Replies

1. 
   FrankB89 | Jan 28, 2003 10:15am | #1

   You should be able to find 1/2 inchers in a good building supply store, but you'll want to hold them with a pair of needle-nose pliers unless you just want to tenderize your fingers.

   'Course there are other ways to attach building paper, like plastic cap nails, staples, strapping tape with staples, staples with wood lath nailed on (remove lath as you install siding).

   Nails penetrating the sheathing is nothing to worry about.

   Jules Quaver for President   2004

1. 
   edwardh1 | Jan 28, 2003 04:22pm | #2

   I thought nails were supposed to go thru the wood and stick out inside else they would tend to bank out over time?

   Roofer used short nails on my moms house and many backed out.

2. 
   xMikeSmith | Jan 28, 2003 04:49pm | #3

   hat:

    they are SUPPOSED to go thru the sheathing... they gain some of their withdrawal strength by penetrating all the way and spreading the fibers..

    a typical ( and most popular ) length would be 1.25"... long enough to penetrate  about a 1/4" on the other side... long enough to handle with your fingers..

   "stubbies" are ONLY for areas like exposed rafter tails or sun porch roofs where you DO NOT WANT the nails to poke thru because of APPEARANCE...

   a 1" nail is a stubby.... so is  a 3/4"... with 1" they will come thru with just the felt... but in normal  application ( one layer of felt , two courses of roofing)  a 1" will not come thru... so that is why you want a 1.25"...

   hot dipped galvanized for hand nails....... Paslode for gun nails

   Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

1. 
   edwardh1 | Jan 28, 2003 09:53pm | #4

   thanx!

1. 
   BungalowJeff | Jan 29, 2003 02:04am | #5

   So, I will always have a nail poke in my head when I'm in the attic? Dang. I guess I should start wearing a hardhat. Obviously paying attention and avoiding them has not been working.  ...that's not a mistake, it's rustic

3. 
   andybuildz | Jan 29, 2003 03:21am | #6

   Just wondering.why roofers and not staples.I must be missing something here.

   a

   "Attachment is the strongest block to realization"
   http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM

4. 
   PTurtiak | Jan 29, 2003 07:35am | #7

   use 1 1/4 shingle nails as they are easier to hold in between your fingers while trying to nail them

1. 
   SHazlett | Jan 29, 2003 03:27pm | #8

   Actually,

   since this guy stated in another thread  that he expects his felt to be exposed for quite some time-----he should be using button cap nails.After all,he doesn't want his felt to blow off.

   for his stated application I would probably spring for either Tri-Flex 30,or Roof Top GaurdII. either of these products will hold up WAY longer than felt,and be much less likely to blow off.

   I definitely,definitely,definitely---wouldn't use staples.

1. 
   xMikeSmith | Jan 29, 2003 03:45pm | #9

   steven... we really like that RoofTopGuard II....looks like it's  gonna save our bacon on this addition...Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

   
1. 
   Stray | Jan 29, 2003 05:24pm | #10

   Mike,

   That looks like a great product!  Is it like a poly sheet, or more like a fiber reinforced housewrap?  How much more /sqr than felt?

   You're always give me good ideas...

   Thanks,

   Erik

1. 
   SHazlett | Jan 29, 2003 08:17pm | #11

   Stray,

   My supplier gave me a roll for free to try out.It sells for about $140 per roll. 10 squares per roll.The actuall material is pretty much a woven polyester( like a blue poly tarp) with a rubberized coating on top.I found it to be MUCH more slippy when dewcovered than regular felt.Each roll is 5 foot high instead of 3 foot like felt and it can be a little tricky to install solo on a steep roof( the material is really curly if ya know what I mean).

   The rubberized coating makes this stuff self seal around nail holes pretty well. ( my rep gave me a demo using a mason jar full of water with this stuff as the lid---it worked pretty good).It is pretty uv resistant,easy to cut but impossible to tear.A pretty good material if you are gonna leave it exposed for a long time.I saw it on a slate roof job exposed for maybe a year.

