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Framers $2.75/sqft
roofers $45/sq
gutters $2.25/ft spiked truck mounted extruded aluminum with warranty
Tile $2-5 mat /sqft
Tile lab $3-5/sqft
Hardwood floors M&L $5-6/sqft
plumbing ? 6-10,000 L&M includes fixtures
HVAC ? 3-9000 L&M
electric ? 5-8000 L&M includes fixtures
siding vinyl $75-100/sq lab
Asphalt drives $.85- 1.25.. mostly $1.00/sqft
clear
excavate
backfill
septic
trenching for utilities
Total site work package by builder or... pay $8-12,000
concrete full basement $10,000 8-12 $50-65/yd mat lab=matx2 of sub each phase to save... footer crew... wall crew... flat crew.. save $20-60/yard $1000 saved or more One source prices for custom.. $150/yd and up for lab and mat.
painting inside $3-5000 L&M
painting exterior $3-5000 L&M
carpets $15-25 mat $3-4 lab sqyd
frame mat includes windows, doors and finish trim $14/sqft
cabinets and counters $100 ft mat and lab
what else...
well $3500 -5000
landscape $2000
Homes that are selling... listed at 140-169,000 and options add $5-10,000 1900-2400 sqft with grass sprayed..some front shrubs, paver walk to door, and ashpalt drive... fully landscaped subdivision with nice lit and landscaped entry.
120 homes built in town... 500 in county... small city in center of wooded mountainous rural area... commuters... some second/vacation/retire to homes.
*Framers $3.50 - 4.00/sqft roofers $50/sq Tile $4-10 mat /sqft I've seen someat $9 each Tile lab $6/sqft Hardwood floors M&L $5-6/sqft, maybe, 8-10 finished plumbing ? HVAC ? my guy ballparks per bathroom/kitchen plus per room for hot baseboard 30-40,000 electric ? 5-8000 L&M includes fixtures sounds good siding cedars$?600L&M/sq excavate & backfill $10,000 septic $20,000 Concrete 100/yd mat painting inside $8000 L&M painting exterior $3-5000 L&M for trim only carpets $15-25 mat $3-4 lab sqyd Dang, are carpetlayers still working that cheap? cabinets and counters $250-350ft mat and lab what else... well $2500 landscape $2000 -10,000This is on an island where skilled help is in short supply, as is housing for same. The wealthy snap up any available housing quickly. Transportation for L&M adds considerably to costs. Ave pay to basic carpenter is $20-24/hrand transportation time one way.slowed down slightly this winter.
*Thanks piffin... Where is this?near the stream looking for more from other builders,aj
*Islesboro, Maine, Penobscot Bay near Camden ME
*Kansas City, Missouri framers $6 to $7 per foot on a home 1400 and up. If you get into a cut up roof, you can get more. Out in Johnson County (one of the richest counties in america) framers are getting up to $10 per foot. High demand and few QUALITY framing crews. You can get a crew for $4 to $5 but you dont want them. Mike
*Framing includes what?Dry-inWindows and dorrs?
*Framers.... wood frame... windows and doors.. and felt on roof... So like the bank payment wants it... It can be locked up and weathertite.near the stream,ajno snow... sunny 55 degrees.
*We live in poor country. I hang my head .
*cabinets and counters...$100...how about we add a 'decade' parameter? What decade do you live in? Even in my back woods, end of the earth locale, a hundred gets you....nada, or as good as. Postform counters are 10 or 12, plus install, plus tax.
*We build in Western Montana;excavation - $4000 to $6000septic system - $2500 to $3500 completewell - $20 per ftunderground line, pump, pressure tank - $1800concrete (formwork) - $175 per yard, L&Mconcrete (flatwork) - $1.80 per sq ft (no prepwork), L&Mframers - $6 to $7 per sq ftroofers - $35 to $50 per squareguttering - $2.25 per LF including downspoutsplumbing - $500 per fixture plus permit (basic, no extras)HVAC - $3000 to $5000 (central heat, no AC)electric - $1.90 to $2.00 per sq ftinsulators - .50 to .70 sq ft L&Msheetrockers - floor sq. ft x 4 x .75 (L&M for hang, tape, texture)paint - complete interior, trim on exterior $3.00 per floor sq.ft. (more for lots of stain & laquer)carpet, vinyl - $3.00 per sq ft L&Mtile - $3 to $6 per sq fttile labor - $ 5 to $7 per sq fttile shower - $1800 to $2000cabinets - $115 to $120 per LF (cabs, tops, complete install)asphalt driveway - $1 per sq ftlandscaping - varies wildly average around $5000average house sale price in our county - $135,000most sell between $115,000 and $150,000average building lot - $35,000 to $40,000average pay for journeyman carp - $18 to $22 per hour
*Thanks Ray for particapating... questions.. plumbing.. are the fixtures extra along with hot water tank? Where would these items be in your line item estimate... also.. electric fixtures like lights.near the stream,aj
*I just finished a very modest kitchen where the cabinet run cost me every bit of 200/ft with contertops rollformed, L&M.$100must be HDcheepo's stand back and throw'min with eyes closed call it goodenuf fer the gurls I go with OK
*100 is wrong probably... I put out the numbers so as to start getting some real numbers back... I think we all will learn a bit from this thread... Hopefully someday it is 400 posts long as it is one of all of ours weakest areas...That is... knowing the numbers that are out there.near the stream,ajKeep em coming all...
