Alright Tim, you asked for pics of the current frame… here’s a few. It’s not very sexy yet, but I think the farmer’s porches we are starting tomorrow will dress it up nicely. It will run across the front, down the left side, and it’s roof will tie in with the roof of the four season porch on the back. The porch is about 8′ and the four season room is 10′ so that will leave me with a bastard hip on one corner to mix things up a bit.
I’ll take some pics of the inside tomorrow if I don’t space out. It’s hiding a 24″ x 34′ quadruple ridge beam in there and a couple cool ceilings. Nothing of the calibur of the ceilings in your last article, but different none the less.
The trim has been the most interesting part of the frame. That is 5 1/2″ crown that runs down the rakes, across all the fascia and wraps around the 44″ returns.
I’ll be building out the columns for the farmer’s porch to match the cornerboard detail. 15 of them IIRC. Should be a nice change of pace.
Like I said… it’s not very sexy, so I’ll include some shots of the us using the machine today…. that’s always sexy!!
Oh yeah…. and don’t ask about the Tyvek around the windows…. sometimes I just do what I’m told cuz it ain’t worth the argument. FWIW, this is the house that started with the oversized fountation.
I’ll get some shots of the porches as they progress. I’m happy to have finished the main house as the mechanicals will be starting later this week…. I hate tripping over other subs! 😉
Replies
Brian,
Nice work. I can't believe how clean the framing always looks on your sites. That man box looks pretty slick. Are you in love? Every time I avoid hauling a heavy window, or we sheathe a gable way high in the air, I fall in love all over again :-)
Your trim looks really good. You are my argument that framers CAN do trim :-) Nice work and you would never know the foundation was all over the place :-)
Glad you like the trim, I kinda enjoy it sometimes. It's a good change of pace. You can't see it too well in the pictures, but I ran a router with a cove bit down the 1x8 rakes as well as the 1x3 shadow. It give it a couple extra shadow lines and looks really cool without adding the expense of more molding. I'll try and get a close up tomorrow.
Yeah, I gotta agree.... the work platform is heaven sent. I love work tools for the forklift.... always money well spent.
is the platform a custom job ?
carpenter in transition
Nope. It's built by ForkMate. United Rentals is a national company and is a distributer of their products, that's where I got mine. They have a larger 14' platform as well as an 8'er that doesn't swivel like mine.
I chose the swivel platform because we get some pretty tight sites sometimes where I can't get the machine in head on. I think it's a pretty slick solution. It ran me about $2800 including freight and jobsite delivery.
You are my argument that framers CAN do trim
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. ;-) Around here trim carpenters work outside, just as much as inside(just pretend for a minute vinyl siding doesn't exist).
Re: "You are my argument that framers CAN do trim "From what I have seen a lot of sites need to find framers who can do Framing.
You kiddin' me?
You're seriously gonna jump into a photo thread started by a framer, add nothing positive to the thread, bash framers, and leave?
Maybe you can guide me to the photo thread of your work.... that way I can vent about electricians who are too lazy to clean up after themselves or constantly blow up schedules because they take on more work than they can handle but are too greedy to say no. Sound fair?
C'mon man... save it for another thread.
Edited 8/19/2005 6:35 am ET by dieselpig
Care to elaborate on your post?
I was just busting stones. Your pics look just as good as anything I could do. Around here the most exterior trim framers do is vinyl siding, and they struggle with that.
Hi Tim. We finally wrapped up that frame at noon time on Friday. 6 weeks to frame the house and 3 weeks to build the porches. Nuts, huh? We didn't break any speed records on this one, but it's a great frame, I made good money, and the builder is phsyched. Can't ask for much more than that, right? I gave my guys each a $500 bonus for this frame because they did such a great job for me.
Anyway, the columns took me about 2 hrs each and there's 11 of them. I'll bet a real trim guy coulda knocked em out in about 45 minutes or less, but I'm barely a framer never mind a trim guy! LOL. We also made the railing stock ourselves and all the mahoghany decking was predrilled and screwed down with SS trim head screws. Every screw is exactly 1" from the edge of the plank and the rows of trim heads are dead on straight. I love it!
Great work. Great pictures. I really like the one of the scaffold. I mean how often is it that you see that kind of scaffold. Man, blue too! Usually around here it is plain old yellow, but blue! And the planks, wow! Surprised they weren't stained. LOL. Nice work my friend. DanT
Glad you like the staging. I thought you might. I'll be sure and ask the mason where he got it for you.
Dink. ;)
Hey Diesel, in the last post to Dan T, you closed with "Dink". Does that word have any special meaning to you? Reason I ask is that a guy I know in VA goes by the name Dink. He swears it means something in German, like "little one", but I couldn't find anything in the German-English dictionary. I think mommy and daddy were into the Dinkalacher beer one night and ...
