The bottom section of my freshly stained garage doors developed bubbles after a day with 3″ of rain. Why? How do I fix it?
Here’s all the facts that I suspect may help you solve my problem –
* This is my first house paint job, the doors were painted (“stained”) after spraying/brushing the 3 other sides of the house. and no other stained area bubbled EXCEPT FOR one trim piece next to the garage (new PVC 1×4 from Home Depot) that was painted with Glidden Endurance (their most expensive) latex exterior paint (it had been painted over a week ago)
* Behr Ultra Premium solid stain (bought last month) with water clean=up
* Sprayed w/ airless sprayer and NOT back brushed (I wanted the ultra smooth finish – I back brushed everything else on the house)
* Applied after 3 dry days with 2-3 dry days after application
* Applied about 5 light coats letting it dry to the touch (mostly) between coats – the can says only 2 coats (but I believe they are talking heavy coats)
* The temperature has probably been as low as 45 during some of these applications, but mostly it’s been in the 50-55 range
* The garage door is on the North East side of the house
* I only found one bubble above the bottom row of garage panels
* Hopefully the pictures help
Do I need to use paint instead of solid stain on the door? Or will back brushing and just 2 coats cure the problem? Should I scrape it down and then sand it first? Why would the paint on the PVC bubble – is that related?
Thanks
The pictures show
The Wood Loon
Acton, MA
Replies
The bottom section of my freshly stained garage doors developed bubbles after a day with 3" of rain. Why? How do I fix it?
Here's all the facts that I suspect may help you solve my problem -
* This is my first house paint job, the doors were painted ("stained") after spraying/brushing the 3 other sides of the house. and no other stained area bubbled EXCEPT FOR one trim piece next to the garage (new PVC 1x4 from Home Depot) that was painted with Glidden Endurance (their most expensive) latex exterior paint (it had been painted over a week ago)
* Behr Ultra Premium solid stain (bought last month) with water clean=up
* Sprayed w/ airless sprayer and NOT back brushed (I wanted the ultra smooth finish - I back brushed everything else on the house)
* Applied after 3 dry days with 2-3 dry days after application
* Applied about 5 light coats letting it dry to the touch (mostly) between coats - the can says only 2 coats (but I believe they are talking heavy coats)
* The temperature has probably been as low as 45 during some of these applications, but mostly it's been in the 50-55 range
* The garage door is on the North East side of the house
* I only found one bubble above the bottom row of garage panels
* Hopefully the pictures help
Do I need to use paint instead of solid stain on the door? Or will back brushing and just 2 coats cure the problem? Should I scrape it down and then sand it first? Why would the paint on the PVC bubble - is that related?
Thanks
The pictures show
The Wood Loon
Acton, MA
Your condition is called blistering.
Not sure it helps (probably not) but:Glidden = garbage
Behr = not much better
<sorry>
Temperature = not the problem
Adhesion was the problem - succeeding coats did not adhere to earlier coats - in other words the APPLICATION is likely the problem.
These were your application instructions:Do not use if temperature is below 40°F (4.5°C), above 90°F (32°C), or if rain is expected within 24 hours.Wood surfaces must be completely dry.No primer needed on most woods. However, Redwood, Cedar, Cypress and other “bleeding” woods contain water soluble extractives which may cause discoloration of white and pastel colors; therefore prime the above type woods with one coat of BEHR EXTERIOR WATER-BASED ACRYLIC LATEX PRIMER & SEALER NO. 436. See label for additionalinstructions.When working with more than one container of the same color, intermix to ensure color uniformity. Stir stain before and occasionally during application.Use a 3/8" nap roller, nylon/polyester brush, pad applicator or airless sprayer.Airless spray is recommended for experienced applicators only. Use a .015 to .017 tip. Thin with water at a rate of no more than 1/2 pint per gallon.Maintain a wet edge when applying. Always back-brush and apply product end to end or to board lengths to prevent lap marks.Over-application of stain will lead to surface failure including peeling and cracking. Avoid applying stain too heavily. Do not apply more than two coats.For optimum performance, coat all six sides of the wood.Spread rate is approximately 200-400 sq. ft. (23-37 m2) per gallon depending on surface texture, porosity and application method.
"Always back brush" oops.
"Avoid applying stain too heavily" ... "Do not apply more than two coats" oops.
"Over-application of stain will lead to surface failure" I guess so.
My advice? Scrape, sand, feather reprime (tinted) with a GOOD primer like Cabot Problem-Solver and finish with Benjamin Moore or Sherwin-Williams paint. No shortcuts or you will have paint failure over solid stain (without primer).
Or - just follow the manufacturer's instructions ...
Jeff
<eta> - "The original paint was a blue solid stain put on 18 years ago."
Any chance you applied a latex solid stain over an old oil-based stain without priming? If so there you go -
Edited 11/15/2009 9:27 pm ET by Jeff_Clarke
I think the problem is due to multiple coats applied before the previous coat was really dry. It may be that the lower panels were the ones that got hit by the sun which caused the moist paint underneath to form bubbles.I was not clear from your pictures if the blistering was between coats that you applied or if it was coming off the old paint or primer. If it is blistering between coats of stain that you applied, I think it must by an application problem, probably incomplete drying as I stated above. If it is not adhering to the old paint or primer, it may well be a prep problem, most likely a dirty or chalky surface, but possibly wax, oil, or something like a concrete sealer overspray onto the door.The fix won't be easy to make it look smooth. The unadhered or poorly adhered paint needs to be removed. Scraping will be faster but will leave a rough surface. Sanding will look better but won't be fun. Even old latex paint (or stain) is hard to sand and fairly fresh is even softer and gummier. If you go for sanding, plan to use a lot of sand paper.I just spray steel garage doors (one normal coat) but wooden doors, I always brush in. This isn't fine furniture. A complete coat that fills all the nooks and crannies for a longer paint film life is much more important that a few brush marks that one would expect on a wooden door any ways.
I think you are supposed to use 100% accrylic paint over PVC.
that looks to be like the top coat of paint reacted with what ever paint was under it...
had Behr paint do that to 30 some louvered doors...
did you prime/seal before the yur application???
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
I did not prime the doors because this is solid stain, not paint - right? I also didn't prime the PVC or the pre-primed pine boards where I used them because it isn't necessary? The primer that I did use on the rest of the trim was fresh Kilz premium stuff.The original paint was a blue solid stain put on 18 years ago.EUREKA! I just remembered that I did prime the lower row after I replaced the flat panels in that row about 6 months ago. Could this be the issue - using a solid stain over a primed surface?Doug
The Wood Loon
Acton, MA
if that's the issue yur more than likely gonna be taking all that off down to original surface..
what brand of stain did ya use???
at 6 months... WTB the primer failed...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
I've only had that problem (so early after painting) when I had used really crummy hardware store primer. That's why I always use a good quality primer that I've have had good experience with.
But I've never tried to paint at such low temps -- that could be a part of the problem.
Solid body stain is more related to a "thin" paint than a transparent stain.
But it has enough pigment in it that it will hide the color of what is under it.
Check the can, IIRC I believe that it calls out using a primer under certain conditions.
Clearly you had some reaction between the existing coating and the solid body stain.
After scraping off the bad, I would lightly sand it. More where needed to feather the paint edges.
Then prime it. Probably best with a bonding primer. They are stickier than average.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe