Replies

1. 
   butch | Oct 28, 2004 08:13pm | #1

   man, you not only got a sky lift but one of them thar

   hellycopters! Stan must uv been around  :-)

   Is that hip the 29' 2" your refeering to?

   Those pics. look good, got any more?

1. 
   Timuhler | Oct 28, 2004 09:00pm | #2

   Thanks.  The hip was 33' 1 1/2" without the tail.  I do have more pics, but I'm leaving in a few minutes for JLC LIVE in Portland, OR.

1. 
   mjesseinc | Nov 10, 2004 01:02am | #18

   Just wanted to jump on the bandwagon with my roof framing pix

   Today we set our 1-3/4" x 14" hip 38'-8" to wall plus 15" o.h. 8/12 rear 12/12 side

   I have a skytrak on site for the whole roof, lots of 2x12-26', 28', 32', ( talk about murderin' some big ole trees) 14" LVL hips and valleys three stories up on the back.

   My guys and my back really like having the skytrak out there. I wonder how (or why), I ever did without it

   mike

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 15, 2004 06:43am | #19

   sweetness!  keep posting. 

   Don't you love having a forklift?  I'm getting fat because I do less lifting now lol :-)

2. 
   rez | Nov 02, 2004 05:01pm | #3

   It's worth the look so for you dialup folks...

    

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 03, 2004 02:14am | #5

   Thanks for reducing those pics :-)

3. 
   xMikeSmith | Nov 02, 2004 10:22pm | #4

   here's your 33' hip.. up close

   View Image

   now .. how 's about some pics of some framers in your 16' work platform ?

   Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 03, 2004 02:15am | #6

   I'll get some pics tomorrow if I can.  We are just starting another house, so we'll be low to the ground for a few days :-)

1. 
   Gunner | Nov 03, 2004 03:20am | #7

   Nice work Tim, keep em coming. That platform is the cats azz. That's got to be way nicer, and much more productive being more stable and having a cutting platform right there.Who Dares Wins.

2. 
   Timuhler | Nov 26, 2004 03:47am | #20

   Mike,

   Here are a couple of pics from the 16' platform.  We've done all the extra framing (overframing) for the trusses from the platform and all the sheathing.  This thing is turning out to be so cool. :-)

   By the way, I forgot how to post pics like you did.  Can you tell me how?

   http://pic9.picturetrail.com/VOL293/2163851/5177572/74533622.jpg

   http://pic9.picturetrail.com/VOL293/2163851/5177572/74533616.jpg

    

1. 
   xMikeSmith | Nov 26, 2004 06:36pm | #23

   tim...

   great  platform... as to displaying pics.. there is the Breaktime way... which is how i mostly do it ...

    but maybe you are referring to this method

   View Image

   in this case... you click on your link.. when you have the pic... RIGHT click, and select COPY...

   then just paste it in to your text..

   View Image

    Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

4. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 03, 2004 04:31am | #8

   Enjoyed your pictures and I envy your platform.  I have not seen to many framers use the LVL's for hips or valleys.  We are about to deck a 1412 that we used 9 inch LVL's for the hips and valleys.  They had to be 34 feet long but at least I could brace them off to a wall.  It looks like that room underneath will be open to the rafters.  Would like to see more pictures of your work.

   James Hart

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 03, 2004 05:18am | #9

   You mean 9" wide?!  Wow!  The biggest beam I've ever worked with was an 8" x 18"x34 or 36' BigBeam glulam.  It had one post and carried a floor and roof above a garage and the owners didn't want a post in the middle of the garage.  That was an easy beam to walk.  Felt like a highway compared with a 3 1/2" wide plate to walk on.

   I'd love to see pics of your work :-)  I've never worked on a 14-12.  What kind of roof was it? 

   Thank you for the compliments.  We are about the only stick framers in this area.  There are some guys who can do it, but most builders don't stick frame.  Our company has been stick framing just about everything for the last 15+years.  The last 3 or 4 though we've changed the way we do it.  I pretty much just copy (don't tell :-)) the guys like Joe Carola who have really made it a science.

