it’s time – in 1980, I stripped the three layers, repaired the sheathing, and shingled with ‘T-locks’ – no leaks yet, but pieces are blowing off and there’s not much life left –
I have sheet metal on everything else, but this roof (18.5 square, 6 in 12 pitch) has enough character (sags and bags) that metal panels will not lay well, and I don’t want to look at nasty seams and racked metal for the rest of my life –
anybody use sheet metal shingles? they might work –
but likely I’ll use asphalt shingles –
there seems to be a bewildering selection of products – I went to Lowe’s website and there are 200+ products – admittedly many are just color variations, but there are also several different product lines –
what’s the bottom line? where does the value lie? –
I want another 30 years at least – if I could get 40 years, there’s not a chance I would have to worry about reroofing again –
Replies
Why not more T-locks? They lay well on roofs with "character" and you know they hold up well. And I think they look pretty nice too -- "pizazz" without having to pay for archies.
A bit more of a PITA to lay, of course.
I'll check on availability - they were getting rare 30 years ago - and I did have a friend use them on his roof a few years after I did this barn who had a bad experience, with the materials lasting less than 10 years - I'm not adverse to the idea - they do look good in that application - and they lay quickly compared to 3-tabs and such - "there's enough for everyone"
A good question for Stephen H. ........... my incllination would be a 40 or 50 year shingle if funds permit- might get you where you want to be or pretty close longevity wise.
"There can be no doubt that Socialism is inseparably interwoven with totalitarianism and the abject worship of the state…Socialism is in its essence an attack not only on British enterprise, but upon the right of ordinary men and women to breathe freely without having a harsh, clammy, clumsy tyrannical hand clasped across their mouth and nostrils" -Winston Churchill
what makes the difference between 30 and 40 and 50 year shingles? - I guess I could search, but it seems I remember discussion to the effect that the effective difference is the price - on the existing roof, the mineral has eroded to the point that the asphalt is becoming exposed, then deterioration is rapid - heavier asphalt wouldn't make much difference once the rock comes off - I'm out of my territory here - - "there's enough for everyone"
I think Owens Corning has architectural shingles that are good for 110 MPH wind now. (But I'm going from memory)
Might look good with some grey ones that look li weathered cedar shakes.
ya - I like the looks of the shingles we put on dad's roof a few years ago - they are a cedar shingle mimic - nominally 30 year material - I cleaned those gutters last week and the material seems to be holding up well, tho the low, shaded, north pitch porch roof seemed less happy than the rest of the pitches - that wouldn't be an issue here - "there's enough for everyone"
David-
T-locks are not available here - I've never touched one.
Metal shingles are pretty pricey, labor intensive, and a 6/12 would be close to the bottom of the range they should be installed on, decreasing their longevity some.
I'd look at a Certainteed Hatteras or OC Duration+ shingle. Both have 50 yr (IIRC) expected lives and high wind ratings. There are other similar brands/models, but these are the two I'm most familiar with. Lowes carries the Duration+ here (special order), but their product offering might differ up there.
From what I've seen, 30 year shingles typically don't last 30 years.
copper p0rn
"30 year shingles typically don't last 30 years"ya - that's the impression I get from reading here and elsewhere - tho it seems there should be no technical reason for the materials not to last that long - these 1980 shingles made it - hard times = time to have good roofs....I was set up at an event a week an a half ago where this upscale mall had what appeared to be tile roofs - close inspection revealed it to be sheet metal - looked good, but it did not leave the impression of longevity - not that I would use tile appearance on my barn - but I have looked at metal shingles that lay 1' X 2' (or close) that have a bonded aggregate - that could be an alternative - I have similar units on part of the house that date from 1916 (no aggregate, just galvanized) - they are delivering metal tomorrow that will replace them - dunno - just don't want to have to do it for another 30 years - "there's enough for everyone"
I'm a little leery of the 50 year claims. The aggregate protects the asphalt and It doesn't appear that a 50 yr has more aggregate than a 30 yr. Just more asphalt. So, IMHO, the difference in lifespan would be how long the extra thickness of asphalt would last w/o the aggregate. I don't know and neither does anyone else, since they haven't made 50 year shingles for 50 years.
As far as Hazlett's 30 vs 50 pricing, that doesn't hold true in my neck of the woods. 50's are about twice the price of 30's and are non stock items, meaning if I buy a few bundles too many, they're mine to keep.
Re: the old metal shingles. I'm not sure what the difference is, but the galvanized stuff I've gotten in the last 10 years or so is more rust prone than the older stuff. Or maybe it has to do with no lead in the paint used to paint it. If you do go with metal, avoid polysester coatings. copper p0rn
I am reading the prices off a price sheet from one of my suppliers dated 10-13-09 I suspect population density-and therefore demand---- haves omething to do with this.
Here- most of the colors in lifetime laminates are stock items and readily available Lifetime TRI_LAMINATES- are a different story-available within a day or so-but non-returnable.
some of the super premium shingles like Camelot, Grand canyon, grand sequoia, , country mission, grand slate, etc.- are significantly more- but run of the mill lifetime dimensionals, I think are a comparative baqrgain forwhat he wants to accomplish.stephen
I know - we've discussed this before. But the prices and availability you get are completely different from here. Don't know about Doud's neck of the woods, but as the population is kind of sparse, I would suspect his offerings are slimmer than mine and special orders command a premium.copper p0rn
I believe the Malarkey Legacy shingles are available where you live. They are nice to put down(except the black color variation).
Rated for 110mph(with 6 nail, no staples) with 50yr.
Never seen a Malarkey.copper p0rn
But you've read plenty of it on this site !!