   I like the 5 foot dimension,dislike the slippy when damp problem, and don't consider the high cost to be a factor at all. Didn't seem to take chalk lines all that well.It's primary benefit is durability and long exposure time.My company won't use a lot of it( after long,serious,consideration) because I generally try to have our roofs each day torn off by 9:00am and completely re-roofed by 2:00pm or so each day. EXTREMELY rare that we would EVER leave a house  felted in overnight.(Maybe once every few years or so---and IF then the felt will be covered with a tarp)

2. 
   xMikeSmith | Jan 29, 2003 08:31pm | #12

   steven... that pic. was the rooftopguard I... we also got the rooftopguard II.. different surface...not slippery ( i never found the other any more slippery that felt ..but psychologically it LOOKS more slippery )

   we're paying about $125 for a 10sq. roll of the RTGII...

   we put that on part of the roof in november.. and then just left it until we can leapfrog our staging to the back  ( zero deg. weather ain't helping ).... but with the RTGII in place we don't have any worries about tearoff or leaking....Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

3. 
   xMikeSmith | Jan 29, 2003 09:48pm | #13

   27005.14 in reply to 27005.12 

   stray & steven:  we got  a break in the weather today... 36deg.  so Barry went back to the roof....

   here's Barry installing Hatteras  RTGII in the foreground, Grace Ice & Water , &  RTGI  and then Barry...

   . and a pic. of some of the RTGII we installed in November.. still keeping the weather out..

   and a pic of one of Barry's favorite stories... story #322.. about how long he's owned those snips and how the bolt is worn flat from cutting granules...

   man, i love this guy....Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

   
4. 
   SHazlett | Jan 30, 2003 01:08pm | #14

   Mike,

   we bought a shingleshear last year which I love.It paid for itself on the first 70 square job we did last year.It let me put MY worn out snips into semi-retirement.

   We are gonna switch to a hitachi button cap nailer this spring----no more hand nailing felt button caps. (Where in THE hell do you still find those antique"tins" ?)

   If I was doing projects that needed to stay open as long as yours,I would definitely be using the Rooftop GaurdII. I forgot to mention it's most serious drawback for ME however. Last year when I was considering carrying it----I sent a sample of it,and its' datasheet off to my shingle manufacturer.After checking it out MY shingle manufacturer informs me that it is not an approved underlayment for it's products! Rooftop Gaurd II "implies" otherwise-----which is why I had it checked out so thoroughly.I didn't want to void the warranty on some 50 year laminated shingle jobs by knowingly using a underlayment my manufacturer told me NOT to use.

   Tri-Flex 30 did pass the test however. I would have to switch brands of shingles to use the Rooftop Gaurd II.

5. 
   Stray | Jan 30, 2003 08:26pm | #15

   Mike,

   I'm confused (Not hard to do)

   "...here's Barry installing Hatteras  RTGII in the foreground, Grace Ice & Water , &  RTGI  ..."

   I take this to mean you're using these 3 diff products on different sections of the roof.  Is the sequence from the eves: Grace I&W, then next course is RTGII and then all subsequent courses are the RTGI up to the ridge?

   If the RTG (I or II) "seal around nails" as was mentioned above, does it just not perform as well as Grace I&W, therefore requireing Grace right at the eves?

   Thanks,

   Erik

6. 
   xMikeSmith | Jan 30, 2003 09:13pm | #16

   stray.... the RTG is a "seal around the nail underlayment" but it may or may not be accepted as a substitute for Ice & water, since it does NOT seal down.. ( no sticky back )...

   in the picture shown, where barry was working there was a 3' starter strip of Ice & water (GAF granular )... and then  up from there was the RTG I.. in the foreground  there was some of the new RTG II and at the break in the roof there was some Grace Ice &  Water which was covering up a temporary situation that will be replaced by step flashings and a very narrow rake board...

   the only thing about the roof in question waa that some of it was new construction, and some old.. and it was all stripped and prepped at different times..on the new construction where Barry was working, we used the last of the roll or RTG I from the Ice & water up...

   on the old roof , we used some of the new RTG II,  but that section still has to have the eaves extended  when we bring the staging around and replace the trim .. so the 3' where the Ice & Water goes isn't even in place yet..

   that clears that up , don't it ?Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

5. 
   don26299 | Feb 03, 2003 08:44am | #17

   If you want to go with roofing nails, something you can do to minimize the nails and help hold the (30#) tarpaper is use nylon string in combination with the nails. 

   Roll out a length of paper.  Loop string over corner 1 1/4 roofer and drive home.  Go a distance of say 10 feet and drive another roofer about half way in, stretch the string tight, wrap around the nail and (holding string tight) drive it home.  Staple over string in between nails later. 

   I have held tarpaper on for a long time like this.  The staple holes will allow slight dripping in big long rains. 

1. 
   Nails | Feb 03, 2003 04:21pm | #18

   What Fonzie said, tyvek on for 16 mo. felt on for 8 months no problem in central Illinois, used staples on ours .