Replies

1. 
   tman11 | Jul 16, 2002 06:06am | #1

   Just finished vinyl siding an old victorian two story.  If you do not have a snap-lock punch and a J channel punch, they are well worth the investment of about $25.  The J channel punch really speeds up trimming around windows and doors.  The snap-lock punch makes for tight fits under and over windows and along eaves. We like using a battery powered DeWalt saw for making straight cuts in vinyl siding.  Use a plastics blade and make nice clean cuts even on ladders and scaffolding.

1. 
   Davo304 | Jul 16, 2002 07:33am | #2

   JB...

   What is a J channel punch and what exactly does it do ? I have a snaplock punch and a z tool, but am unfamiliar with the (J channel) tool you mention.

   Davo

1. 
   Crawford510 | Jul 25, 2002 09:15am | #13

   A J channel punch cuts a slot about a half inch long and leaves the top side still attached ( sort of like an open door ). I would be lost without mine. It's ideal for hanging the top piece into the finish trim or J channel under windows.

   Tip#1. Nothing cuts vinyl cleaner or faster than a 12" metal cutting abrasive blade on a chopsaw. ( Use caution, familiarity will breed contempt )

   Tip#2. Save those cut off top edges - they are great as filler strips either for undersill J channel or when inserting the last cut piece of vertical siding or if you must use J channel at the soffits.

   Tip#3. Get yourself a pair of left and right aviation tin snips (the only way to cut out a hole falling in the middle of a panel). 

   Tip#4. Get yourself an unzip tool, $5 bucks tops, if you ever have to replace a damaged panel, it's a real time saver and sometimes the only way.

   Tip#5. Take the time to make yourself a story board. You can save yourself a world of grief at the soffits and windows if you plan ahead. Hint: 10 inch siding will only cover appoximately 9 7/8". That 1/8" can make a real difference over 8ft. 

1. 
   Davo304 | Aug 01, 2002 07:42am | #28

   Hey, guess what? I already own a "J" channel punch. Never heard it called that...always refered to it as a "punch;" period.

   Oh well, learn something new every day....only thing is, that punch punches holes so the siding will lock onto the UNDERSILL TRIM, not the J Channel. The J channel goes on overtop the undersill trim.

    That 's what I think had me confused...I thought the siding was being attached directly to the J channel.

   As for the zip tool...I got one. Works OK, but so does a screwdriver in a pinch.

   As for the saw blade trick, I'll give it a try sometime. I've been using my 72 tooth carbide blade that came with my SCMS. It works great too.

   The story pole trick is definately a good one.

   Thanks for the info, Blondie.

   Davo

1. 
   Crawford510 | Aug 03, 2002 07:20am | #29

   I just mentioned the J channel because under some conditions it's preferable not to force siding into a finish trim ie: when using a cove profile and the final cut requires that it should sit a half inch away from the wall. Two options in this case are to : 1. Lay in a half inch filler stip behind the finish trim or 2. Lay in a filler strip on top of the J channel.  I've found that the top inch or two of a panel ( usually the piece you've just had to remove ) works well as a filler if positioned so that the locking ridge lines up with the curl of the J channel.

   Option 2 is simple, easy and the materials are right at hand whereas Option 1. usually requires cutting a plywood strip about  one and a half inches wide and that only works if your panel cut is at least one and a half inches above the jog in the siding . 

   In a perfect world the top edge of the siding would meet every window sill and every soffit at just the right spot or siding manufacturers would come up with a way to stretch or shink siding to fit. Until then we poor souls required to make it fit and make it look like REAL WOOD SIDING will just have to do our best and pass along any hopefully helpful hints to the next generation of installers.

   And remember " There is not a shread of evidence to support the theory that life is serious". If you can't laugh at your mistakes and learn from them then carpentry isn't for you.

2. 
   PhillGiles | Aug 03, 2002 09:42am | #30

   Did you turn the blade around backwards ? That's what I see most often..

   Phill Giles

   The Unionville Woodwright

   Unionville, Ontario

2. 
   Davo304 | Jul 16, 2002 07:41am | #3

   Just Remember......you don't nail  vinyl siding.....you hang it. Leave the vinyl loose enough so it can expand and contract. And be aware of which direction to start your siding so the butt seams will not appear to be too noticeable when viewed from the street.

