Okay, soon I will have to select kitchen cabinets. A daunting task for an indecisive person.
The first step is to narrow the search to a brand that offers some of the bells and whistles that are must haves: appliance garage, big drawers under cooktop, recycling trash center and maybe a spice pullout.
Someone mentioned in a post that Merrillat would just fall apart. This was alarming because that was the first brand I thought of.
I know that there are different levels of quality in most brands and wondered if I just specified the highest quality, would the brand matter? I was not planning on doing that because wear and tear would be at a minimum besides my own carelessness. (no children, pets) I planned on picking the medium quality stuff except for the sink base. Of course, the style is an important factor, also.
I eyeballed the Kitchen Maid? at Lowes and the contractor suggested Merrillat.
Any thoughts? Major likes, dislikes? Brands you feel are absolute junk?
Replies
Diamond is ####.
I like Wellborne.
Kraftmaid is also good stuff.
haven't installed Merrillat in years so can't comment ... can't even remember if I liked them then.
Just installed "builders grade" cabinets from a local lumber yard that were their "stock" brand ... and they're very, very nice. Will have to look up that name.
it was an insurance job for my neice and I wanted to upgrade just a bit from the crappy cab's the insurance "refered contractor" was going to replace.
Was really suprised when I saw how nice they were.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
That would be great if you can get the brand name of the cabinets. I sometimes think there are probably a lot of well made products that go unrecognized because of an unfamiliar name.
No marketing may equal better price?
Ac,
Find a small local cabinet shop. Much better service and product.
I really dislike Krapmade.
KK
By a "small cabinet shop" do you mean custom made cabs? Why do you dislike Kraftmaid? I had looked at them a while ago and they seemed like a very well made cabinet.
That was my thread with the Merrillat line in it. Now that I think about it the last Merrillat kitchen I installed was nothing to write home about.
I've had decent luck with the Shenandoah line from Lowes. I have had problems with them but I use them again and reccomend them because they stand behind there products.
The last house I flipped had a problem with cabinet doors that rubbed the faces (miscut hinge cups). The company sent out a rep that changed the doors for me.
That kind of customer service today (I thought) was great. I'll use them again.
Yes it was your thread that mentioned the Merrillat quality or lack of. Isn't the Shenandoah line Lowe's lower priced cabinet? How do you like the finish.
I thought they were pretty good. They have dove tail drawer boxes.
I guess they're probably a mid line cabinet. I'm installing a kitchen full of Shenandoahs right now (well not right now its 9 am on sunday). They are the Maple (I think) with "coffee" stain, i'd buy / reccomend them again.
MSA1,Shenandoah is an American Woodmark product.
Dynasty is a MasterBrand Product.http://www.josephfusco.org
Edited 9/9/2007 11:20 am ET by Joe
Thank you for the suggestion. I will definately check them out. The dovetailed drawers are important to me. If the person who installs them ( like you ) thinks they are good, then I will be confidant about purchasing them.
I can tell you this. Maybe I havent installed high enough end cabinets yet but I have to say I havent seen too much differerence in the boxes.
That's interesting and what I needed to know. Is it worth upgrading and how far of an upgrade would be comparable to custom?
What should the boxes be made of? I read somewhere that at least the sink base should be ply.
I guess I would have to say I strongly disagree about your saying the quality of the boxes isn't important.<!----><!----><!---->
Too many of the cabinet lines will sell you particleboard sides with a plastic picture of wood - their big upgrade is a wood veneer over particle board.<!----><!---->
I strongly recommend to my customers to upgrade to plywood carcasses.<!----><!---->
And just as important is the best hardware – Soft shut drawer slides and 6 way cup hinges.<!----><!---->
By the time you pay the up grade charges for those options from Kraftmaid or the like, you will be at the pricing of a good semi-custom or even custom.<!----><!---->
For me, I recommend Dura Supreme or <!----><!---->Holiday<!----> for as good a cabinet I can buy from a factory.<!----><!---->
<!----> <!---->
Terry<!----><!---->
Terry, I respectfully disagree with respect to the use of melamine-faced particleboard in cabinet carcases.
