I have about 55 squares of roof to do- new construction 5/8″ osb sheeting, Malarkey Legacy shingles (50 year) going down.
Talked with the owner and we discussed using synthetic underlayment. I see the benefits as the following:
lighter weight and faster to install
can be exposed for up to 6 months (though we won’t leave it open for more than a few weeks)
lays flatter than felt- i.e. won’t wrinkle
higher tear resistance and less likely to blow off
Disadvantages: Cost
So now I start to research it a little more and find out that you cannot use staples to fasten this. I knew that it would probably require a cap and fastener to realize some of the aforementioned benefits, but they specifically state that it must be a 1″ cap and nail- No staples allowed, or you void the warranty.
I can understand not using hammer tackers, but why not use a pneumatic cap stapler? I ask because, I do not own a cap nailer or stapler and the cost of this specialized tool is pricey, especially when you add the cost of the nails and caps.
If you have used this product, how do you fasten it? Any limitations or shortcomings that you have experienced???
I will invest in the tool if necessary, but just thought I would see what others have used first.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Replies
Hand-drive cap nails come in box at Lowe's
We use the Rex product, which is similar. The great benefit of the synthetic stuff is speed of installation (partly because it covers a larger area than tarpaper) and the fact that it shrinks to a super tight smooth surface. It is very tough and is almost impossible to rip.
They recommend not using staples simply because they don't hold as well as caps. We initially install it with staples to position it and then supplement with caps as needed. They have the spots for fastening the caps printed right on the underlayment.
We save our rips from various cuts during construction and sometimes use them along the seams instead of caps if it's going to be quite awhile before we get to the shingles.
If you end up using a lot of this product, I would probably buy a cap nailer since there are so many other places you could use it. Otherwise, cap nail by hand.
We tape the end seams with Tyvek tape.
I see no issues with stapled caps, I interpret the "no Staples" as no hammer tacker staples. I have a cap stapler and they hold just fine.
Perhaps a message to the maker of UDL would solve the confusion.
The caps will degrade faster from light than the nail caps for some reason, must be a different plastic mix.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
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The caps will degrade faster from light than the nail caps for some reason, must be a different plastic mix.
That's the problem. And a little degradation allows the caps to pop off the staples. I've grabbed the end of a piece of Titanium installed with stapled caps and jerked upon it and all the caps popped off.copper p0rn
Yup, but if ya get it shingled in a reasonable amount of time, they hold fine. I have felt that was exposed for 4 months and the caps hadn't rotted yet. But thats about the limit.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
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Hand nail your caps. You only need about half as many vs. a felt installation. It takes my guys about half the time to dry-in with a synthetic underlayment as it does felt. We hand nail exclusively.
copper p0rn
We installed this on a house with about 30 squares. When I had help there, we installed cap nails by hand. When I was working alone, I bought a Bostich cap stapler so I could unroll and tighten with one hand and fasten with the other. Not the easiest thing to do, but would have been really tough any other way.
Anyway, I saw no difference in the holding power of the pneumatically fastened cap staples and the hand driven cap nails. On the other hand, I didn't try to rip it up either, so maybe there is. It was exposed for at least 3 months (on the beach)before the roof went on with no problems. That's interesting info about the UV exposure and different kinds of plastic caps.
The biggest advantage I found with the Titanium (besides the exposure time) was the slip resistance. Most of our roof was a 10/12, and I could actually carefully walk without putting any weight on the safety rope if I wanted to. The safety bonus alone may be worth the cost.
I just sold my Staple gun after the job for about half what I paid for it ($120). It definitely paid for itself in the time savings alone. If I was to do it again, I would probably buy one of these:
http://www.bostitch.com/default.asp?CATEGORY=BOS_ROOFING_NAILER_STAPLER&TYPE=PRODUCT&PARTNUMBER=N66BC-1&SDesc=BOSTITCH%26%23174%3B+Cap+Nailer
You can shoot 2 1/2" nails with it, which would work on foam sheathing as well.
Jamie
Thanks for the feedback. Hand nailing with caps seems like more of a project than I want to undertake on this, so I'll probably invest in a gun.
We'll see how it goes.
When I used it, I got curious about the No staples deal too, so I called them... here is what they said:Staples are not approved for this product - NOT EVEN CAP STAPLES! The reason is that staples have square edges instead of the rounded edges of nails. These square edges can cut the plastic under the cap where you won't see it, Not necessarily a big cut, but any roof perforation can be bad.BTW, I had mine uncovered for months, and no problems at all. Loved it loved it loved it!
Tu stultus esRebuilding my home in Cypress, CAAlso a CRX fanatic!
Look, just send me to my drawer. This whole talking-to-you thing is like double punishment.