Torch Down repair questions??
Hudson Valley Carpenter
| Posted in Construction Techniques on
Found a problem with some step flashing which has allowed rain to leak under an area of torch down roofing, over the patio. There’s some bad sheathing under the torch down, about ten-fifteen square feet I’m guessing from the feel of it.
Of course I’ll need to replace the step flashing and some shingles on the intersecting roof. And I’ll have to remove about half a square of torch down, to repair the sheathing then install new torch down.
I’ve never worked with torch down, only watched it being applied, so I need a lesson in how to do a good patch job.
Peter
Replies
for that big of a patch go cold process..
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Since posting my question, I spoke on the phone with a rep at one of the nearby roofing supply places. He suggested that, starting from one end, I get under the rolled roofing with a scraper, lift up and roll back the area where the sheathing needs to be replaced, do that repair and then roll the roofing back in place.
He had a bunch of calls so we didn't get specific about how to re-adhere the rolled material. I figured I'd use a cold adhesive, preceeded by a strip of peel and stick around the perimeter.
How's that sound to you?
It should work!
that should be the ticket...
if you fracture the membrane plan on using bimiteous coating/sealer/brushable fibered cement w/ a mesh fabric for repairs....
if ya got gravel on the roof now, scrape it back further than you need... put it back on with the cold process...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
Thanks for thinking that plan through, giving it your approval and offering the advice about the fabric fix. I've used that method in the past and was impressed by how well it worked.
I'm gonna be real careful about how I peel that torch down material back. Don't plan on putting any holes in it. It's still fairly flexible so I expect that, with care, it'll come up OK.
Fortune smiles on this job. SoCal weather is forcast to be fair and warm for the next five days...at least.
Fortune smiles on this job. SoCal weather is forcast to be fair and warm for the next five days...at least. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Guess what, NY weather has not been too bad. High of 50's every day. Shoot I haven't even seen snow this year.
Guess what, NY weather has not been too bad. High of 50's every day. Shoot I haven't even seen snow this year.
I imagine you're "makin' hay while the sun shines", huh? That's almost too good to be true for this time of year.
I have to admit that I'm getting spoiled by this SoCal weather. There's only one rainy season, winter, and even then the satellites can see it coming, days ahead of time.
Of course it would be difficult to spend a summer doing roofing here. I'd be done before noon every day. Glad this repair showed up when it did.
thank piffin...
he made ne say all that...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
Sounds like you're hedging your bets, lookin' for a scape goat if your advice doesn't pan out.
You must have spent some time workin' on union jobs. That's a typical Plan B move there. ;-)
wait till ya get intro'd to plan "C"....
you'll love it...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
Plan C on most union jobs is in the hands of the contractor's on-site supervisor. It usually involves a layoff, then a call to the hall for another likely suspect. That's why a good Plan B is so essential to a union carpenter's longevity.
Plan A would be to actually know what you're doing and apply that knowledge effectively, every minute of the day. But there are always SNAFUs during the day so even an expert carpenter needs a grabazz backup plan, a smoke screen designed to dodge bullets shot by foremen and supervisors who are under pressure to keep the job on schedule.
Laying someone off is one of the super's Plan B's. Seen it happen often. Miss a deadline, someone gets laid off. Got a few early checks that way myself, over the years. Nothing to do but laugh and call the hall. "Put me back on the list Charlie. They missed another deadline and it was my turn to get the axe."
advancing the plans mean that "A" was awlful...
"B" was a bummer...
"C" was crappy....
"D" was a dud...
"E" was a full fledged error..
and so on...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
if it don't pan out...
I'll take the heat...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
if it don't pan out...
I'll take the heat...
Not to worry, you're covered. Paul at Burbank Roofing Supply put in his two cents ahead of you. And he's close enough to grab too.
so how close were we???
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"
I'll have a progress report later today.
Edited 11/25/2009 4:39 am by Hudson Valley Carpenter
Plan B would be to buy a roll or two of torchdown and torch it down.