An in-depth discussion of the pros and cons of PB MEL vs ply can be found at this page: http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Melamine_Carcasses.html
I am not a cabinet maker, but am a sometimes residential contractor, who designs, builds, and installs all the cabinetry myself. Since 2001 I have gone to sourcing packages not as built units, but as components I use to build and assemble the packages. I buy carcase parts from one source, finished fronts from folks like Conestoga and Walzcraft, and hardware and accessories from wholesalers. We have also done jobs using turnkey RTA packages from Conestoga and Scherr's.
I have always used the best undermount full extension drawerslides I can get, and since they have been available, have gone to the soft-close types. Same for door hinges . . . fully adjustable and now with the soft-close clip-ons. Our trash pullouts are the best we can get in Rev-A-Shelf, and our other accessories are of equal quality.
IMHO, the best upgrade for any set of kitchen cabinets is softclose doors and drawers all the way round. We prefer Blum Tandem slides, and their tool-free Inserta models for concealed hinges and mounts. I've got a evaluation trial going right now using Mepla Dynamic NT slides.
We do not feel we have compromised quality one single bit in the use of 3/4" PB MEL for carcase floors, sides, partitions, or shelves. Everything done is frameless.
As you may know if you are regularly buying sheetgoods, mel is readily available in white, bisque, and woodgrain birch and maple, and can be special ordered in a huge array of exotic species woodgrains and colors and patterns. We have used black mel as a handsome accent in high end kitchens.
I will agree that the way you are assembling your carcasses does make a quality product.<!----><!----><!---->
<!----> <!---->
What I am alluding to is the construction of factory built carcasses on the cheaper end of the scale.<!----><!---->
<!----> <!---->
I have yet to receive a factory built cabinet box constructed of ¾” melamine like you build.<!----><!---->
More typically, it’s ½” to 3/8”, sides and back, hot glued together. I’ve spent too much time reinforcing the back joints of the boxes to keep them from pulling apart during installation or in use by the customer.<!----><!---->
<!----> <!---->
I agree that most any material can be used if assembled properly, I’ve just found that factory produced units are assembled with speed and efficiency being more important then being solid.<!----><!---->
<!----> <!---->
Terry
I’ve been making cabinets for many years now and I have found that there are about 37-1/2 different ways of making them. I make my frameless boxes from ¾” prefinished (1 side) maple plywood and all interior shelving from ¾” prefinished (2 sides) plywood. The boxes are all screwed together with 2-1/4” s.s. # 8 square drive screws. The backs are ½” prefinished (1 side) maple plywood and are screwed and stapled flush to the back. All finished sides are veneered. All base cabinets are toe less as well and have an applied toekick frame.That being said I agree with Gene that the use of PB Mel is not a sign of “less quality” even though I don’t use it. For me it was just a matter of working with something that wasn’t going to kill me. Since I’m for the most part a one man band, humping that PB around would have really broken my chops. Plywood is a lot lighter to move around the shop all day then PB.
I would also agree with Gene that the best upgrades are in better hardware, but I was put quite close pistons on my doors 8 years ago and using full extension drawer glides forever. I never used eco drawer glides on anything.
http://www.josephfusco.org
I'm not arguing that PB itself makes for a poor box.
It's just that in use, by the factory, it's typically coupled with poor construction techniques.
I have no problem with custom cabinet builders using PB. They (the custom builders) are the ones you can count on for solid construction details. That just isn't what I have found with the factory purchased units.
Terry
Terry,That I agree with 100% ;-)http://www.josephfusco.com
melamine is crapola. it never stands the test of time. all it takes is humidity for it to come apart or begin to sag, never mind what spills do to it. I'm sure it looks nice when you're packing up your tools. particle board is particle board no matter what you glue to it. it'll never be called furniture grade
I always use veneer plywood for carcase material and straight grained (plain sliced) veneer ply for end panels that are not finished with panel raising.
I could'nt help but notice the end panels in one of your kitchen pics, sorry to say they look like rotary cut AC plywood. almost always the mark of lower grade cabinets. nice layout though
I could'nt help but notice the end panels in one of your kitchen pics
Not my cabinets, not my job. I use stile-rail-panel finished ends. Over the mel PB carcase sides.
I've no idea what you mean by "test of time." If you are such a purist, then why are you using plywood?
I dont think I said its not important. What I (at least) meant to say was that of all the cabinets i've installed except for the price I hadnt noticed much difference in boxes.
Are plywood boxes better? Sure. I just said i've yet to get a kitchen full of them to install.
I've been impressed with the Shenandoah line that Lowes sells. The stuff that I put in our kitchen was from Home Depot in early 2000. I can't remember the brand, but, knowing the Depot, they probably don't sell it anymore. It was ok and has held up well, but it's nothing to brag about.
Doing an install right now with Dynasty, they're ok...stock built for semi-stock prices, some different door styles...carcasses are bout the same in squaritude as Merrilat, but the packaging is better than anything I've ever seen, no kidding.I just priced cabinets for a whole house I'm doing, Merrilat is about 5 grand less than Dynasty...mid-line...Dynasty has ply sides and doubled up backs floor to ceiling cabs...Merrilat has 6 way hinges I have Merrilats in my own kitchen...Enfield, low end construction, but nice doors, drawer fronts and faces...put a skin and a filler here and there...if you do a good install, cardboard boxes would probably be ok,G> Someone's got it in for me, they're planting stories in the press
Whoever it is I wish they'd cut it out but when they will I can only guess.
They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy,
She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me.
I can't help it if I'm lucky.
I don't think I've ever heard of Dynasty. Where would I look for those?
What do you mean by the "packaging"?
What's the budgeted dollars for the cabinets? Dynasty by Omega Cabinets is a good choice. If the budget is high enough Omega Custom is a really good choice.
A budget amount for cabinets wasn't mentioned on that a Merrillat midline would be included in the price. I certainly hope the contractor gives me a cabinet allowance. The first contractor I worked with wouldn't give me the allowance amount and midline oak was the same price as high end maple?!!? Our relationship didn't last long.
That Dynasty name is popping up again. Will definately have to check them out.
If you want to take a look just go to
http://www.omegacabinets.com
You can check out styles and finishes.
Nice site and there's a dealer very close to me. Thanks!
that job is my neices and I'll be back there on Mon ... so I'll see if I can find a name.
If not ... I'll call the lumberyard.
in Cleveland ... try to track down Pete Draganic thru this site.
he may have a good connection for ya.
btw ... Browns suck and I'll see U at 1pm Sunday!
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
that job is my neices and I'll be back there on Mon ... so I'll see if I can find a name.
If not ... I'll call the lumberyard.
Thanks. I would like to look at all sources and brands so if you can give me a lead, it will be much appreciated.
in Cleveland ... try to track down Pete Draganic thru this site.
he may have a good connection for ya.
Actually, I believe Pete lives in my neighborhood. Maybe he will see this.
btw ... Browns suck and I'll see U at 1pm Sunday!
Ha! Die-hard Steelers fan here! And I am pumped! I get so darn nervous about these games because I take a lot of #### about it. I truly miss going to Pittsburgh for the games. Used to make a couple a year.
GO STILLERS!!
Ac
I don't know why I was so nervous.
Okay, now that the game is over...I was going to start another thread, but from what I've read on this board, you seem to be the pro. Included in the project are refinishing hardwood floors that are in not so great shape. I'm sure you have answered this question before, but what finish should be used?
I'm concerned because hardwood will be in the kitchen, also.
Another vote for custom.
In my travels, I've noticed that east of the Mississippi, one buys factory made cabinets. From west of that to the great divide, it's a mix. Downhill and to the left coast, it's almost 100% custom.
I've had them both, several times. Will only get custom in the future. And finishing them yourself is not unreasonable.
I'm less then happy with Merilatt, at least I was 2-3 years ago when we stopped using them, maybe they've improved, they used to provide a good value then we had some problems.
We use Medallion cabinets for our base-line, they have 3 different levels, Silverline, GoldLine, DesignerGold. Never used the top of the line, for the money I can get custom cabinets from a local place. Use a lot of the GoldLine, finish is nice, all-dovetail drawers, decent hardware, lots of options and it is fully customizable (if that's a real word).
The box construction is nothing to write home about but it's about on par from what I've seen from most larger cab companies. I like the fact I can get flush finished ends and extended stiles.
what part of the country are you located in, maybe someone here knows a reputable dealer or custom cabinet maker
You only mentioned Medallion but I'm wondering if top of the line in any brand would be about the same cost as custom. Should I not even bother looking at the top of the line and just consider custom made if it fits in my budget? Guess I will just have to compare prices.