*> 100 is wrong probably... I put out the numbers so as to start getting some real numbers back...ROFLMAO!!Rich Beckman
*I've learnt already!
*aj....The plumbing fixtures and water heater are included in the $500 per fixture price. Kitchen sink = one fixture; each lavatory sink = one fixture (yes, a double sink vanity is 2 fixtures); each toilet = one fixture; each tub/shower = one fixture; washing machine box = one fixture; water heater = one fixture; etc. Obviously these are basic builders line fixtures - chrome Moen single lever faucets, Kohler "Heartland" white cast iron self rimming kitchen sink with sprayer, Mansfield 309 white china lavs, Kohler fiberglass tub/shower, Mansfield white toilets, Bradford-White or AO Smith natural gas or electric water heater (propane extra). A garbage disposal adds about $150. Exterior hose bibs add $100 each.I did neglect to include light fixtures in the line item estimates. Light fixtures and bulbs are not included in the electricians cost. His price does include installing the light fixtures, but not fixture cost. Since lighting fixtures are largely a matter of taste, I usually give the client a lighting allowance. Average range is from $1000 to $1200. Clients are welcome to spend more with use of a change order.Also, I would like to respond to Piffins remark that the cabinets must be Home Depots cheapest junk with post-formed countertops, etc. Piffin, just because you can't buy cabinets at that price doesn't mean we can't. We buy our cabinets directly from the local cabinet shops that build them in their shop. These are not pre-built boxes. The cabinet shops around here are all competitively priced. They can build to fit your kitchen dimensions and are not constrained to the 3" rule. Their builders line cabinets are nice looking cabinets, obviously not solid cherry with 2 miles of crown mold, but nice. They build plastic laminate tops with wood trim on the front and on the backsplash. Of course, you can upgrade to Corian or granite with a corresponding price hike, but most clients choose not to. These shops install all their own cabinets and tops, cut holes for the sinks, etc. I think you need to think twice before automatically catagorizing us as some "Home Cheepo Hacks" just because we don't happen to fit into your price expectations. That remark was uncalled for.Ray
*Rich... Easy... Every kitchen I have been involved with came from a kitchen showroom priced by allowance. What I think would be useful to all of us is a quick rule of thumb for any particular part of a home.On season...I am a tennis court builder. The rest of the year, I still enjoy working on new homes and remodelling...and more so additions. My next major project... 30sq of Certainteed fibercement siding... adding 3 dormers, grand entry. Then next year back to put in their new kitchen. Seems every off season they book me for a major portion of the time I have available.So... back to the easy... Please join the numbers game Rich. I'm sure your quick rules of thumb would be a great addition to this thread.near the stream,aj
*I don't price by the foot (and I'm only talking cabinets here)....there be dragons. But I do go back and do the guzzintas by the foot and lots of other ways. I was talking to a local designer about a job, a while back...he moved back here from central Canada, where I come from....he was using $350-400 Cdn. a foot, for nothing special bases and uppers, no countertops,residential and commercial as a rule of thumb, and trying to dial it in for hereabouts. I'd have to go back into the files, but that's my low end.I am (was, kinda still are)...totally custom, lots of gadgets usually requested, not high production, and I do lots of other things besides kitchens, but, I think my prices are low. I run into lots of small custom guys on the cabinetmaker forums talking about $500-650 US being about average for them, some give numbers a lot higher.I don't know how someone could do it for less than 200-250 US a foot, no frills.
*I'm taking it all back, too many variables to give a per foot price for cabinets for me. Interested to hear more prices though.
*I agree Adrian. I use per foot for advance budget estimating only and compare back after when job costing. Options and finishes really crank the cost up!