Don
Naw... no special meaning. I just like it cuz it's a 'grey' word. Just enough bite to find it's mark.... but not quite a 'swear' so you can get away with it. ;)
"you dink"
"that's a dink move"
"way to go dink"
You can even pep it up a bit by adding 'wad' to the end. Nice move dinkwad.
See how versatile it is?
"Dip" works as well.=0)You dipwad.Hey, when are you going to send that picture again ?
Are we there yet ?
I'll find it and sent it soon Luka. Just got a full plate right now. I'm so tired right now that I can't take my boots off and I'm hungry enough to eat this keyboard. Off to the shower.
Cool !!Take your time. Don't stress about it.I was just worried that you weren't sending it because you didn't want to bother me or something. I'm kinda champing at the bit to get back at it again. LOL I was doing a bit at a time, and had gotten used to having it there to fill some time.
Are we there yet ?
don't you have a hosue to be building?
don't let the wife catch ya here ;)
Came in to the office cuz I was waiting for a fax regarding the new front door. It's tough to sit in front of the computer and not check in here. It's nice working at home!
I will close tonight with.......RAIDERS!!!!! DanT
gas expences ought to go way down also...
Working at home would have it's benifits.
minus that not paying thing...
I humbly go back in my cave now until next year......DanT
Nice pics Brian!!
Our crew might start to get to do some trim :-) We are going to take Gary Katz's trim class at JLCLIVE in Portland, OR and on rainy days this winter, we'll work with our trim guys and start learing. I'm looking forward to that.
Nice forklift :-)
Man, that is neat stuff. I notice you aren't working, just the photographer huh? New truck, camera. I get it. Next you will be having one of the helper do the photography cause you are in the Bahamas. Smart guy. DanT
I am in the Bahamas. I took a left out of Cal's instead of a right... and just kept going in my new amphibious assault F-350. I just make the guys take pictures so that I know they're working. Ain't email great? I love bein' the boss.
What material is being used for the corner columns? Is that aztec? I have a feeling it isnt, because it seems the white colour is only a coating? is it preprimed ?
Just plain old pre-primed schwag.
Just posting to book mark this thread for myself for later.
You might want to delete that bookmark. I have a feeling this thread is about to head to the gutter. ;)
If anyone's interested....
Here's some shots from today of us putting the machine to good use. The beam across the front of the house is 42' long, triple 2x10 and the beam down the side is also a triple 2x10 at 55' long.
We built them right there at the front of the porch, across the joists. This gave us a nice flat level place to build the beams, ensuring that they would be as straight possible, minimizing how much we'd have to rassle it straight before joisting.
When I set it on the posts, there was actually only one post where the crown held it off the post about 1/4". Once we had it adequately braced, I used the machine to nudge the beam down tight to that post and nailed it off. Sweet.
The machine was, once again, the hero of the day. Rasselin' that big bertha beam into place with just the three of us would have been an impossible task, and building it in place up on the posts would have been a perfectly miserable experience.
Another day where the machine gets voted MVP.
By next week, I'm hoping to have all those 4x4's packed out and trimmed out to match the corner boards. I dunno though... that's an awful lot of posts. We're also installing the 5/4 x 6 mahoghany decking and trimming out the framing as well. Oh yeah.... I haven't even cut, framed, sheathed, or trimmed the roof yet either. All right... maybe 10 days?
Two weeks tops. ;)
I think that's cheating. ;-)
How long did it take you to bid this job? Seems like a lot of detail work that would get lost on a blue print.
Edited 8/20/2005 3:24 pm ET by dustinf
I put the proposal together back in April I think so the details are a little sketchy. This was after getting the plans, reviewing them for a week, and then having two sit downs with the builder and his wife to go over the details.
When we met the second time, I brought my own detail drawings of my suggestions for the porch railings and the pack out for the corner boards and porch columns. That particular post wrap is something I've done on several other houses so it only took maybe an hour to sketch. Also, having done them before, I have a pretty good idea how long they'll take to wrap out. A pretty good idea anyway. ;)
Our first meeting was to go over the proposal for the frame of the house itself. Since they were cool with that, I went ahead and invested a little more time to do the sketches and get back with them again to go over them.
That's probably way more information than you were looking for, huh. How's 8 hours sound? Thats about how long it took to put together the price of the frame, meet with them, do the sketches, meet again, and write up the final contract.
What a big friggin' show off you are!!
First the truck and know "My Framing Job"!!!
Hey, nice work Brian. I have seen a progression in your posts (from when I first took notice of them) here on BT, of the increasing complexity and skill level in the jobs you are doing. I like those cornice returns. I too often see them 'clipped off' at the end rather than 'hipped' back into the house.
You are doing one heck of a bang up job in my opinion. The tools, the trailer, the lift, oh, and the NEW truck.
Looks like you really got your deal together. The neatness and organization on your sites speaks volumes not only of your abilities, but your concern for safety.
I just hope the work keeps rolling in for you. You must be developing a good reputation in your area.
On a side note, there is someone here on the board who may wish to take mental notes on how to have posts in place and how to properly set a beam, steel, wood or otherwise. (had to throw out that dig)
EricIt's Never Too Late To Become
What You Might Have Been
[email protected]
Thanks Eric.
I don't think you can really win with posting pictures on this board though. Some see it as showing off, while others will always only point out the negatives. I don't think I've ever been in any house anywhere where you couldn't find a couple things that could've been done a bit better, or had a few plain old screw ups that an experienced eye could find.
I'm far from perfect and every one of my houses has something that I could've maybe done better or is somehow slightly compromised as the result of a mistake. To be fair, I'm talking minor things.... a miter joint that could've been a hairline tighter, a rafter that could've been cut a degree straighter and fit the ridge better, a fascia line that could've been that much closer to perfect, etc.
Some of it is the human factor while others are the result of today's materials. Doesn't matter. The important thing is to learn from these mistakes and find a better, more efficient way to do something the yeilds an improved result.
That's why I post pics. Sure I like it when people ask to see what I'm working on. Who wouldn't? But I've also learned a lot from other people's pictures. They say a picture is worth a 1000 words, and I'm a believer in that. I'm a "show me, don't tell me" kind of guy. Visuals really help me understand things much better.
Do you get JLC? If not, pick up this month's issue. Tim's article on barrel vault ceilings is a perfect example. While the article does a very good job of describing the process, I'd be lost without the great pictures. In fact.... I'm still a little lost in that article even with the pictures!!
As far as the pics of the truck goes.... yeah I guess I was showing off the new ride. Hey... I work hard for that thing and yes I'm proud of it. But at the end of the day.... it's just a truck. It won't build the houses for me and it won't build a good business reputation for me. It'll just do a good job of getting me and my tools around to accomplish those things on my own. Besides... maybe everyone will be too busy looking at the truck to notice how funny looking its driver is. ;)
Oh well. Can't please everyone, right?
If you decide to stop showing off and sell the truck and buy a 78 Chevy half ton, well then.......I WANT THE LADDER RACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Don't apologize for showing the great work you do man! That's what this board is all about. People who know what they are doing exchanging info, be it pictures or verbal so others can learn. We all know there are 5 different ways to do anything and still do it well.
If someone decides to be critical just to bust your balls then it is just a matter of envy or the fact they learned it from a book and probably haven't ever done it before. So..................SCREW EM'!
You run a good business, head is in the right place and do nice work. You should be proud of your work and your new truck for that matter. But I still want the ladder rack. DanT
If someone decides to be critical just to bust your balls then it is just a matter of envy or the fact they learned it from a book and probably haven't ever done it before. So..................SCREW EM'!
WTF are you talking about? First of all, I was just having fun, like 90% of my other posts. Second of all, my comments weren't even directed at dieselpig. Tim was speaking in general, as was I.
If that means I'm envious, I'm guilty. If that means I learned it from a book and probably haven't ever done it before, you must be right. I quiver in your presence, fear your gigantic intellect, and bow down before the almighty DanT.
In conclusion, I guess I'm just an ignorant a-hole from cyberspace. Besides, I haven't even finished reading the book on how to be cool on Breaktime.
Geez Dustin..... I don't think he was even talking about you dude. I know I was speaking "in general" in my post and when I read Dan's post I got the vibe that he was too.
Got a guilty concience or sumptin'?
Maybe.
The words,
If someone decides to be critical just to bust your balls
Gave me the impression he was.
We are all guilty of something.
You could be right. Dan's a good guy and it seems like you are too. We'll just let this die, ok?
And yes.... we are all guilty of something. How true.
Edited 8/21/2005 9:06 am ET by dieselpig
squashed.
I am glad diesel is being the bigger man and letting this lie. Probably the right thing to do and of course the mature thing to do.
He was also correct in the fact that I was responding to his general reference in his post as I had not read yours. I usually don't read posts from guys I don't know unless it is a subject I am really interested in, which framing is not one of them. I do however like diesel and am interested in his work.
You, dustinf, are not someone I know nor apparently care to. Highlight this post, hit "print selection". After it prints roll it in a tube and stick it sqarely up your a$$. DanT
Alright now that the bombs have stopped we can get onto what we really want to talk about here.
