get a laminate counter top that looks like granite or some kind of stone at HDIn a previous post I referred to my conversation with an interior decorator and she works at HD in Kitchen design.She recommended the laminate counter top with the under mount sinkShe had one on display at HD and I thought it looked really goodHere's a picture of what we're doing with countertopsDark slate looking tile ($3.00 per foot) and grey groutSame tile for backsplashWe feel like it goes good with the cabinets and the stainless steel sinkWe've had some compliments on our design but, again, you've got to remember these are just starter homes and this is better than the other houses they are looking at.
Edited 6/9/2009 8:59 pm by mrfixitusa
I think anything but that crappy aluminum sink would look better. But then again I scored a $300 Americast from Lowe's for 20 bucks.....
Like the counters and backsplash tho....
Congrats on scoring the $300 sink.I'm guessing you as an employee had access to a lot of the clearance or damaged items
Twas not an employee but a vendor. But the day they were redoing the kitchen sinks asked my vendor bud for a good price. Since there was "zero" on hand in the computer just had to name my price.....
But i don't really miss those days, too many annoying customers with questions... :o)
here's another picture showing the contrast between cabinet and tile
Mrfixitusa ,I appreciate what you are doing I've done quite a bit of similar remodels in rentals(using that exact same cabinet style in fact, it is very popular with renters, college students parent's , etc..) ..you do seem to be getting the short end of the stick in terms of the quality of the wood on those door and drawer fronts. would like to say your carpentry work on display looks good.I used to focus on nice door hardware as another relatively inexpensive way to nice-up those starter homes..an extra hundred in knobsets can make a big difference in impression to people looking.
Thanks for your input.We have installed brushed nickel knobs and handles etc in some of the kitchens.Others we don't just to save some money.Something else we're trying to do is coordinate things and pay attention to the small details.I don't remmeber who mentioned this - it may have been someone on here. I can't remember.But we're trying to match & coordinate the details of the house:*the brushed nickel knobs & pulls on the kitchen cabinets match the sink, door knobs, door hinges, towell bars, kitchen faucet, appliances, light fixtures, etc.Men don't pay any attention but women do.Same in the bathroom.Even go to the trouble of taking the brass brackets off the handrail and install brushed nickel so that it matches.What's your take on tile countertop for a starter home?At least it's better than a formica counter top off the shelf at lowes.Although I have seen the dark formica counter top they have in stock and they would probably be okay.
You mention a laminate w/under mount sink. I don't think I've ever seen that. What is the transition? From the countertop into the sink? Laminate?
FWIW I would not put tile in. Laminate only
Here is what they are selling at home depotHD has a laminate counter top and undermount sink on displayI'm going to look into this a little more to see if it would work for us.I like the look of the sink.And I like the look of the faucet attached to the counter tophttp://www.karranproducts.com/installation.html
After I did the cutout for the in the substrate I would coat the edge and a couple of inches back with a thinned epoxy to seal it from any water leaks.There has a been a couple of discussion of doing this in the past. IIRC mongo posted a procedure that he used.And there are some commercial products to to it.Here is one;http://www.counter-seal.com/products/product-schematics
.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
mr.fixitusa,I have no sense of style--- so a formica countertop with a beveled edge screams 1980's very loud.- It's a step up from the post formed 1970's countertops---- but I think you are on the right track with the tile countertops at the very least-- when you list it for sale-it lets you proclaim
" NEW kitchen with Ceramic Tile countertops!!!!" the materials are inexpensive-- the labor to DIY is not unmanageable---and you get to offer something un-expected in your price point. a couple questions
1) is this your primary source of income--or an investment sideline2)---- how is your over-all real estate market there.-- Here, your pricepoint is what is actually moving---most of the more expensive properties simply aren't being listed because they won't move. the average sales price reported looks very low--- so people assume they have lost ton's of equity---but that stat is skewed because it is composed primarily of sales in neighborhoods below 100Kstephen
On our last house that we are still waiting to close on;
We simply repaired the cabinets and painted them. They really needed tore out but I thought I could make them live again. I installed a dishwasher and stove plus put in a new fridge for benifit no one does. Just a simple redo and went new knobs and hinges . Front door got a circle glass unit that up graded the pos that hung there. Back door got a 12 light unit. Very nice carpet with thicker pad . Everyone noticed that . Overhauled the bathroom to look pretty sharp but not out of line . Just simple dimple . Reworked everything that flawed the house . Even the landscaping . Removed a broken concrete driveway and buried it . Went back with pea gravel . Im cheap.
I had no trouble geting an offer in 6 days. Im not knocking what you are doing at all. It looks nice . Just to say I got the desired results your brother is looking for and I saved 10 grand he spent . Im also saying you dont have to really sell 100 percent buyers. Its a step down from renting as far as being afordable . Their payments are cheaper than rent with out a deposit . Think about it . Its like tossing out feed to sparrows . Throw out all you want and they will take it away.
Kitchens look good btw. .
The problem we have is Lowes and Home Depot DOES NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO GET EXCITED ABOUT IN A FORMICA COUNTER TOP
So what else can we do?
If you do your own laminate work (not postformed), take a look at Wilsonart High Definition... changes what most people think about laminate in general...I've installed in some pretty swanky surroundings, provided people can see an example before they form an opinion. Shouldn't be an issue in what you're doing. Actual material is about 20 percent more than standard laminate
http://www.whywilsonarthd.com/
Add Gemloc, and you have a knockout installation, that will challenge people's perception of what laminate can be. Enough to do an average kitchen will run $300-$400. I'd think it'd be worth it for the WOW factor.
http://www.loticorp.com/index.html
Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.
i did a countertop once that used the corian look alike formica,top and edge then routed a reverse 1/4 round edge where the black edge shows. then took a can of spray paint in a coordinating color that is suppose to resemble granite [you can get it at lowes] sprayed that 1/4 round and gave it a coat of poly.
every time i walk in that rental i notice how good that top looks,it has held up now for 8 years,i was expecting that it would need touched up frequently,but so far..............YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
My brother has 30+ rentals and had homeowners ins with state farm and got fed up with themHe switched to "Country" insurance and has been happy with them http://www.countryfinancial.com/SiteController?url=/productsAndPlanning/insurance/homeAndRenters
We're remodeling a house built in 1960We've been putting off making a decision about a bar that was in the home when we bought itEnclosed is a picture of the barWe're thinking about tiling the counter top and moving on but several people have commented "get rid of it"Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about interior decorating or designing and whether or not this bar is an asset or not to this home.Thanks for any input
Move it if you can lose the post, otherwise keep it.
Lose the bar and make the post an "exercise" pole... brass, of course.A La Carte Government funding... the real democracy.
Thanks guys I hate to take it out and am hoping some guy will want a bar in his "man cave"I feel the thick top hurts the appearance and I think a thinner top and redoing things to an L shape would make the bar an asset to the home and would be a more modern fellHere's a picture of what I'm talking abouthttp://farm1.static.flickr.com/153/422284392_5c05f1bb3d.jpg
I left a pole in my basement . All the girls practice on it . Its good excerse watching them.
I don't need an excuse. A La Carte Government funding... the real democracy.
Get rid of it .
I agree with the other poster who said get rid of it if the column can be removed as well.
Off it.
Go there now and rip it out-----------POS
I was talking to a guy about bars and he told me about when he built a bar as a gift for his DadHe said his Dad thought it was the best present he had ever received.I thought it was a great story.I wish I had done something like that for my Dad - although looking back I did things like paint his house for him, etc
A bar needs some character (somewhere) and just putting something on
the top won't create that. IMO that thing needs to go.
I do agree with the making something for someone (gift idea), they
never forget it. One year I had zero $$ to spend at Christmas, made people bird houses and bat houses, to this day they still comment on
those simple gifts. Straight out of Shop class 101.
