Wall jacks- Proctors or Tranzporters
jonblakemore
| Posted in Tools for Home Building on
I’m this close to buying a set of 16′ wall jacks.
For those of you who may remember, there was a thread in the past about building your own wall jacks. I did and wish I didn’t. Nothing bad happened but they certainly aren’t worth the time and money I invested in them. Wish I would have listened to those who said just buy the pro made ones.
Anyways, there seem to be some benefits to the Tranzporter jacks over the Proctors, but I also heard there were some problems. Any have any opinions either way?
Replies
never even seen a tranzporter..
but i sure do like my Proctors
doesn't a trans climb a pole ?
seems like the Proctor has more uses.... like making it into a slow crane
Hi Jon,
I don't have any first hand knowledge of the Tranzporters, however I do have some information on them. My tool rep from the tool house I use is a pretty good friend of mine at this point. We've been doing business for 5 years now and have hung out socially on a couple of occasions. Any way..... point is.... I trust him.
They had always stocked Proctors for years. When the Tranzporters came out, they (his tool store) made the switch. Reason being was that the Tranzporters were cheaper and appeared to have some features that were better than the Proctors. After six months, they pulled their stock of Tranzporters off the shelf and bought back sets that they had sold. They had multiple problems with them ranging from walls getting stuck partially up, to total cable failure resulting in walls coming down on guys.
Like I said, I have ZERO first hand knowledge of my own. And I have no idea how many sets of Tranzporters they sold to give you some idea of the percentages involved. All I know is what he told me and what he told me is what I wrote above.
Last year when I was looking for a 2nd set of jacks I just bought another set of Proctors. Better safe than sorry, I figure.
i found a picture of some on a Northern Tool site
they LOOK like a square version of the Proctor
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200329626_200329626
but , based on Brian's post, i'd stick with my Proctors
i owned a pair for 20 years... sold them to a guy moving to Colorado
...bought another pair shortly after that.... couldn't operate without themMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Thanks Brian,I did a search trying to find your post but didn't dig deep enough. I think I will stick with the Proctors unless I'm convinced by the left-coasters to buy the wood pole jacks.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Just wonder how much wall R-U liffiting? & how often?
Heres my gear, have six of them, think I paid $65 each I have raised 45' of 2x6 walls (104 5/8" studs w/2x12 headers solo). You just have to take your time.
If your a production framer might not be the way to go. But if your framing one or two a year, small investment & well worth the $.
Think I bought off of Amazon, made in Mass. maybe American wall jacks? (the brand name)
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Yeah, I have a pair of those, too. Great jacks for the part time framer.
Qual Craft makes similar jacks that are cast iron and every framer I know here in the Great Northwest uses them. Retail for about 100 bones each.
Jon - Mike and Brian and I have had these discussions for years now, unless you frame every day, I can't see spending the money for Proctors. Maybe I'm just an old dog resisting new tricks, but I don't see enough advantages to justify the price difference. Loren Wallace for president.
If I remember right, there was a write up in FHB on the Old School Jacks?
Do you know the issue #?
No, but I'm pretty sure the author did some research and discovered the Proctors are rated to lift the same 1,000 lbs/jack as the type that climb a 2x4.
To be frank, though, I don't think he really knew what he was talking about. Just another fluff piece. Loren Wallace for president.
If I remember right I think it was May 2001, #138 maybe? I will have to go to the South wing where the library is & find that issue. I recall the crew in the story were raising walls with siding on them.
Day after reading I went out & bought mine!
If I could remember who wrote that article I sure would like thank them :) !
We don't frame more than a dozen times per year. We're general remodelers who like to build new houses and room additions, but also do decks, basements, kitchens, etc. So they definitely not get weekly use, maybe monthly use but possibly only quarterly use.I know about the Qual-craft jacks similar to what you showed and looked them up at Amazon. The thing is they were $160 for the jack and another $60 for the hooks and hinge assembly that you nail to the deck. So for ~$440 plus the cost of four #1 2x4x16's we could get the set up that you have. I can get the Proctors delivered to my door for $855.50.I like the fact that the Proctors have been around a long time (I used a set about 10 years ago that were probably 15-20 years old at the time) and they are steel and you don't have to follow the wall up with the stepladder.Still, I would consider the jack you show if I could get them for $65 but I haven't come across a price even close to that.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
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American Manufacturing Model 6200 Wall Jack
JON,
looks like the price went up a little in the past few years. $79 Now.
Proctors would be a great addition to anyones tool list.
Glenn,Thanks for the link. I didn't see those at Amazon before. You're right, the price difference is pretty substantial.How do you support the bottom of the 2x4 so it doesn't kick out when you get the wall up high?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I don't know how Glenn does it but I have always used a similar jack (cast iron, pipe handle) and out here we simply nail or screw a 2x block to the floor that the "pole " kicks against. Always ensure the block is directly atop a joist or you can jack the decking down. When working with the joist parallel to the wall we would place a block across several joists and then add a kicker block to that. I personally have never had a pole kick out, but then I always checked to make sure the block was secured well before starting the lift. .
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Just like Dovetail stated, we make sure the 2x4 is good for the lift, & nail & screw a 2by plate to the sub floor on a joist!
Like I said before, "take your time!, when liffiting. Something about working alone & lifting a 40' wall with headers & sheating installed, might take an hour, but where your done it feels good!
Pretty handy for liffiting beams also.
Only con I can see with this type is, they only go up! You cannot back the lift down. I would not do any rake walls alone with this type of jack. But a flat top wall is no problem working alone.
glen.... they only go up ?
wow... that is a drawback
the Proctors are a simple come-a-long... the ratchet works up, or down
Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Mike,
Little draw back, pulling the jack from the 2by once the walls up. But for $280 clams for 3 of them, which will do more wall then one guy needs to. Beats the Heck out of doing without!
My new favorite is the drywall lift were using now! The price of the import lifts about $200 now a days. Worth having around at that price. Will try to get a few photos up on solo drywalling!
Mike, You can get them to back down , but it is a bit scary. Requires tapping each of the "dog" handles in turn just enough to get them loose and dropping the bite an inch or so at a time. I have backed mine off many times, mine are the cast iron version. They don't compare well to the Proctor in that regards at all.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Yeah,I agree that is a big advantage to Proctors.Loren Wallace for president.
Just wondering did you make up your mind on a set of jacks?
For the price of shipping I could loan you 3 of mine?
Think will be frame-less for the next 3-4 months.
Glenn,We were all set to buy the Proctors and then we found out a critical piece of information. The two Counties we work in have always let us install Tyvek while the walls were on the deck. They never really inspected the nailing patterns on the sheathing (we're in a 90mph wind zone and Seismic A, so it's not that big of a deal).As of a few weeks ago, they have added an inspection code that must be cleared for our normal rough-in inspections to take place. We cannot conceal any sheathing nailing from here on out. One of the big benefits I say to buying the Proctors is the chance to install our normal sheathing & Tyvek but also get in to installing the windows while the walls are still horizontal.I think we could save a good bit of time doing it this way, but may never get to find out. Now the plan is to buy a couple of those jacks that you gave me the link to and try them out. Maybe a set of Proctors will be the ticket down the road for us, but maybe the wood pole jacks will work just fine.Thanks for all your help.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
There are housewraps that are translucent. The inspectors can see the nailing patter through the housewrap. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
Blue,Do you have any names that I could look up? I've never noticed translucent wraps.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
I don't remember which brand it is but I do remember the literature listing it as a feature because it allows the carpenter to follow the printed stud markings on OSB or foamboard. I do remember using some and it does work fine. You can see the nails.Another strategy might be to use capped sheathing nails through the wrap. Do roofing nails satisfy the sheathing nailing requirments? I think these nail inspection for osb or drywall are silly unless it's in a siesmic zone. An inspector can walk around the perimeter on the inside and tap. It's not really a structural issue. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
Maybe you could consider switching to Huber's ZipWall and Ziproof system? Huber is the company that also makes Advantech sheathing.
I'm using it for the first time on our current frame. Seems like a decent system.
http://www.huberwood.com/main.aspx?pagename=productOverviewView Image
Ziproof system?
How does that price out? Personally, I won't shingle a roof without underlayment, but I might install copper on a Ziproof.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
I honestly don't know Grant... I don't supply materials when I'm the framing sub. It does save a fair amount of labor in addition to just the cost of housewrap though. I agree with you on roof underlayment for a variety of reasons, but for walls I think it's a pretty good deal. As far as the roof goes, as a framer, I love the idea of being dried in before the roofer shows up... especially this time of year.View Image
Diesel, they "dry" in the roofs here in Texas too. That was something that we never did in MI. My question is this: Why can't they schedule the roofer to show up the day after the frame is done?Actually, we always allow a day for paint. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
Why can't they schedule the roofer to show up the day after the frame is done?
Boy, that's a good question. I'm usually just standing around waiting for somebody to call me to do some work tomorrow.
Seriously, though. most of the time, the GC calls me the day the framers are finishing and wants me there tomorrow. Right after 4 other GCs have called me on the same day wanting the same thing.
I've got one roof that's been setting ready for two months while the homeowner picked out a roofing material. Finally got the selection last Thurs. GC called me today wanting us to start tomorrow. Had to tell him it will be 4 weeks before the metal gets to me and then another 3-4 days of fabrication before we can start. I will send someone up this week (this job's about an hour away) to do a dry in so they can carry on inside. http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
It's hard for me to believe that no builders outside of MI can figure out what they need for a roof and when it will be ready. I guess if it's a custom fabbed metal roof, it might be an exception but most of the roofs I see here are standard dimensional shingles and the roofs don't get shingled for weeks! Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
I'm mostly dealing with $$$$ custom homes and they seldom get "weathered wood" dimensional shingles. But I've got two roofs in the $50-90,000 range that have or are taking forever for the HO to pick a roof out. Seems like they'd have that put to bed before they started building.http://grantlogan.net/
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - J. Handey
Brian,
Can you take some pictures and post them or send them to me? I like the idea, but it seems like the roof to wall areas would be difficult to flash, or at least you'd have to do it when its clean and dry, both hard to do here in the NW
How much more $/sheet is it? Is it hard to install on the roof? Slippery?
Hit me with the details :-)
Brian,I'm with Tim- I'm very interested in your thoughts and experiences.The idea of not having a traditional WRB makes me nervous. But I'm always willing to keep an open mind, and I do really like what Huber has done with OSB (Advantech) so I'm open to the possibility that maybe they just have the first wave of the future.Are you supplying materials? I remember reading somewhere that the cost of the tape almost made it a wash vs. installing house wrap.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Jon, I haven't forgot about you (and Tim).... just too busy the past couple days to give your questions the attention they deserve, but I will. Probably on Sunday. In short, I am not (and hardly ever do) supply materials on my frames. However, I can ask my lumber rep about pricing. We also have only used it on the walls thus far but should start the roof framing/sheathing this up coming week.View Image
Jon,
Same thing here. But what we do is install the WRB on the 2nd floor walls that they can't see anyway. I've talked to different inspectors about this and with one exception they all said no. Then I found out about others in the area doing it, so I did it and have not had one problem :-)
One of those things on paper that is easy to object to, but then in the situation, not a big deal? I figured it was worth trying.
It is easy and quick to install the WRB on the first floor walls, less quick and safe on the upper floor walls.
Tim
PS, I'd try it if I were you and if/when they say something, just be candid with them.
Tim,I figured you were one of the guys who head to deal with this type of inspection. I remember you having to keep the floor sheathing off to have the floor nailing inspected on one of the project you posted here.We are going to feel the inspectors out and see how picky they are going to be.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Jon,
The BIs here also started out wanting that . In short order they figured out who did things right and who didn't. Now the BIs allow 2nd. floor wraps to be done.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Yeah, it is a new experience for everyone and some of the bugs have to be worked out.
I hope it goes well for you.
http://www.nationalladder.com/cart/search_result.asp?CATEGORY=Contractors-Specialties&SHOWTHUMBNAILS=TRUECheck out the various wall jacks at National Ladder. Theres something in there for $65 and it might do what you need it to do if your aren't lifting anything too heavy.I also looked into the proctor on that site and see that the maximum length available there is 15' 6" which I think is a bit slim in many situations if you need them for custom two story walls. In MI, all the carpenters use the Mac Hoists that are shown. They come with two different lengths of cable. We always used the 50' lengths. I've seen guys build 22' poles out of 2x6 in a "T" formation and lift incredibly heavy and tall walls, loaded with porches, windows, overhangs etc. I know for a fact that the proctors would not handle the loads I'm talking about. In fact, the bigger danger when lifting the loads I'm talking about is at the bottom. Care must be taken to get the feet on solid bases. I think I did almost all my lifting with standard 16' plate stock. I also kept a smaller boom of 11' 6" available for standard 8' walls. Quite often, we'd use these booms up during the last days of the frame and just make new ones on the next job, which basically was nothing more than sorting through a few sticks looking for some stable, small knotted stock and putting them together with 6 nails or so. The other very important distinction with the Macs is how much space they take up in storage mode. They show the pair cranked up with the jobsite built boom removed. They'd fit into a suitcase and could be carried by one man. In my first year as a foreman, I actually used to transport a pair of them in my hatchback Pinto along with every other tool needed for a hand pounding framing crew. The Macs are less than half price compared to the Proctors, but if the prices were reversed I'd still buy the MACs at double the price of the Proctors, if money wasn't a major factor in my decision. I can't stress the value of the flexibility of using a wood boom. FKA Blue (eyeddevil)