*Aj: I can't contribute too much but here in Illinois around the Champaign/Bloomington area........steady growthtile setting $3-5 footblock laying $1 to $1.25 blockbrick laying $6-700 per thousandsiding wood or vinyl $50 to $60 a squaretrim work...doors/cabinets $2-$3 square foothardwood flooring nailed down $3 square foothardwood floor sanded/finished $3 square footthree tab shingles up to 8/12 $30-$50 squarebackhoe with operator $65 an hourgutters/downspouts $1.75 to $2.00 footconcrete/flat work $2.50 to $3 sq. ftstairs..........................priceless :)
* DavidP "Drywall hanging premadonnas..." 2/2/02 12:45amsome Drywall costs...near the stream,ajStan... come on now... tell us straight stock stair and railing costs and a few basic landing and curve stair costs...
*Stan,Wood siding is twice or more the cost of vinyl labor and materials both being more around here... that number sounds fishy to me or a real deal for GCs.near the stream,aj
*Aj: serious, I added on to my stairshop, and was too busy to put the siding on. I had a guy come out that normally puts on vinly. He told me he would install the cedar siding for the same price. Maybe he was hungry for work? AJ---I am a straight shooter, and if I am kidding you will know it.
*Aj: I hate to pigeon hole myself on stair prices. There are so many variables. I have built two step stoops for $100 to a stairway that was $138,000However----basic 90 degree curved stairway--oak treads, poplar skirts and risers, paint grade balusters---cheapest $10000 installed------------average $12- $14000 installed-------freestanding $20000 plus------ellipticals $18-20000
*Well I come across these deals that others get all the time and it urks me that I am not employing them. Like the trim guy that works weekends for $10/cash.. and my friends place where he got the boiler service guy to come in on a weekend and build the whole manifold system and do the start up for $200 plus a tool. Not only are these guys less, they are like 1/10th the cost of a true business.Near the deals and steels...ajA tennis court with a nice fence will run around $30,000, but another friend built a scabbed together quicky one for around $10,000... To me, it looks like $10,000 although I put a finish on it for him that at least makes him think it's the greatest thing.
*Thanks Stan... I build Oak tread straights with painted risers and closed stringers... installed... $2000 with the railing mounted to the wall. Landings would add close to $1000.near the stream,aj
*Stan,You know your business but it seems to me that you are selling curved and elliptical work too cheap. I tell my customers that a curve will cost about three times as much as straight, as a general rule. Now maybe that's because I don't do as much of it so you can likely do the same work for less money but there are darn few craftsmen who can do such work well. The scarcity of skills help hold the price up.BTW that must've been a learning experience for your siding guy. He'll charge more next time.
*Piffin...What do you charge for my proposed stairs above. I may have to change the figures to $3000 and $4000?near the stream,aj
*Its important to list what average houses sell for in your area. Within twenty miles surrounding me the houses sell anywhere from $200 to 1.5 mil. Thats average. In my hood houses average at about $850,000.Most peole around here call contractors from the other end of the island where they get cheap prices but not very high standards in the workmanship. Makes it rough on me cause most people are penny pinchers and are happy to get things done cheap in spite of what they end up having to deal with. Plumbers around here get more then doctors. Shoulda been a plumber but it bores me. They get average of $700 a fixture and thats just labor. Thats AVERAGE!Rockers get about $1.10. Roofers....$50 L&M on regular strip 15 year shingles....Tile goes for about $5 labor depending on the job....duh. Demo guys?....Don't even wanna tell you what they get...OMG.For ME plumbers are the hardest to deal with. Wuts wit dat?????? Why do they get so much money? Had a "friend" who is a plumber tell me yesterday he gets a thou a fixture...labor......and he's turning away work. Anyway list where you're from and prices of average home sales.Andy in New Yawk
*Andy... one word sums up NYC... Unions.Plumbers in Westchester had the same huge attitude, huge money, will come if I like you thing going. And Italian plumbers... Yo Vinnie... Should we charge this upstate punk double and tell em we're doin him a favor just to be on his site? Naw... charge em triple and we 'll go fishin next week up in the Adirondacks.near the stream,aj
*Pffin: I am told that I am expensive in my area. I feel that I am making a good living at it, my wife does not have to work outside the home, but she does help me on occasion.There are several stair hatcheries in Chicago that everyone is aware of in my area. I am more expensive than them.I only mentioned my basic stair prices. I am not shy to ask much more on more custom stairs. I did one last year that only took three months to build, and I could have honestly taken off the rest of the year.I turn down several stairs a year because of being so busy, but also lose several stairs because I am too high. I dont know what area you are in, but there are not a whole lot of million dollar plus homes going up. Mainly 500,000 to 750,000.