   LOL.

   Davo

1. 
   bikerXski | Jul 16, 2002 09:50pm | #4

   they now make 90 degree corner pieces that make the window/door corner trimming look much better than cut J channel. Faster too. If you do cut the J channel for corners, cut one piece straight and the next at 45 degrees. Show the 45. Carefull with corner pieces. can be pulled too tight in places without care. run the pieces toward your sight lines to hide the seams better. use the new rubber tape under j channel, install as instructed. Some art to hanging vinyl, need to tighten and loosen nails, add shims, bend hidden vinyl etc... to get a good look. example, had to cut an inch or so off the bottom of vinyl piece and insert into J channel running on ledger board. Simply inserted the cut piece behind the cut end to shim the vinyl bottom out correctly.  

1. 
   BossHog | Jul 17, 2002 03:17pm | #10

   "they now make 90 degree corner pieces that make the window/door corner trimming look much better than cut J channel."

   You really think so? I thought those things looked kinda cheesy.

   Anybody else use them or have any opinions on them?

   Keep honking. I'm reloading.

1. 
   IronHelix | Jul 21, 2002 10:39am | #11

   Check out this month's edition of Fine Homebuilding!

2. 
   JDRHI | Jul 25, 2002 05:18am | #12

   You really think so? I thought those things looked kinda cheesy.

   Its vinyl siding....the whole thing looks cheesy. IMHO J. D. Reynolds

   Home Improvements

   "DO IT RIGHT, DO IT ONCE"

3. 
   TLRice | Jul 26, 2002 04:00pm | #15

   "You really think so? I thought those things looked kinda cheesy."

   What about vinyl isn't cheesy? Its cheap. Its easy. Its cheesy.

1. 
   BossHog | Jul 26, 2002 04:21pm | #16

   My comment wasn't whether or not vinyl siding itself looks bad - Just whether these particular corners look bad. I think they make the job loook amateurish.

   Like vinyl siding or not, you might as well get used to it.

   Heart attacks. God's revenge for eating his animal friends.

2. 
   Edgar76b | Jul 26, 2002 06:06pm | #17

   I was wondering about that Moldable/bendable J channel. Has anyone seen it after a few years? Do the UV rays discolorit at the same rate as vinyl?

3. 
   junkhound | Jul 27, 2002 03:48am | #18

   A big "second" to previous opinions of "cheesy".

   My own brother put vinyl over cedar when he added on to his house. AAARGH!!!!

4. 
   JeffBuck | Jul 27, 2002 05:08am | #19

   even after your offer to do all the maintenence?? Man...what a fool he was!

   Jeff   She's exotic ,but not foreign, like an old Cadillac......she's a knockout!

5. 
   TLRice | Jul 29, 2002 03:15pm | #20

   Maybe others have different experience, but in the area I live, the no maintenance argument fails miserabley. I notice lots of repairs required after any high wind or severe storm. Thats leaves: cheap, ease of installation and no painting required, as benefits of the product.

   The article about wether or not vinyl belonged on "fine" homes centered on environmental impact. Never once mentioned the fact that this is cookie-cutter, tract house junk. Obviously, some people have differing opinions. Its very popular, but then so is rap.

6. 
   AndyEngel | Jul 29, 2002 10:55pm | #21

   Tim, we didn't discuss the aesthetic aspects of vinyl because we thought that people's minds are already pretty much made up -- They hate it or they don't. However, we figured that we could provide some information that would be new to many of our readers by covering the environmental aspects of vinyl.

   Andy Engel, The Accidental Moderator

7. 
   TLRice | Jul 30, 2002 02:59pm | #24

   Indeed you did, in my case, provide new information on the product. I understand that many, myself included, have pretty strong feelings one way or another. In a sidebar discussion titled along the lines of does it "belong" on a "fine" home, I would have expected the can of worms to be opened. I think that aesthetically, vinyl is acceptable. It looks like other types of siding. I would, however, argue against the quality and durability of the product. As usual, the magazine did an excellent job of providing information without regard to personal biases. Thanks, again.

8. 
   JeffBuck | Jul 30, 2002 01:31am | #22

   properly installed vinyl doesn't blow off with a good strong breeze!

