What should I use ? I’m going to reside an old barn [1860’s]. The siding now is red,paperthin and looks likes todays white shakes. 3″ to 8″ wide x 16″ long. As always cost is important and the shingles will be left unfinished.
I don’t have any pics now, will post some monday afternoon.
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Replies
whites wil cost about half that of reds
speaking generally:
whites will last 15- 20 years on some of the areas
reds will last 20-25 years depending on the conditions and which side
reds are more formal than whites
reds will stay flatter than whites
whites ( 16" ) will have a max exposure of 5"
reds ( 18 " )
will have a max exposure of 6"
generally , you shouldn't weave a corner with whites
and woven corners are fine with reds
your choice
Edited 3/27/2009 2:27 pm ET by MikeSmith
mostly true, in that reds are better and last longer, but I weave whites for a lifetime now, and the whites I am replacing are 70- 100 years old. The ones I did in 91 are not near being ready to replace yet, or even think about it. Your aging scheme would be right for roofs, but siding lasts much longer.
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the only WC they use here are "EXTRA"
and the ones from the 70's have been replaced years ago
we're working on houses from the mid-80's and they have many exposures that have nothing left
the red's are faring about like i described
the worst wer is always the south side
or ... any shingle with it's butt in contact with a horizontal surface.. they're gone in 10 yearsMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
"the worst wear is always the south side"Yes UV and on the west wind erosion.But I don't see the wear you do apparently
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
i built two capes right up the street from my office
one in '77 and one in '78.... both with cedar clap fronts and WC on the other 3 sides
the one from '77 was resided two years ago
the one from '78 is owned by a guy with not much money.. so his should have been resided 10 years ago ... but it still hasn't been
these shingles have many holes in them and the portion just below each but is anywhere from 1/16 to 1/8 " thick .... all from erosion
here's the one from '78
View Image
Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Edited 3/27/2009 4:37 pm ET by MikeSmith
Good example of how the wood in our generation is not as good as it was earlier. Those look almost as bad as some 80 YO shingles on a south face I've torn off
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
i think some of it has to do with the structure they're on also
the old summer houses around here were either the victorian "cottages"
with no insulation and lot's of ability to dry to both sides... mostly red cedar
or they were fishing camps or summer camps.. again , no insulation and the ability to dry to both sides
these modern ones are invariably plywood sheathing and 15 LB felt
fully insulated... so , a much reduced drying to the back
the shingles get wet in a rain and stay wet for longer periods of time
in the spring they may be wet the entire time and don't really dry out on the back until julyMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike, I'm getting confused or I need to check my notes.....drying to both sides.
Isn't that what a drainage plane behind the shingle provides?
Unrelated, those shingle look like a little maintainence would have bought them quite a few more birthdays.
eric... what does maintenance have to do with a cedar shingle ?
if you want to put a "preservatve " on them ...god bless
if you want to stain them.... more power to you
but .... people who live in cedar shingled homes do not put preservatives on them
nor do they stain them... nor do they paint them...
now .... let's define what we're talking about
are we talking about untreated shingles, or treated shingles?
if you stain / paint / preservative them, you are creating a weatherable surface, if you redo the weatherable surface, the the shingles will last forever
but we are not talking about shingles that are stained/painted/ or preservative treatedMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike, I'm getting confused or I need to check my notes.....drying to both sides.
Isn't that what a drainage plane behind the shingle provides?
where did the drainage plane come from ?
what drainage plane ?Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
where did the drainage plane come from ?
what drainage plane ?
Look! Up in the air!
It's a bird!
It's a plane!
It's the one we're told to put behind the shingles. Not that I ever have.
Trying to learn something new, or maybe unlearn something no quite right?
You gonna work with me here ?
i don't need no stinkin drainage plane and if i did it would be Cedar BreatherMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike check out the new photo techniques Rich and Steve have helped me with over in Penobscot.
I think you and Paul are both going to approve.
Walter
What techs [Rich& Steve] ? 25yrs I've never used rain screen, maybe it's time to learn something new - although I doubt any one will want to pay extra for it. Rain screen info @http://www coastalcontractor.net/article/135.html<http://article/135.html this article is by Mike Guertin
Plus whites generally weather to grey, reds weather more to brown, although YMMV depending on climate. I haven't applied reds in decades, but as I recall, they were thicker than whites.
A lot will depend on where you're located. Here in Michigan, it's almost impossible to find white cedar shingles whereas, at my summer home in Atlantic Canada, you can't find red cedar. Mike Smith may be right about those distinctions between red and white but I've used both and, if the quality is the same (for example, "perfections"), I haven't noticed much difference in application or longevity.
ChipTam
Thanks I thinks I'll do some more reserch
If you order "perfections" you are going to be getting red cedars.First clear select R&R is the top designation for whites
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
the WC shingle grading i'm familiar with is :
best.... EXTRA ( also "extra clear" ) no defects in the bottom 12"
next best... CLEAR .... no defects in the bottom 6 "
next .... 2d Clear some knots & defects
and..... UTILITY, culls from the other grades
any shingle can be R&R , but it only makes sense if it's an untreated shingle to spend the money on making R&R's out of EXTRA's
if the mfr. is going to treat the shingle ( like a Maibec ) then they will sometimes use the next grade down , like a CLEAR in WC
or a #2 ( Red Label ) in RC
RC's are graded
#1 ( Blue Label )
#2 ( Red label )
#3 ( black label )
& #4 undercoursing
i know you already know this... but some reading it don't Mike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
I've done a lot of whites here in Maine. Homes along the coast are all covered in whites and some are well over 100 yrs' old. You will extend the life of any shingle if you use a preservative. I did my own place in 1980. I didn't have any money and used C grade whites, the cheapest, poorest. knottyest junk you can get. I let the maintenance slip for a few years. Last year I washed, brightened and applied a clear preservative. I'd say they are good for another 20-30 yrs.