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So far I’ve only done two crown molding jobs, one was pine the other MDF. Now I’m looking at a job for a client and they have the Balmer VI molding (plastic foam stuff) to put in. I checked out their website for giggles and they are saying install it with mitered cuts on the inside corners as well.
Stupid me I’ve been putting this stuff in with coped inside corners which I thought was the correct way to do it. (that’s what I get for learning on the fly) I want to know which way do most of you do it. inside corners coped or mitered? If mitered is acceptable I can save a little time. if not and there are good reasons not to miter I will continue to cope because I want to give my clients the best installation possible.
Also any tips on putting in long lengths solo would be appreciated. right now I just prop/wedge a 2x towards the other end (with padding of course) to hold it until I can work my way down to it. kinda like a deadman.
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I've just helped one foam install.....but we mitered and glued. Didn't get to see it on that job....but I remember the guy saying he had prefit and glued whole zig-zags together and installed as a unit.
When I'm doing crown by myself.....I'll use the deadman too. I've even screwed 2x blocks on the wall and ceiling to make "pockets" to slip one end into......with a "shelf/ledger" 2x midwal along the wall to help hold it. If the walls are gonna get repainted....that's an easy way. Just a little "fast-n-final" and away ya go.
One tool I'm always considering buying is a B@D Workmate. Seems every other customer has one sitting around collecting dust....and I've even borrowed them to hold an upside down push broom to hold the long end.
An ad in JLC has something called Helping Hand...or something like that......for around $25...that is a retractable version of your 2x prop. Been thinking about that one too.
Remember....there's always hand pounder 8's. A few at the wall and ceiling line will hold pretty well too.....then just pull and caulk. Jeff
*With the foam I use miters for inside corners. Regular glues may hold the joint together...but the proprietary glues actually dissolve/melt the two pieces of foam so when you join them they co-mingle, then they re-cure/harden as one piece. It's a tough joint.
*Steve, Other than some need for expansion (check with manufacturer), I would do the exact same thing. How does it look when you cope it ? Sometimes certain profiles cannot be coped. You'll know this right away because coping will cause a void. Sounds like this isn't the case for you. I'll bet that the manufacturer is recommending coping for the amateurs who would install the product.
*Steve, as Mongo says, the proprietary glues melt the foam so mitering gives the required cross-sectional area(surface area) to give good bonding. As for wood crown, coping the joint gives the best fit and accomadates the wood movement best. Geoff
*Jeff, I bought a workmate last year and it's the ticket for a portable workbench. the walls were already painted, that's why the homeowner is having the crown put up. the painter didn't mask anything and couldn't cut in freehand for sh__. homeowner is major disgusted with the painter becuase they couldn't get them to come back and make good on a major botch job. my 6 year old could paint better than what I saw. pisses me off because this is the kind of crap that makes people distrustful of all of us.Mongo, manufacturer calls for polyeurathane glue for the joints. no brand specified just type.Tim, i I'll bet that the manufacturer is recommending coping for the amateurs who would install the product. don't you mean "isn't"?
*PL Premium would be my glue choice
*This reminds me.....didn't I see an artical in FHb or JLC about this stuff? I seem to remember a pic of two guys lifting the crown for a small room...already glued up......4 pieces...or sides, if ya will.......Jeff
*PL brand is pretty much what I always use. the stuff hasn't let me down yet.
*Jeff, that might work on the utility room but kitchen has the soffits built above the cabinets and has more corners in that room than carter has little liver pills. the living room is 21 x 14 so that kind eliminates that one too for the lift into place deal. too much flex possible there.
*I think it was FHb...they were usng good sized crown, on maybe a coffered ceiling? Same thing...I remember them pre-glueing the squares of molding on the floor, then installing the cures squares of crown in the ceiling.
*Stupid DIY question. I thought polyurethane glue was something liquid, like Gorilla Glue. Piffin's recommending "PL Premium" adhesive, which I understood to be similar to (and maybe a better brand than) Liquid Nails. Thicker, applied from a caulk gun, let's call it a gel - not liquid, not solid. So which is the one Balmer's site is calling for, as per Steve? Or are they both kinda related, and hence both referred to as polyurethane glues, except one air dries, one water cures?
*Hey Sean how ya doin? yeah PL is actually a polyurethane caulk type adhesive. I'm no expert but for this application the more viscous product is better. perhaps some of the others could explain things better. in my humble opinion PL is superior to liquid nails.
*At least their tube looks fancier.
*I don't know if the PL tube stuff is cured BY moisture or if it just tolerates it. The Liquid Gorilla foams out to fill voids but is not a solid creamy fill. It needs moisture to cure.
*is pl premium difficult to clean up?brian
*VERY!Wear surgical gloves or expect it to wear off after about three days.I keep an acetone rag handy but you need to hit it quick or forget it.
*i figured, since it's poly.think i'll try pl premium to bond vanity top to base cab. brian
*that's the job for 100% silicone. Jeff
*I would use silicone or Geoseal for that one
*That FHB article on foam crown showed the inside mitre joint failing using a non-proprietary glue (it may have been PL premium).
*FYpon recommends that you use their own glue exclusively but I was told at the factory that if I ever got in a pinch, the PL Premium would do. So I tried some also. I can't tell the difference. I think it's the same glue in a different label. And I do like it. We've been using it for joints in wood gutters too.
*Roger, from the information I have balmer doesn't have a proprietary glue. they just recommend using poyurethane adhesive nothing more.
*BTW, I didn't get the job. the owner wants somebody cheap. (funny that's what got her the crappy paint job she's trying to cover with the molding) some people never learn.
*isome people never learn. but see what you've learned in the processand U won't need to learn what a paion she could've been
*Steve coping or mitering depends on a couple of things.Is the job paint grade or stain grade, are the corners square, is the material good stock or crap like the mdf ar that foam stuff. Personally I cope all inside corners when using wood which incidentally is all I would use
*Julian, There are some comp[lex crown moldings that cannot be coped because of the profile or because foam won't let you work a feather edge. Other than that, you are right that a coped joint is the best way to go.
*I just did another crown job monday. repeat client, they bought the MDF stuff, painted it and had me install it. although I hate the way MDF is like trying to hold up a rubber band (I use the deadman thing but the stuff is so flexible it's still all over the place) but I must admit I like the way I can fine tune the miters with my block plane. shaves off like paper and I can fit the miters REAL tight.