Cool I bet those people still have the gifts you made themOne of the things that hurt us on the house we just finished was the electricalThe panel needed to be moved and it wouldn't work to move it from inside to outsideWE HAD TO MOVE THE PANEL ABOUT 17 FT AND PUT IT ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE HOUSEAn electrician came in and ran wires from the old panel, up and through the attic, down through the exterior wall, out the wall, and up into the new electrical panelThere is no more panel at the old location and I said "let's cover it up" And I was told by the electrician "NO YOU CAN'T DO THAT"Apparetly you have to leave access to itHere are some pictures of us moving the electrical panel (at no small expense)
I don't know if it would have worked in your particular situation, but
my elec. taught me a long time ago, if it's gonna get invasive inside the home, get outside ASAP and run the wires in conduit. Much less $$$
involved.
wow, appreciate the infoHadn't even thought about doing it that wayThanks
The way we do these houses is we come in and demo everything and try to at least leave one toilet in the houseThen for the next 30-60 days we work on the houseDuring the last week we put the sinks and toilets in and we just did this and two of the sinks were not draining.The house has 1 1/2 galvanized drain pipes and a basementWe called roto rooter and the guy came in with a small powered augerBefore he got there I looked at the plumbing and noticed there were no clean outs and I wondered how he would get into the drain linesI showed him the problems and left him alone and went about my businessA few minutes later I heard a grinder running and I thought to myself "what the......" and I watched the guy cut a hole in the 1 1/2 galvanized pipe so that he could run the snake.He did so and a few minutes later was finished.He placed plumbers putty over the approx 1" square shaped hole and then slit a rubber coupler (fernco?), placed it on the pipe, and tightened the clamps and packed up and moved on to the next job.
Edited 8/9/2009 10:52 am by mrfixitusa
I was at a local Lowes the other day and they had a returned Laminated countertop that was 8' with a sink cutout and maybe 6' on shorter side. Looked nice next to the not to get excited about in-stock countertops. They were trying to get rid of it for $50.00. The thing that was interesting to me was the original price for what appeared to be a custom countertop was $329.00. I was wondering if you had tried ordering a countertop through Lowes or HD?
We currently have one house on the market.It went under contract on MondayFull price offerFHA financing and the Buyer is asking us (the seller) to pay 3% of his loan and closing costsThe house was on the market for three weeks.HOUSES ARE SELLING AND WE ARE NOT IN A RECESSIONWe're working on two other housesOne will be finished this week and will go on the market.HOPEFULLY IT WILL SELL QUICKLYI'm working on a different houseWe have another house setting empty that we need to get toI went and looked at it yesterday for the first time.In the garage was an oxy acetylene set up on a two wheel cart.Large oxygen bottleIt's set up with a cutting torchWhy would someone leave that?
Low self esteem and giving up.
some of those bottles you own and can get refilled,some are leased. if the lease is up the guy just didn't want to mess with them. no matter what you have a set of gauges and torch.YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Thanks LarryOn a different issue, we started working on a new house about 3 weeks agoWe had a roll off dumptster moved in and after a couple of days there was a knock on the door."Hi my name is ____ and I'm with the city inspectors officeI said helloShe said "can I help you with any permits you might be needing?"I said "we're just getting started. Right now we're cleaning up and I hadn't even thought about permits"She said "ok" and "I'll make a note that you will take a look at things and get back to us if we can help"I said "that would be great"She was a very nice woman. She had seen the 30 yard roll off dumpster in the drivewayAnyway, we are getting a plumbing permit and an electrical permit and a remodeling permit.I was talking to a guy today and he indicated he doesn't have the time to mess with permits, the costs, and the headaches.He says he demos a house and puts the trash in the garage and then has the roll off there for one day and just long enough to fill it and he gets it out of there.Don't know that I necessarily agree with him but that is his solution.
Edited 6/27/2009 12:01 am by mrfixitusa
pretty much my solution also. if i have a lot of stuff to clear out,i have a dump trailer that i bring in and load,sometimes maybe 5-6 loads if they have left alot of stuff.
then on a house that i'm going to go thru and be there for a couple months i get trash service.it's amazing how much you can get rid of on a daily basis. all the big stuff like cabinets etc. get thrown in garage until i have a load for my trailer,load it and go.
my goal is to get in get out ,and the city not know whats going on. i start buying permits,the valution goes up,taxes are higher and i have to raise rents,making it harder on evryone.
around here you don't need permits for much besides elec and plumbing unless you start moving walls etc.
you guys should look at a dump trailer,vs the dumpster ,if someone has a truck to pull it. it will pay for itself in about 50 loads.
YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Sounds like a great idea Larry.In the past week I've had two neighbors come to me and ask "could I throw some things in your dumptster"I stutter and say "uh, well, yeah, sure, okay"When you come into a neighborhood you want to be friendly and congenialI'm going to have to start saying no.It costs $300 for the roll offI wonder what they would say if I said go ahead and use the dumpster but you're going to have to help pay the $300 feeAgain, I like your idea. Putting a big dumpster on a concrete driveway is probably risky as all the weight could cause the concrete to crackI've seen the dumpters get a lot of water in them alsoI think it's a tremendous weight on the concrete when they lift the filled dumpster and pull it forward and all the weight is on those small metal wheels.I wonder how many driveways have gotten ruined
when they get soaked with water and they get dumped,your paying for a lot of weight thats not trash!
i haven't used a container for a long time,but i would throw out the figure of 15% of the trash isn't mine,it's the neighbors...................YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Isn't that a warm feeling you get for your neighborsWe had a dumpster completely filled and over night one of the neighbors put a chest of drawers & old furniture on top of the pile.We had a pile of metal concrete forms stacked beside the dumpster and then I went on vacationWhen I got back the concrete forms were gone!Someone had stolen them!I had been trying to sell them on CLHere's a picture
Hey that's for the link about the edging. I take it you have used it. Whats the ball park cost per foot? I used some of the fancy wilson art laminates, they are really good looking!!
Got a lot of compliments on them.
I wished I would have known about that edge system 2 months ago. We did a wood chamfer with matching edge and stained the birch to match the cabinet color. Still looked good and on the island got to relieve the edges as not to create "hip Pointers"
FWIW when we were putting in 1 of 4 counter tops the plumber cut out the sink. I grabbed it and put a coat of what ever the heck is sitting around acrylic paint on the cut edge and the underside of the sink area.
He asked why did you do that. I said "crumb board will always suck water and I need to sleep at night". he laughed and said " I am going to start doing that to all my installs".Interesting thread here. We arn't feeling things as bad as some of you folks. No federal aid money but interest rates so low and rentals non existant, a lot of first time buyers coming out of the woods. ie the guy that has lived with his folks and saved a good down payment. Lots of boomers leaving a good inheritance.Lots of folks wanting the dream home buying nice lots and scraping the old one off and building some nice stuff.
I've been talking to a guy who works in a retail business He is a general contractor and was building houses and when things went south he quitHe doesn't like his job in retail.I saw him yesterday and he said "I'm out of here as of next week"I said "where you going"He said "I got hired to be project manager"He said "we've got 15 houses and we're going to flip them"I said "wow" and I've been thinking about it and he must be going to work as a project manager for a Real Estate Investment Group (REIG)Not very many individuals who could buy 15 houses at one time.I've been thinking about REIG's and I know they are out there.I know that one group bought 10-12 houses at one time and they listed them all at once with one realtor in wichita.Just wondering if you have ever tried it - pooled your money with other investors.Wouldn't that be the way to go?You know everything there is to know about real estate in wichita.You know what the houses are worth and what it takes to fix them.What if you could simply invest your money and sit at home and let other guys do this hard, dirty work that we're doing?Wouldn't you rather be out there in your shop working on your boat than crawling under a house in the mud and sewage?What if you could invest some money and make some decent money and not have to do all the hard work and lifting that you shouldn't be doing at your age?Just thinkin out loud.Do you really want to deal with home depot every day for the rest of your life?
Now you are thinking straight!
one of the things we're doing to reduce our expenses is to walk through a house at the beginning and organize our "order" from HDWhen I started in January we would walk through the house, measure doors, make notes, measure how many feet of baseboard we would need etcOur order would then go to the HD "bid room"You must order at least $2,500 in materials to go to the bid roomThey look at your order and give you a discountThen things changed during AprilHD hired a guy to help contractors get their materials more smoothlyHe goes to the house and HE PUTS TOGETHER THE ORDERWe walk from room to room and talk about what to do and he takes notes AND THEN HE SPENDS A COUPLE OF HOURS OF HIS TIME MEASURING AND TAKING NOTESIt's a nice service from HDHD then delivers the order by flat bed truckThe materials are on a pallet and the driver sets the materials as close as possibleThey try to get it into the garage for you if they can.Anyway, we're working on a 1200 to 1300 three bed two bath home.It has a finished basement.We'll gut the kitchen and bathroom and remodel the house.Our order has been delivered from HD and is in the garage.We don't buy carpet, cabinets, appliances, or paint from HDWe can buy those things at a cheaper price elsewhereOur total was $4,800 This is for tile, greenboard, vanities, toilets, faucets, backerboard,
enough doors to replace every door in the house, 100's of feet of baseboard, door trim, plumbing, bathtub, shower pan & glass walls & shower door, new light fixture for each room, and on and onWe saved $1,200 (20%) by purchasing materials through the bid room.We save money, not only on price paid BUT IT ALSO CUTS DOWN ON OUR TRIPS TO HD
Your almost making remodeling sound easy LOL.
