FHB Logo Facebook LinkedIn Email Pinterest Twitter X Instagram Tiktok YouTube Plus Icon Close Icon Navigation Search Icon Navigation Search Icon Arrow Down Icon Video Guide Icon Article Guide Icon Modal Close Icon Guide Search Icon Skip to content
Subscribe
Log In
  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Restoration
  • Videos
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House
  • Podcast
Log In

Discussion Forum

Discussion Forum

sidewall shingles: staples vs. nails?

roberttp | Posted in Tools for Home Building on August 30, 2009 05:52am

Hi all,

  I’m looking at doing a couple of sidewall cedar shingle jobs and am looking to tool up to make the work go faster.  I don’t own a pneumatic stapler yet, but am considering getting one for this because from what I understand this is the standard way that cedar shingles are installed these days.   Does anyone use a nailer for this?  I have a job coming up that involves either a lot of clear cedar claps or maybe fiber cement.  If it’s decided that it will be fiber cement I’m definitely going to get a siding nailer for it.  It seems to me that one could use the nailer for both applications and more.  I don’t see why a nailer wouldn’t work on shingles, so is the advantage of the stapler that it is so compact and light?  I hear that staples hold pretty tenaciously due to the glue on them.  How about future repairs; is it easy to replace a shingle that have been stapled?

  Finally, anyone have advice on models to buy?  I’m leaning towards the Hitachi’s, maybe the older model that is a bit more money but feels a bit more durable and looks less flashy.

Thanks in advance for the advice.

– Rob

Reply
  • X
  • facebook
  • linkedin
  • pinterest
  • email
  • add to favorites Log in or Sign up to save your favorite articles

Replies

  1. Bing187 | Aug 30, 2009 06:22pm | #1

    I did a large amount of red cedar R&R's in the 80's and early 90's with a 1/2" crown stapler, 1-5/8" length if memory serves. Never had an issue with cupping, splits or the other issues I've seen raised here...... I have seen those jobs 20 years later, and the ones that were maintained still look great. I will say that it was all sidewalling, and not blowing 10 staples into a 9" wide shingle. Followed the " 1" in from the edge, 2 to a shingle up to 6", then 3 to a shingle" rules (approximating on those, by the way)

    I will say that for people doing roofing with Reds, staples would be a nightmare to strip. I'd be inclined to use a nailer on those, I guess

    Sounds like it would make more sense for you to get a siding nailer anyhow. More useful down the line for a few more things, although I still don't like em for clap..

    Bing

  2. Scott | Aug 30, 2009 07:32pm | #2

    This gets debated here every year or so.... you'll find various threads in the archives. IIRC, it's pretty much an even split. Some prefer to hand nail, some use staples.

    Scott.

  3. Piffin | Aug 30, 2009 08:16pm | #3

    Depth setting with either is the most critical issue. I hate staples, but I know guys who can do an acceptable staple job and others who can ruin th ejob with nails.

    If you have ever had to patch something done with staples, you would not even consider them.

     

     

    Welcome to the
    Taunton University of
    Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
     where ...
    Excellence is its own reward!

  4. ms | Aug 31, 2009 01:52am | #4

    I hand nail with ss ring shank. If you want to speed up the job for claps get Bear clips from Harvey Industries. It's the only product I've ever purchased from them and they really allow you to make up time. Once you've leveled the first course they allow for a consistent 1 1/4 overlap all the way through.
    Mark

    1. andybuildz | Aug 31, 2009 02:31am | #5

      For me I find SS overkill if the siding is blind nailedView Image

      The Woodshed Tavern Backroom

      The Topics Too Hot For Taunton's Breaktime Forum Tavern

      1. ms | Aug 31, 2009 03:37pm | #6

        Hey Andy,
        I agree, it just seems easier not to have both galvy & ss nails on site. Mark

        1. andybuildz | Aug 31, 2009 03:45pm | #7

          My reason was b/c SS is a small fortune that you don't need to spend if the nail head is being covered by another course of shingles.
          If one is paronoid you can always used dbl dipped galvies for your gun. My supplier sells single and dbl dipped galvies for my Max guns.I also hate how SS looks when exposed on a siding thats not going to be stained or painted. Looks gawd awful. Looks like a million little mirrors on your house.Really depends on your location as to wheter or not it's mandatory to use SS nails.View Image