I want a sturdy cabinet. Right now I have drawer fronts hanging off and sagging shelves. But it has to look good, too!
I'm in Cleveland, Ohio
Ac,
I'd also recommend finding a local cabinet shop and going custom. I priced out higher end cabinets for my kitchen and the price wasn't much different. To be sure, store bought and custom and cabinets shops will vary in price and quality. You can pay a lot more and not get the quality. The cabinet maker I selected starts all of his solid stock parts from 5/4 material. He's awesome, and I'm learning to step up my own game as I work to trim out my house. Also, he has a shop full of Martin tools. I'd never seen a Martin saw before, I think that's what really sold me ;-).
Check out the photos. Many of the parts are cut out from the same sheet of ply or from the same board.
I do agree not just because i am a designer/cabinetmaker, but for the fact that he will not get the same quality and attention to detail from a manufacturing environment where volume is an unavoidable factor in material selection and orientation.These kitchen's sold at the box stores are manufactured for profit ( and they don't look all that bad ON THE SURFACE ) but your local cabinetmaker will add the element of pride, workmanship and custom details that you don't see in those glossy leaflets. Not to say that profit is not in the equation...we all have bills to pay. The bottom line...you get what you pay for and sometimes even less if your eyes are open shut.
I admire and respect all tradesmen but cabinet makers furniture, staircase builders included) are also artisans. Trust me, if the budget can handle it, I will go custom.
I have seen custom cabinets and could tell immediately upon walking into the room. They looked so much richer and sturdier and I would love to have mine made. If it comes to choosing top of the line or custom, it's a no brainer.
I hear what you are saying about going custom. Just afraid my budget won't allow it. I'm still waiting on the price from the contractor and expect to have sticker shock. Takes me about a week to get over it and then I can think straight again.
So are you saying top of the line cabinet prices are pretty much equal to custom?
Ac,I hope you dont mind a long winded response! I certainly understand the sticker shock syndrome. Once you have a layout, I'd suggest that you take it the rough design to several cabinet shops. You'll be surprised by the range of prices. Several higher end semi-custom cabinet brands were priced higher than custom cabinets from local shops. Semi-custom cabinet shops aren't necessarily bad, some are very high quality and I'm sure the craftspeople take pride in their work as well. But my belief is that you'll get a tighter fit with fewer filler pieces when going full custom since your cabinet maker can get exact measurments for the construction of your cabinets. My cabinet maker came out and measured everything even though I had a design drawn up for him already (the design helped with the estimate). He then came out and built some of the more difficult toe-kicks onsite, totally amazing attention to detail! BTW: Don't forget to ask your cabinet maker or painting contractor to add in the price of painting or clear-coating the cabinets to get the total cost.One note is that even a custom cabinet shop may outsource or subcontract some of the work such as drawers or cabinet doors (and finsishing) to other local specialty shops. Here in California, we also have to be aware that the air quality board forces us to use water based varnishes which used to not be as good as oil based finishes, but that has changed over the last few years. The folks that sell out of state semi-custom cabinets always claim their finish is better.
This may come as a surprise but most of the cabinet companies you speak of are only really three companies.MasterBrand:Stuff like Omega, Thomasville,Diamond. . .
Masco:Kraftmaid
AmericanWoodmark:All sold thur HD and Lowes.http://www.josephfusco.org
You can check it out:http://americanwoodmark.com/
http://masterbrand.com/brands/index.cfm
http://masco.com/our_companies/index.htmlhttp://www.josephfusco.com/
Edited 9/9/2007 11:24 am ET by Joe
In many markets, "custom" is extremely competitive in price, even with bigbox brands such as Kraft Maid.
As for your needs of stuff like applicance garage, trash pullouts, etc., I cannot think of anyone in cabinetry that does not address those needs.
In Kraft Maid, for instance, you can opt for drawerboxes that match in quality and specs, other cab lines all the way from the bottom to the absolute top. Same goes for drawerslides. You can get cheapies that cost the cab maker $2.35 per drawer, all the way up to full ex softclose undermounts that go wholesale for almost ten times that.
