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Discussion Forum

Skim coat with joint compound

emaxxman00 | Posted in General Discussion on September 10, 2008 06:17am

I have a foyer that had previously painted drywall and wallpaper.  I’ve removed the wallpaper…it actually came off cleanly with no stripper needed. 

The paint underneath is pretty rough.  I’d like to smooth it all off by applying a skim coat.  My plan was to use a lightweight joint compound (because that’s what I have).  The paint was a flat or eggshell finish…definitely not semi or full gloss.  The texture of the paint is pretty rough.

The walls will be primed and painted when done.

Plan was to scuff sand and then apply 2 thin coats of JC. 

Do I need to prime first?  Some other threads recommend priming but that was for walls with glossy finishes. 

Do I need to prime or seal the walls since the wall had wallpaper on it?  Considering how easy the paper came off … kids actually stripped it all off in less than 30 minutes with no issues whatsoever…I’m thinking residual glue is not an issue. 

Should I add anything to the joint compound to help it adhere…doesn’t seem to be a problem when taping joints but skim coating (I think.)

Should I thin the JC with water to help it spread more evenly?  Not really sure where this question is coming from but it popped in my head so I thought I would ask.

Thanks all in advance.

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Replies

  1. User avater
    Huck | Sep 10, 2008 06:26pm | #1

    Plan was to scuff sand and then apply 2 thin coats of JC. 

    thats the way I've always done it, and I've never had any problems.

    View Image “Good work costs much more than poor imitation or factory product” – Charles Greene
    CaliforniaRemodelingContractor.com
  2. sledgehammer | Sep 11, 2008 01:10am | #2

    Something was holding that paper on the wall, are you sure the rough paint isn't glue?

     

    I'd wash the wall with hot/warm water before doing anything.

  3. Zano | Sep 11, 2008 01:19am | #3

    Scrape off all the old wallpaper and then prime it with Bull-Eye or Zinnzler and then skim coat it twice. You must use the primers that I mentioned.

  4. User avater
    NickNukeEm | Sep 11, 2008 02:40am | #4

    Sand, prep walls (repairs, etc.) prime with Zinsser shellaq-based, skim coat.  Prime again after the skim coat.  Maybe the intial prime isn't needed, but I've never had a problem doing it this way.

    And I would use general purpose compound.  I look at it this way; the easy sand jc isn't suppose to be the base coat, which is essentially what you are doing for all the walls.  (Granted, it's on paint versus bare dw.)

    "I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."  Invictus, by Henley.

  5. Frankie | Sep 11, 2008 03:41am | #5

    I agree with Sledge - something was holding the wallpaper on. Thew rough finish is most likely glue. Take some hot soapy water and try to wash it off. It will require a minute or two to soften.

    Be sure to rinse the wall well after washing.n Then you can determine how smooth the surface is.

    Next, prime the walls as mentioned with a shellac based primer, or, since you have washed the glue off, prime with an alkyd/ oil based primer.

    Skim coat. Light weight jc will sand easier. This may not be a good thing. Do not sand between coats. I think it will require 3 coats - especially if you aren't used to it.

    Keep the coats thin. Adding more material is easier and A LOT less dusty than removing material.

    Primed skimmed walls with an alkyd/ oil based primer.

    DO NOT use a water based primer after skim coating. An alkyd (okay, and shellac) primer will actually soak into the compound while a water based primer will float on top - especially if you haven't wiped off the sanding dust well. Others here will, and have, argued that there are water based primers which will bond well but that is not my experience when the skimming is over a previously sealed material.

    Hope this helps.

    Frankie

    Flay your Suffolk bought-this-morning sole with organic hand-cracked pepper and blasted salt.

    Thrill each side for four minutes at torchmark haut. Interrogate a lemon.

    Embarrass any tough roots from the samphire. Then bamboozle till it's al dente with that certain je ne sais quoi.

    Arabella Weir as Minty Marchmont - Posh Nosh

    1. emaxxman00 | Sep 11, 2008 04:31am | #6

      Thanks all for your help. 

      I should've clarified...the rough texture was due to some weird faux texture paint that the previous owner had all over the house.  If I remember correctly, she mentioned that it was one of those Ralph Lauren sand textures.  I actually tore out all the drywall in the dining room because it was so bad and uneven.  The hallway isn't so bad so that's why I'm skimcoating.

      I've always used Zinnser's Bullseye 123 or their odorless oil primer.  123 over non-previously drywalled areas.  Odorless oil primer on previously drywalled areas.  I was planning on using the 123 since that is what Zinnser recommends for new drywall (and also thinking that the skim coated wall is like new drywall.)

      I'm curious...I oil prime over walls that used to have wallpaper on them.  I use oil so there's no chance of the water-based primer accidentally reactivating the glue.  Why do you recommend priming before skim coating?  Is it to give the skim coat something to adhere to?  Or is it to protect against the glue?

