Hi there,
I am in the process of doing a bar in my home. Got a piece of 8/4 by 12″ by 9′ Vermont Hard Rock Maple. Good grain, looks great. Since surface planing, and edging it, I have spent lots of time (over 6 hours) sanding it. First with a belt sander 80 grit through 150 grit, then a random orbit sander 150 grit through 220. Felt like glass. Trouble is: when I put on a light coat of Zar stain (cherry), I was very surprised to find what appears to be scratch marks from the belt sander. These areas feel just as smooth as the rest of the wood. Question is, what should I do now that the wood is stained? If i just sand the areas with the marks and re-stain, how noticeable will the difference be. Should I have used a lighter “body” stain like minwax? Have had no trouble with the lighter stains in the past, and this is the first time with the heavier “body” Zar stain. Would greatly appreciate some input.
Steve
Edited 7/23/2002 9:39:10 AM ET by Steve
Replies
Two suggestions -
1. Write it off as "character"
2. Try posting this in the "Knots" woodworking forum.
I can resist anything but temptation.
Thanks for the responce.
#1 Since the bar is immediately adjacent to new maple kitchen cabinets, it would look very rough. The only character involved with these tool marks is that it would show a lack of character on my part if I don't fix it.
#2 Might try this.
Thanks again, Steve
"The only character involved with these tool marks is that it would show a lack of character on my part if I don't fix it.
"
Actually, I feel the same. Can't imagine why anyone would build something new and then "distress" it. Or use poor quality wood and then call it "character".
Mostly, I was just kidding. Option #2 (posting in knots) is probably your best bet since it's a woodworking forum.
Hope your project turns out well .
I smile because I have no idea what's going on.
Thanks,
I figured you were just kidding. I don't like distressing anything either, got a bunch of kids who will eventually do it for me.
Appreciate the tips,
Steve
Hey Steve,
2 Questions: #1 Have you already installed the bar?
#2 How much of a perfectionist are you?
If you had originally asked how to finish the top I would have suggested that you avoid sanding alltogether and use a cabinet scraper. That would have left you with a satin smooth surface ready for finishing. Problem now is that any abrasives left in the wood will dull down the scraper. I think at this point your best bet would be to either live with the marks or go back and use the RO to remove them. Start off around 100 grit and work up to 180 or 220. The belt sander leaves much deeper and impressions than other sanders which take more effort to remove. I'd avoid spot sanding from the standpoint that the divot created would be more of an eyesore than the original 'defect' once all is done. However, to answer your question, the tone of the finish would most likely not be altered by resanding one or a few spots. Hope that helps a bit and good luck - Nick
Hi there,
Thanks for the responce.
#1 Not installed yet.
#2 I am an Architectural designer, and hence a perfectionist.
I will be finishing the bar with an epoxy from Aristokraft that is about 3/16" thk. A slight impression where the defects are might not be noticed. Am thinking about the removing the scratches with a RO sander, but suspect that I will not be able to stain the spot without getting a double coat around it, so I might just sand the whole thing, then redo it. Have never used a scraper before, will it work on the hard maple? Also, any opinion on the stain itself. I re-finished some old hard rock maple dressers years ago, and used a RO sander, and minwax stain. I was a novice then, but no tool marks showed at all.
Thanks again, Steve
Learn how to use and sharpen a scraper.
Scrape until all traces of the stain are gone.
It will take an hour. Sanders are for lazy
people who like scratches, or if you need to sand
1000 feet with a real industrial machine and you know
what you're doing. Random orbit sanders just make
random scratches that never entirely go away. One
single grit of your 80-grit belt caught in the fine
disc will trash the finish. Perfect cleanliness is
a necessity.
Get a good fine diamond stone. Grind on the flat until
smooth. Grind the edges perpendicular. Use a burnisher
or the smooth end of a good drill bit. First rub almost
parallel to the flat face of the scraper. This draws the
edge out the wrong way. Then rub perpendicular to the
flat face, then at a slight angle. Now you have a burr.
The two-step burnishing bends the edge one way, then the other
and work-hardens the edge. Much sharper and longer lasting edge.
Either wear gloves when burnishing or be careful not to cut
off any important body parts. Very easy to slip. You press
HARD when burnishing. While sharpening, try to give the edge
a very slight curve so the edges do not dig in. Practice
on the back first. On a thin scraper, you bend it slightly
while scraping. You'll need to resharpen it a couple times.
You'll get a mirror-smooth finish. No scratches. When
sharpened and burnished properly, the scraper takes shavings
just like a plane.
You might be able find a cabinent shop that rents a wide belt sander and pay them to run it through for ya. The sanders have various grits and might be able to clean it up for ya. Then you can finish sand and stain ect Darkworksite4: When the job is to small for everyone else, Its just about right for me"
A scraper is the best solution here. $6 at Lee Valley (but the burnisher will cost up to $30, plus the cost of a good file and stone if you don't have them). Take your time with the scraper and be alert to the flatness of the surface You may want to return the surface to flat with a large plane, as a belt sander will not generally give you a flat surface. Close enough for government work
Thanks a lot. Will probably try this. Need to sand all the stain off first though. the edges have a thumbnail round over routed on them. Will this pose a problem for the scraper?
Steve
Hey Steve,
Good to see that you're a perfectionist and care about your work. The thumbnail won't bother the scraping process, however you may need to re-mill the profile once done - no big deal really. The scraper would take off all of the stain saving you from sanding. Sanding really isn't a perfect way of finishing... it just happens to work MOST of the time. Scraping works best on harder woods, and you happen to be using a prime example of that. Pick up a scraper and give it a shot. Once you get a good burr and get the motion down - it's really not that hard - you'll be well on your way. Just make sure to practice on some scrap before going on to the bar. Good luck - Nick
Thanks.
Steve
What about sending it through a planer for a cut just heavy enough to remove everything you did, and then using a scraper as NMARKEY suggests? Just a thought...
Be seeing you...
Thanks for the thought. Will try a random orbit sander first, since the ends are rounded and the edges are routed already.
Steve