Most shops that do "custom" and do it competitively with the bigbox brands, will use design software that allows them to do you a proposal with a rendering, after a quick session to measure and discuss your specs. Here is an example.
View Image
That software will then produce for them a completely costed package and enable a proposal to be written. Not as quick as sitting with the cab designer at a bigbox store, but almost.
But the local shop can probably deliver a couple weeks quicker than the bigbox or lumberyard dealer can do with the stock cab pacakge.
Here is what you see at the end.
View Image
By far the biggest element of cost in a cab package, is the fronts. The doors, faceframes (if framed), drawerfronts, panels, trim, anything that is seen and finished. The least cost fronts are done with MDF and RTF, the most expensive have expensive wood species and finishes with glazes, distressing, etc.
Cab boxes, the carcases, are one of the least cost elements of the whole package.
If you can find a cab outfit that has the software to do the design and run the cutting through a CNC cutting center, you can get "custom" at the price that might meet your needs.
Dynasty packing is very installer friendly: pop the bands and all the cardboard simply slides off. No staples fight or gouge floors or cabinets...The tops and bottoms are reinforced to keep the cabs from getting bunged up, and it works.Dynasty has a 4-5 week turnaround, 2 1/2 weeks if there's a screw up.A Merrilat plant is pretty close to me, so I can get the Classics in about a week.After a good install, with the tops on, it's tough to tell the difference between Merrilat and Dynasty, except for the 3-4 grand I can save on a typical job<G> Someone's got it in for me, they're planting stories in the press
Whoever it is I wish they'd cut it out but when they will I can only guess.
They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy,
She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me.
I can't help it if I'm lucky.
Where you live, you should be buying from one of the boys in the True32 chain. Locally made, totally custom, quick turnaround, any options you want.
Most all the CNC shops get their fronts from Conestoga. I am sure you are aware of the depth of their offering. Conestoga probably makes more cab doors than anyone, and many of the brand names discussed here buy their fronts from them. Everything you see that is painted wood, in the pic, attached, is by them.
View Image
A good cab shop is like an auto manufacturer. A whole lot of what goes into the finished product is made to specification for them by a specialist. The cab shop presents, proposes, engineers, then fabs and assembles the package.
I didn't really get much from the True 32 website... locally made? Edumacate me a little more here? Someone's got it in for me, they're planting stories in the press
Whoever it is I wish they'd cut it out but when they will I can only guess.
They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy,
She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me.
I can't help it if I'm lucky.
Wow! Awesome pictures. Exactly what I need because I can never picture the actual look. Have an old home architect program that has helped me immensely because it has a walk through capability, but those drawings were great.
Quality concerns for me were the boxes and what they should be made of. Also, there was a thread once on drawer slides which to me is really important (since mine are all broken!) I want to have all this spec'ed before I go shopping. If I can get what I want with pre-made, I would go with that. If not, I will, for sure, go with custom. I am leaning toward custom only because the kitchen will be wide open to the rest of the house and the cabinetry will be a focal point. Also, just want the opportunity to watch an artisan at work, and in my home!
So you need pictures?
You can do some good stuff with stock cabinets and make your customers feel like that get a completely custom kitchen from you. The kitchen below is designed with Thomasville cabinetry from the Home Depot and designed and laid out in eCabinets.
View Image
View Image
http://www.josephfusco.org
Joe,
That style is exactly what I am looking for! The layout is very similar, too! I have saved the picture to show the architect and contractor.
Just so you know, I'm not the carpenter...I'm the homeowner. I'm just trying to determine a budget which is why all the questions on cabinetry and costs.
Does Thomasville have a low to high end cabinet and would this be the high end?
Forgot to ask. What is ecabinets?
Edited 9/9/2007 6:43 pm ET by AcCable
AcCable,First eCabinets is a program that is developed by a company named Thermwood and they make CNC routers. These are machines that you program to make the cuts on sheet goods to cut your cabinet parts. You can get a copy of the program and are free to use it.As far as the cabinets go, Thomasville is the high end of what you can get at the Home Depot. They have a great look but are made to about a b- standard. . . They are made by MasterBrand. The cabinetry in that kitchen cost about $21,000.00 without appliances, countertops and installation.From my experience you get a better value if you buy the Kraftmaid or even American Woodmark brands from Home depot, but some people just love the look.http://www.josephfusco.com
Edited 9/9/2007 7:55 pm ET by Joe
Go here http://www.kraftmaid.com/rooms/index.cfm?print=1&print=1&navigationid=225X0&roomsceneid=302
to see, from Kraft Maid, fronts for a kitchen similar to what Joe showed in Thomasville.