*Stan, Prices of getting stairs neweled balustered and all the trimmings are so much I had to do it myself which I HATE doing. Its one of those trades where theres next to no room for error which is why you guys can get so much. I finished up the job with valutes, goosenecks and the whole shabbang and I have to say it looks great and have gotten mega compliments on them but if I had to charge someone a fair price I'd loose my shirt. The prices I got to do them were around four grand....eeeeee...Dats New Yawk 4 ya!!! So even in the two and a half weeks it took me I'd say I made out pretty OK. You can see the stairs on my site http://WWW.CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM There aren't any finished pix but I'll have them on my site soon. Used a red mahogany and three coats of an Amber Shellac. I have a lot of respect for you guys. Unlike I do for plumbers.Be well, Andy
*one and Stan, I got to thinking after that post, I was comparing the 20K eliptical to Stans 10K straight and coming up with 30K for the curved.Actually 20K sounds about right for the curved or elliptical without a lot of high detail but the 10K basic sounds high. I've done a few (Not speciallizing so I'm not as fast maybe) straight and angled with either angle or winder at about 6-7K, couple of simple back service stair at about 3K, wall on both sides for handrail mounting, few or no ballusters.I did sub out to a boat builder (he was used to working with intricate carvings and turns) a custom flight that was very special custom classic work that came out to around 75K
*piffin: That 10k basic was a curved stairway--90 degrees. Very basic, and simple.
*Hardwood floors-$1.70 to install, 1.90 to sand and 3 coat poly, flooring material on top of thisStairs- I'm in the middle of doing two sets, one to the basement. Upper stairs- open 3x12 ash stringers, 1 3/4"x 12 treads, landing with 2 winders, simple rectangular ash balusters w/ ash railing Basement stairs- closed stringer, 5/4 ash treads, birch ply risers, one flat landing, rail on wall.Materials- $1000 for planed and jointed ashLabor- $4200 and less than $200 to goMy estimate was $6000
*Could you guys tell where you are from when giving the numbers. Just interested if it is a big city small city, rural etc. I am going to have Lars come here with some numbers as soon as he can get three bids done. This thread has been a great help. Thanks for starting it. By the way we are in Western NC a very rural area.
*Orange Co. Central NCBoy howdy, rules of thumb for pricing? Septic $2500-$300002000sq' house- cabinets $6000-$40000Tile- Labor & materials $9-$25Schelling, where do you work? I just bid a set like the ash one you describe $1500 labor, and that's very good money for the 3 days(with a helper) it will take.Same stairs carpeted $980 laborBright trim- 3x more than paintedWe never give square' trim prices, but do like to know...Just bid on 3368sq'heated came to $4.63sq'and a 2931sq' for $4.96sq'. Both a mixture of bright work and paint...
*Essex Co. Northern NYBilly- It took me two days just to make the 2" treads and the 3" stringers along with putting a coat of varnish on them. The upper stairs alone were $1500 in labor with the railing being about the same. But then again I'm not that fast.
*Excellent!I don't have time to post it all right now-later.this is good Jack.great topic
*I'll just post a cost sheet. Tomorrow- it's on a different computer which is being refitted... thought I would have it back tonight but no dice.
*I'm getting 12-15/sq foot to frame to shell post and beam. Labor only to frame, side it in cedar t+g, hang windows, ext. doors, and felt it off to dry it in
*Dallas, Texas.High-end market.$15.00 sqft. trim labor and up, and I mean up.Basic custom drawn cabinets at $800 (and up) a foot M&L installed (uppers and lowers together)- stain grade with raised panel doors no tops no finish or decorative hardware.Depending on design......it can go passed your wildest dreams, and often does.We're not a good place to compare prices....sorry. And no, we're not making a killing. Most of what we build is just that complicated.Ed.
*:-)
*Schelling, making the parts the parts is a whole different animal. I'm not even close to fast, but I was talking about off the rack materials and only two wall rails. I think I would have bid a job similar to yours much higher...I just subbed out 4 sets of stairs. All have 1 x12 single piece skirts. 2 are carpeted w/ landings midway to make 180° turns. 1 is carpeted w/ 5 winders, 180°. 1 is finished pine treads/painted risers w/ already laid pine landing, 180° turn. No rails. A team of two guys are gonna do them all for $1400. That's total. They're good carpenters, too...rules of thumb for pricing?