A big church is in the planning. A guy is putting in a bunch of time to gather cost estimates and such to be able to sell the church board on a dome building. He’s trying to work it so he has a role as some sort of consultant. Now, I know the role of an architect in commercial construction, with contract management and construction management, etc. I know the role of a general contractor. I know the role of the client.
But where would someone like the guy I’m talking about fit in? If this guy doesn’t do what he’s doing, then it’s likely that a different construction method will be used, just be/c the board woulda had no familiarity with thin-shell stuff and wouldn’t have known where to get started. To be blunt, he’s trying to figure out how to get a cut of the pie for the time he’s investing selling them on the particulars of the project, but without doing the design or construction himself.
I said maybe the board would feel the need for a liaison to the Arch/GC or maybe the need for an independent advisor on the project…certainly don’t want another level in the hierarchy…wonder if this is typical in commercial work, where some advocate or evangelist wants something for their time and energy, and where that fits into the scheme of things.
Replies
The standard AIA Contract deals with a "owner representative" who tells the architect or GC what do to. Hierarchy is Owner Rep to Architect to Construction Manager to GC to Sub.
Regards,
Boris
"Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934
Cloud, anyone has the right to sell their services as a consultant any time to anyone. It sounds like your guy is just doing a deal. He might be interviewing several dome people and acting like a third party evaluator.
blue
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
Is this person going to be in the position to accept some of the heat when things go wrong? A "cut of the pie" can be cut two ways. Someone should find out in front what this person wants. I have seen many times that the person who is helping "get things together" for church boards is many times looking to get a bigger piece of the pie than they earn and/or deserve. Was the board looking for a buffer between themselves and the GC did this person create a job that was not needed and now wants to be compersated? Find out what the persons intentions and qualifacations are, and do it soon.
>I have seen many times that the person who is helping "get things together" for church boards is many times looking to get a bigger piece of the pie than they earn and/or deserve.This is exactly how I read it, and it makes me nervous, be/c the numbers he threw out as his expectation, to say nothing of how he wanted to limit his role and responsibilities....well, let's say he was anticipating architect-type compensation for all the effort of being a sidewalk superintendent, if ya know what I mean.Blue, I agree that consulting can take on just about any form. In listening to this guy's expectations, it was hard to see where he'd fit in amongst the architect and GC and church Board of Directors, aside from taking his cut and sticking his nose in here and there. There's no value added that an experienced Architect and GC wouldn't be providing in the normal course of performing their jobs. But he IS trying to sell the job, so who's to say...I do not get the sense of him shopping it to various people. I know who he does not want to use and why he doesn't want to use them be/c I brought up some of the obvious names in our little field.Anyway, while I'm open to commercial design work in concert with an architect, I might just beg off this one be/c I don't have a good feeling about it. And it's not like I can claim any real personal knowledge of churches...let alone 1500 seat ones! Ha ha. Still, I'd like to better understand the process.
If this is what I think it is... I am inclined to believe that the board has hired a liaison/consultant.
What this means... the board is probably volunteer. They realize that none of them have the ability, nor desire, to manage the owner's responsibilities on the construction. They want to have an intermediary to help them understand the process and watch their backsides. Pretty smart, actually.
So, in essence, they have hired a consultant to perform in the owner's capacity.
In some ways... this is preferable for the GC and archy also. He has to deal with the politics of the board.. then relay the desires and wishes to the Archy and GC. Keeps the archy and GC from dealing with 6/8/12 people that all have different wants and desires.
Just a guess... but that is what it sounds like to me. I wouldn't throw it out yet... at least until you further discover the role of the consultant.
Another analogy would be an executive director for an association. The association board has no desire to run the day to day... so they hire an administrator (executive director) to take care of business and report back to them.
Cloud,
Many (most) churches are incorporated. The "Church board" is the Corporate BoD.
They tend to react like clubs.
SamT
Don't beg off............run!!!!!!!
Hey, the church hires him, he is the liason between you (the GC) and the owner (the Church)...
you don't care what or how they pay him unless it affects how he does his job...