David,- I am not entirely certain about what you are calling Tlocks
If it is what we call interlocking shingles- the good news is that they aren't double coverage shingles-and they tear off fast
what to put on?
well the quickest and easiest would be dimensional shingles.
shingles for that area would cost me about $1520 in a 30 year weight-and 2220 in a 50 yr/lifetime weight- roughly.
I suspect 30 year shingles- might not make it to your target lifespan- but the 50 year/lifetime shingles- might have a fighting chance-and for only $700more you get a much longer potential lifespan.
GAF/ELK- now claims 110mph wind rating on 30 year timberlines(hooey)-and 130 mph on 50 yr/Lifetime timberlines( also hooey)- for comparison.
got a picture of the barn?- because I might have a 3rd idea for you,
stephen
here's one that gives you an idea -
View Image"there's enough for everyone"
That's steeper than a 6/12.copper p0rn
"That's steeper than a 6/12."ya, you're right - I'm mixed up - the roof planes run 20' - the barn is 30' across - so ~40' of roof over 30' of barn - is that roughly 12/12? I'm out of my territory here...let's see - hypotenuse is 20' - A squared plus B squared = 400 A = 15, so A squared is 225, so B squared is 175 - the square root of 175 = 13+so that's 13/15 - a bit less that 12/12, tho all this ignores the overhang - "there's enough for everyone"
Dave, I have a threory that the steeper the pitch the longer the roof lasts. I have replaced many 12/12 pitch roofs around here that have lasted 30-50 years. My own roof was 40 years old. (t locs).
Steal would work on that roof, I think from the picture.
ya - looks great in that pict, doesn't it?sight up the run and the bags and sags are pronounced - doesn't show with shingles, but it I try to lay full length metal, it'll look like hell - I'm going to call my supplier and get a price on metal shingles, just for fun - "there's enough for everyone"
Yea - when I saw that pic of your barn, I said to myself: "6:12?????" This from a non-roofer...
Here is a little tip though for guessing roof pitches: I look at the gable end and imagine holding my speed square up to the the angle at the 'peak'. is the angle = to the 90 degrees on my speed square? yes? roof = 12:12. I think most people can "see" a right angle. If not, they may not belong here.... or at least they shouldn't be giving out roofing or carpentry advice.. :-) Angle less than 90 degrees? 13:12 or 14:12. Angle a little more than 90? 10:12. Angle much greater than 90 degrees like maybe around 125 degrees = 6:12. 125 degrees is 1.5 times 90 degrees. Hope all that makes sense.
This will get you in the ballpark with no measuring or math (or fancy electronic levels).
View Image
And another method (again from a non-roofer): I look at the roof and imagine getting up there. If I think: "hummm I could fall off that roof". then I know it is greater than 7:12. :-)
ya - I could fall off that roof - makes sense - I knew that it was roughly a 45* roof, just brain faded when I went to put numbers to it - 6/12 - that's half way, right? - - that means it's 45*, right? duh..."there's enough for everyone"
Maybe I didn't communicate it too well... a 45 degree roof (measured at the eve) is a 12:12... Maybe I can take some pics today...
no, you were clear and correct - I was just explaining my faulty thinking that led me to describe the roof as 6/12"there's enough for everyone"
Anyway I took a few pics so here they are... me holding up my speed square...
Nice looking house, but that big triangle thing in the front yard is kind of ugly.
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
If I figure "I could fall off of there" it's anything higher than 3 feet off the ground.
A strong nation, like a strong person, can afford to be gentle, firm, thoughtful, and restrained. It can afford to extend a helping hand to others. It's a weak nation, like a weak person, that must behave with bluster and boasting and rashness and other signs of insecurity. --Jimmy Carter
well, that was interesting - 'decra' (sp?) sheet metal shingles, laying 20" X 4' are $183/square - plus the trim and misc necessary to make it work - don't think I'll use that - "there's enough for everyone"
" I have a threory that the steeper the pitch the longer the roof lasts"I don't think there's any doubt that you are right - this barn was built in 1906 after the big one burned down - it's worn out 4 roofs in that time - all asphalt shingles so it's getting 25 years on average - intimately knowing the family responsible, I can say with confidence that neither the cheapest nor the most expensive materials were used - might as well just buy the $25-$30/square shingles, cross my fingers, and get it over with - roofing is one of my least favorite building activities - right up there with digging out crawl spaces..."there's enough for everyone"
roofing is one of my least favorite building activities>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Mine also, but I made a good living selling it>G<
Verifying a 12/12 pitch is easy. Hold something up in front of you that has a square edge (Like a sheet of paper) As ya look at the gable end of the building. A 12/12 roof will form a 90° angle at the peak. The square thingy in your hand will serve as a reference.
The less hair I have, the more head I get
David - for a 'wood shingle' look I really like Certainteed's Landmark TL (Tri-Laminate) in color 'Resawn Shake'
or
'Sunrise Cedar'
http://www.certainteed.com/resources/landmarktlbrochlakecentral.pdf
http://www.certainteed.com/products/roofing/residential/308956#
Jeff
I used the trilaminates in sunrise cedar in spring of 2008 they are pretty "spendy" considering the warranty is really no better than the regular 50 yr/lifetime laminates. they were a good product- but I won't install them again without my shingle shear- they are a challenge to cut- also- sunrise cedar- is one of those things that the color of the individual shingle is really ugly up close- you hate them all day long- it's only when you get down and view them from the ground that they look really good.
stephen
I've had enough time to read about the shingles you recommended - 340 pounds per square!is it just the thickness of the asphalted felt, or is there extra aggregate?the pictures show very attractive roofs, no doubt about it - I'd guess they are stiff and I'd want to apply them in warmer weather?<insert lame joke here> 4 laminated sealing strips! that's a lot of peeling to get the plastic off! </j>thanks - "there's enough for everyone"