I like the concept.
I heard about something kind of different the other day.Nothing earth shaking or anything. My friend and her husband got a divorce years ago and their divorce agreement stated they would sell their house when their daughter turned 18they would split the proceeds.The daughter turned 18 and my friend decided to buy the house.My friend has been living in the house for a long time.Anyway, she got a loan to buy the house - in other words "buy out" her ex husband.She bought the house several weeks ago.What was different was THEY HAD THE CLOSING AT HER HOMEThe lender came to her house at 6 PM and they sat at the dining room table and signed the paperwork to close the loan, complete the purchase of the house etc.Just kind of different.Usually you have a closing at a Title Co or at a Bank.
I've closed refis at my kitchen table but never a sale/loan.
We had a deal fall throughWe put the house on the market and it went under contract in three weeksthey did their inspection on monday and then back out of the deal on tuesdaySo we put it back on the marketKind of took the wind out of our sails a little bitWe feel like the inspector must have talked them out of buying the house
We're remodeling a bathroom and yesterday I removed the toiletI picked it up and looked at the wax ring there on the floor on the flange.It had been in place for several years but it looked like it was brand new.The toilet had been on top of it BUT IT HAD NOT BEEN SMASHED DOWN TO FORM A SEALI scratched my head and said "what the heck happened?"I realized the previous owner had tiled the floor.He had installed 1/4 backer board and 1/4 thick tile and so he had raised the toilet 1/2 or 3/4 off the flange and SO THE WAX RING WAS NOT THICK ENOUGH AS THE RESULTWe proceeded to investigate and we wondered how much moisture damage had occurred.The backerboard around the toilet was soft and we tore it out.The subfloor under the backerboard seems to be okay.I WAS SURPRISED THERE WAS NOT MORE MOISTURE DAMAGE.Apparently it really didn't leak that much which seems odd to me.
A lot of sewer gas in that house..
We work on vacant houses and we demo everything the first week.We probably should, but don't stuff a rag in the plumbing to block the sewer gas.I've never smelled sewer gas with the exception of something that happened a couple of months agoWe had removed a toilet in the basement bathroom and did not stuff a rag in the open pipeI was working in the basement and suddenly was the worst smellIt about knocked me overI went to the bathroom and stuffed a rag in the toilet flangeI gagged and ran upstairs and outsideIn the street was the city truck they use to clean sewer linesI think they spray a high pressure water through the pipes to clean themAnyway, the smell was so bad it took several days to air out.IT REALLY IS A STRONG SMELL THAT WILL MAKE YOU SICK
Big slurpee cups or the like make good toilet plugs. Better than a rag fer damn sure.
Joe H
Thanks - I never would have thought of that.Appreciate the tip.I wanted to throw out something I learned this week.I've been patching oak boards in a floor and it's taken my longer than I had projected.I was told the plumber was waiting on me to cut a hole in the concrete floor in the basement.The plumber will re-do the old shower drain so that we can install a nice new shower.They wanted me to cut out a 2 X 4 ft section of the concrete floor in the bathroom in the basement.I have never done anything like this before and so I said "how do I do it?"Answer "cut it out with a concrete saw or use a jack hammer"I don't have anything like this and so I went to HD and rented a conrete saw.I loaded the Makita saw in the trunk of my car and they alloted me four hours to use the saw at a price of $65They charged an additional fee for using their blade and the total was $115Anyway I pulled the starter rope and I ran the saw for a few minutes and it worked really good!Another guy finished the rest of the cutting and then we took a pry bar and took out the concrete.It was 4" thickI was proud of myself and the next day I was talking to a licensed plumber about how well it had worked.I told him I had cut it out and didn't even use a jack hammer.He said "next time let a real plumber do it"I said how so?He told me he would have simply put a concrete saw blade in his worm drive saw and cut it a couple of inches deep and then use a sledge hammer to finish it.I guess I learned a lesson and I'll do it different next time.
I'm bouncing all over the place in this thread.But A lot is happening from day to day and week to week.I got a call yesterday from a client who is getting sued.Before she met me, she was working with another realtor and she signed a contract to buy a commercial property.That was 4-5 years ago.She got cold feet and wanted to back out a few days AFTER SHE HAD SIGNED A CONTRACTShe had her realtor write a letter to the other party(s) and politely say that she was backing out.She had heard nothing for four years and now has rec'd notice that she is being sued for a little over a million dollars.The other party has hired an attorney.She has hired an attorney to represent her.Anyone have any idea how this will turn out?I don't want to give out any details that would identify the person (such as the business she had agreed to buy)Thanks for any input
I was under the general impression that there usually a 2 year limit to file on basic tort and contract disputes..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
There must be more to this story.
One of the things I think of is how common it is for people to sign their name to a contract and then think they can change their mind at their convenience, with no consequences.And for the most part they are right!Many times there are no consequences.
Friend of mine called me this evening .
He does handy man work . He probably would say hes a carpenter but hes not . He does everything we are doing on these houses. hes a pretty knowledgeable dude and very smart . He says everyone is really hurting over no work . He had a long list because he calls everyone and asks for work including me . Bad stories all over .
Looks like you and I are in a good spot working on the goverment dime . Should work any where there is gov loans .
last fall I replaced a shower and pulled the toliet to have room to work.And also the wax ring look new. I am not sure, but I think that the install might have been orginal with the 20 YO house. But not one drop of moisture.Unfortunately I could not say the same for the shower. As luck would have it the only very very minor damage to the studs and floor. But the tile was litteral falling off the walls and the shower seat was only held up by a colony of 743 carpenter ants. Now make the 744, no 745...I am still finding them <G>.
.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
well i had to go talk to a therapist 3 times before i could reply yo this post.lol
"i've been talking to a guy who works in a retail business
He is a general contractor and was building houses and when things went south he quit
He doesn't like his job in retail.
I saw him yesterday and he said "I'm out of here as of next week"
I said "where you going"
He said "I got hired to be project manager"
He said "we've got 15 houses and we're going to flip them"
I said "wow" and I've been thinking about it and he must be going to work as a project manager for a Real Estate Investment Group (REIG)
Not very many individuals who could buy 15 houses at one time.
I've been thinking about REIG's and I know they are out there.
I know that one group bought 10-12 houses at one time and they listed them all at once with one realtor in wichita.
Just wondering if you have ever tried it - pooled your money with other investors.
Wouldn't that be the way to go?
You know everything there is to know about real estate in wichita.
You know what the houses are worth and what it takes to fix them.
What if you could simply invest your money and sit at home and let other guys do this hard, dirty work that we're doing?
Wouldn't you rather be out there in your shop working on your boat than crawling under a house in the mud and sewage?
What if you could invest some money and make some decent money and not have to do all the hard work and lifting that you shouldn't be doing at your age?
Just thinkin out loud.
Do you really want to deal with home depot every day for the rest of your life?"
this is probably my biggest downfall in being self employed, i trust no one with my money except me. yeah sure i'd loan you a 100. bucks but when you get to talking about enough that if i lose it i won't sleep,can't make myself do it.plus BIG deals don't really impress me much.
anytime i had a partner,it ended bad.this was all back before i'm 25 and i just took the lesson to heart.
i would rather own 2 houses on my own,than 20% of 10 houses. i guess i'm a control freak,i'm doing it my way and if it goes south,i know who is to blame. don't have to worry about which partner screwed me to the wall.
i did take a look at something like this a couple years ago, the group devolped commercial r.e. buy in was a 100k per share. after you read the first page it sounded like a no lose deal,oh it sounded good. but as i read that whole trust thing came in and i said nope. today i wonder how they are doing, with the bust in calif. commercial r.e. i would guess that i would have 0.00 by the time they had charged me fees,maintance cost etc.
i'm a lone duck,to old to change, and unfortunately probably will be at hd everyday for the next 20 years,but all the charges i will have made and not some crack head maintance guy the group has hired..............