Plan C is the blue tarp, right?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Thing to be care ful of doing that is not to break it by steppiong on it where it is folded back. I have some doubts, but with care, if it is not too old, it may work.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
i just did my roof. peel and stick base sheet, then a torch down cap.
unless "torch down" refers to a different animal than it does up here, i don't see any way that you will be able to lift that stuff up.
there were a couple of places where i had to remove some 3 year old torch down on an extension to redo the intersection with the main roof, and it was hard to get it off the decking, let alone in one piece.
i got lucky with the weather, as well. had to brush the frost of in the morning, but it warmed up enough to eat lunch at the picnic table.
the torch down I have used goes on over a 43# base sheet that is nailed down, so it would merely take popping the base loose at the fasteners.
With a peel/stick base, you would be right. It is there until the apocalypse
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
OK. Tore the shingles off the intersecting roof and got my first look at the torch down application. It appears that they used the 43# rolled material you referred to, as a base. So far I've been able to delaminate the torch down from the 43# stuff without too much trouble, although I've only just started that process.
I hope it continues to go well because the 43# is rather dry and a little brittle while the torch down material is still quite flexible.
Assuming it comes up and rolls back OK, what method and materials would you use to re-apply it?
Edited 11/25/2009 1:55 pm by Hudson Valley Carpenter
"able to delaminate the torch down from the 43# stuff without too much trouble"Good for you, but not good overall. That means that the installer did not get things hot enough as he applied it, leaving the seams of doubtfull integrity.So I would be using a torch to re-apply.Heavy base sheet is normally stiff and 'brittle' and is 'sanded' with a fine sand/powder.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
I use a ton of torch down... even if you have to cut and remove the section over the the damaged area... slide this section to the side.... make your repairs... put down new felt/base slide cut out torch down back into place... clean 12" back from the cut line on the surface all the way around... ( i use gasoline on a rag but that will make people here scream like little girls) after it dries... with my torch i go all the way around where i have cleaned and just hit it til it has a slight "gloss" I then use an 18" strip of torch down all the way around on top of the cut line (18" is my standard because you can just cut the roll in half... but 12" is good too if you want to get 3 strips out of a roll) starting with the lowest cut first... then the 2 sides overlapping the full 18" (or 12) then finish with the top...I don't always but if you want you could put metal button cap screws around the edges that will be covered with your new torchdown.... if you think you need it... I use torchdown for small patches all the time on flat roofs... as long as i clean the area around it well i've never had one fail..p
Edited 11/26/2009 9:54 am ET by ponytl
works by me.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
OK, it's all good news. The large soft spot in the valley turns out to be a big blister in the material, due to a combination of poor product application and a minor leak in the step flashing. The roof sheathing is fine, no sign of delamination or other loss of integrity.
So what I'd like to do is use roofing cement, some appropriate formula that I can trowel on to the sheathing below the 43# material, then weigh both layers down until it's cured.
How's that sound? What brand and type of roofing cement should I use?
BTW Paul, all the lapped seams on the torch down are very secure.
PS: Ponytl, thanks for the good advice. I'm glad it's not going to be required this time.
Edited 11/26/2009 2:54 pm by Hudson Valley Carpenter
rolling out some cold process cement ought to do it OK
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
OK, thanks. I'll check with the supplier to see what type of cement they recommend. Last time I looked there were about four-five types.
I offer my gratitude and salutations to all of you who gave me the benefit of your experience, taking the time to put it in writing.
Peter
Edited 11/26/2009 7:08 pm by Hudson Valley Carpenter
Peter ,
Karnak products are very good .
I think # 19 is their standard PRC
Walter
Karnac huh? Didn't he do late night TV, wearing a turban and devining the answers to questions hidden in envelopes? <G>
Thanks Walter, I'll make a note of that and ask for it when I go to the roofing supply, later today.
With the torch down product I have used, "Dibiten", there was a base sheet that was put down lst with buttons. If that was NOT used you will NOT get the roofing up without cutting out the sheathing also.