          The Woodshed Tavern Backroom

          The Topics Too Hot For Taunton's Breaktime Forum Tavern

          1. User avater
            Dreamcatcher | Sep 01, 2009 01:59pm | #8

            For the most part I agree with you, Andy. I would [usually] rather not see nails in siding. If a customer doesn't specifically ask and the reveal isn't too drastic then I hide nails. Occasionally I will recommend that nails are exposed, such as in rustic cabin situations where the look of exposed fasteners fits the style of the house. On some historic remods I will even use exposed cut nails - can't use SS there!As far as the shingle siding goes...I use staples. Usually I use 1/2" crown staples but lately I have been using 1/4" crown staples. The 1/4 gun is lighter, the staples are cheaper, they seem to hold just as well as 1/2" staples, and any necessary face staples are less noticeable. Why should I care how difficult they are to remove. Removing a single shingle is easy with a MultiMaster anyway. One time I had to shingle a garage gable and had forgot to bring my stapler. The GC lent didn't have a stapler but lent me a roofing nailer (a Porter Cable). What a PITA that was. The nails split about 1/3 of the shingles I tried to install. Adjusting the depth either put the nails right through the shingle or I had to finish nailing by hand. I would never use a nail gun to install cedar shingles again.If the OP is more of a framer type he should get a 1/2" stapler since it makes plywood install much easier. If he does mostly trim then he should get a 1/4" stapler as there are so many interior and exterior trim applications to use it for. Either way, he'll wonder why he didn't have one sooner.DC

          2. andybuildz | Sep 01, 2009 02:36pm | #9

            My MAX side wall gun is the lightest out there and durable. Lightest gun I own.View Image

            The Woodshed Tavern Backroom

            The Topics Too Hot For Taunton's Breaktime Forum Tavern

          3. User avater
            Dreamcatcher | Sep 03, 2009 04:39pm | #10

            How many guns do you own?Seems like a "sidewall gun" would be rather limited.Might be great if I just did siding. I looked at a MAX siding nailer that was 4.9 lbs. w/o nails.I have over a dozen air guns... the 1/4" stapler that I recommended is 2.5 lbs., one of my lightest guns, even lighter than my brad nailer (3.1 lbs) but only slightly heavier than my pin nailer (2.3 lbs). 1/2" stapler [actually 7/16"] is 5.1 lbs. but seems to me much more versatile than a sidewall gun.DC

          4. Piffin | Sep 03, 2009 04:59pm | #11

            " I would never use a nail gun to install cedar shingles again."Nothing wrng with it if you use the right tool and nails. Roofing nails should never be used on cedars, whether from a gun or by hand. 

             

            Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

          5. User avater
            Dreamcatcher | Sep 03, 2009 05:42pm | #12

            Why not use roofing nails?

          6. User avater
            Dam_inspector | Sep 03, 2009 07:28pm | #13

            <<<Why not use roofing nails?>>>They split a third of your shingles.

          7. Bing187 | Sep 03, 2009 10:02pm | #14

            Gauge of roofers much too wide for a cedar shingle. Thus=splits

            Stainless ring shank, Galvy box nails, staples all have much thinner wire.

            Bing

          8. Piffin | Sep 04, 2009 12:44am | #15

            Because the shanks are too large and they split cedars. 

             

            Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

          9. User avater
            Dreamcatcher | Sep 04, 2009 01:00am | #17

            "Because the shanks are too large and they split cedars."unless you pre-drill them.I'll just stick to staples.DC

      2. ronbudgell | Sep 04, 2009 12:53am | #16

        If stapling, then SS is essential. The galvanizing on staples is just about enough to keep them from rusting in the box in the store. Most of the time.

        I'd bet a staple job with standard or galv wire wouldn't last ten years in a damp climate.

        Ron

        1. andybuildz | Sep 04, 2009 01:02am | #18

          I'd never use staples...but thats just me. Just call me ol' fashioned : )
          On blind nailing like I said b/4 in most conditions I'd just go galvies or dbl dipped galvies.View Image

          The Woodshed Tavern Backroom

          The Topics Too Hot For Taunton's Breaktime Forum Tavern

        2. Piffin | Sep 04, 2009 01:04am | #19

          I'll take that bet.Wanna see pictures tomorow? One block from this job I am on there is a house I renovated in 98 and the cedars were stapled with galvies. It would be about 120 yards from high tide either east or west. That salt air would make it a humid place, right? 

           

          Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

          1. Scott | Sep 04, 2009 08:15am | #20

            >>>One block from this job I am on there is a house I renovated in 98 and the cedars were stapled with galvies.Good to know, thanks. I was wondering if we needed SS (and we're 75 miles from salt water). Apparently not.Scott.

          2. ronbudgell | Sep 04, 2009 12:45pm | #21

            Piffin,

            OK, then, you win that one, How about fifteen years?

            Do you know what kind of shape your staples are in?

            I know that common galv nails will last about a century. Then there isn't much metal left. Staples have a lot less metal to start with.