   Jeff   She's exotic ,but not foreign, like an old Cadillac......she's a knockout!

9. 
   Edgar76b | Jul 30, 2002 03:25am | #23

   Personally I prefer the old 1 1/4" overlapping Asphalt panels that look like brick. That stuff lasts for ever. Sorry, I guess I am being sarcastic.

   What I really mean is, you guys act like you've never done a vinyl job before. I don't pretend that vinyl looks like real wood. But there is a heck of a lot of work that just doesn't get cedar.

   There is a right way and a wrong way to do vinyl. But vinyl is not wrong. I kinda take it personally I guess.

10. 
    JeffBuck | Jul 30, 2002 08:23pm | #26

    Ahhhh...Insulbrick! Then you'd love my house......Insulbrick covered with vinyl!

    I'm on your side too......vinyl has it's place....especially when the customer wants a nice new exterior and doesn't want to rob a bank to pay for it!

    my own house........the vinyl is just fine. It was installed by the previous owners...the crew they hired did a nice job......still looks good. And if I ever had any pangs of doubt...and wanted to make it a "fine home".....

    ........I'd save up all the money needed...........then take the family to Jamaica! I'm sure the vinyl would look even better after we returned! Jeff   She's exotic ,but not foreign, like an old Cadillac......she's a knockout!

11. 
    bikerXski | Jul 30, 2002 11:36pm | #27

    Reading pros and cons about vinyl in This Old House mag. The contractor dude of the gang, don't remember his name, had a lot to say about vinyl. The most telling was that he did it on his own home 15 years back cus he didn't have time for the maint most other siding systems require.

12. 
    TLRice | Jul 30, 2002 03:02pm | #25

    Maybe so. Is 60 mph winds a strong breeze? Maybe I have only noticed the poorly installed siding in disrepair after some serious wind, and there were plenty of installations that were undamaged.

3. 
   JDRHI | Jul 17, 2002 12:53am | #5

   I just wanted to second Davos post! There is a DIYer round the block from me. He finished siding his own house less than a month ago....."Holy warpage Batman!!!"

   J. D. Reynolds

   Home Improvements

   "DO IT RIGHT, DO IT ONCE"

1. 
   JeffBuck | Jul 17, 2002 02:17am | #6

   One big tip...this addresses all that wavy siding out there.....the pieces should be able to slide back and forth...with a strong tug.....and not have either end slide clear of the corner/j-channel.

   Word is...this is how the factory reps decide on correct installation....I'm sure among other things...but I've been told by those in the know..the first quick Rep test is the back and forth tug......shows that it's not been nailed too tight.

   Biggest and best tip of all......start LEVEL......and stay level as ya wrap around a corner. I've always used a starter strip.......my Dad just pointed out a nice job that starts mid-panel....by using an undersill at the bottom........think they did this to match the other sides of the house..as the porch is built up a bit.

   And of course......lay the overlays so ya don't see the overlap seams from the main traffic areas.

   Take your time getting the J nice around doors and windows. The rest goes fast enough. Have fun. Jeff   She's exotic ,but not foreign, like an old Cadillac......she's a knockout!

1. 
   user-441621 | Jul 17, 2002 03:47am | #7

   thanks for the chat. has anyone put in the lineals around windows and doors. i also have two half rounds. i have not even thought of haw to finish that.any info on that j channel punch i havent heard of that.

1. 
   chimd1 | Jul 17, 2002 06:49am | #8

   flexible J-channel for the half-rounds. It's a different material than the straight J-channels, but from any distance you can't tell the diff.

1. 
   user-441621 | Jul 17, 2002 02:12pm | #9

   i allready have j channel built into the windows. i want to put up 4 inch lineals aruond the windows and doors

4. 
   Edgar76b | Jul 26, 2002 03:58am | #14

   When I was doing siding, And It came time to capp the rakeboards, I learned to figure out the roof pitch. Standing on the ground, holding my pocket square up paralell with the ground.You can read the square, figure your pitch, and your plumb cut. Without leaving the ground. Big deal right?  One less trip up the ladder too. It is much  like Leonardo holding up his thumb eyeing up the Mona Lisa.