Canning homemade Salsa! What's your favorite recipe? Are you a pressure cooker or hot water dunker?
Wait I just read DanT's reply. We'll get back to canning later.
Let's do the time warp again!
Chunky salsa:
I qt of water from the tarps ( mosquito swimmers)
1 Rotten, blossum end rot, mater
I qt of gin
drink it all, down in from a tire.
You will have chunks. Garunteeeeed. Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
let's be entrophatic, you start
What DanT said. Word for word. I don't need a ladder rack though.
Let's do the time warp again!
<<"I don't think you can really win with posting pictures on this board though. Some see it as showing off, while others will always only point out the negatives.">>I hope you will remember that posters are not the only ones who read through your threads. I read and appreciate them all; but I'm no framer, so I usually don't have anything to contribute, and therefore keep my mouth shut (or I should say, keep my fingers idle).Your willingness to share and explain your projects is a very valuable asset around here.I occasionally sense some jealousy -- that one so young could be doing such great work -- and at the same time be making enough $$ (and have the will) to invest in the tools and equipment to maximize the efficency of your operation. You really do have your act together, and I respect that. So, just brush off those naysayers with their snide comments -- and remember that there are many of us who both learn from and appreciate your posts.********************************************************
"I tend to live in the past because most of my life is there."
-- Herb Caen (1916-1997)
Sorry I missed this thread, Diesel....blew right past it. :-)
Keep up the pics man, I love seeing other guy's work.
If it were easy....a caveman could do it.
8hrs sounds about right.
I'm always afraid when I bid large trim jobs from a print. SometimesI spend more time rechecking than I really should. One mistake can make or break a job, profit wise.
Looks great, couple of questions.
Whats the siding going to be? wouldn't it be easier to wrap the house before doing the corners and windows?
and last, why plain old pine for the exterior trim? guessing you didn't spec it?
Hi Neil,
The siding is cedar clapboards. All materials were specced by the builder. I don't supply or spec any materials on 99% of my jobs.... just supply labor. I try to advise, but I don't really push unless asked.
You are correct. It certainly would have been easier to wrap the entire house while the walls are on the deck or at least before applying trim or siding or windows. But, "why should I pay you to Tyvek it when the sider will do it for nothing?".
Good questions dude, thanks. While I don't always agree with how I build my frames, or what materials I use, the truth is that sometimes I just have to grin and bear it. Sometimes it's better for me to just not argue with the guy who's writing the checks, you know? In the big picture, who installs the Tyvek and when, isn't really that big a deal. I don't believe it will really effect the quality or integrity of the building, so why argue?
Yeah, but the builder is an idiot....
"the siding guys will run tyveck for free"
unhunh... guess I should say either the builder or siding sub is an idiot... cause someone is paying for it somewhere, I'd think the builder would be smart enough to realize even if the sub says it's free, that he is paying for it.
The most efficent way to do something is usualy cheapest but whatever minor point.
Isn't tyveck incorrect under cedar anyway?
If it didn't really effect the quality of the house or my paycheck I wouldn't bitch either though...
Yes Neil, I've heard that the tannins in cedar can break down some of the properties of Tyvek. Not sure if that applies to pre-primed cedar siding which is all I ever really see anyone use around here.
Honestly, I don't know enough about cedar or Tyvek to really know the answer.
You could be right... the builder could be paying for the wrap through the sider anyway. All the more reason to not pay me to do it. But either way, this particular builder is far from being an idiot. He's got bigger fish to fry than worrying about who is hanging the housewrap. I think the important thing is that it gets hung.... not who hangs it.
Personally it's a gigantic nuisance for me to do it anyway. It's not like it really brings in any real dough, and it forces me to get to places I normally wouldn't even go to during some frames. What I mean is, there are some places (corners and short walls particularly) that can't be properly wrapped while the walls are laying on the deck. Now we have to go back and wrap those corners from either a ladder (PIA) or the machine which ties up not only the machine, but also two warm bodies that could be spending their time and my money in a more productive way somewhere else on the frame.
In my opinion, it's better left to the siders anyway. They need to stage every inch of the house anyway to do their job. Pump jacks are the perfect opportunity to efficiently and safely install wrap.
I guess their is no perfect answer. And, like I said Neil... I'm far from perfect. Unfortunatly not everything I build is worthy of the pages of FHB. But I think I build a good deal of "middle of the road" type houses. Average size and finishes, if you will. Therefore, I would assume that many of the folks who frequent the forum are working on similar projects and would appreciate the opportunity to compare apples to apples rather than try to compare their work to the projects that grace the pages of most magazines with their rediculous budgets and super high-end finishes.
But I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.