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YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Edited 7/5/2009 8:28 pm by alwaysoverbudget
You made a lot of good points Larry.My brother is the same way. He doesn't want any part of a group He wants to be able to make all the decisions.On a side note.We are doing some work and have a permit and are preparing for inspection.My co-worker told me today that the inexpensive two handle bathtub faucet we bought at HD (glacier bay) will not pass inspectionI said "why"Because it doesn't have "anti scald valve" I said "huh"WowThere are a couple of other plumbing code requirements we're scratching our head and trying to figure out.Water Hammer Arresters is something I don't have any experience with and didn't know they are req'd according to code.Someone told use we'll need to install them wherever there are appliances:wash machinedishwasherrefrigerator ice makerOh well. It's just more money.
i didn't know you could buy a shower valve without anti scald??????????
if you are having to install that many hammer aresters,you need to look on ebay.
with what you guys are doing you need to be doing lots of shopping on ebay. i can sometimes snag a case a kitchen faucets,price fister,single handle pull out type for 20. each. i buy all of my doorknobs on ebay,kwikset runs about 5.oo for entry and deadbolts. paint brushes,i buy purdy for 3.00 each,the other day grabed 50 delta shower heads for 20.00 etc etc.
with what your doing you know you will use them
oh,by the way i feel the old age coming also..........................i've been painting on a 3 story over in college hill,32' up a ladder,it's killing me,lolthe older i get ,
the more people tick me off
I feel the same way.
Wife thought she was much smarter than me and she is actually. She invested in stocks . She had the guy here and we went to dinner . He tried to sell me and told him Im in real estate . He told me how bad that was and I needed to trust in him and let him guide me through the best deals going . You know like he did for DW. She lost her arse and I havent lost a penny. Through all those times Ive continued to make money but Im the one in control. DW has no stocks left. It was a money pit from the git go. Sure the stocks go up and you sell and buy more of that stock. One day you come home and its in the tank . She lost over a 100 grand trusting others. NO thanks .
Larry did you have any hail damage?I heard you had baseball size hail and a lot of damage across the middle of townBroken windows in homes.Cars with broken windshields and major hail damage
the hail is basiclly between west street and hillside,pawnee to 13th. then andover east got some. right around friends u was ground zero,it pounded stuff.
i've got 5 i think hit.i'm so sick of this stuff,used to be i had full replacement,state farm did away with that on rentals.
so how it works now is 6k roof,10 years old,worth 3k. state farm deducts 1% on wind and hail,so at least 1k deductable,they hand me a check and want to know when i'll have them replaced.
well if only had 1 no problem,but now there is 5,so i'm out 20k and it just isn't happening.i'm still not caught up with the one from 3 years ago with 9 roofs!
i hate mother nature.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
That aint right .
Call Cameran Mutual or an agent that has it .
I just did you a big favor.
Put them all on the same policy. Youre gonna love it .
Youre buyin dinner if we ever meet now .
You can get separate pressure balance units to go between the supply lines and 2 handle valves. They are designed for use with setups for supplies to crawfoot tubes.But I suspect that they are not practical in your case. Both in cost and possible in having to install it in an accessible place. Now pressure balance are not truly scald profit. What they do is maintain the ratio of hot and cold water when the cold water pressure changes, from example from flushing a toilet.However there are add on shower head or valves that go in the arm that are anti scald in that they have a thermostatic valve that shuts off the water if it get too hot.Not sure if they have a tub spout with that feature. And I don't know if they will accept that or not. But if yes and yes it is a cheap fix.I don't know what they require in terms of hammer arrestors. But the most common is just a stubbed T of copper. And they are worthless. For really functional arrestors you need one of the sealed "cartridge" units. And I believe that you can get those hose thread ends on them and you could just screw then on the outlets for a washing machine.And there are any number of other fittings that would make it easy to add under the sink for a dishwasher..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
thanks Bill, excellent advice as usual
Just wondering what your system is for painting an empty houseWhat we are doing is:Day 1Spray white semi gloss on all of the new doors, door trim, baseboard, window trim, etcDay 2Masking tape all of the above and then spray the walls a beige eggshellDay 3Masking tape the walls and spray the ceilings and closets flat white
Edited 7/9/2009 11:59 pm by mrfixitusa
How long are those days? How many sq ft on the homes?
Just curious,
These are 1200 sq ft homes with finished basementYou've got to start with a clean houseClear it out - get all the tools and everything out Vacuum up the dirt & dustIf you leave anything in the house it will get paint on itWe use two guys and these are 8 hour daysNo primer, just paint
Edited 7/10/2009 10:05 am by mrfixitusa
I'm pretty sure my painter could do a 1200 sf house, if empty in two or three days working alone. I'm going to ask him how he'd do it and see about his timing.
Tim's got the program I'd use except for the doors. I'd leave them on the hinges and paint them with a mini roller. That was a trick that I saw my painter use. He can paint a door faster than I can get it off the hinges and into the garage.
Ive done the doors that way . I dont have a problem with it .
But it gets them out of harms way until the carpet is layed. Remember all the doors have to go out in the garage when the carpet is layed so why not just do them out there and keep them protected from me and them?
Another thing is the hinges. Sometimes I buy new ones . If you paint old ones you need to degrease them and clean them up. I do that in a paint bucket full of laquer thinner. Just depends on what you want to do. I use a five galllon bucket to drop all the door locks in and a gal paint bucket to drop hinges and screws . The fill it up with thinner and lid it . I use a nail apron to carry them putting them on and a nice driver I bought thats 7.2 volt thats a big screw driver .
Edited 7/10/2009 8:00 pm by Mooney
Youre goin to a hell of a lot of trouble ..
Every thing gets off white flat . I spray every thing .
Now that eleminates cutting around the ceiling .
It gives a flat primer coat to all the doors and trim.
Two coats of flat on it all.
It doesnt take much to cover enamel on the doors and trim after those two coats.
I set the doors up in the living room or garage like this ; |--------| I put a 1x4 on top of all those doors and use screws. I spray all of them with a hlvp gun using off white eggshell enamel.
I face paint all the trim not cutting it to the wall with a mini roller and spray the inside of the jams with the gun.
Spec house special. Get in and out and get your money.
Im like you I doll the house but I dont do it with paint .
Youre just gonna pizz wimmin off tryin .
No one says shid about off white . They dont seem to mind it on the ceiling as well. DW says its in the mags that way as well.
What they want is stainless steel and upgraded counter tops . Thats what they are asking for . Ive been getting by not replacing cabinets and paint them with new hardware. I alaways up grade the counter tops and install new apliances.
I hang very nice light fixtures and expensive carpet with thicker pad.
I upgrade the exterior doors . Try to put some wow in new entrys . I just spent a grand on a front door unit and Ill buy nice harware as well.
Everything has to look new or close to. Power wash brick and all concrete. No oil spills or green mold please . All siding and trim out side gets washed and windows cleaned. Everything has to be detailed. Two houses back I spent 1500 on landscaping because it didnt have any.
I try to make the people feel that look at 8 houses today that mine was the nicest one they looked at . Thats my goal. Whether Im selling or renting . It doesnt matter which really.
The house I'm working on is 1200 sq ft built in 1960The new kit cabinets cost $1,900They are natural maple We ran an ad on Crooks List saying we had FREE kitchen cabinets to give away if someone would "gently" remove them.No one called so we took them outtwo guys tore them out in one dayWe flatten them and throw them in the dumpster.I think $1,900 for cabinets is a pretty good investment It really improves the house a lot
How long does it take to get every thing installed and ready?
We move our tools into the garage and then sweep the floor. Then vacuum.Day #1 is no masking tape or plastic. Just spray the woodwork white semi glossWe overspray on the walls and floor. We install carpet and don't care if we spray on the oak flooring.We leave the doors on the hinges.Why?Because we are going to remove the gold colored factory hinges and replace with brushed nickel hinges. The hinges will match the brushed nickel door knobsDay #2 is masking tape and plastic the white woodwork and then paint the walls. Overspray onto the ceiling is okayClean the paint equip and go homeDay #3 Masking tape and plastic at the top of the newly painted wall. Use blue tape or you will pull the paint off the walls.Spray the ceilings flat white. Spray the closet walls and ceiling flat white(remove the closet shelves)Clean the spray equip and remove all tape and plasticLastly, admire your work and pat yourself on the back for a job well done.I wanted to add that we really should have one guy follow the painter with a roller.I find places where we have missed spots.Stairway walls and ceilings and closets are some of the places where we have to come back and touch up.Masking tape at the top of the
Edited 7/10/2009 8:02 pm by mrfixitusa
Its too slow . I promise . Youre doin too much work.
Ive had airless sprayers for 35 years and made my living with them . Ive ran crews o painters for many years with drywall crews as well. What I said is the fastest job for a spec house . Its not custom work . Im not sayin it is . But its the best way to paint specs and make the most money.