            Ron

          3. Piffin | Sep 04, 2009 02:40pm | #22

            You are right. The staples will not last as long as nails. I prefer to hand nail with hot dipped galvies myself, and I know that electroplates will start to show some rust pretty quickly.On a roof much better to use SS either, but sidewalls just don't see that much moisture once installed. I will try to sneak a peak at that job today for reference and my own knowledge.The crew instaling them had to talk hard to get me to allow them, and I was over their shoulder like a hawk making sure they didn't bruise the wood with crowns. IMO, that is the bad part of staples on cedars - they set too much air pressure or depth and fracture the wood with the crowns from trying to work too fast.
            The narrow crows models are worse at that. This job was done with wide crowns 

             

            Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!

  5. Unsworth | Sep 04, 2009 11:38pm | #23

    I did a cedar siding job using the Hitachi NV75AG Utility coil nailer. Can shoot both siding nails and framing nails, plus it has a depth adjuster. I would recommend it, and its a lot more versatile than a stapler or straight siding nailer. I used stainless steel ring shank siding nails.

    Check out the Cedar Shake and Shingle Bureau online for proper installation.

    If you never did this work hear are a few tips:

    Bid high- they take a while to install correctly.

    Woven corners take forever, even after you've done them awhile. Corner board on the outside corners and a stick on the inside corners will vastly speed up the process.

    Only us 30 lbs tar paper with plenty of staples!!! The tannin in cedar will degenerate most house wraps, giving it the water resistance of burlap. I don't trust the guy at building supply to know which one to use, besides 30 lbs tar paper is better. 15 lbs is too light, tears too easy, and is not as durable, especially while it sits on the house before the siding goes up (hence lots of staples).

    If you are painting it, are responsible for the paint, or are looking to avoid a huge headache, follow the proper painting schedule to the letter, or, again, the tannin will bleed through and look terrible.

    The Fine Home Building archive has a couple of good articles from years ago that were very helpful, they are long and have lots of details, unlike the USA Today format Fine Home Building has adopted today.

  6. greg_robb | Aug 08, 2015 03:00pm | #24

    Cedar Shingle nails

    I've used ss staples, galvnized #3 nails, and #2 blued nails. My cedar shingled house was built in 1912 and 2-1/2 miles from the San Francisco bay salt water. All the shingles were installed with #2 blues.

    After 80 years, I removed the shingles because they were split and very thin on the south side of the house. There was no building paper installed in 1912. There was no evidence of Any water drops hitting the doug fir 1 x 12 skip sheathing, even in the worst shingle deterioration area on the south west side–were the storms blow into.

    I can't find any #2 blues anymore. Using a staple gun is slower overall than holding/rolling several nails by hand. There is no setup/breakdown with hand nailing.

    If I lived at the beach in Florida, I'd consider stainless steel nails.

Log in or create an account to post a comment.

Sign up Log in

Become a member and get full access to FineHomebuilding.com

Video Shorts

Categories

  • Business
  • Code Questions
  • Construction Techniques
  • Energy, Heating & Insulation
  • General Discussion
  • Help/Work Wanted
  • Photo Gallery
  • Reader Classified
  • Tools for Home Building

Discussion Forum

Recent Posts and Replies

  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
  • |
View More Create Post

Up Next

Video Shorts

Featured Story

FHB Summit 2025 — Design, Build, Business

Join some of the most experienced and recognized building professionals for two days of presentations, panel discussions, networking, and more.

Featured Video

A Modern California Home Wrapped in Rockwool Insulation for Energy Efficiency and Fire Resistance

The designer and builder of the 2018 Fine Homebuilding House detail why they chose mineral-wool batts and high-density boards for all of their insulation needs.

Related Stories

  • Podcast Episode 692: Introduction to Trade Work, Embodied Carbon, and Envelope Improvements
  • FHB Podcast Segment: Embodied Greenhouse Gas Emissions and the Building Codes
  • Old Boots Learn New Tricks
  • Install Denim Insulation Like a Pro

Highlights

Fine Homebuilding All Access
Fine Homebuilding Podcast
Tool Tech
Plus, get an extra 20% off with code GIFT20

"I have learned so much thanks to the searchable articles on the FHB website. I can confidently say that I expect to be a life-long subscriber." - M.K.

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Fine Homebuilding Magazine

  • Issue 332 - July 2025
    • Custom Built-ins With Job-Site Tools
    • Fight House Fires Through Design
    • Making the Move to Multifamily
  • Issue 331 - June 2025
    • A More Resilient Roof
    • Tool Test: You Need a Drywall Sander
    • Ducted vs. Ductless Heat Pumps
  • Issue 330 - April/May 2025
    • Deck Details for Durability
    • FAQs on HPWHs
    • 10 Tips for a Long-Lasting Paint Job
  • Issue 329 - Feb/Mar 2025
    • Smart Foundation for a Small Addition
    • A Kominka Comes West
    • Making Small Kitchens Work
  • Issue 328 - Dec/Jan 2025
    • How a Pro Replaces Columns
    • Passive House 3.0
    • Tool Test: Compact Line Lasers

Fine Home Building

Newsletter Sign-up

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox.

  • Green Building Advisor

    Building science and energy efficiency advice, plus special offers, in your inbox.

  • Old House Journal

    Repair, renovation, and restoration tips, plus special offers, in your inbox.

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters

Follow

  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
  • Fine Homebuilding

    Dig into cutting-edge approaches and decades of proven solutions with total access to our experts and tradespeople.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X
    • LinkedIn
  • GBA Prime

    Get instant access to the latest developments in green building, research, and reports from the field.

    Start Free Trial Now
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
  • Old House Journal

    Learn how to restore, repair, update, and decorate your home.

    Subscribe Now
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • X

Membership & Magazine

  • Online Archive
  • Start Free Trial
  • Magazine Subscription
  • Magazine Renewal
  • Gift a Subscription
  • Customer Support
  • Privacy Preferences
  • About
  • Contact
  • Advertise
  • Careers
  • Terms of Use
  • Site Map
  • Do not sell or share my information
  • Privacy Policy
  • Accessibility
  • California Privacy Rights

© 2025 Active Interest Media. All rights reserved.

Fine Homebuilding receives a commission for items purchased through links on this site, including Amazon Associates and other affiliate advertising programs.

  • Home Group
  • Antique Trader
  • Arts & Crafts Homes
  • Bank Note Reporter
  • Cabin Life
  • Cuisine at Home
  • Fine Gardening
  • Fine Woodworking
  • Green Building Advisor
  • Garden Gate
  • Horticulture
  • Keep Craft Alive
  • Log Home Living
  • Military Trader/Vehicles
  • Numismatic News
  • Numismaster
  • Old Cars Weekly
  • Old House Journal
  • Period Homes
  • Popular Woodworking
  • Script
  • ShopNotes
  • Sports Collectors Digest
  • Threads
  • Timber Home Living
  • Traditional Building
  • Woodsmith
  • World Coin News
  • Writer's Digest
Active Interest Media logo
X
X
This is a dialog window which overlays the main content of the page. The modal window is a 'site map' of the most critical areas of the site. Pressing the Escape (ESC) button will close the modal and bring you back to where you were on the page.

Main Menu

  • How-To
  • Design
  • Tools & Materials
  • Video
  • Blogs
  • Forum
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Magazine
  • Members
  • FHB House

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Podcasts

  • FHB Podcast
  • ProTalk

Webinars

  • Upcoming and On-Demand

Popular Topics

  • Kitchens
  • Business
  • Bedrooms
  • Roofs
  • Architecture and Design
  • Green Building
  • Decks
  • Framing
  • Safety
  • Remodeling
  • Bathrooms
  • Windows
  • Tilework
  • Ceilings
  • HVAC

Magazine

  • Current Issue
  • Past Issues
  • Magazine Index
  • Subscribe
  • Online Archive
  • Author Guidelines

All Access

  • Member Home
  • Start Free Trial
  • Gift Membership

Online Learning

  • Courses
  • Project Guides
  • Reader Projects
  • Podcast

More

  • FHB Ambassadors
  • FHB House
  • Customer Support

Account

  • Log In
  • Join

Newsletter

Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox

Signing you up...

This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.
See all newsletters
See all newsletters

Follow

  • X
  • YouTube
  • instagram
  • facebook
  • pinterest
  • Tiktok

Join All Access

Become a member and get instant access to thousands of videos, how-tos, tool reviews, and design features.

Start Your Free Trial

Subscribe

FHB Magazine

Start your subscription today and save up to 70%

Subscribe

Enjoy unlimited access to Fine Homebuilding. Join Now

Already a member? Log in

We hope you’ve enjoyed your free articles. To keep reading, become a member today.

Get complete site access to expert advice, how-to videos, Code Check, and more, plus the print magazine.

Start your FREE trial

Already a member? Log in

Privacy Policy Update

We use cookies, pixels, script and other tracking technologies to analyze and improve our service, to improve and personalize content, and for advertising to you. We also share information about your use of our site with third-party social media, advertising and analytics partners. You can view our Privacy Policy here and our Terms of Use here.

Cookies

Analytics

These cookies help us track site metrics to improve our sites and provide a better user experience.

Advertising/Social Media

These cookies are used to serve advertisements aligned with your interests.

Essential

These cookies are required to provide basic functions like page navigation and access to secure areas of the website.

Delete My Data

Delete all cookies and associated data