   That room is a chathedral living room/diningroom/entry/ stairway. It's turning out pretty well.  Some of the really long rafters have to be braced so the roof will be a little flatter.  I'll post more pics if the coming houses turn out well :-)  The hack jobs won't ever make it to Breaktime :-)

1. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 04, 2004 01:04pm | #10

   It was 9 inches tall and 1 3/4 wide.  I do not like to splice hips and valleys.  This particular hip and valley was 34 feet long.  We also do metal framing with c-channel metal.  WE did an addition for a church that had a 19/12 pitch and we framed it out of 2x12 c-channel metal.  Had to screw the decking on.  For that project we had a lift and platform like the one in your pictures.  I don't know how it is in your area but these spec builders here are buying plans out of magazines.  We keep running into problems with these architects trying to mix the roof pitches but on paper they draw it as if it is all the same.  How much do you think I need to charge to correct structural flaws?  I will take some pictures of this roof tomorrow because it has been raining for 3 days here and we have not been able to do anything but drink coffee and read breaktime.

   Maybe that is a good question.  What do most framers do when the drawings are wrong and the builder says to just make it work?  It is not that we can't make it right.  It is just that we aren't paid to reengineer and redraw the already paid for plans.  I have been charging extra when I have to call my engineer and talk to the local building official about structural changes.  Oh well, I don't mean to complain.  The builders we work for trust me to do the job and pay on time.

   James Hart

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 04, 2004 04:21pm | #11

   James,

   I'm very lucky.  I work hourly.  My father owns the company I work for.  He started general contracting in the late 70's and he has always had his own framing crew.  Right now I'm lead framer and on my crew, including me, we have 4 guys.  Depending on how busy we are, my crew will do framing, siding, concrete (foundations and sometimes flatwork) and whatever else (never done roofing). 

   Often our plans aren't drawn correctly.  Our plan designer is pretty good and he has been doing our plans since the late 70's.  I remember being a little kid and visiting him in his office and seeing him draw by hand the plans.  He is a really cool guy and get gets the roofs pretty close.  We've had some other guys here and there that don't do a good job with the roofs. 

   What our problem is, is that often as we are framing and because we stick everything, it'll become apparent that we can utilize more space or if we change a pitch here, we can add a window there.  My brothers house is like that.  When we started framing it this last June, I told him that if we added a 12' dormer to the front, he could move his bathroom and make it bigger, add a walk in closet and also get a hallway to the area above the garage.  The garage roof was going to be trussed, but he decided to use I-joists and put a floor above the garage and then we just put a wall in the back of the garage and changed the pitch of the back to a 4-12 and the front to a 10-12 and he got a bonus room.

   Sorry for being longwinded :-)  What framing subs do when we use them is charge an hourly amount when things get changed on them.  It's agreed to before they start.  If the hours look wierd, then we'll meet with them and discuss it.  It works pretty well, but we try not to sub jobs that are likely to get "funky".  We try not to sub at all.

   Here are some pics of my brothers house.  You can see the dormer on the right hand side up against the garage.  That upper roof would have come all the way down to the porch beam.  We added that dormer and the garage bonus room.  14" I-joists spanned 21'

   http://pic9.picturetrail.com/VOL293/2163851/4215098/53557843.jpg

2. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Nov 04, 2004 05:23pm | #12

   James, we don't do the builders job...which is to supply the drawings, engineering and talk to the building inspector.

   We are willing to cooperate, in CONJUNCTION with the builder, but we get paid while we are CONSULTING. If we run into problems collecting, we don't work for that builder anymore. This year alone I've turned down hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of work.

   The current builder we are working WITH has had troubles with his drawings. Basically these are large customs that are being drawn by a rookie architect. He's causing all sorts of problems because he doesn't know how to draw. I know him...he worked in the field with me as a carpenter and his work ethic and building instincts were zilch! Other than that though..he's a funny and fine young man!

   We've already warned the builder that we won't continue to deal with these "issues" even though we are getting paid. We reviewed and sent the last set of plans back a month before we started but there were still too many mistakes and ommissions.

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, some of it is viewed as boogerin and not consistent with views of those who prefer to overbuild everything...including their own egos

   Additionally, don't take any political advice from me. I'm just a parrot for the Republican talking points. I get all my news from Rush Limbaugh and Fox and Friends (they are funny...try them out)!

1. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 05, 2004 04:20am | #13

   It is really getting to be a problem with these generic plans.  You are right, Blue.  It is not out job.  I have been in the construction business all my life.  I have done all phases just to say I can.  My two oldest sons work with me as crew leaders and we are all getting weary of having to do all the calculating of joist and beams and rafters.  This particular builder was having someone else do his framing until the framer began using the smallest structural members possible and we had to come in and redo several thousand dollars worth reframing.  I told the builder then that he needed to have someone engineer his plans.  The name of our company is NEXT LEVEL CONSTRUCTION.  We try very hard to bring framing to the next level of quality.  We are not the cheapest around but our work is worth every dollar spent.

   We are presently building 3 houses for this one builder who buys these magazine plans without proper specs.  I told him last week that he needed to have the specs finalized on the next houses.  It just seems to me that more and more responsibility is trying to be put on the framer.  Lately, I have called the HVAC man to meet with me to make sure we worked out what he needed before we put some impossible situation in front of him.  I don't mind working with the other subs.  I know that we have all got to work together but I do feel that I'm doing the builder's job to much lately.

   Well, there's my soapbox.  I'm going to take pictures of our 1412 meeting a 1012 roof tomorrow.  It quit raining today and the temp dropped 30 degrees.  I'll start my curved rafters on Monday and try out Joe's formula.

   James Hart

2. 
   blue_eyed_devil | Nov 05, 2004 06:11am | #14

   James, we don't assume any liability for speccing bearing headers....because...we NEVER  do the engineering! If a bearing header is needed, someone else has to tell me what goes in there. My first call is to the builder, who calls whoever, or he simply tells me what to put in there...I don't care...I never make the call!

   blueWarning! Be cautious when taking any advice from me. Although I have a lifetime of framing experience, some of it is viewed as boogerin and not consistent with views of those who prefer to overbuild everything...including their own egos

   Additionally, don't take any political advice from me. I'm just a parrot for the Republican talking points. I get all my news from Rush Limbaugh and Fox and Friends (they are funny...try them out)!

3. 
   toast953 | Nov 26, 2004 08:15am | #21

   ?? , what is with the chain link fence, I've only seen them on commercial jobs, and where is the City/County building Dept. approved set of Prints? You know the ones with the red lines drawn here and there. Here in my parts it takes minimumn, three weeks for an approved sets of Prints.  "Plan Review" is part of the AHJ job, and usually these guys are fairly sharp. Keep up the safety, and the good work,, Jim J 

4. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 26, 2004 02:12pm | #22

   You may have my job mixed up with someone else's.  We do not have a chain link fence.  I think TMUHLER did.

   As far as the plans being approved, here in these parts they do not look at the structural at the building department.  We have gone round and round this merry go round with the inspector.  They do not feel responsible for the drawings  being properly engineered or anything else.  A permit and their stamp really does not mean anything.  If we frame it by the plans and the plans are wrong then then it's not the building department's fault.

   I can certainly see their point.  They do not have the time for those kind of reviews.  But they really should not put their stamp on the plans.  If we have questions the inspector will come out and help if he can. 

   Anyway, we have started reviewing the plans ahead  of time so that we can get them back to the builder if there are problems.

   James Hart

    

5. 
   toast953 | Nov 27, 2004 07:31am | #24

   James,, Thanks,,, and please keep checking with your HVAC team. One particular job, the County building dept. while doing plan review, asked for and got, a letter from the HVAC Co.   Basically asking them, Can you guys really get your system in this big ol home, and make it work. I personelly get tired of seeing over and over again, the total lack of pre planning, on the Arch./Designers end.    Note; all I do is the small jobs anymore, anywhere from 1 day to 3 weeks, this all I want, and I seem to keep busy.    I so much enjoy this forum, you all be safe, charge em, be fair, but charge em. Jim J

2. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 07, 2004 02:20am | #15

   I have my pictures ready but have not ever tried to put any on the web.  How do you attach them?

   James

3. 
   NEXTLEVEL | Nov 07, 2004 05:39am | #16

   Here are the pictures of the 1412 meets 1012 roof.  If You look on one side you will see the 30 foot dormer that will get the curved rafters that I asked help for.  I  used 9* tall LVL's 34 feet long for the hips and valleys.

   James

1. 
   Timuhler | Nov 07, 2004 07:00am | #17

   Nice work.  It looks like you did a really clean job.  I'm leaving tomorrow for Maui and I'm totally unprepared, but when I get a chance I'll look at those pics in more detail and figure out what I can copy from your job :-)  Great job and thanks for those pics