Ive sprayed hinges and left them. Ive sprayed new hinges on apartments . Ive sprayed old hinges and replaced with new. Youre doin that right . Except the doors should be sprayed first and removed while they hang. All this masking is homeowner stuff and non painter useable . Too much time with little return.
I have to check my hat at the door somtimes. Ill have to be honest . Im a professional painter and most folks are not . I said that to not brag . I can cut a door trim twice before you can mask it . When you get done you havent got any thing done . Im not tryin to get on you . Brush hoggin the pasture is the same thing ..It dont pay nothin .
I know no one likes to be told what to do. So think about work every day this way;
Wear a watch with a stop watch. Casino brand has them at walmart for 10 bucks . Clean the latex paint off it with alcohol. Work in it . Use it . Keep a file card in your shirt pocket . Keep times posted for every job you do. Know how long it takes to do a door , the door trim etc. Record it every day. Someday you will want to bid this work. Its important . I had a crew of painters and I counted minutes . Ive tried every single thing I could think about and recorded it . Ive time every thing . Broke a brush painters time into feet per second and on and on. Be the fastest you can be by using your head not your back and arms .
Tim
The garage is like the hub of activity for me . Its like the checkout at wallmart . Every thing goes through there.
First on the tear out things are compressed and separated to go different places. I dont bring tools on the job while Im doing that . I collect for different loads . I have a burn pile , trash cans with bags for trash, recylcles, metals, etc. Some are dump loads like carpet I haul out on a flat bed trailer .
I work different than a lot of guys here mainly because I think Ive got space they dont enjoy and privacy of having the only lock to a house.
My tool trailer represents carpentry with all big and small tools aboard . Lots of tradesmen have to get it all on one trailer . Ive got boxes for other things . Big bin boxes for painting & drywall . Ive got a couple electrical boxes and two for plumbing . Ive got a big bin for parts like traps , faucets , etc. I dont go to the hardware store after plumbing . That took a long time to get it aboard with out running back and forth. Ive got an electrical parts box as well that keeps switches , plugs , plates , light fixtures , etc. I kinda do what you do and warehouse my full order but I dont take it all to the job. Ive got a small trailer 4x8 that I haul these boxes with. I slide them off in the garage when Im ready. Everything is contained.
My warehouse is stocked with all this stuff . I keep the paint I use , drywall mud , drywall in a few pieces. Always a commonde or two and several lids plus repair parts.
I only use off white paint . Ive got white and some other colors but thats all I stock in quanity. I bought wall mart out tonight of flat white I had tinted off white. Off white used to be one of their premixed colors but this store doesnt carry it any more. 52.00 per 5 gallons. It went up. Used to be 42 per 5.
Wow, I like your style.Especially paying only $40 to $50 for five gallons of paint.We're buying our paint at KWAL and getting a big discounnt and yet we're still paying $70 something for flat and $80 something for eqqshellWe don't have a good system down the way you doThanks for sharing it with everyoneRight now I'm working with two skilled carpentersOne guy takes his tools home with him every niteThe other one has his tools in a certain corner and he covers them at night with a blanketI like the way they take care of things.Last week my sawzall was missingWe have two laborers and both are good friends of mine - I like working with these guys.But they took my sawzall to another job site and I didn't know where it was NiceAnyway something interesting happened yesterdayI've been working at my current project for about four weeks now and I have gotten to know the neighbors a little bitThey've used our trash dumpsterOne of our guys helped an elderly man with a flat tireThere are two guys living across the street and ONE OF THESE GUYS IS THE FORMER OWNER OF THE HOUSE WE'RE WORKING ON.His neighbor let him move in when he lost the house.No big deal. It's cool.Just something kind of different. It's never happened before.
Edited 7/11/2009 7:44 am by mrfixitusa
I don't know if you are thinking out loud to only Larry, but here's my take on that idea.
There are lots of people working in offices that would like to invest in real estate but don't have the time or skills. They are the kind of folks that might be interested in pooling their resources.
thanks Jim I'm going to ask around a see if I can find out what the scoop is on groups or clubs in my area.I guess I would like to start looking ahead and hopefully someday get away from doing this stuff 8 hours a day.I'm 51 and thought I was strong and in decent shape.I found out I"m wrong.My back is hurting when ever I lift a toilet (couple of times a month)My back hurts when I lift a 5 gallon bucket of paint.My back hurts when I help lift a refrigerator.My back hurts when I lift a box of tile.The list goes on and on.I'm working with several young guys who have incredible strength.One guy can lift and carry two pcs of 4 X 8 sheetrock by himself.Carries them up or downstairs like it's nothing.I can lift one box of tile. These guys lift two boxes and carry them into the house.
"I'm going to ask around a see if I can find out what the scoop is on groups or clubs in my area."
Do a websearch for" REIA" (Real Estate Investment Association) in your area.
I am 65 and my back hurts just reading your list..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
ditto except that I'm "only" 56.
At some point in our skilled trade life, we have to relalize that we all will get weaker, slower and less productive. Often, the business model is based on some form of speed and production and old age is our enemy. Instead of gaining wealth from our experiece, we end up with less income because of reduced production.
That is the "problem" with skilled trade based businesses. Yes, some can overcome it and some can overcome the old age syndrome but I wouldn't count on that if I was a youngster. I'd be looking in other baskets...
Larry, today I was driving and saw a red roll off dumpster parked in someone's garageLooks like it's about the size of a car and about 6 ft heightI think I found the solution to some of our problemsPUT THE DUMPSTER IN THE GARAGEAlso, I was looking at some flyers today regarding trash service and it's a competitive businessOne company called pac man is a trash serviceThey advertise that there are no limits on residential trashThey will take all you have(They do have limits on tree branches and construction materials)
Keep it securely covered daily to keep the water and the local freedumpers out.
Get a couple of sheets of 3/4 cdx and rip them up in half or thirds to make runways for the dumpsters. Keep them and re-use them.
Never seen damage to concrete as in cracking. Only blacktop when the wheels settle in. The piont laods from the truck wheels when loaded are the thing to worry about on concrete.
"When the spirits are low, when the day appears dark, when work becomes monotonous, when hope hardly seems worth having, just mount a bicycle and go out for a spin down the road, without thought on anything but the ride you are taking." — Sherlock Holmes, 1896
Thanks for the info EricI have never heard of a truck or roll off dumpster cracking a drivewayIt would be a disaster to be working on a customer's house and damage their drive way.Looking back, I ruined a side walk driving a loaded u haul truck over it
RE my removal;
I like the way you think. I do the same and more I guess.
I haul the trash to my own site somtimes daily going home . Sometimes I order trash service with a hand helf roller bin that hold three cans of trash. 15 bucks per month and its amazing how much stuff you can get hauled off if you are smart about it.
Anyway;
Metal gets hauled to a yard that pays me for it .
I dig a hole in the ground at my site and burn every thing that will burn. In the country I do it on the job. YOu wouldnt believe unless you do it how much stuff goes to metal recycle . They will take stuff only 25 percent metal. All plastics melt thus condensing . I burn tvs and bury what doesnt go poof.
My jobs dont look like Im working there. I park the job trailer in the back yard center of the house . I mow and keep a clean front yard. I spray cabinets and trim at my shop etc. I use the garage mostly to hide every thing . Every day clean up occurs .
Larry I know you've flipped some houses and you have to keep on top of the various code rules and regulations, etcI know we've talkd about this stuff in the past.Here's something that's happened to me out here.We looked at a 1960 house with an old out dated elect panel.I talked to our electrician about replacing it and he said "I can't replace it"I said "why"Because it's at the top of the stairway.I said "so, a lot of them are that way"Here in Denver it's against the code to have it on the stairs.Why?I don't know.So bottom line is for us to have a new panel, the electrician will have to move it outside.Which is okayWe've done that.BUT THE NEXT THING THAT'S REQUIRED IS THE ELECTRICAN NOW MUST MOVE THE ELECTRICAL SERVICE SO THAT IT'S COMING IN THROUGH THE ROOF.So replacing the electrical panel has just gotten into a heck of a lot more work and a lot more expenseYou need to know these things or you will get yourself into trouble.(don't ask me how I know)
i got into this with one in the closet,the panel buss bar went bad. you could not replace in the closet. so simple thing would be just flip it to the other side of wall. well that was right in the middle of living room,wouldn't that look nice.
so i tried for a while to find a old box and just replace the buss bar,but that didn't happen,so. ended up with the panel in the hallway,which meant all the wires coming in were to short. so the electrician used the old box as a junction box,spliced all the wires and extended out to the new box. nothing money can't fix.
