OK, so I’m doing a design and helping owner decide between one layout and another. It would be sufficient to have rough estimates, so that I could say something like…”Plan A has 1000 less sf of walls, but 200 more sf of ceiling, so that’s gonna cost/save you $X.” Where’s a good source for numbers like these–it’d be fine if I could round to the nearest thousand or two. Buying and using Walker’s Builder’s Estimating Reference Book seems overkill for this.
Are there good guidelines on pricing–labor, materials, everything–a lineal foot of 2x4x8′ (16″ oc) 1/2″ SR walls (finished) and a sf of 2×10 (16″ oc) 1/2″ SR underneath and 3/4″ plywood deck? Remember, this isn’t for developing a bid, it’s just for helping a HO have a sense of the differences be/c two alternatives.
Replies
Have you tried Means Residential Cost Data? There is a section on sq ft costing that might work.
Do it right, or do it twice.
Price $65 at Amazon...can live with that. Is it easy to work with? If I need to guestimate a 2x4x8' x 10' wall with 1/2" sr, tape, paint, baseboard, crown labor and materials.....how long would it take to find a number? How easy? How many steps involved?
$65 !!! I paid $92.
1/2" rock, finished (2 coats paint) + base = $1.90/sf of one side of a wall so X2 for both sides. And 0.035 man hours/sf
Interior luan flush door, hung w/ hardware, painted, $492
Interior wall framing, 2x4 @16" 2 top pl, one sill pl, $1.46/sf and 0.024 mh/sf
Crown is in a separate section...stock pine profile, 3-5/8" $3.04/lf and 0.032 mh/lf.
The $/sf includes mat'l and labor.
Do it right, or do it twice.
They also have sections in the book with LF costs. I don't have a scanner, so I took a couple of pics w/ my digital...a little crude, but I think you get the idea.
edit...The sf section is broken down into economy, average, custom, & luxury classes, and 1, 1-1/2, 2 story houses, etc. There are also modifiers for upgrades.
Do it right, or do it twice.
Edited 6/16/2003 6:08:34 PM ET by ELCID72
Edited 10/16/2003 8:19:46 PM ET by ELCID72
picture 416 was the one that helped me understand. Thanks. I didn't want to have to look up each component separately be/c that's too much effort for quick-n-dirty numbers.
Amazon's pretty good for stuff like this. Discounts AND free shipping. Just got $129 software I needed for $30 after discounts and 2 rebates (and free shipping).
Wanted to thank you for the recommendation. Got the book and love it! Helped already to put some options into perspective for a client.
You're welcome. Shall we discuss my consulting fee....?
Do it right, or do it twice.
I'll let you discuss it for as long as you wish. How's that for cooperative? <G>
Ok, well, that discussion is closed now.Do it right, or do it twice.
Your scenario may be one of the instances where the guides, such as Means, are worth having around for ballparking. I bid 8 ft walls, 16"OC sr, with paint and base at $55 per running foot. Here, that's profitable. I can stick a lot of framing up in a day, and drywallers have started playing competitive bidding games this summer. I just got a quote for 37 cents / sf for the hanging and finishing. I supply the rock. Thats durn cheap. I guess they'll go back to the old way when enough of them go out of business doing this silliness. Interior HC PH I allow $400 ea. My material cost is about $89 for an oak prehung, $1.25/ft for colonial case.
"The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb " lyrics by Roger Waters
Elcid....material/labor cost for hanging/painting a pre-hung Luan door...$492
RW...Hc(hollow core) Ph (pre-hung) I allow $400.
WHOA! HOLD THE PHONE! Anyone else out there charging this high for hollow core pre-hungs? Damn...I'm definately missing the boat.
As for $89 for a luan door...cost here is $42 per...period. Lockset, add another $22. Total cost...$64. Add $15 for paint...total cost $79.00
Labor to install door...new construction...$50......old, retrofit...anywhere from $60 to $100 depending on circumstances.
Cost for painting door...$20.00
Soooo, worst case scenario...retrofit monster problem door ($100) plus cost of door & lockset ( $64) plus cost of paint and paint labor ($35) = a grand total of $199 for materials & labor.
Add a 30% mark-up ( $59.70) and total cost is.....$258.70
A far cry from the $400 range you guys are touting...and this was worst case scenario....average charged cost would really only amount to $193.70
We are talking interior doors aren't we? $400...!?
You guys would be in a fist fight with the homeowners around here if you try to charge that high. Heck, it's like pulling teeth just to get them to pay ANYTHING that comes in at over $100 period!
Where you guys from?...I'm gonna hafta move...will be rich in no time!
Davo
From the RS Means Residential Cost Data Book
Luan, Flush, Hollow Core
Item (material cost/labor cost)
Door 32/33.5
Frame 99/27
Trim 32/42
Paint trim 3/11
Butt Hinges 25
Lockset 14/19
Prime 4/53
Paint 7/88
Total...492.54
That's how they break it down for a new door, not pre-hung.
if you want to work cheap go ahead paint a door for twenty bucks you must not value your time at much. do you mark up your material or charge for your time to go get them? do you shop at home depoe and pass the saving on to your customers?
if you work cheap you cause other proffesionals problems wether you do good work or not
Are you a businessman or an employee?
As for $89 for a luan door...cost here is $42 per...period. Lockset, add another $22. Total cost...$64. Add $15 for paint...total cost $79.00
Labor to install door...new construction...$50......old, retrofit...anywhere from $60 to $100 depending on circumstances.
Cost for painting door...$20.00
Soooo, worst case scenario...retrofit monster problem door ($100) plus cost of door & lockset ( $64) plus cost of paint and paint labor ($35) = a grand total of $199 for materials & labor.
Add a 30% mark-up ( $59.70) and total cost is.....$258.70
2 hours to pick up door and hardware = $120
Grand total = $319
At my labor rate ($60 includes hidden costs take home about $35) you are talking 20 mins to remove door from frame, paint all six sides with 2 coats, paint frame with 2 coats, rehang door.
I want a %35 profit margin to cover OH and company profit so I mark up %50. Total cost = $478.50 using your low numbers.
SamT
"Law reflects, but in no sense determines the moral worth of a society.... The better the society, the less law there will be. In Heaven, there will be no law, and the lion will lie down with the lamb.... The worse the society, the more law there will be. In Hell, there will be nothing but law, and due process will be meticulously observed."
Grant Gilmore, The Ages of American Law (New Haven: Yale University Press, 1977), pp. 110-111.From 32866.117
I personally view estimating books as retail for insurance work. A competive installation price requires knowledge of one's market and/or the specific client and their expectations.
Just finished installing 20 doors (birch veneer fire doors; not prehungs) for $1000 each, including new finish (believe it or not, old hardware reinstalled).
It happens, once in a blue moon...
Our usual installation price (no painting/finishing) is about $200-250...
brian
http://costest.construction.com/cest/
found during one of my forays
never used it
bobl Volo Non Voleo