      Thanks all.

      1. User avater
        BillHartmann | Sep 11, 2008 04:42am | #7

        I have down about 2 dozen wallpaper removals. And when I am making minor replace don't prime.When the DW is baddly damaged I will prime and the sand. That is to lock in the loose fibers on the torn paper.Then skincoat.And I also use a primer sealer even if I did not skimcoat to sealing paste residue.I usually use SW Preprite primer sealer or Bullseye 123..
        .
        A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.

      2. Frankie | Sep 11, 2008 06:18am | #8

        A. Priming walls with shellac or oil based primer prior to skimming gives you insurance that the jc will stick. Cheap, easy and 100%.B. If you want to prime with Z-123 after skimming, go ahead. It is a water based primer. I stated this should not be done and why. Your walls, your choice. I have never had success with this route. Z recommends 123 over new drywall. This is NOT new drywall. You are skimming a non-porous surface.C. Your wall may be rough due to the texture of the previous paint. Cool. But this roughness only adds to the probability that the material (glue) used to adhere the wall paper to the walls is still stuck in the nooks and crannies. Why fight it?D. Bottom Line - you need to/ should prime - twice. You can use only shellac or only oil based primers or a shellac or oil base primer, prior to skimming, (due to residual glue, which will react with a water based primer) and the other primer after skimming. Why even think about bringing a third type of primer into the equation? I don't get it. Actually I don't get why you would even use two types of primers.That's my perspective. Some may question it, but I am sticking to it.Frankie

        Flay your Suffolk bought-this-morning sole with organic hand-cracked pepper and blasted salt.

        Thrill each side for four minutes at torchmark haut. Interrogate a lemon.

        Embarrass any tough roots from the samphire. Then bamboozle till it's al dente with that certain je ne sais quoi.

        Arabella Weir as Minty Marchmont - Posh Nosh

        1. User avater
          Huck | Sep 11, 2008 06:51am | #9

          Some may question it, but I am sticking to it.

          I question it.  I've skimmed painted walls with joint compound more times than I can count over the past 30 years of being in this business, and never, not ever, not once, ever had a callback or any problem with the compound sticking.  I rough-sand, skim with joint compound, let it dry, sand, skim with topping, and texture - then prime and paint.View Image “Good work costs much more than poor imitation or factory product” – Charles GreeneCaliforniaRemodelingContractor.com

          1. rasher | Sep 11, 2008 06:27pm | #10

            And how do you apply this skim coat joint compound? Do you thin it at all? I read somewhere somebody thinning the JC with water or PVA primer (can't remember which) and then applying with a roller with a thick roller cover.
            BTW: Not trying to start a D-Mix fight!!!
            Also: Anyone care to comment on the "Magic Trowel"?

          2. User avater
            Huck | Sep 11, 2008 06:55pm | #11

            And how do you apply this skim coat joint compound? Do you thin it at all?

            apply with a broad drywall finishing blade.  Thin a little if needed, and mix thoroughly, with a blade on a drill or a potato masher - just like always when using joint compound.View Image “Good work costs much more than poor imitation or factory product” – Charles GreeneCaliforniaRemodelingContractor.com

          3. DonCanDo | Sep 11, 2008 11:48pm | #13

            Anyone care to comment on the "Magic Trowel"?

            I bought one because it really seemed like it would make skim-coating easy.  The one time I tried to use it, I thinned the compound with water and applied it with a 12" knife.  Then I tried to use the magic trowel.  What I realized is that I didn't thin the compound nearly enough.  It needs to be so thin that it MUST be applied with a roller.

            That means that you need to pre-mix as much as you think you'll need and discard any excess.  Also, I imagine that rollering on a thin coat of compound will splatter quite a bit, but I haven't tried it so I can't be sure.

            I have skim-coated since: slap the mud on with a 6" knife and swipe with the 12".  Of course, it requires a bit of sanding, mostly to smooth over the ridges.  A second coat would have been necessary if I had been doing a high-visibility critical area, but the small areas I did came out fine.

            If I had to skim-coat an entire wall, I would be very tempted to just put up new drywall instead.

  6. BryanSayer | Sep 11, 2008 09:17pm | #12

    Does the joint compound say "Suitable for skim coating"? Some specifically say otherwise, as in "Not suitable for skim coating".

    I'd suggest using something designed for skim coating, like Diamond Veneer plaster, or even actual plaster.

  7. toolbear | Sep 12, 2008 12:49am | #14

    Do I need to prime first? Some other threads recommend priming but that was for walls with glossy finishes.

    @@@ Ran into this in my bathroom, years PB ago (pre breaktime). I did not prime and I wish I had known to do that. The skim coat has adhesion issues here and there. Hate to bitch up a nice job for want of some paint.

    Prime.

    The ToolBear

    "You can't save the Earth unless you are willing to make other people sacrifice." Dogbert

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