my only question is ,on a house your flipping [or living in for that matter] why are you changing the box? is it a fpe? or other type that has problems? if you just need more space you should be able to leave that one and sub panel to another area and wire off it.
it seems like the saying "it's always something" applies times 3 on houses.YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Larry all the breakers are really loose in the panel.It's an old GE panel and there are also two breakers that are tied together and the mechanism is just old and sprung for lack of a better termI think an inspector would caution buyers verbally (maybe not in writing) Just my guess.It's not a federal pacific stab lock or anythingBUT AS AN INVESTOR YOU NEED TO KNOW HOW ONE REPAIR CAN JUST START A CYCLE OF MORE REPAIRS THAT ARE THEN REQ'D WHEN YOU DO THE FIRST REPAIR.If you don't do the repairs that are req'd and needed to bring the house up to code - this can come back to bite you later on.You know what I'm talking about?Anyway, here's my brothers system that he has developed over time.He has trusted tradesmen who work on these houses.This is the current roster:carpet installer 7-8 years
electrician 5-6 years
HVAC 5+ years
laborer 15 yearsThis is how long he has been doing business with these guys.His plumber is a guy who has done everything for 15-16 years but we've only known him a couple of years.Anyway, they all know each other and they know the system. These houses are going to be sold at some point and they will undergo an inspection. It's up to the tradesman to get the house ready.IT'S HIS CALL WHAT TO DO.We can then state in 100% honesty that we had a licensed electrician go through the house from top to bottom and he fixed whatever he saw needed to be fixed.Our electrician is recommending panel replacement in a lot of these houses and that's just what we're doing.What's interesting is the arrangement that if the tradseman misses something or does it incorrectly and the inspector calls it out, THE TRADESMAN HAS TO GO BACK AND TAKE CARE OF IT AND IS NOT PAID FOR THISExample: if the plumber puts a fernco connector in a 2" horizontal ABS pipe and the code says you can only use them in vertical pipes, the plumber gets to go take care of it on his own time.Another example: We flipped a house with aluminum wiring.The inspector did not like the way copper was connected to aluminum in certain places and it had to be redone.The inspector didn't like the electrican using the paste and a regular wire nut and wanted them changed out to the more expensive wire nuts.So the electrician went and took care of it on his own time and on his own nickel.Right or wrong, good or bad, that's how they're doing it.
if i had a ge panel,and the bars were good,i'd go buy a bunch of new ge breakers and make it work,but thats me i'm a tightaz.
i can't imagine with a system like that with the contractors that they don't up the bid 15-20% to cover themselves.
when i get ready to unload these things[and that day is getting closer all the time] i will first sell by owner,they can inspect till the cows come home,but it's a house and will always have something to spend money on.if they are worried about such and such,lower your bid,i will say yes or no.
2nd option will be auction,you bid ,you own it with all it's defects.
the only perfect house is one thats not built yet,lolYOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
so you had a aluminum wired house? did he go in and pigtail all the boxes? i ask cause i have one and the way i address it was i replaced all the switches and recepticals with new and they were all speced for alum.
i had a electrician in there 1 day and ask him about rewiring it to copper,said it wasn't worth it. i may run some new wire to the kitchen/refrig/ microwave someday as those are the heavy use circuits.
hope i never buy another one.....................YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
Larry, I think he went in and pig tailed all the switches and boxes and then the inspector didn't like whatever he did to connect copper to aluminum.So, the inspector wanted it done a different way and he had to go back in and re do it.I like your idea about the switches and outlets made for aluminum.Sounds like something they would not sell at home depot.Here are two other electrical issues we got hit with.(1) someone had installed a panel in a garage. I walked by it and it was a newer panel and I shrugged and walked on by.BUT IT WAS SURFACE MOUNTED.The electrician says it needs to be redone and put IN THE WALL.The wall is sheetrocked and a coupled of wires came into the top of the panel by looping outward through the sheetrock and then down into the panel.(2) the electrical service (above ground wire coming into the house from the pole) was plenty high off the ground - it was probably 10 to 12 ft, but it was attached to the house in a way that the wires were right beside the roof gutter and would be in your way if you tried to clean out the gutter or paint the house etc.Code requirement is to get the wire up above the roof and out of the way.Live and learn I guess
Those are called CO-ALR receptacles and switches. Don't know about your area, but I Lowes in Kansas City area has them.They are about $2..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Bill, they've got an interesting code here in Denver pertaining to bathroom exhaust fans.Exhaust fans are now required, EVEN WHEN THERE IS A WINDOW IN THE BATHROOM.I think this is something fairly new.A guy I work with talked to an inspector about this and asked if he could just vent the fan into the attic and the inspector said "no"My co-worker asked if he had to vent the fan out the roof or out the side of the house and the inspector said "no"The inspector told him they were allowing people to run some kind of flue pipe or flexible hose from the bath fan up to a roof vent in the attic.Providing it vents to within 12" of a roof vent.That was a new one on me.I don't think they would allow that in Wichita
Edited 6/11/2009 9:12 pm by mrfixitusa
Bob Walker said that he finds that type of bath vent common in Toledo."My co-worker asked if he had to vent the fan out the roof or out the side of the house and the inspector said "no""Does that mean that you CAN't vent through the roof or side wall? Or that those are not the only options?.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
I wasn't very clear on what I said.Yes, you can still vent through the roof or side wall.Although if you vent a basement bath fan out the wall, it can't be next to a window.Supposed to be at least three ft from a window if I understand correctly
We remodeled a 1050's or 60's brick ranch house with a basementBasement had a bathroom with tiled shower.We got started and noticed a strong mildew smell in the bathroomWe had our demo guy tear out all four walls in the 5 X 8 bathroom(we had him tear out all of the drywall)We found mold behind all four walls.Anyway, two of the walls had mold at the bottom 12" or soLike we've all seen many times.BUT THE TWO OTHER WALLS HAD MOLD FROM FLOOR TO CEILINGI think this is unusual to see this much mold and we correctly assumed the water had come from the bathroom above - from some kind of leak Sheetrock absorbs water like a sponge but I don't think it will absorb it clear to the top (when orginating from ground level)We found the leaks and took care of the problem.THE SMELL WAS GONE WHEN WE GOT RID OF THE MOLDY DRYWALLIn summary, I think all basement bathrooms need a vent fan, even if they're got a window. I felt bad for the previous owner of the home. They had been living in a home which had a LOT of mold in those walls.
like bill said hd and lowes both have them,there not in the 39 cent rack!
i would of handled the garage box differently,i would of just built a new wall 2' wide and enclosed the box.knocked the rock out from old wall,nothing says you can't have a 8" thick wall.
next one unless there was a absolute must for guttering it would of lost that 10' pc,but like i said im a tightaz,lolYOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
That's pretty good - I'd have never come up with that solution in a million years. Larry, I'm working on a house right now with a garage that a previous owner had installed a car lift. The lift is gone now but the neighbors told me about it.The previous owner even raised the walls & roof in order to have the car lift installed.he worked on cars for a second job.Plus he used the lift to store a car.You've got a lift in your garage don't you Larry?I was thinking when I use to borrow your tools you had a mustang or vette on a lift in your garage?
Larry, I know you were getting ready to refinish some oak floors in your rentals.Probably already done by now?Anyway, we're going to have a flooring guy come in and refinish the oak floors in a house we're going to flip.The house is 1960 brick ranch and we're going to refinish all the floors including the bedrooms.We pulled up the carpet and as per the usual we're looking at hundreds of staples in the floor and I asked him how he pulled themHe uses a floor scraper such as this one and says he can remove all the staples in an entire house in pretty short order.http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DXFJK4He says my method of using vise grips to pull the staples is a complete and total waste of time.I think he's probably right. I can't believe how many hours I've sat on a floor pulling staples.The house we're working on has 2 and 1/4 oak floor and this guy can walk through a house and tell you if the floor is #1 or #2 oak.He's pretty sharp.He indicated most of the hardwood floors in Denver are the 2 and 1/4 wide boards.This guy charges $1.75 per sq foot to sand the floors down and apply poly for top coat
i see my carpet guy use a scraper,i'm not sure it pulls them all or just shaves off some and pulls the rest.
but i'll buy the hours and hours deal of pulling them,btdt. i wil say if i break a staple,when it's refinished you can sometimes see the pc of wire that was left.
i'l tell you at a 1.75 a ft it seems like a bargain. last one i did was probably 750 sq ft,wife sanded on them for 4 days with a orbital type sander,plus 125.00 in sandpaper,then 8 gals of poly=250.00 ,and 3 easy 1/2 days of putting finish on. must work out to about 6.00 a hour wages.......
