uneven heat in upstairs bedrooms
paperhanger
| Posted in Energy, Heating & Insulation on
I have 3 bedrooms and 2 baths upstairs in my house. Built in 2000, hot water heat by gas. The problem I have been having is the first 2 bedrooms and bath are much warmer than the master bed and bath. The system is on one zone, the thermostat is in the master bedroom and the way the system is set up the water comes up in bedroom 1, goes thru a bath, goes thru bedroom 2, goes thru the master bath, then to the master bedroom. The basement run to bedroom 1 is 60 feet, then up to the second floor, goes thru a run of approximately 100 feet to all beds and baths, then returns to the system. Any help would be appreciated. Jim Z.
Replies
Bleed air out of system. That's all I know.
1 zone hhhmmmm that's a tough one.
I'm curious what your return temp is at the boiler.
Sounds like you're using up all the heat before it gets to the master bedroom.
I wonder is the one zone a continious loop or is there mainfolds seperating the rooms --- if there is you could install balancing valves to equalize the system.
Its a contineuos loop. No pressure valves etc. Could bleeding help and how could I do it. Jim Z
Bleeding will only help if there is air in the system.
If there is no high point vents it can be tough to get air out.
If this is a basic system with no chemical additives
you could hook up a garden hose on the inlet side & connect a hose to the boiler drain as long as there is a valve in between the two & force water in at full flow will eventually get the air out--- that is if you have decent flow from your garden hose.
do you think the loop is too long or would getting a bigger circulating pump be an option. Jim Z
With-out knowing how big the pump you have now is, or how much footage on the system, and the gpm you're curruntly having.
Can't really say if a bigger pump is an option or not.
You say it's one long continious run----- I haven't seen that on a radiant system---- But I haven't seen baby pigeons either but I'm kinda sure they exsist.
It does sound like your losing all your heat in the system before it gets to the last bedroom.
An easy way to check is to reverse the connections at the boiler so that bedroom gets the water first.
Then see if the last bedroom is colder.
I think I will bleed the system and see if that works. That might be the problem and go from there and eliminate things as I go.
I assume yours is baseboard hot water. I have a big, 100 year old house with boiler system/radiators -- no zones at all. Heat distribution is a problem, and you deal with it by stopping down the radiators in the hotter part of the house to push more hot water to the colder areas. Once you get things evened out, it will stay that way, but it takes a lot of futzing around to make the proper adjustments.Is that kind of thing possible with baseboard units?Air in my system can also be a problem (with heat distribution), especially if any part of the system has been drained for one reason or another. In that case, I usually have to hit each radiator 3-4 times over several days before all the air is purged from the system. I would think there must be some bleeder valves on the baseboard units. I know nothing about heating systems, but I have always assumed pumps were built into all the modern hot water set-ups. If you have none, I would think you would want to have a confab with a heating person (other than your installer) to find out why your system has no pump. ********************************************************
"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
Its a hot water baseboard system, gas fired, 1 zone. But, a long run. probably 120 feet in length. Jim Z
If you can get ahold of a laser thermometer (60 bucks) you could measure the difference between supply and return water-if its greater than 25 degrees or so, you would be well served to add another zone.
The bummer is that this is a finished house, right? You'ld have to cut in a new return line for the existing zone you are splitting, and then run new supply/returns where you are feeding the new zone. Use pex-al-pex to repipe, much easier than copper. I would wait till there's warmer weather to tinker.
Thats what I am going to do. The 2 warmer bedromms are the kids and in the middle of winter they are running the ceiling fans and cracking windows. There is a closet right under thr feed to the masterbath and that is where the new supply and return will be located. And it could be done in the pex tubing. Sounds like the best bet for me.
adjusting output in single pipe series baseboard can be hard. The baseboards themselves should have adjustable dampers on them; you could try closing them in the first bedrooms, to "constipate" the heat flow there and get a little more output downstream.If the BBs are not true series and instead use diverter tees and balancing valves, you could play with the balance.. If you have a high temperature drop from beginning to end of the loop, you could try a bigger pump perhaps, so the end of the run is warmer and emits more heat, which would reduce overheating in the earlier zones.This sort of thing is why I hate series baseboard. Very little adjustability available if any is not quite "to spec".. if a spec is ever even considered.-------------------------------------
-=Northeast Radiant Technology=-
Radiant Design, Consultation, Parts Supply
http://www.NRTradiant.com
the dampers are closed in the first two bedrooms and the bath. I know I should have put every bedroom on its own zone! Why I didn't, I don't know. Putting the master on its own is my best bet.
You don't necessarily have to put a thermostat in every room, but I do like home-run systems so you at least have adjustability on each BB unit... and, if needed, you can zone later.-------------------------------------
-=Northeast Radiant Technology=-
Radiant Design, Consultation, Parts Supply
http://www.NRTradiant.com
Yeah, but when the house was being built, I had the option to zone every bedroom. Now its a big PITA. But, I have a closet to run nessesary pipes to do so.
Man I didn't know it was a baseboard system.
to get air out there should have been needle valves at the connection of the base board units.
If not they are not that hard to install depends on your configuration.
Are you sure it's a problem with your heating system? I've visited a number of homes with unevenly heated bedroom complaints. Often the problem is one of insulation. For example, is the master bedroom over the garage? If so, it's surrounded on 5 out of 6 sides by the outdoors. Most bedrooms have only 2 or 3 of their 6 sides exposed to the outside. Is it in a cape style house? Insulaters rarely detail the knee-walls well. I've even seen rooms off cold bedrooms that were entirely open to the attic, sucking all sorts of cold air from other places into them. Is there a catherdral ceiling? Attic hatch?
Could you describe your house's insulation and configuration?
Andy
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig." Robert A. Heinlein
"Get off your dead #### and on your dying feet." Mom
Andy, house is well insulated, I did it. No voids anywhere. It is a heating system related problem. Floors r-19, walls r-13, ceiling r-30, interior walls are also insulated with r-13, I did not miss a cavity. You can actually fell a substantial difference in temp at the entrance and exit areas of loop. TOH just had a ask THO segment about this and they put the circulating pump on the outlet of the boiler, not the input. I'll have to get a heating sub I guess. Jim Z
Did you see "Ask This Old House" this week???
If everything is bleed and working basically as designed, you might want to look into TRVs for the radiators (I'm assuming you have radiators). These valves allow individual temperature control for each unit.
Has it always been like this?