Am preparing to submit a proposal to carve a bathroom in a single story Sears house (walls are 2x on the flat, so they are 2″ thick, total, including the 1/4″ paneling on both sides.) The br will come from splitting a den into two rooms. (See floorplan – sorry for size)
The br is pretty run-of-the-mill. The question I have is: the clients have a stain glass window they would like to install on the interior partion dividing wall. What’s not shown on the floorplan are the two windows on the exterior wall (left on plan), so the hope is to get some natural light to shine thru the beautiful pane.
The size of the glass piece is 46″x62″, and due to a required drop ceiling, the window will be below the minimum code requirement for tempered glass.
So, my question is, after all that, how would you do this?
My first thought is to sandwich the pane between tempered glass. Is there any other option?
(The br side will have some sort of shade for privacy)
Although I tried to talk them out of it, the path is set and the window will be installed. I now need to determine how to install while complying with codes.
Thanks.
“I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul.” Invictus, by Henley.
Replies
The size of the glass piece is 46"x62", and due to a required drop ceiling, the window will be below the minimum code requirement for tempered glass.
What's the minimum sill height to avoid the tempered glass requirement? Also, maybe there'd be some sort of creative way to re-design the low drop ceiling.
... so the hope is to get some natural light to shine thru the beautiful pane....the br side will have some sort of shade for privacy...
Won't the shade pretty much kill the beauty of the art glass panel?
It's a stunning panel, and I can see why they want to use it, but it seems like there are some problems with the current location. Personally, I'd try to find a more suitable location for it, but I know how it is sometimes when people get stuck on an idea.... ;)
Edited 7/24/2007 7:49 pm ET by Ragnar17
Hazardous locations/glazing requirements in the IRC state that if the glass area is greater than 9 sq. ft., or within 18 inches of the floor, then some sort of safety glass/barrier is required. So I will be able to squeak by on the height (96" wall, minus 6" drop ceiling, minus 62" glass surface = 28" above floor, + or -) But the surface area is about 19 ft2.
Yeah, the practicality of this is low on the relative scale, but mine is not to reason why, mine is just to do it and pay my kid's tuition.
There is no where else in this small manufactured home to put it. He put the window up on eBay, but withdrew it when it didn't draw his minimum required.
Hey, they want the window in a bathroom, I'll put it there. I'm recommending a large Panasonic exhaust fan to try to minimize the condensation between panes, but I don't harbor much hope.
Thanks.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
Why not put it in the ceiling? Put in a skylight with a well down to the ceiling, then install the stained glass panel with optionally some kind of protective glass panel below in case it sags. That way, you bring in a lot of light into the room and it comes in through the stained glass.
Stained glass windows don't like being mounted horizontally. If a piece is to be horizontal, it'll need extra reinforcement built into the caming to keep it from sagging over time.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
I can't tell for sure what the design in the center is. Can the window be mounted with the long axis horizontal?
Rose in a vase. Afraid the vase needs to be vertical, although the idea first crossed my mind when they talked to me on the phone, until I saw the actual pane.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
Sorry...can't help you with the code issues, but I thought I'd mention that I have a similar situation, and have installed an old stained glass window that does bring light into the bathroom from the adjacent sunroom, and we enjoy it very much. On our dead end road in the woods, code issues were never very important. Good luck. Sue
Well, the box is not fun, so let's climb out of it a bit.
How about using the SG as a ceiling light? Ok, framing it into the drop ceiling will take finessing, but, you get cool light in the bath.
Ok, they really want light in the BR--any chance of a dormer? Or, a skylight well with the SG at the bottom?
Too huge for skylight well, not that they want a skylight anyway. And the guy who owns the window won't be using the bathroom, so the SG has to be viewable in the (new) computer room.
The box is suffocating.
At least there will be light at the end of the tunnel : )
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
One simple and cheap solution would be to frame the glass in a nice wood frame with some eye bolts in the top and then build a cased opening slightly larger than the piece and "temporarily" hang the piece in the opening from a couple of eye hooks. Unhook it and hang a piece of fabric in the hole on the day of the final inspection and have the owners sign a piece of paper saying that they understand that hanging glass that is not tempered within 18" of the floor or 24" of a doorway is a code violation and they do not hold you responsible for any injury that may result if they hang untempered glass in this opening. Then let them hang the frame you have made in the opening that you have made on the hooks you installed. So long as they put it there it is not your responsibility. ------------------
"You cannot work hard enough to make up for a sloppy estimate."
Interesting puzzle. I think what I'd do is install a clear tempered glass window, just larger inside the stops than the stained glass piece. Install the privacy shade from the ceiling in the br. Pass inspection. Hang the SG piece in front of the window, br side, from hooks in the header. It's hung "art", not a window, at that point.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Edited 7/25/2007 8:44 am ET by MikeHennessy
Interesting idea. I'll present that as an option for their decesion at the proposal meeting.
Thanks.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
No problem. Also see post # 10 regarding exceptions.
The reason for the tempered glass rule is to avoid large, sharp glass fragments if something happens to the window. With leaded glass, expecially like the one you are dealing with, dangers are minimized since the lead tends to hold the larger pieces in place and the fragments will not likely be large enough to pose the dangers that a normal window the same size would pose. Nothing is ever perfectly safe, but this one is pretty darn safe, if it's designed so the window can't accidently fall.
Still, I like the idea in another post of a liability waiver signed by the HO acknowledging that there are potential risks and that they choose to take those risks.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
Nick, double check the exceptions in your code. MA code has an exception for 'assemblies of leaded glass or faceted glass'.
A couple of thoughts on installing stained glass windows.
I was in England many years ago, and heard a discussion on preservation of the old windows. One of the worst things that could be done to the windows was to "double pane" them. That is, keep the stained glass mounted as if they were exposed to the outside (sealed, if you wish) and add a second pane of glass outside, also sealed.
As everybody seems to know, the space between the windows will accumulate moisture, and it will condense on the inside which will ultimately corrode/damage the stained glass. The solution is to remount the stained glass proud of the frame, allowing air to circulate.
Now as to your specific problem: I would install a window of the proper size in the wall, meeting all code requirements. I would then install the stained glass in front of the window, leaving air to circulate. If the code required tempered glass, I would consider adding a protective cover of (say) Lexan in front of the stained glass.
Bitter experience: I would mount the stained glass in such a way as to allow cleaning. It WILL get dirty.
Humm...good point about the sammie. Not to hijack, but unfortunately, that's what I just did with some old SG panels.However, I used felt strips for the outside weatherstripping, thinking that would allow the 3" space between the two panels to "breathe."Any thoughts?Todd
I don't really have any suggestions. Sorry.
But, if they start getting condensation on the windows, there is a problem somewhere.
Thanks, I'll keep my eye in it when the heating season rolls around.Todd
Thanks for all who responded. I just got off the phone with the building inspector, and he feels there should be no other precautions required as long as the window is greater than 18" off the floor and no other 'swinging' hazards are near.
Thanks again.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.