YOU ONLY NEED TWO TOOLS IN LIFE - WD-40 AND DUCT TAPE. IF IT DOESN'TMOVE AND SHOULD, USE THE WD-40. IF IT SHOULDN'T MOVE AND DOES, USE THEDUCT TAPE.
So they move just outside of the city and stay close enough they can drive to their job.
They put the kids to school in the small town and they are very happy
Apply the same principle to raw land...........as the cities get larger and suffer a little more crime.........and don't forget price increases.................land and homes just outside of that seem to become very desirable almost over night......land that they can build their dream home on suddenly triples in price.
A guy I'm working for is trying to buy ever house he can get his hands on. He bought a condemned property for $5,000 (!) and we are rebuilding it. I say rebuilding because about the only thing staying is a couple of exterior walls, the roof, and some of the floor. We just finished the addition the other day, and I'm waiting for him to get back into town so that we can finish framing the roof on the addition (we have a journeyman carpenter helping us on the weekends........he's in no big hurry, but when he puts these things together, they fit!). He's going to rent this particular house for $750 a month. I think its a little steep considering the neighborhood (alot of government housing), but in the end he will have put almost $30k of renovations to it.
I'm sure its old news to you guys in the business, but now is the time to buy!
We're doing the same things from one house to the nextSame color of paint on the walls (satin in every room)The same flat white on every ceiling And the same semi gloss white for doors and woodwork and trimSomething we're doing is we use a white paint which is really close to the same color as the factory primer color on the doors.Then you don't notice it if I miss a spot
I bought this book a bunch of years ago:
Streetwise Investing in Rental Housing: A Detailed Strategy for Financial IndependenceHe uses the same paint, shingles, etc., for each house. You only need to stock one color of everything. Makes it simple.Glenn
One of the mistakes I made in the past was spinning my wheels looking for the best prices on everything.We've got a system in place right now where we're really not wasting a bunch of time.We buy most things at Home Depot but we put in an order before we start the house.The order must be $2,500 or higher to qualify for contractors discount.WE DON'T BUY KITCHEN CABINETS AT HOME DEPOTInstead we have a small cab dealer who gives us a better price.We take in the kitchen dimensions and they put it into the computer and put together a plan for the kitchen (as opposed to us fumbling around trying to come up with something)We are buying natural maple cabinets and even though they are low end cabinets, THEY LOOK REALLY GOODThe kitchen looks like a really nice modern kitchenOur last kitchen had a lot of cabinets and the total cost was $2600 for the cabinetsWe put crown molding on the top of the cabinets and it looks pretty good.
100 percent buyers?
Tim I've been here in denver since Jan and I'm learning the ropesI've worked on six houses and all have sold FHA loansWith an FHA loan they finance 97%.HOWEVER, with some additional wrangling they can get 100% financing. Some kind of "program" I'm still learning how it all works.But that's just the way it is in today's market. The seller is helping the buyer pay his closing costs.That's how it is in today's world.BUT THESE HOUSES WE'RE REMODELING ARE SELLINGThey're selling fast. We're not sitting on them for months and months.It's not the doom and gloom market you hear about in the media.We fixed up a brick 1950's ranch really nice and it had SIX SHOWINGS YESTERDAYIt should go under contract any daySomething else I wanted to mention.About a month ago we fixed one up and it went under contract.when we work on these houses they get "trashed" Sawdust, drywall dust, debris, dirt etc is everywhereWe clean it up and put it on the market, BUT WE MESSED UP AND DIDN'T GET THE DUCTWORK VACUUMED OUT.The house sold and they had it inspected.the inspector pulled up a few registers and saw the trash and guess what they demanded professional duct cleaningWe learned our lesson and won't let that happen again.
I have a few and would like to buy more but im priced out even in this market.
The average price of a home is , or was 750000.
A fixer would be starting at 2, 250, 300 grand.
I cant fix it up and carry that big a loan while working on it .
Lets say i do fix it up the rents never going to be close to the mortgage.
If i could buy homes around 50 grand and rent them i would buy as many as i could and if it just carried it self i would bet on the next up swing.
I'm on a one week vacation and back in town staying at my Mom's house.
Heading back to Denver tomorrow.
Wanted to report something I've seen with my own two eyes.
We have a friend who is flipping houses in a small town of 1500 population
Town is out around Dodge City and Garden City.
We drove there a couple of days ago and saw with my own two eyes the houses they are buying and I saw the houses they have sold.
I walked through the home built in 1900 they recently bought for $7,000
I looked at a home they bought for $10 or $15 and sold for $80,000
I don't want to go into any details but it can be done.
I'm talking about something along the lines of a small town physician earning a pretty good living and his wife is the one flipping the houses.
THEY ARE BUYING HOUSES FOR $5,000 AND FLIPPING THEM
They don't want any part of Wichita or Denver and paying $100,000 for a house they are going to flip
They are making $20 K on these houses just like we are
BUT THEY ARE DOING IT FOR PRACTICALLY NOTHING OUT OF POCKET
They are buying these cheap houses sometimes 2-3 at a time and THEY DON'T CARE IF THEY SIT THERE FOR SIX MONTHS
They can't keep up with it.
IT'S WORKING FOR THEM IN A SMALL TOWN OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE
I've seen it with my own two eyes
i have a bil trying it here in conway springs.
just what you said 8k for the house. been told it's worth 80 when done.sounds good so far.
old house ,had to go in put in new floor joists,subfloor etc. new sheetrock all the way,new kitchen,bath, roof ,siding,everything.
i don't think he will make 5.00 a hour when done,thinks he's going to have 40k total.
i'm to lazy i guess.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
hey what happened to your post on the casino's?did you delete or bt?
anyway ,yes there is a pretty good possibility of a casino going in at the mulvane turnpike exit. was suppose to happen by now ,but the economy went south so they pulled the plug. now someone else says they want to do the deal.
i'm sure re will go up some in the mulvane/wellington area,but it's only 10 minutes from wichita,so i would guess that most will commute.
know of a guy who bought 360 acres for 460k about 5 years ago at the mulvane exchange,first developer offered him 3.6 mil for it,had the contract everything. then the whole deal went south so i don't know where he's at with the new guys.
ok,you heard it here first...................
my dollar bet is,it never happens. my second dollar bet is,the colosium becomes a casino. lts got lots of parking, dogtrack next door, hotels,highway access, everythings in place. if i'm wrong i'm out 2.00!
oh,and if i lose both of those bets,next one is gander moutain will be a casino...............................................................
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Edited 12/1/2009 9:58 pm by alwaysoverbudget
I deleted the post about the casino and the possible opportunities for an investor.I got to thinking maybe you were looking into something like that and I didn't want to publicize it to the whole world and the millions of people who are reading this posts.I guess I do think there are some opportunities there - but I agree and you're probably right on target - I do know about other areas where it has taken many years to get the casino built and in place.
funny timing,today the casino annouced that they were going back to the drawing board...................
so there goes another couple years.
as far as me getting involved,i don't know if i'm just in a funk,or tired of dealing with the people, or what,but i'm pretty burned out on this stuff. i just today signed a contract to sell a comm. property,i don't think it will happen,lots of contingencies, but i don't know what i'll do if it does go to closing. i have always 1031 the money and bought more. but right now less seems better for me personally.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Every monday nite I meet my daughter somewhere for dinner.Two days ago we ate dinner at a Italian Food restaurant in what I call a residential area with some commercial properties mixed in.Whenever we meet I am dressed in work clothes with paint on them (meaning we are not talking formal dining or anything)Anyway this restaurant was on the corner and it was an old brick building (est 70-80 years old) and with a lot of charm.In this particular area there are businesses on each corner and then old houses filling in the rest of the block and the old homes have been turned into COMMERCIAL There was a house that had been turned into an art studio. There was another that is now a coffee shop where you can go have an expressoAnother was a book store.Another was a natural health foodsAnother was an attorneys office.Again, these are old bungalow houses that are now businesses.What's my point?I didn't know it but this part of Denver is one of the hottest real estate areas in town !!!The old homes sold for $100 K a few years ago and now they are selling for $300 +There are areas like this in Wichita - areas that have some charm and old commercial buildings mixed in the old established residential area.Like Hydraulic and Kellogg.Charming old buildings.My point is people like these quaint old areas better than "strip malls" and if you could sell your property you were referring to and get something going in the right part of town and maybe kind of "develop it" maybe you could get something going.Kind of like some of the old commercial buildings mixed into riverside area.