Go into a Lowe's or Home Depot where Kraft Maid is sold, and look through all the selections in door styles and finishes, noting carefully the price group level (2, 3 . . . ) of the ones that catch your eye.
As I said in an earlier post, the style, species, and finish on the fronts is what relates most to cost.
You'll find the most economical fronts to be in RTF on an MDF core. I'll translate that for you. Rigid thermofoil film is vacuum-formed with heat assist, on a door or drawerfront core made from CNC-machined medium density fiberboard. Most of the RTF selections you'll see will be in white, but colors and woodgrains are available, with some of the newer products in five-piece doors being quite handsome.
You'll also find that fronts done in "everyday" finishes on red oak to be in the lower price groups, and stuff like quartersawn white oak and select cherry to be in the top end groups.
All the stock cab people, Kraft Maid and all the others mentioned here, will take your checkbook for a real ride if you select fronts from the upper price groups. You'll see that it may make more sense to pay for the hardware and drawerbox upgrades (softclose, etc.) than for the color and species of the fronts.
IMHO, frameless cabs are the only way to go, and by the way, frameless is (as far as I know) the only way to get softclose cab doors right now. For some stupid reason, the stock cab makers sell their frameless lines at a premium price. Perhaps that is because most all the ultra-high end euro lines are frameless, and the American cab companies have positioned their frameless lines as only available in high-style fronts.
and by the way, frameless is (as far as I know) the only way to get softclose cab doors right now
Gene, by softclose I assume you mean dampers like Blum's Blumotion. This can be added to existing cabs (frame or frameless) using their Clip Top hinge or any cabinet in general the separate device shown at the link.
http://www.blum.com/us/en/01/30/40/20/index.php
I've installed a couple of times on refaces...people love them. I even put them on some of our 1964 model 3/8" lip doors with knife hinges!PJ
Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.
I work for a kitchen/bath outfit, and we install woodmode/brookhaven cabinets. Woodmode is $$$, but brookhaven are comprable in price to kraftmade, and in my opinion are far better made. I just installed a kitchen for a relative who insisted on using kraftmade and I found the cabinets to be of much less quality. The glue was all over the face frames, the rabbets are very shallow, some of the cabinets were very out of square and I had to re-drill alot of hinges to get enough adjustment to line up the doors. This is a real problem on ull overlay cabinets. I like the brookhaven cabinets becasue they are durable and well put together. They use blum hardware, and soft close hinges are standard. I think they might have soft close drawers as standard now as well. The other thing to consider is that the door hardware (knobs and pulls etc) is included in the price for the brookhavens.
I consider merillat to be comprable to aristocraft cabinets. Somewhere on the lowerr end of the spectrum. If I had a choice, I'd go for custom shop made cabinets, but for pre made I would recomend the brookhaven.
Thanks or the reply! Your product comparison from KraftMaid to Brookhaven is the type of info I was looking for. I liked the look of KraftMaid but figured I would be paying just for the name and wanted to look at comparable products. Also wasn't sure of the quality of the cabs. The fact that they come from Lowes was why I was questioning the quality. Don't know if that is a good reason but it made me suspect that more was out there.
I wouldn't knock Kraftmaid becasue they come from lowes. I think that the thomasville cabinets from Depot are nice. Infact, I know of alot of cabinet dealers that sell Kraftmaid, I just haven't had grand experiences with them. I like the brookhavens, they are made in the same factory with the same tools as the Woodmode, and they stand behind their product. Lead time is 8 weeks though, and thats a bummer, but all the cabinets are made when the orders are placed, they don't sit around in their warehouse waiting for someone to buy them.
Custom cabinets allow a flat bottom along the entire run of top cabs instead of those intersections & gaps at every box. This makes the installation of more attractive under cabinet lighting easier.
Good point! Thanks.
dug out the invoice.