to tell you the truth the building i'm selling is in a up and coming area, i think?
it's at broadway and kellogg across from wendys and spangles,if you can picture that. the buyer asked if i wanted in on the deal of developing something there.
i look around within 2 blocks is the waterwalk[maybe a casino someday?],the other way is the new arena,lots of things happening.
my answer was no,i'll take the money and go,as i said in my email,i'm just a little dog.lol
you know where clifton square is? bunch of old houses with all the speciality shops? they were doing really well,but something turned there and it's about 3/4 vacant now. on the up side there is a large high dollar condo project going on right next door, so it will probably pick back up.
commercial real estate is a funny animal, a place can be hot ,get the wrong tenant,wrong business and all of a sudden it's dead inventory.
i talked about always backing off the big stuff, about 4 years ago looked at a 38,000 sq ft warehouse type building,been on the market about 3-4 years at that time. i looked at it they wanted 450k [thats what it was on corparate books at] i offered 150k , they all laughed told me i was nuts. fast forward 4 yrs.
monday i happened to be driving by, cornejo was bulldozing it! i'd like to call them and laugh. turned down 150,paid taxes of 30k a year,another 120k ,probably cost 100k to tear down and haul off.there down 370k and i'm not!!!!!the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
so you guys have to be dealing with this problem,seems i am more and more.
rough walls
been wallpapered over,stripped,takes some drywall paper with it,then maybe painted over . looks like hail.
so how do you guys do this? smooth em up? do a knock down and go on?
i just spent the last three days doing a bath,and 2 bedrooms. used the famous d-mix talked about here a couple years ago,trowel it down. then come back with my porter cable drywall sander and sand em smooth. looks nice, but i'm getting to old for the stuff.
any easier way?
i should learn how to do knockdown and do that.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Our system is to do a medium or heavy knock down texture on each and every house.Even if the walls are smooth.I wouldn't mess around with skim coat or the D-MixWe've tried both and they don't work on these messed up old beat up houses.Do the knock down on walls and ceiling. I had a guy tell me the other day his system is texture the ceiling, primer it, and leave it at that He doesn't paint the ceilingSaves money that wayHe said he has been doing it this was for a while now.
We're working on a new house.We've finished two other houses - one sold in three days and the other one is going to be a rental.The rental was completed on Thursday and I put some signs out on a busy street and he's getting some calls.He's asking $2,000 a month for an old brick run down looking bungalow.Will be interesting to see if this works.It's right beside a four year college I've been meaning to take pictures of both houses but just haven't gotten it doneAnyway, our new project is a flip house.It's a 1980's house that's in good shape.Our new business plan is get in an out in 3-4 weeks. Nothing major.Our new project had a damaged steel bath tub and so we decided to replace itSomeone had dropped something in in and chipped the finish.The floor was fairly new (but unattractive dark grey linoleum) and so we decided to leave it.We put the new bathtub in and guess what.The new bathtub is smaller than the old oneThe old one was an inch or two wider.So now we have to do something with the gap.Another thing we run into is two other small bathrooms with ugly linoleum.These are small bathrooms and we are saying "why not just tile them""you're only talking a small amount of tile and a day of labor"It just snow balls.The floors are fairly new and in good condition any YET THEY ARE UGLYWhat do you do?
i'm in the same dilemma next week,yeah a day will tile it,cost less than 50.00,but then as you say,it snowballs. have to pull toilet,reset with a spacer,maybe a new mounting ring [there goes a couple hours. then reset the vanity and re trim. all of a sudden what starts out as 25 pcs of tile and a couple hours, and you find yourself in the bathroom for 3 days.
but where your tub is to narrow,theres nothing to do but new tile,linoleum,or carpet. [carpet being the quick easy fix]
your college rental looks pretty darn good. i have a question though, what cha doing hanging 30.00 window blinds in a college house. i've got nice single family homes and the best they get is 4.00 vinyl blinds. my experience is if the don't get tore up,after about 4-5 years they are so dirty i just throw them and get new ones,don't even have to change brackets. when there shooting beer at their buddies they won't care that they cost 30.
i'm a buy and hold on r.e.,but if that was mine i would get it generating cash ,and find someone wanting to make about 6% on their money and just let them have it in the 250k range and be gone. on the other hand a guy might make more writing a book on the adventures you have.............the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
He's tried it both ways - he just doesn't like the cheap mini blinds.He has to pay someone to replace them so he just doesn't want to mess with themHe feels the more expensive blinds will last longer and he won't have to pay the labor to have someone install more blinds in a year when the renters move out.Hey, I've got some more pictures.This next house is the house we're flipping.We finished it on Nov 13 and it went under contract (full price) three days laterI'll post some pictures.It sold for $159
it's not like i'm a mini blind salesman,but what i do is hang the off white ones.
your right they will need replaced,just go back by some more,open the box and take out the blinds and throw everything else.
99% of the time you can use the old brackets.3 minute deal.
one of the biggest problems we have had in the rentals is curtains. my wife insist on hanging them in the lr and kitchen. everytime the tenant comes in takes them down ,puts theirs up. throws ours away. then when they move take theirs.
i can't tell you how many arguments we have had when we pull the cost out of their deposit.the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
There's a half bath in the basement. Kind of an unfinished or partially finished room which also contains the water heater and the boiler for the steam heat in the houseWe installed a vinyl plank floor in the bathroom$1.79 a foot from HD
have you been over to the spinoff,breaktime classic?
i hang out here probably more than i should and i have looked at this new format they are going to and just went ,huh? everyone hates change,doesn't matter what it is. i'll see if i'm smart enough to figure it out,but i may just head over to this #2 and see if they can get it going.
hope it doesn't go nuts with the tavern bs
if you try to sign in,it takes a different name,or a 1 or 2 after it.
http://forums.delphiforums.com/breaktimeclass/messages/?msg=8.1
the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
Here's the house we're flipping
It took five weeks to completeWent with formica countertops rather than tile and saved some time.The half wall around the stairway was an 8 ft wall when we bought the houseIt had a beaded board ceiling and a door to the basementIt looks a lot different and a lot better with the changes
Its an unusual houseRanch style but yet there is no door on the front of the houseFront and back door are on the sides
Really small bathroomAbout 5' X 6'No room for a vanityWe put the smallest pedestal sink in
The basement had one bedroom when we bought the houseWe took it out and crossed our fingers hoping the Buyer would rather have a "media room" than a bedroom There were no walls on the sides of the stairs when we bought the house.There was no light switch at the bottom of the stairsReally a bad layoutAdding the walls to both sides of the stairs really made a big improvement
I just registered at Breaketime ClassicIt's pretty cool
Do they have peer mods?Do they allow pol talk? Or, are they uptight?http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
no tavern,no mods,i think it's going to try and run on the honor system.
you will have to sign in with a different name. just add a 1 or somethinghttp://forums.delphiforums.com/breaktimeclass/start
Check it out - You'll like it It may not have all the fighting and bickering we have here though.Give it time - Let's see, it's only a few months until the Fall 2010 elections
I signed in over there. I like this format...I probably would prefer the old original format but I can't remember it so this is fine. I don't really like the format that Andy chose for the "darkside" forum. I wouldn't involve myself in the QT forum because the mod there thinks he's special and I prefer to hang with mortals.http://thewoodshedtavern.com. = no peer mods!
Basement pictures
College students don't care if the bathroom floor is ugly. All I'd be worried about is protecting against water damage from the 1" missing floor covering near the new tub.Rebeccah
I looked at the floor today and there is a gap of 1/2 to 1" from the new bathtub to the old linoleumWe're going to try a piece of quarter round.Thanks for your suggestion!
Here's some pictures of the rental property - we completed it a couple of days ago
We didn't do much to the house.We just cleaned up the oak floors and installed a sink and some used appliances in the kitchen
We installed about 30 window blindsAt $30 + apiece the total cost was a little over a grandRemind me to go elsewhere next time we need to get 30 window blinds cut at HD
The house had a kitchen in the basement and we took out the cabinets and tiled the floor.We're guessing college kids will rent the house and maybe set up a ping pong table in what used to be the kitchen.They play beer pong a lot around here
here's a few other misc picturesthere are a couple of huge trees in the yard. Approx 7-8' dia trunk
We bought the house and it was two separate units Four bedrooms totalWe eliminated the kitchen in the basement and added a fifth bedroom Plan is to rent it to five college students at $400 apiece$2,000 per month total We hope to get it rented by January 1st