Quality Kitchen Cabinets.
http://www.qualitycabinets.com
just found the home page ... have to dig thru their site.
I confirmed I had the right "Quality" by using their "find a dealer" link.
might find someone near you.
Have to note ... I borrowed a price book from a buddy that's used them before and my quoted price was higher than expected. Lumber yard cab guy said he upgrades all his orders to full extension drawer glides ... and he got alot of complaints on their base model glides.
But even with that upgrade ... the price was still fantastic for the product.
nicely built boxes ... very nice face frames and finish.
didn't ask for anything special as far as upgrades and semi-custom but I think they have a fairly nice selection. If I was going "fancy" ... I'd most likely step up to Wellborne.
Steelers looked pretty strong. Even playing against a bad team don't make our QB throw long ball on target ... so while they did make us look better ... I think we'll look OK against real competition.
either way ... gonna be an interresting year. I was never Cowher fan ... so I'm exceited to see a new coaching staff.
Jeff
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
Well if someone like you recommends them, then they are definately worth a look-see.
Scanned the website and there is a dealer very close to me. I have also heard of Wellborne and will investigate them when I get the estimate. I truly hope there is room in the budget for custom or fancier cabinets but for some reason, I don't think there will be.
I posted a question to about a hardwood floor finish. I believe I have read that you are a big fan of shellac. Would you recommend this in a kitchen also? I also have a wood front door that needs refinishing; it is exposed to all the elements. Would you recommend shellac for that also? Whatever is on it now is peeling and flaking off. How often does shellac need to be reapplied?
I think the Browns made the Steelers look better than they may be. It will be interesting to see them play a real team. Cowher had his ups and downs but I'm also looking forward to the new coaching except for the defensive coach...can't remember his name. That man is a god-send.
Dick LeBeau.
Sun was his 70'th birthday!
anyways .... nope a hardwood guy. The best ever here was LuvDitchBurns ...
not sure if he's checking in lately or not.
I have no useful info on finishes ... have to trust my subs on that one!
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
I've installed a lot of cabinets over the years as a finish carpenter. I would say that not only do you want to pick a cbinet that is decent but also a company that has good customer service. Buy from a local dealer or cabinet shop who has a vested interest in getting a referal from you. Home depot and lowes is a #### shoot. it comes down to the individual person you design with. Second pick a cbinet line that has good service. Kraftmaid as mentioned before has different levels of construction. go for the plywood sides and dovetail drawers , it's worth it. their finishes are nice and if there are problems they are quick to remedy. Dynasty by omega are also a good company and cabinet. same reasons. these are mid range companies. higher end companies exist and are expensive but if that's your budget the there is craft-maid (not Kraftmaid), plain and fancy, woodmode.
All of the mid line brands will have color variations in the grain, the boxes may not always be assembled square, and the handling of them may result in some damage but most companies will make good on these issues (eventually).
We have a cabinet maker by me who turns out really nice custom cabinets that outshine any of the above. He's not cheap but you are indeed getting what you pay for. worth at least looking into in my opinion.
at any rate - find a dealer that takes his/her time to design to your needs and have good references from previous customers. No kitchen goes without a hitch so having someone on your side is key.
good luck,
jason
"it aint the work I mind,
It's the feeling of falling further behind."
Bozini Latini
http://www.ingrainedwoodworking.com
I am definitely looking for good customer service even though I'm not the one that will be dealing with them. If the installer has problems, then I have problems. That is why I'm leary of Lowes or HD. And I don't want to tell the carpenter 'here are the cheapest cabinets made now make them look custom".
There seem to be a lot of brands out there which is why I am making a spec list. Looks are really important to me but the quality of the boxes needs to be acceptable to me and the installer. Since I'm only talking to the contractor, I needed to get suggestions from this board and you have been most helpful.
anytime you have further questions - feel free to look me up"it aint the work I mind,
It's the feeling of falling further behind."Bozini Latinihttp://www.ingrainedwoodworking.com
You live only 70 miles north of one of the finest custom cabinetry shops in the US - plus they are extremely reasonable.
Email me at [email protected] and I'll tell you more.
Jeff
tell everyone.
must be somewhere close to me too.
and there's other Ohio people near by ...
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa